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Texas harming FLDS children, Utah group says
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DAve | 7:08 a.m. April 22, 2008
But look on the bright side, as soon as texas can "mainstreem' these
children they will have the opportunity to join a nice gang and try drugs and
alcohol.
AMEN | 7:11 a.m. April 22, 2008
How nice to hear the voice of reason from someone who should know better.
Wouldn't it be nice to see the Texas Authorities charged with child
abuse...
Anonymous | 8:37 a.m. April 22, 2008
Leave it to Texas. Or rather, Walther. Who was it that made her signer of
warrants, judge, jury, and executioner? I don't normally agree with
attacking one person, but she is now the one on trial, guilty until proven
innocent. What happened to her heart? These are babies!
Comments continue below
??? | 8:42 a.m. April 22, 2008
Texas is doing the best they can with that number of children. The FLDS are the
ones that should be blamed for putting Texas in this postion. Had Texas not
found evidence of abuse they would have let them be.
G | 10:06 a.m. April 22, 2008
"Had Texas not found evidence of abuse they would have let them
be."
Where exactly is that "evidence"?
Where exactly is that "evidence"?
Proud Texan | 12:29 p.m. April 22, 2008
I do believe the evidence is confidential, but think 16-year-olds with 3-4 kids by 50-year-old sleazeballs would be a pretty good indicator that sexual abuse is going on.
Anonymous | 2:01 p.m. April 22, 2008
And the nursing infants. Were they sexually abused?
Not quite | 2:28 p.m. April 22, 2008
I haven't seen a single report of any 16 year old girls with 3-4 kids. The
reports have only been that they have seen some girls who APPEAR to be
teenagers, who are pregnant. I guess in Proud Texan fashion you just made up
the rest, fill in the blanks, it gives you a reason to do whatever you want to
these people, all in the name of justice.
Empathetic mother | 2:28 p.m. April 22, 2008
Assuming there was abuse (innocent until proven guilty). Why rip the kids from
the only home and environment they have ever known? If they have been abused,
why abuse them further? Where are you going to find better (or even equal)homes
for 437 children?
Also, it's interesting that a middle school in Maine has just started dispensing perscription contraceptives to their students. That's 11-15 year olds. Where is the outrage there?
Also, it's interesting that a middle school in Maine has just started dispensing perscription contraceptives to their students. That's 11-15 year olds. Where is the outrage there?
voice of reason | 2:38 p.m. April 22, 2008
to ???:
texas did not find evidence of abuse. but they have also not "let them be".
texas did not find evidence of abuse. but they have also not "let them be".
Wheezy | 5:07 p.m. April 22, 2008
I love Peter's quote regarding that she hopes Texas CPS is simply clueless
regarding child welfare. I guess the FLDS mothers are way better at it.
Consider that the girls are being raised to fulfill their destiny (as determined
by the prophet) and the boys are raised to contribute to the wealth of the
community until such age that they have proven themselves worthy of marriage
(plural) or out they go. So much for motherly love. I applaud Texas for
attempting to get a handle on the problem. As far as SWAT teams, remember Waco?
Even polygamist groups in Utah have been violent. Remember Ervil Lebaron and his murderous followers when they killed two people from competing groups right here in SLC? I don't trust happy faces and long dresses.
Even polygamist groups in Utah have been violent. Remember Ervil Lebaron and his murderous followers when they killed two people from competing groups right here in SLC? I don't trust happy faces and long dresses.
??? | 7:01 p.m. April 22, 2008
TO Voice of reason and G
Reports and evidence in juvenile matters are sealed. A judge has found probable cause for the children to remain in states custody, and I think the judge had more facts then the press has released to anyone here. I can't believe you guys find it so hard to believe that the FLDS may have abused these kids.
Reports and evidence in juvenile matters are sealed. A judge has found probable cause for the children to remain in states custody, and I think the judge had more facts then the press has released to anyone here. I can't believe you guys find it so hard to believe that the FLDS may have abused these kids.
Anonymous | 7:53 p.m. April 22, 2008
Is being seized by CPS traumatic? Yup! I bet it's traumatic for kids and
parents both for different reasons. Is it more disorienting than getting moved
around and assigned new daddies at will? What about the risk of getting kicked
out and shunned? Ummm, hard to say. Maybe the kids are such little
shape-shifting wizards that they will adapt brilliantly and take this all as
just another upheaval where they have to figure out who to obey now.
I am hoping and praying the kids do not wind up fitting in really well with other sociopaths in foster care.
I am hoping and praying that at least a few of the kids find new doors opening and learn that the outside world, while certainly not short of horrors, also has strengths and beauties and opportunites for them. I am hoping and praying that MAYBE some of them get to see normal human relationships where people love and look out for each other without all the freaky overtones at YFZ.
I am also hopign and praying that at least some of the parents do a whole lot of praying and considering and get a wakeup call, a reality check too!
I am hoping and praying the kids do not wind up fitting in really well with other sociopaths in foster care.
I am hoping and praying that at least a few of the kids find new doors opening and learn that the outside world, while certainly not short of horrors, also has strengths and beauties and opportunites for them. I am hoping and praying that MAYBE some of them get to see normal human relationships where people love and look out for each other without all the freaky overtones at YFZ.
I am also hopign and praying that at least some of the parents do a whole lot of praying and considering and get a wakeup call, a reality check too!
to little minded anonymous | 1:13 a.m. April 23, 2008
Where to start? The risk of getting shunned? I want to know where you live so I
can join you because everywhere that I have been in this WORLD, being shunned is
an everyday fear of everyone. And how many kids in the "world" get
"new" daddies or mommies on a regular basis because their parents
fight all the time or sleep around and cheat on eachother? Which is the less of
two evils? And this "hope" for the chance to see "normal"
human relationships???? Would that be a homosexual relationship? or
inter-racial? or Hugh Hefner relationship? or the multi-family/ extended family
dwellings? or would that be the boyfriend went crazy on the girlfriend and
killed her relationship? I am trying to figure out what you mean by the
"normal" relationship???? EVERY religion has its downsides and people
that dont agree with the way it is lived, too bad. There is no evidence that
makes these people less worthy. There are areas for improvement, I am
sure...just like the rest of us!
Kelli in Texas | 9:25 p.m. April 23, 2008
I read this article and some of these comments and it frustrates me that people
do not get what is really going on here. These are kids. Would we leave kids in
a "Crack-drug" house just because that was what they had lived in
their whole life? No, we are supposed to protect children and their innocence.
Instead of giving your "opinion" on what you think CPS and Texas are
doing wrong, help be a solution. If you are a professional in helping children
that come out of these cults, offer your services. Help us help these kids and
these mothers. Let me assure you, we have not ever had to deal with anything
like this in San Angelo. I pray that all these kids recover and heal from the
trauma that has surrounded them for all their lives and for what they are going
through right now. I'm sure this comment will frustrate some people and
that's okay. Because if it frustrates you, you will think about it more and
maybe if we all work together for the sake of these kids, we might can make a
change. Thank you for listening.
the actual court case | 11:59 p.m. April 23, 2008
If I was on a jury, and had no preconcieved notions, there is no way I would
place any of those kids in foster care. The whole court case focussed soley on
whether the parents believed underage marriage wrong or not, and that flds
people were incapable of making decisions because of what they had been taught
their whole lives. Not once was coercion by threat or foce even mentioned! Not
once was a specific case of underage marriage presented. Those things would
have only proved individual cases of abuse. The only way to treat all 400+ kids
that they apparently can't even count, as one single case, was to declare
the beliefs "abusive". The judge, with a straight face, declared all
400+ children in "immenent danger" for abuse because of the parents
beliefs (not actions - they did not discuss actions at all!), and because of
what the kids were taught (not how - the only testinony on how was that the
mother never yelled at her kids) concluding WHAT one teaches therir kids makes
those kids incapable of decision making, and what one believes makes those kids
in "immenent danger" of being abused.
Sj Bobkins | 1:21 a.m. April 24, 2008
OH Molly, the hypocrisy!
You condone kids being ripped permanently from their dads to be "GIVEN" to another man, on "pofit" Warren's order, yet whine about Texas trying to get to the bottom of this child sexual abuse mess. Truly Amazing, how a human brain can rationalize.
You condone kids being ripped permanently from their dads to be "GIVEN" to another man, on "pofit" Warren's order, yet whine about Texas trying to get to the bottom of this child sexual abuse mess. Truly Amazing, how a human brain can rationalize.
Diana | 1:43 a.m. April 24, 2008
I read tonight that they released two of the girls that they THOUGHT were teens
to go back to the ranch because CPS finally concluded that they weren't
minors after all. This supports what the FLDS people were saying in interviews,
that despite drivers� licenses, SS cards and birth
certificates, CPS would not accept that women who looked young were in fact in
their twenties. It will be interesting to learn the extent of any actual abuse
compared to the scope of what was done to these folks.
MJ | 12:29 a.m. April 25, 2008
Yeah, taking children out of an environment of systematic sexual abuse could
really damage them.
OH PLEASE!
OH PLEASE!
Mrs. Smith | 1:32 a.m. April 28, 2008
This is the most revolting abuse of children, babies, families, and civil rights
I have ever witnessed.
"Judge" Walther has no heart. She is stone cold. She'll face her Nuremberg, though, and she WASN'T just doing her job. She was being, and is being, s soul-less, unbelievably callous woman. No one with a half a heart could treat these poor families and babies and children like this.
THERE WAS NO ABUSE FOUND! IT WAS A PHONEY ALLEGATION OF ABUSE!!! TEXAS, AND ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE OF AMERICA - DO SOMETHING TO HELP THESE PEOPLE - write to your politicians, tell your friends and neighbours you will not tolerate this abomination of humanity!
ACT!!!!!!!
"Judge" Walther has no heart. She is stone cold. She'll face her Nuremberg, though, and she WASN'T just doing her job. She was being, and is being, s soul-less, unbelievably callous woman. No one with a half a heart could treat these poor families and babies and children like this.
THERE WAS NO ABUSE FOUND! IT WAS A PHONEY ALLEGATION OF ABUSE!!! TEXAS, AND ALL THE GOOD PEOPLE OF AMERICA - DO SOMETHING TO HELP THESE PEOPLE - write to your politicians, tell your friends and neighbours you will not tolerate this abomination of humanity!
ACT!!!!!!!
Mrs. Smith | 1:34 a.m. April 28, 2008
BEWARE the catch phrase:
"In the best interests of the child."
That's the phrase they'll use when they want to condone an act that is tantamount to murdering YOUR family.
"In the best interests of the child."
That's the phrase they'll use when they want to condone an act that is tantamount to murdering YOUR family.
Jude | 11:20 p.m. April 28, 2008
No real Texan would have separated mothers and children like that. Let those
mothers know that through the grace of God, with each one of us praying, and
acting through spiritual guidance, their children will be safely returned. Here
in Beaumont, Texas I am raising money to send to the legal defense fund for the
FLDS families.
About ten years ago my family was similarly attacked by CPS. You're not fighting against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against wickedness in high places. The power of prayer defeats them. I thank God for the safe return of my children and pray for the safe return of yours.
About ten years ago my family was similarly attacked by CPS. You're not fighting against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against wickedness in high places. The power of prayer defeats them. I thank God for the safe return of my children and pray for the safe return of yours.
Dawn | 3:30 p.m. April 29, 2008
Lets look at it another way. A 14 yr old child has the choice of being forced
to have sex with a man 20 yrs older than her, or of being forced to cope with a
new way of living? I am a parent, life has its stress and tradgedies
everywhere. Children are resiliant if enough love, support, and coping skills
are given to them. I would rather help a child cope with a new lifestyle
instead of rape. Isn't having children at age 14 abuse also?
There is no way these kids could have won, no matter what the state did or didn't do. The important thing now is what is being done to help them cope! Whats done is done, now clean up the mess that both the state and the sect have created! Had these 14 yr old girls gotten pregnant outside of the sect, what would their lives have brought? These are still children, and they still need hope, love, and as much help as anyone can offer them.
There is no way these kids could have won, no matter what the state did or didn't do. The important thing now is what is being done to help them cope! Whats done is done, now clean up the mess that both the state and the sect have created! Had these 14 yr old girls gotten pregnant outside of the sect, what would their lives have brought? These are still children, and they still need hope, love, and as much help as anyone can offer them.
Hattie | 6:21 p.m. May 5, 2008
Yes indeed this is traumatic! I too was taken from my mother by CPS (but that
was long, long ago). The FLDS children need to be removed because their mothers
are not in a position to protect them. The mothers are abused (and may not
realize it... just as my own mother) and unless the mother asks for help and
wants out of the FLDS culture, she should not be given custody of her children
just to teach them (expecially the girls) to accept this riduculous alliegence
to the men who need at least three wives to het into "heaven." I need
three icecream cones to get to "heaven"...lol
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