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Number of children in Texas custody rises — some young mothers are actually under 18
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Ron | 1:56 p.m. April 24, 2008
While I certainly don't sympathize with or condone the FLDS lifestyle, I
still believe (last time I checked) that I live in the United States of America
and that parents and children still have constitutional rights. Are American
citizens now guilty until proven innocent? These cases should be treated
individually. Seems like we're heading rapidly towards a fascist America
and it's truly frightening!
avengeance | 2:13 p.m. April 24, 2008
law says: you have a right not to incriminate yourself
CPS says: give us DNA or we won't return your children.
law says: search and seizure must be specific as to what will be searched and taken, and probabe cause must be given
CPS says: they all look abused, or like they were abused, or might be abused someday. Let's take them all!
law says: hearing for individual must take place within 14 days
Texas judge says: I can't hear 400+ cases in the given time. Instead of acknowledging the shortcoming in the law and addressing the worst cases, I'll rule a blanket ruling skirting the law and say "all children..."
How much illegal action can they get away with? Quite a lot. What are you going to do? Protest? March? Write your congressman? All while these childrens lives are slowly destroyed. Maybe blow something up or burn something down? The media and the government would paint you a terrorist or kook. Face it- it's too late to do anything except submit to the will of the government overlords.
CPS says: give us DNA or we won't return your children.
law says: search and seizure must be specific as to what will be searched and taken, and probabe cause must be given
CPS says: they all look abused, or like they were abused, or might be abused someday. Let's take them all!
law says: hearing for individual must take place within 14 days
Texas judge says: I can't hear 400+ cases in the given time. Instead of acknowledging the shortcoming in the law and addressing the worst cases, I'll rule a blanket ruling skirting the law and say "all children..."
How much illegal action can they get away with? Quite a lot. What are you going to do? Protest? March? Write your congressman? All while these childrens lives are slowly destroyed. Maybe blow something up or burn something down? The media and the government would paint you a terrorist or kook. Face it- it's too late to do anything except submit to the will of the government overlords.
Anonymous | 2:12 p.m. April 24, 2008
Stop tearing babies from mommies. A 2 year old is a baby. It is too traumatic.
Stop punishing babies for criminal men's deeds. Texas justice is not
justice...it is a big, totalitarian sham!!!! I suspect the property owners near
the FLDS compound are really the ones behind this whole "herding of the
human cattle" drive.
Comments continue below
Doug S | 2:20 p.m. April 24, 2008
Let me get this straight:
FLDS tells their kids that the world is evil and they should stay on the compound = repressive cult.
FLDS identifies kids who don't want to be there and sends them out into the world to make their ways = repressive cult.
Anyone else sensing a conflict here?
FLDS tells their kids that the world is evil and they should stay on the compound = repressive cult.
FLDS identifies kids who don't want to be there and sends them out into the world to make their ways = repressive cult.
Anyone else sensing a conflict here?
fc | 2:56 p.m. April 24, 2008
Wouldn't it have made more sense to have the men vacate the ranch, and
leave the women and children behind in their customary environment for DNA
testing? It seems better for the children, and less expensive for the state.
Lori | 3:39 p.m. April 24, 2008
To Avengeance:
Good post, but it's not too late for the people of Texas to demand that their elected officials put a stop to CPS abusing these children.
That hearing was a mockery of the justice system and that wacky judge needs to be impeached.
Good post, but it's not too late for the people of Texas to demand that their elected officials put a stop to CPS abusing these children.
That hearing was a mockery of the justice system and that wacky judge needs to be impeached.
Justin | 3:58 p.m. April 24, 2008
It is good that the appellate courts are getting involved but I'm affraid
that justice will not be done until the cases move from the Texas court system
to the federal court system.
LDS convert | 3:59 p.m. April 24, 2008
seems to me that the el dorado folks feared the flds might take over the town,
politics, just like in Missouri....against underage child brides, and why not
have flds change, have children brought back to them, prosecute the men? Dr.
Phil's attitude is return the children to the mothers as well, but help
this group CHANGE.
Freddie Kruger | 4:09 p.m. April 24, 2008
These kids need to be taught the realities of the real world. Get them away
from their degenerate lifestyle. Once they are away from it they will never
want to return.
Fred | 4:23 p.m. April 24, 2008
>>"A spokesman for the FLDS Church told the Deseret News he fears
that authorities are using the DNA to build criminal cases against
members."
What do you FLDS people have to fear?! Maybe the proven guilty part??!!!<<
What do they fear, you asked. They fear that their constitutional rights are being violated.
What do you FLDS people have to fear?! Maybe the proven guilty part??!!!<<
What do they fear, you asked. They fear that their constitutional rights are being violated.
wrz | 4:33 p.m. April 24, 2008
>>"If Texas wants to know which kids belong to whom, all they need do
is to return them to their homes and they sort it out" I can't believe
that Texas has not thought of that. They can just peek in the windows at night
and see which underage girls are living with which Old Man..You Can Not Be
Serious!<<
It is not the responsibility of the government, any government, federal, state, or local, to know who is related to whom. It is the responsibility of the government to prosecute crime. These women and children are all innocent of any hint of a crime. If there are crimes it would seem the label point to the men.
It is not the responsibility of the government, any government, federal, state, or local, to know who is related to whom. It is the responsibility of the government to prosecute crime. These women and children are all innocent of any hint of a crime. If there are crimes it would seem the label point to the men.
It's A WHOOOle nother country | 4:49 p.m. April 24, 2008
I used to just chuckle at my work friends from Texas when they'd say,
"It's a whooole nother country". Now I see what they mean.
I think they mean it when they say, "Don't mess with Texas", "It's a whooole nother country" and "The Constitution is Just a piece of paper".
Texas really thinks parents have no rights to their children, due process, legal representation and the legal redress when they feel their own government is repressing them.
I think they mean it when they say, "Don't mess with Texas", "It's a whooole nother country" and "The Constitution is Just a piece of paper".
Texas really thinks parents have no rights to their children, due process, legal representation and the legal redress when they feel their own government is repressing them.
So quick to forget | 4:58 p.m. April 24, 2008
Sarah is not the key to the case.
There is also an informant who has been working with local law inforcement for 4 years. Remember that? That's why the search warrant said to look for evidence of bigamy and sexual activity on beds in their temple.
There is also an informant who has been working with local law inforcement for 4 years. Remember that? That's why the search warrant said to look for evidence of bigamy and sexual activity on beds in their temple.
Fredd | 5:11 p.m. April 24, 2008
All who say the babies and boys and pre-pubescent females are not at risk and
should be returned. Do you agree when they reach puberty they are at risk? If
so should we take them away then? How do we ensure they are not spirited away
to another compound perhaps in Mexico?
well... | 5:11 p.m. April 24, 2008
I have to say that they brought all this upon themselves. I can't pitty
this group cause I have noticed that most of the teenagers are
girls..where's the boys?? They got tossed out without nothing by the
so-called leaders of these FLDS people. Hence there are lost boys, are their
mothers crying for them??? Or just the little tiny boys not yet teenagers and
will probably get tossed out after they get older. Sorry these kids are better
off on the buses hopefully to discover what freedom really is!
Re: wrz | 5:14 p.m. April 24, 2008
WRZ...I agree the men are at fault. What Texas is trying to do is keep the
children away from abusive pedophiles. The women are not in a condition to act
for themselves. The mothers have been manipulated, mentally/physically abused
and suffer from what's known as Stockholm Syndrom. The mother's,
unfortunately, aren't in a state where they can make the best decision for
themselves and protect their children. The mothers are trapped. So,
unfortunately, keeping the children away from the abusive men requires splitting
the children from their mothers because the mothers would just go right back to
the abusive men. This is all about the men. The FLDS want us to think it's
about the mothers, and the media paints a picture like it is, but you as well as
50 percent of the people on this board forget what kind of situation these
children would be in if left alone at that ranch/prison. Everyone one of those
children received into custody has been either mentally or physically abused.
Good for Texas for rescuing them. Sorry the moms have to watch, but they
didn't do anything to stop their "husbands."
Everyone in America | 5:27 p.m. April 24, 2008
"This situation should scare everyone in America!..."
Not skeered. Probably because I don't abuse children. Go figure.
Not skeered. Probably because I don't abuse children. Go figure.
Jaymes | 5:38 p.m. April 24, 2008
Whose next? If the precedent is set that all someone has to do is call up and
claim that this religious group or that civic group is abusing children, and it
makes it ok for the government to swoop down and take all the children from that
group, then I ask again...Whose next? Someone could call up and say that
they're are raping little girls in the Salt Lake Temple of the LDS church,
and next thing you know the FBI and state authorities nationwide could knock
down any Mormon's door and take their children. Why not? It's the
same thing isn't it? What if it was the amish accused? Why not? The things
these children are about to be exposed is far more abusive than what was
happening to them before. Would have been far smarter and easier to swarm in and
arrest all the adult men, leave the children with their mom(s) and sort it out
that way. The criminals (if any) were the men (and possibly the moms) why
punish the children?
Children | 5:39 p.m. April 24, 2008
To all the people that want the children to go back to their mothers, well that
is exactly what the CPS intended. It is the FLDS that have twarted the return
of the children because they lied, lied, and lied some more. The names and the
ages of the children have been changed, so why should CPS assume correct
parentage? If CPS returned the children to the wrong parents, do you believe
that the FLDS would not legally retaliate? DNA is undeniable proof of
parentage.
There is already a man that has claimed he is ex-flds and that the mother of his children was reassigned, taking HIS children across state lines WITHOUT his permission. Where are your complaints of his rights? Oh I forgot,this is only the right of a father to his children and not the umbrella of religious rights which you pretend to hide under, so the father doesn't count.
Where children are at threat of abuse in the home, the child is always removed, not the parent. If the mother didn't defend her child from her husband, why assume safety with him gone?
There is already a man that has claimed he is ex-flds and that the mother of his children was reassigned, taking HIS children across state lines WITHOUT his permission. Where are your complaints of his rights? Oh I forgot,this is only the right of a father to his children and not the umbrella of religious rights which you pretend to hide under, so the father doesn't count.
Where children are at threat of abuse in the home, the child is always removed, not the parent. If the mother didn't defend her child from her husband, why assume safety with him gone?
Where are the men? | 5:51 p.m. April 24, 2008
Where are the MEN who have impregnated all these underage females? The culprits
who have broken the law are the leaders and male followers who support and
believe in sex with children. Isn't it usually the perpetrator who is taken
into custody by the police? Why are the women/children the ones we see
suffering?
I must be missing something here...
I must be missing something here...
Go Texas! | 5:53 p.m. April 24, 2008
I think the FLDS believes we will be outraged by what CPS and Texas authorities
have done to their cult. Quite the contrary; we applaud what's been
done.
This is not 1953. We Americans will not defend neglect by mothers or fathers, incest, molestation, rape of our welfare system, child brides, and child rape.
I do not care if it's legal to marry girls under 18; it's still wrong! And is it not against the law not to give children a complete education?
This is not 1953. We Americans will not defend neglect by mothers or fathers, incest, molestation, rape of our welfare system, child brides, and child rape.
I do not care if it's legal to marry girls under 18; it's still wrong! And is it not against the law not to give children a complete education?
To willie Jessop | 5:55 p.m. April 24, 2008
Where was that "do unto others" when wives were being reassigned with
the children, then moved to Texas? One ex-flds man is in Texas already and with
DNA testing will hopefully get his kids back.
Muslim | 5:58 p.m. April 24, 2008
So, if these were Muslim girls and had circumcision a.k.a. genital mutilation,
would all of you still be crying out that it's about the constitution and
religious rights? My magic eight-ball says "doubtful." If these
children were black, would there be an outcry? Nope, it would not even make
more than a blip on the news channel. Everybody would simply say,
"it's about child abuse and glad the kids are away from those horrible
parents."
To fc | 6:38 p.m. April 24, 2008
They have no grounds to arrest or prosecute the FLDS men or they would have done
so. They are hoping with their DNA fishing expedition to come up with evidence
of a crime but the DNA will not prove that an underage girl had sex with an
adult male in the state of Texas after the age of consent was changed from
fourteen to sixteen. DNA doesn't tell you that much.
It would have been illegal to remove the men or women from their homes without any evidence of a crime. So they used the only weapons they had which were an arrogant judge and the CPS goon squad who could remove their children and accomplish the destruction of the FLDS community.
It would have been illegal to remove the men or women from their homes without any evidence of a crime. So they used the only weapons they had which were an arrogant judge and the CPS goon squad who could remove their children and accomplish the destruction of the FLDS community.
THE INNOCENT ONE! | 6:45 p.m. April 24, 2008
For all you who listen to Flora Jessop I grew up with Flora and when she was
atempting to leave FLDS, I asked her to let me go with her, and she said no
becouse your too innocent she said, I cant take you out in that big bad world, I
begged her, she said I have to go do this I cant take anyone who is innocent.
She said you belong here, she was my Idle. I thank Fora to this day for not
letting me go with her.
Messing around | 6:51 p.m. April 24, 2008
The men need to be taken into custody. Send the kids back to the moms. The Men
are the ones who are morally corrupt and messen with the minds of these women
and children. The FLDS men need to be stopped in their tracks.
ml_in_gresham | 7:06 p.m. April 24, 2008
I keep hearing how much this sect is 'all about raising our children in a
wholesome manner'. I have looked at pages of photos of this YFZ ranch, and
I find it curious that I've not seen a single swing set or basketball
court. I am left to think that perhaps 'playing' as healthy children
should is not encouraged
To messing around | 7:08 p.m. April 24, 2008
If they had any evidence that the men had committed a crime they would have
arrested them. They do not have any evidence of criminal behavior - even after
searching the ranch, taking their records, interviewing the children, and
threatening to women with the loss of their children. They did not need to meet
even a minimal standard of proof of abuse to take the children away and they are
hoping that they will be able to dig something up to justify themselves.
abby smoot provo utah | 7:30 p.m. April 24, 2008
those kids were abused and needed to be taken away from those child molesters.
being in foster care will open a whole new world to them... maybe for the
better... the poor kids didn't even know what a crayon was..... maybe this
will open the eyes of other polygamus houses in hilldale and coloardo city...
good for texas
Daphne | 7:37 p.m. April 24, 2008
I am outraged at the treatment of the children. They are innocent
bystanders!!!!! Why can't they stay with their mothers? It seems that it
is the intention of the state of Texas that the children are NEVER reunited with
their mothers, much less their families. Think how traumatized those kids are
already from this upheaval. It is a mistake of gigantic proportions to have
removed children 10 and younger from their mothers.
DAN | 7:41 p.m. April 24, 2008
Ref: Utah Paper on Texas incident. I for one am glade to see a newspaper not
afraid to tell the story that other papers either ignore or misrepresent the
facts. DN at least has some credibility and is willing to report the news. The
country needs to have some sort of media that is willing to report the news and
not perpetuate a bias. Thanks DN for being willing to do a fine job. When the
media is afraid to report, then we are hurt. I for one try to see all sides of
the issue, and then I can make a reasonable conclusion on the issue as
presented. Not some 10 or 30 second sound bit or BIG HEADLINES, telling little
of the facts or bias reporting. Thanks again.
dear abby smoot | 8:08 p.m. April 24, 2008
You are repeating the myth of the crayon. Just because the children did not
want to color in the coloring books the CPS provided does not mean they have
never seen crayons. On the wall of their school room is a carefully-rendered,
crayon drawing of a dump truck with a child's hand-written description.
These children have been sheltered from television, video games, public school indoctrination, junk food, immodesty and our hyper-sexualized environment.
There are thousands of people outside YFZ who home school, raise their own vegetables, shun junk food, breastfeed, don't have television or video games -all the while immersed in a growing sea of debauchery. They are doing their best to protect their children from the "new world" these FLDS children are being thrust into.
The raid on YFZ is supposed to be a message to all those who think they can reject the world of Mammon - "try it and we will take your children."
These children have been sheltered from television, video games, public school indoctrination, junk food, immodesty and our hyper-sexualized environment.
There are thousands of people outside YFZ who home school, raise their own vegetables, shun junk food, breastfeed, don't have television or video games -all the while immersed in a growing sea of debauchery. They are doing their best to protect their children from the "new world" these FLDS children are being thrust into.
The raid on YFZ is supposed to be a message to all those who think they can reject the world of Mammon - "try it and we will take your children."
JP | 9:31 p.m. April 24, 2008
Willy Steele, if I am kicking my sons out as young teenagers, if I am handing my
daughters over to men old enough to be their grandfathers, then the state should
come take them. It's not about religion. It's about child abuse and
even child rape.
anon | 9:50 p.m. April 24, 2008
This is off the subject, I know, but I checked out the FLDS's website about
the "captive children." I clicked on the "video" portion
and watched a short bit on how happy the children were within the compound. The
images were accompanied by an arrangement of a popular contemporary LDS primary
song. This surprised me. Do they (the FLDS) make use of LDS hymns and primary
music? (And I don't mean music written before John Taylor) Janice Kapp
Perry gives permission in the LDS primary song book for her songs to be employed
in "church and non-commercial use." Does this constitute copyright
infringement? Just wondering. I had heard the FLDS consider mainstream Mormons
corrupt and led astray. Guess it doesn't apply to the music.
Mountain-man | 9:57 p.m. April 24, 2008
This is not about the FLDS, Polygamy nor under-age-marraige, it's about All
Americans and our constitutional rights! Where's the due process?? Where
are the patriots? I don't care what abuse they have done, this abuse tops
them all. First one little cult, then another, then religion all together! the
very things this country was founded on.
Crying in the Night | 10:01 p.m. April 24, 2008
Pray for these babies separated and the little ones.. tonight will be a VERY
difficult night. Tomorrow they will likely be very very depressed..it goes
downhill, not uphill from now on with these little ones... The babies may not
eat either. I cannot believe they are being punished and abused (I guess this is
legal abuse...) this way for the crimes of the father's (which may not be
ALL of the men)...
I suspect that if I was early 20's I would lie about being underage to stay with my children--I would do almost anything to stay with them. I almost guarantee that is why the number of "teen moms" jumped on the day of separation..
I don't agree with child brides or rape or am a "FLDS sympathizer."
Guys, what is happening at TX CPS is not new. This violation occurs ALL THE TIME. I hope this tragedy will start a chain reaction to set a precident of CPS check and balance and better parental rights protection. I once read CPS is not child protection (just look at their figures) but parent punishment based on subjective (opinion/feeling based) feedback.
I suspect that if I was early 20's I would lie about being underage to stay with my children--I would do almost anything to stay with them. I almost guarantee that is why the number of "teen moms" jumped on the day of separation..
I don't agree with child brides or rape or am a "FLDS sympathizer."
Guys, what is happening at TX CPS is not new. This violation occurs ALL THE TIME. I hope this tragedy will start a chain reaction to set a precident of CPS check and balance and better parental rights protection. I once read CPS is not child protection (just look at their figures) but parent punishment based on subjective (opinion/feeling based) feedback.
wrz | 10:11 p.m. April 24, 2008
"WRZ...I agree the men are at fault. What Texas is trying to do is keep the
children away from abusive pedophiles."
You can't take away one person's (the women and children) constitutional rights in the process of entrapping/nabbing others who may be criminals (the men). Local, State, and Federal authorities, including the US Congress, need to figure out how to uphold the guarantees of the Constitution, including the First Amendment, in their pursuit of criminal conduct. If they can't do this then the criminals will (and should) go free. The US Constitution and amendments thereto, trump all laws, rules regulations, determinations, judgments, provisions, procedures, etc., including those under which the CPS and the Texas judge are conducting this charade.
You can't take away one person's (the women and children) constitutional rights in the process of entrapping/nabbing others who may be criminals (the men). Local, State, and Federal authorities, including the US Congress, need to figure out how to uphold the guarantees of the Constitution, including the First Amendment, in their pursuit of criminal conduct. If they can't do this then the criminals will (and should) go free. The US Constitution and amendments thereto, trump all laws, rules regulations, determinations, judgments, provisions, procedures, etc., including those under which the CPS and the Texas judge are conducting this charade.
Show some mercy | 10:13 p.m. April 24, 2008
Those mothers, even if they are 60 now, they are still victims who probably also
got pregnant before they turned 18. Why doesn't anybody show some mercy for
them? They should treat them as refugees, give them the option of abandoning the
compound and staying with their kids. They have imposed husbands, hard working
lives, their kids are all that they have, how can Texas be so cruel to them?
Sure some of them might be brainwashed into crazy religious beliefs but some
others are not and because of the magnitude of the case they might not get a
fair trail based in their own personal situation. As a mother, I feel very
empathic for them, no one is perfect but mothers try hard.
Want to donate | 10:27 p.m. April 24, 2008
Can someone tell me where I can donate a few pairs of levi's and some
chocolate bars for these girls who were condemned to live such a deprived life
with few chances, limited education and a sentence at 14? Children who
can't even identify their parents and whose parents refuse to identify
them?!
I would also like to pay for some of the children to join sports teams. How traumatic its going to be when these boys realize they were being raised to become pedophiles.
As for the Mothers - just as bad as the rapists! YOU allowed your children and your neighbours children to be raped!! These children you say you love! Children dont need that kind of love!
I would also like to pay for some of the children to join sports teams. How traumatic its going to be when these boys realize they were being raised to become pedophiles.
As for the Mothers - just as bad as the rapists! YOU allowed your children and your neighbours children to be raped!! These children you say you love! Children dont need that kind of love!
Re: Want to Donate | 10:43 p.m. April 24, 2008
"limited education"?
Gosanangelo posting reported that initial testing revealed they are at or above grade levels.
There is such ignorance about homeschooling..sure there are a few bad apples but public school is one too. Apparently YFZ is not one of those though.
As far as your Levi's--keep them but donate the chocolate--gosanangelo reported what homes they are going to so mail them and tell them you are fighting for them to return home--whichever "home" they choose-It will mean more than your Levi's which will be seen as an insult and immoral-farther pushing them away from any help.
As far as family relations... we are looking at a different culture that defines family differently. We are imposing our egocentricism and condemning these children because they see "Mother" and "Father" and "siblings" differently.
As far as identification..I doubt they wanted to cooperate given the warm welcome with AK47s at their door and their journals being ripped up and being torn from their parents.
As far as rape...CPS did not give any rape testimony (this "rape" is from Rozita) yet when they would have pulled the "big guns" to get custody of the children. You are jumping the gun in your judgments.
Gosanangelo posting reported that initial testing revealed they are at or above grade levels.
There is such ignorance about homeschooling..sure there are a few bad apples but public school is one too. Apparently YFZ is not one of those though.
As far as your Levi's--keep them but donate the chocolate--gosanangelo reported what homes they are going to so mail them and tell them you are fighting for them to return home--whichever "home" they choose-It will mean more than your Levi's which will be seen as an insult and immoral-farther pushing them away from any help.
As far as family relations... we are looking at a different culture that defines family differently. We are imposing our egocentricism and condemning these children because they see "Mother" and "Father" and "siblings" differently.
As far as identification..I doubt they wanted to cooperate given the warm welcome with AK47s at their door and their journals being ripped up and being torn from their parents.
As far as rape...CPS did not give any rape testimony (this "rape" is from Rozita) yet when they would have pulled the "big guns" to get custody of the children. You are jumping the gun in your judgments.
Legal Child Abuse | 10:52 p.m. April 24, 2008
What CPS is doing to all the children is legal abuse and thought police.
Prosecute the crime and handcuff the criminal--check your "Sarahs" and
lock away perverts(why does CPS say "there were many Sarah's in her
condition"? "Her" never existed!). When "abuse" is now
labeled "submission to a husband" or "isolationism" (from
this wicked world but still providing heart and home) you start riding a fine
line of thought policing. I doubt that the trauma that these children are
enduring tonight and the next year will EVER amount to any
"indoctrination" that would have occurred these next 2 months before
the next hearing. It would seem CPS in their handbook only allows for removal if
the child's life is in danger but they constantly stretch that to mean
"we don't like the "feel" of your home". I doubt any
babies or under 12 years of age will have ended up dead or raped under CPS
supervision if the moms could have retained them. This was heavy handed and the
children are now the abuse victims. Who monitors CPS for their abuse? This
happens every day folks, and I am not busting CPS on children who are TRULY at
risk.
Texas CPS | 11:10 p.m. April 24, 2008
If Texas CPS acts like this in the public with cameras and nation-wide
audience, I can hardly imagine how they act to the average family who
doesn't receive a shred of media attention if they are ever falsely accused
or "false warrant". No Judge wants to say CPS is wrong.
ParentalRights org(anization) and Texas Home School Coalition highlighted and highlights Texas CPS corruption but I doubt it stops in Texas. I hope this leads to a check and balance system of CPS like any other gov't organizations. They are inadvertently raising a generation of children who will hate CPS. When I was a child and truly abused, they did nothing despite my cries and I was stuck. And yet, today I know of dozens of GREAT families who were torn apart and split up due to either vengeful "anonymous" phone calls or false or misinterpreted allegations. I strive everyday to be a great parent and even though I do not abuse my children I am still scared of CPS every day because I know that even though I follow their parental guidelines, that even the perfect parent is not perfect enough and they can take my children regardless.
ParentalRights org(anization) and Texas Home School Coalition highlighted and highlights Texas CPS corruption but I doubt it stops in Texas. I hope this leads to a check and balance system of CPS like any other gov't organizations. They are inadvertently raising a generation of children who will hate CPS. When I was a child and truly abused, they did nothing despite my cries and I was stuck. And yet, today I know of dozens of GREAT families who were torn apart and split up due to either vengeful "anonymous" phone calls or false or misinterpreted allegations. I strive everyday to be a great parent and even though I do not abuse my children I am still scared of CPS every day because I know that even though I follow their parental guidelines, that even the perfect parent is not perfect enough and they can take my children regardless.
Re: Re: Want to Donate | 11:32 p.m. April 24, 2008
I had no idea there was such a thing as homeschooling at university level.
Please enlighten me. If at this point you are thinking 'oops', it is
your ignorance about my comments that is showing. My children have unlimited
education choices; these kids dont.
Rape - anyone under age of consent pregnant not legally married is legally rape. New reports so far indicate there are at least 25. And before you state they are married; not in the legal sense.
Parentage: They can't charge anyone with rape until they can prove parentage by DNA. Because the parents wont identify the children, they have to resort to such lengths
Telling me to keep the Levi's is insulting to these children. Why are YOU trying to make decisions for them. Why are you unwilling to give them choices?
Why would you tell me to tell 'them' I am fighting for them to return home? I don't take orders from you.
Sounds like you are one of those control freaks who not only is willing to force your ideals and opinions on children and NOT give them choices, but also feel you can instruct me on what to say. What are you? Taliban?
Rape - anyone under age of consent pregnant not legally married is legally rape. New reports so far indicate there are at least 25. And before you state they are married; not in the legal sense.
Parentage: They can't charge anyone with rape until they can prove parentage by DNA. Because the parents wont identify the children, they have to resort to such lengths
Telling me to keep the Levi's is insulting to these children. Why are YOU trying to make decisions for them. Why are you unwilling to give them choices?
Why would you tell me to tell 'them' I am fighting for them to return home? I don't take orders from you.
Sounds like you are one of those control freaks who not only is willing to force your ideals and opinions on children and NOT give them choices, but also feel you can instruct me on what to say. What are you? Taliban?
RE: Re: Want to Donate | 11:40 p.m. April 24, 2008
No Levi's? Wow. Wouldnt want to offend anyone.
But then, by existing I offend FLDS. Being that we on the outside are a great evil and are going to "force their girls to have sex with lots of men".
And now they want help from the great evil.
Where can I sign up to send a few pairs of Levi's too?
But then, by existing I offend FLDS. Being that we on the outside are a great evil and are going to "force their girls to have sex with lots of men".
And now they want help from the great evil.
Where can I sign up to send a few pairs of Levi's too?
Dori Harston | 11:39 p.m. April 24, 2008
It would be rather elementery to me, had I been following the teachings of some
nerd who dictated and controlled my life, that I would DISCONTINUE following him
after he ADMITTED to the authorities that he is NOT A PROPHET! Apparently this
was his statement upon being arrested in Nev. News apparently does not get to
those under his dictatorship?
Do any of you living in either Utah, Ariz. Texas, Co, know what percentage of your taxes go monthly to house and feed these ILLEGAL free-loaders?
Do any of you living in either Utah, Ariz. Texas, Co, know what percentage of your taxes go monthly to house and feed these ILLEGAL free-loaders?
To ML | 11:51 p.m. April 24, 2008
I must be an abuser, as I don't have swings or a bb court either, and I
have 8 kids!
Quick! call CPS! My kids are unhappy because I don't have a swingset or BB Court
Quick! call CPS! My kids are unhappy because I don't have a swingset or BB Court
Misinformation | 11:52 p.m. April 24, 2008
I just looked at the "Damage" pictures from the captivefldschildren
site and I am beginning to question the media and their information. I saw a
radio in the bedroom! I thought these children were "sheltered" from
technology. Apparently this boombox (portable) can have CDs/cassettes and radio!
I am seeing happy crayon pictures and happy children playing and doing education
at their desks. I don't think we are getting much truth. The pictures grip
my heart of the children being lead away in the presence of machine guns. I
doubt my children would say much to anyone or play with coloring books (which my
children do not like--they free draw) if guns were around them and torn from me.
I think these "teen" moms are mostly over 18. CPS never presented any
14 year old brides when they had the chance at the last hearing or any rape
cases. They are using a hoax call and trying to substantiate a group conviction.
You cannot tell me that ALL these families were committing rape. I am reading
the posts of many people who know Flora and she needs to be checked out before
we think her words are Gospel.
OregonPioneer | 12:00 a.m. April 25, 2008
I hear a lot of armchair quarterbacks making criticisms on the actions taken by
the State of Texas, but at least they did something about the FLDS in their
state. It seems that some Utahns are getting defensive because Texas had the
guts to do something while in Utah they've let this cult cause all kinds of
trouble while turning a blind eye... for decades.
truth | 12:08 a.m. April 25, 2008
Why do you all sound like you all saw the flds people doing all kinds of evil
things when texas can't even find one thing they have done wrong. They have
to go take them all and then look for even one thing they might have done. they
can't find anything and have not found anything wrong with them. Should
they not have all the rights that every other person has, I think so. Why do
people go on and on about how flds rape and all that. Wow you all think you know
that its happening but how do you know. Texas can't find whats not there
and what they are looking for does not happen there or with that many people
looking it would have been found. All i ask is until you see it dont sound like
you have
anonymous | 1:05 a.m. April 25, 2008
In response to UT paper on Texas incidents. The Utah paper may be owned by the
LDS church, but it is obvious from this coverage that it has the freedom to
operate as an independent newspaper for it's readers of all faiths in Utah
and around the country. The church has other publications which are the official
publications for it's members, such as the Ensign, Church News etc. The
Deseret News is an excellent newspaper which over the years has had a lot of
experience in reporting on members of the FLDS and other fundmentalist churches
and because of this experience it has been able to tell both sides of the story
more effectively than other news media. If the newspaper wasn't reporting
on this subject at all these messages boards would be filled with people
accusing them of covering up something or taking sides with the FLDS by not
commenting. By doing their jobs effectively they show that they are willing to
to continue to inform their readers and others around the world in a fair and
balanced manner.
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