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Search of FLDS temple site complete
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lynn | 12:07 p.m. April 10, 2008
Resume their normal lives? With all of their children snatched under slim
pretext and placed in state custody? Give me a break. I'm no ACLU
supporter, but this sounds a little too "Short Creek" even to me.
Matter of time | 12:49 p.m. April 10, 2008
Like most people I think this group is "way out there". However, I
find myself bothered by the fact that a single phone call prompted such a
response. I hope they had other evidence (other than innuendo about a
strange/perculiar religion) to break up families and invade their holy place.
Why hasn't the ACLU spoken out for this group?
amazed1 | 12:44 p.m. April 10, 2008
Everyone seems to be fixated on the sexual aspect of this story. Have the FLDS
men been having sex and impregnating only underage girls all this time? Who
built the compound...the "obviously older" women with their children?
Child abuse should be dealt with, but not by condemning "EVERYONE".
What we have heard for years and years against the FLDS has come from those who
are embittered against them. It would be some interesting reading to have access
to FLDS followers' stories.
Comments continue below
Rich | 12:52 p.m. April 10, 2008
I read in the hard copy of the Deseret News that Shurtleff claims to have
"almost" conducted a raid of the Utah FLDS, saying he didn't do
it, deciding instead to work with the group's attorneys, and then the
suspects he sought vanished. My question: If polygamy is illegal, why not
enforce laws against it? The mistake of the 1953 Short Creek raid wasn't
the raid itself; it was backing off, allowing citizens to publicy flout the law
and continue the practice of polygamy. Now I hear that Shurtleff is telling
FLDS in Utah that they don't have to worry about his conducting a raid
here. Another huge mistake IMHO. Let's either change the law so that
polygamists can conduct their lives in the open, or let's enforce the law.
Why have laws that we don't enforce?
amazed1 | 12:57 p.m. April 10, 2008
That was mighty big of "them" to opt to search the temple last. When,
in all the years of hearing about the FLDS, have they actually hidden abuse?What
we "know" has come from embittered ex-members. I hope these children
will be treated with respect to their wishes. If 9 to 17 year old girls (and
boys) out in the "normal?" world are being allowed to buy
contraceptives, have sex and generally do as they please...I surely hope these
children will be allowed to stay with their parents if they so choose.
RE: Matter of time | 1:05 p.m. April 10, 2008
I've had the same thoughts. Although this is one odd religious group. But I
feel something fishy is going on regarding that phone call. This seems as though
they've got "Gestappo" police taking these people to another
compound under the direction of the "The First Baptist" church written
on these 2 white buses according to a photo shown on this website a week
earlier.
sam | 1:07 p.m. April 10, 2008
I don't agree with the practice of polygamy and find the FLDS to be a
strange people. However, it broke my heart to read how the FLDS people knelt
and prayed and sobbed around the outside of the temple. I can only imagine any
Latter Day Saint would respond the same way if their temple were being broken
into by authorities. It is a sacred edifice to them, and only certain people
are allowed inside. It would be desecration to them of their holy place.
Opinionated | 1:10 p.m. April 10, 2008
I don't agree with their beliefs, but this is scary. What would we do if
they showed up at the Salt Lake Temple with the jaws of life to get inside?
Shauna | 1:16 p.m. April 10, 2008
I think the issue isn't just about polygamy, it's about child abuse.
If they had reports of sex with underage girls going on inside their Temple,
then Texas authorities had an obligation to check this out. How sacred can this
edifice be if child-rape is going on inside its walls?
Oink Oink! | 1:17 p.m. April 10, 2008
It's about time the authorities searched out these child abusers! What
ashame for our world to have such people living it who do this to children.
Would any of you want to be a breeding machine?
Anyone who condones this sort of piggery needs to get some serious help! And FAST!
To some of you morons on this site, the authorities did the right thing.
Anyone who condones this sort of piggery needs to get some serious help! And FAST!
To some of you morons on this site, the authorities did the right thing.
Anon | 1:20 p.m. April 10, 2008
Take note the fear of the mormons is raising it ugly head again. Egnoring the
constitution and proceeding without facts and real evidence is what happened to
the early church. Desecration of sacred buildings, tearing families apart in
2008 should be familiar to Latter-day Saints. We claim the priviage of
worshiping Almight God according to our own revelations can be swept away in a
heart beat.
Members of the church need to be concerned about what is happening in Texas.
Members of the church need to be concerned about what is happening in Texas.
sickos | 1:21 p.m. April 10, 2008
Yet more sick stories from a very sick patriarchal culture.
Amazed you amaze me | 1:27 p.m. April 10, 2008
Amazed1---your comment lacks one main point. Those kids in our
"normal" world who are buying contraceptives are doing so on
free-will. Their parents are not forcing them. Religous freedoms have gone too
far--all these men need to be convicted sex offenders and all these girls/women
need to be put through counseling to undo the deep brainwashing and abuse that
they have been put through.
Anonymous | 1:23 p.m. April 10, 2008
" However, it broke my heart to read how the FLDS people knelt and prayed
and sobbed around the outside of the temple. I can only imagine any Latter Day
Saint would respond the same way if their temple were being broken into by
authorities. It is a sacred edifice to them, and only certain people are allowed
inside. It would be desecration to them of their holy place. "
Sound more than a little like idolatry to me. Treating a building as more than a building is no different than a golden calf in my book.
Sound more than a little like idolatry to me. Treating a building as more than a building is no different than a golden calf in my book.
compare? | 1:27 p.m. April 10, 2008
Why are people comparing Latter Day Saints to them. I don't want to be
compared to them. Noone is going to show up at the Salt Lake Temple. They do
not follow the laws of the land. They are wrong. If they thought there was
evidence in their temple then they had to go in. If you want to
"Pretend" or let your mind run wild that they would ever show up at
the SLC temple than imagine that they could find an official that is a member to
go in. This si so sick they need to follow the rules.
Jackson | 1:28 p.m. April 10, 2008
Resume their normal lives, lol. All their stuff was rifled through or stolen,
and their holiest place defiled, with doors and walls smashed and broken down
with jaws of life machines. Their wives and children were stolen away.
And the suspect they supposedly were after hasn't even set foot in that state for 30 years. Not to mention they can't produce this supposed abused girl.
And the suspect they supposedly were after hasn't even set foot in that state for 30 years. Not to mention they can't produce this supposed abused girl.
Anonymous | 1:32 p.m. April 10, 2008
WHo cares if she is real. They are still sick and wrong and anyone defending
them please do not say your are LDS!
Kim | 1:33 p.m. April 10, 2008
Amazed1.... Amen
pixel105 | 1:34 p.m. April 10, 2008
If you want to know the inside story of the poltgamous cult lead by Warren Jeffs
(who live at the YFZ Ranch in TX and in Colorado City, AZ.), check out the
recent documentary BANKING ON HEAVEN.
Anonymous | 1:42 p.m. April 10, 2008
Patriarchy is patriarchy.
What would you expect?
What would you expect?
Texan | 1:43 p.m. April 10, 2008
Under Texas law if there is any report about possible child abuse the state has
to act on it. If the state had not done so and more things had happened that
came to light people would have been upset that the state of Texas did not do
anything to investigate or stop the abuse when allegations were brought to the
attention of authortities. When did Utah go into that polygamy haven you have
there when they knew young girls were forced into marriages that were illegal
and immoral? Y'all just sat on it for years with a blind eye. It is sad
these families are apart but at least Texas didn't sit and keep letting it
happen. The people of this wonderful state are stepping forward to help the
counties who have taken on this monumental task of caring for and providing for
these children. It is more than Utah ever did all the years they allowed it to
go unchecked with their thinking about doing something but talkling about it.
Jodi | 1:46 p.m. April 10, 2008
Why are the "victims" pictures splashed across the front page of the
newpaper and on every television newscast? I thought victims of sexual abuse
and children's identities were supposed to be hidden. I guess not when
they are dressed funny.
Plain and simple | 1:53 p.m. April 10, 2008
I agree with the previous two comments. This is not about polygamy or religious
freedom, it is about child abuse plain and simple. If we don't have the
right to go onto somebody's property and search when somebody calls to
complain about physical and sexual abuse, then we simply are not protecting our
children. The government obtained a legal search warrant and removed children
from danger, a far cry from the Gestapo. If Utah and Arizona would have cared
more about protecting children instead of taking the easier route of ignoring
it, Texas would never have had to do this. I'm sure the idiots who stand up
for these child abusers will have a great explanation for the beds they found in
the FLDS temple too. The government was going in because child abuse was alleged
to have occurred. There is no constitutionally protected right to abuse
children.
live the law | 2:05 p.m. April 10, 2008
they don't seem to be moaning and crying about breaching the temple of
young children ..what a farce victums ...i am one too...as these are felonies
who use my tax money for their children.
Random Thoughts | 2:11 p.m. April 10, 2008
"Go back to normal lives" Can any young girl go back to a normal life
after going through what they do?
We've know for years about the abuse of children in polygamous groups. Texas, at least, is strong enough to do something about it. My question is why now and on such litte evidence? Maybe to take our minds off of Bear Stearns, economy tanking, etc?Also, good points about showing pictures of abuse victims. While I think it is long overdue that the men in this group be sent to prison, the timing and the publicy violations make me go hmmmmm....
We've know for years about the abuse of children in polygamous groups. Texas, at least, is strong enough to do something about it. My question is why now and on such litte evidence? Maybe to take our minds off of Bear Stearns, economy tanking, etc?Also, good points about showing pictures of abuse victims. While I think it is long overdue that the men in this group be sent to prison, the timing and the publicy violations make me go hmmmmm....
Jeff Ward | 2:36 p.m. April 10, 2008
I cannot believe the USA is not outraged by this-- since when does a search
warrant become so broad as to allow them to search the whole property and to
kidnap all those children-- A search warrant is a limited document looking in
specific area for a specific piece of evidence. There was 1 individual making a
charge- the search should have been for that 1 individual and the perp-- not a
complete confiscation of computers, documents, kidnapping of 416 children-- Just
the 1 specific home, victim, and perp not the whole area owned by the Church.
They have tried to make thes individuals look like crazies and calling it a
"Compound" to make it seem more strange. I work with many of the FLDS
people several times a month--- they have always been honest, straight forward
and God loving and fearing people. If they commit a crime they know they will
be punished--- Want to know why the outcome of Waco was so terrible--- the
Government will vilify anyone and then seek to destroy them. The FLDS people
have issues we don't understand but I can't understand the Government
on this one! Kidnapping! Unlawful Searches! Lies! Mis-truths! We're
better!
Enforcing the Law | 2:35 p.m. April 10, 2008
If we enforce the laws against polygamy, we also need to enforce the laws
against sodomy, unmarried sexual relations, cohabitation, and so forth. Why
just leave it with polygamy? There are several laws going unenforced. We
cannot be selective and be providing equal protection under the law....
Jay | 2:44 p.m. April 10, 2008
Before I pass judgement and make all kinds of accusations, I will wait until all
evidence is in!!
Anonymous | 2:53 p.m. April 10, 2008
They took practically all the children they found in the community with one
possible case of abuse. There is a registered sex offender around the corner in
my neighborhood. If they were to take all the children away here, everyone
would be up in arms.
They needed to look into this matter. But did they need to do so in this manner? I kept thinking back on the first two temples of the LDS and what the mobs did to them when reading this story. It is very troubling, even if I abhor polygamy (I can't manage one family responsibly, let alone multiple)!!
They needed to look into this matter. But did they need to do so in this manner? I kept thinking back on the first two temples of the LDS and what the mobs did to them when reading this story. It is very troubling, even if I abhor polygamy (I can't manage one family responsibly, let alone multiple)!!
Chris L. | 2:49 p.m. April 10, 2008
The sexual abuse of children under the guise of religion is an
abomination...These FLDS males need to be brought to justice.
However, the power to search private property on the tip of and anonymous victim/whistle blower is a really scary thing. Could one of your disgruntled neighbors call the authorities posing as a 15 year old girl and allege similar things and get this same result? In the real world the authorities should have a little more to go on than a phone call. Just sayin'.
However, the power to search private property on the tip of and anonymous victim/whistle blower is a really scary thing. Could one of your disgruntled neighbors call the authorities posing as a 15 year old girl and allege similar things and get this same result? In the real world the authorities should have a little more to go on than a phone call. Just sayin'.
It's back again... | 2:57 p.m. April 10, 2008
Who is watching out for the people here. Their rights are being trampled to
death. Everyone in the world does not practice the same lifestyle. The
government is overstepping their authority. We are condemning the whole society,
vandalizing their holy places, because of one phone call. Imperialism is back
here in the good ol USA!!!!!
East Coast | 3:02 p.m. April 10, 2008
I am completely amazed at amazed1. Wow, what a crazy comment.
Levi | 3:10 p.m. April 10, 2008
Opinionated and Shauna- The difference here is that if the police had a valid
warrant to search the LDS temple, we would work with them and allow them in. We
would not be out front holding hands trying to keep the police out. It would be
dealt with the correct way and they would not have to break down the doors to
get in. As a member of the LDS church I would not feel as if the police were
defiling the temple at all by doing their jobs. It's not like they were
trying to break in to spray graffitti or something!
bhparkman | 3:11 p.m. April 10, 2008
To Texan,
I absolutely agree. Utah authorities did not act on this, and some former legislators did their best to legalize polygamy. Few arrests and light sentences resulted from Utah leaders lack of onion's in dealing with the hard issues.
I'm glad Texas did this. I want Utah leaders to grow some onions to stand up to Federal and special interests, and get our problems fixed instead of supported - or we'll find others who will.
I absolutely agree. Utah authorities did not act on this, and some former legislators did their best to legalize polygamy. Few arrests and light sentences resulted from Utah leaders lack of onion's in dealing with the hard issues.
I'm glad Texas did this. I want Utah leaders to grow some onions to stand up to Federal and special interests, and get our problems fixed instead of supported - or we'll find others who will.
jessejames | 3:04 p.m. April 10, 2008
Texas:
I find you comment naive. The phone call your referring to took place on Monday. It took the authorities until thursday to respond. When in the history of 911 phone calls does it take three days to get a response. This phone call was manufactured and the response a well co-ordinated affair between state officials, police presence, child protect services, and The First Baptist Church. Texas has no moral compass. Take a closer look at the situation we call "Waco". Over 200 men, women, and children dead. I'm sure law inforcement was hoping to use their tanks to get into the temple.
I find you comment naive. The phone call your referring to took place on Monday. It took the authorities until thursday to respond. When in the history of 911 phone calls does it take three days to get a response. This phone call was manufactured and the response a well co-ordinated affair between state officials, police presence, child protect services, and The First Baptist Church. Texas has no moral compass. Take a closer look at the situation we call "Waco". Over 200 men, women, and children dead. I'm sure law inforcement was hoping to use their tanks to get into the temple.
Lots of opinions on here | 3:05 p.m. April 10, 2008
Things I agree with that have been posted:
FLDS are criminals as they steal money from the feds, they are criminals because the girls are underage. There isn't room for arguement on these points.
There's no reason to be upset that they have been raided. I appreciate that Texas takes child abuse charges seriously and they went in. It has nothing to do with the economy or anything else. All events are not linked to each other.
This while breach of the temple thing is silly for LDS people to talk about. There is no LDS compound with gates and walls for people to live in so the comparison is apples and oranges.
FLDS are criminals as they steal money from the feds, they are criminals because the girls are underage. There isn't room for arguement on these points.
There's no reason to be upset that they have been raided. I appreciate that Texas takes child abuse charges seriously and they went in. It has nothing to do with the economy or anything else. All events are not linked to each other.
This while breach of the temple thing is silly for LDS people to talk about. There is no LDS compound with gates and walls for people to live in so the comparison is apples and oranges.
Finally!!!!!!!!!!!! | 3:17 p.m. April 10, 2008
IT'S ABOUT TIME
This should have been done long ago...now the infection has grown larger and the surgery is more painful. But, it still needed to be done.
This should have been done long ago...now the infection has grown larger and the surgery is more painful. But, it still needed to be done.
sleazy journalism | 3:23 p.m. April 10, 2008
The hard print of the Dnews talked about finding beds that had rumpled sheets as
if they had been slept in and even found a long hair on one - conclusion: sex
orgies by older men with under age girls.
It also said one girl who looked 16 was interviewed and when asked her age she looked at her older husband who told her to tell them she was 18 which she then did. How can you conclude she was 16 by her looks?? Did she have 16 horns on her head?
Finding slept in beds and girls who say they are 18 but look 16 are not facts on which to forcibly take people into custody. Hopefully the law enforcement involved have more evidence then what the media is reporting.
To the media: give us facts and reports on evidence not sleazy allegations or innuendo. These are people's lives whether we agree with the lifestyle or not. If laws are broken report that along with the evidence found that makes it true and leave the rest for the National Enquirer
It also said one girl who looked 16 was interviewed and when asked her age she looked at her older husband who told her to tell them she was 18 which she then did. How can you conclude she was 16 by her looks?? Did she have 16 horns on her head?
Finding slept in beds and girls who say they are 18 but look 16 are not facts on which to forcibly take people into custody. Hopefully the law enforcement involved have more evidence then what the media is reporting.
To the media: give us facts and reports on evidence not sleazy allegations or innuendo. These are people's lives whether we agree with the lifestyle or not. If laws are broken report that along with the evidence found that makes it true and leave the rest for the National Enquirer
Re: Jeff Ward's Outrage | 3:37 p.m. April 10, 2008
The true outrage is that this horrible practice of forcing young girls into
marrying abusive old men wasn't stopped years ago.
The child abusers who have run this child sex slave business need to be put out of business permanently.
Maybe now, the innocent children and brainwashed women will have a chance to begin a normal life.
The child abusers who have run this child sex slave business need to be put out of business permanently.
Maybe now, the innocent children and brainwashed women will have a chance to begin a normal life.
Texan Ego? | 3:49 p.m. April 10, 2008
To Texan, Please wake up and realize that the only reason Texas was able to raid
and take into custody 400+ kids was because they were all residing on one piece
of land. It only required one search warrant. If Utah or Arizona were to do this
type of raid or search, it would take thousands of search warrants. For each
search warrant you would need a cause to search the individualy owned property.
Texas had the added bennefit of the FLDS residing on one singly owned chunk of
private land.
If the FLDS had made that mistake in Utah or Arizona we would have been able to do the same thing. However, the logistics of how they are living in Utah and Arizona versus Texas is the only reason Texas has been able to do what they have done.
Utah was able to prosecute and convict their prophet. All Texas has done so far is sequester all their children. Texas is no better at enforcing the law than Utah of Arizona. Utah and Arizona have conducted multiple search warrants over the years. Texas so far has only done one.
If the FLDS had made that mistake in Utah or Arizona we would have been able to do the same thing. However, the logistics of how they are living in Utah and Arizona versus Texas is the only reason Texas has been able to do what they have done.
Utah was able to prosecute and convict their prophet. All Texas has done so far is sequester all their children. Texas is no better at enforcing the law than Utah of Arizona. Utah and Arizona have conducted multiple search warrants over the years. Texas so far has only done one.
Make It Fair | 4:14 p.m. April 10, 2008
I have a question. Would we do the same to a muslum temple. We regard their
temples as so sacred as to let them conduct meetings that we know involve all
kinds of issue harmful to our country including the plannning and plotting to
destroy us as Americans. I have no problem with them going into the FLDS
compound on good cause but lets make sure we have the same laws for everyone.
If we find a muslim temple that needs to be raided, lets do it as well.
Re: bhparkman | 3:11 p.m | 4:16 p.m. April 10, 2008
The phone call was not a 911 call it was to an abuse hotline. The hotline had to
report the girls claims to the authorities. When abuse is suspected and a report
is made the State must investigate!
Dan | 4:35 p.m. April 10, 2008
It seems to me that the whole process was a bit on the over kill side. When
individuals break the civil law they should be placed in custody, but this
action give the legal authorities an inch and they take the whole mile.
I'm pretty certain that the judge who issued the warrent may have been told
a rather embellished story, with the truth blown up to make the it shound worse
then it was. It takes one upset kid to call the law on their folks and the whole
child protective system goes in attack mode. Many times the facts don't
warrent the action taken by the law. Individial's lives are ruined and
families are never the same. Probable cause, it a liberal legal term, meaning,
we don't know if anything is really going on, so let's go on a fishing
expedition, and see what we can find. I've seen this several times having
worked with the legal profession. I hope they get some good lawyers because
they'll need them.
Finally, children should be protected, but right is right.
Finally, children should be protected, but right is right.
Anne Frank | 4:50 p.m. April 10, 2008
I couldn't help but think of the story of Anne Frank, the Jewish girl
hiding from the Nazi's, when I heard about kids hiding from the authorities
there. This whole thing is FISHY. Find the girl that made the call, find the
accussed, but take ALL the kids. Come on, religious persecution is what I see.
Now, for all the LDS people that are spouting about "laws of the land"
etc. It seems like their forefathers stuck with polygamy until they needed to
become a state, and the ones that were already doing it finished it off until it
died out with a generation. No? Amazing how quickly they forget LDS history
when it's convenient, and how they don't when necessary. But, this is
true for all groups, especially religious ones!
Now if child abuse was going on - get the abuser! Now we are finding out he doesn't even live there? Probably wasn't there during an accused time frame? Holy crap, figure that out first!
"Can't we all just get along?" -Rodney King
Now if child abuse was going on - get the abuser! Now we are finding out he doesn't even live there? Probably wasn't there during an accused time frame? Holy crap, figure that out first!
"Can't we all just get along?" -Rodney King
Wow | 4:44 p.m. April 10, 2008
Look this whole things is about child abuse. If anyone is turned in for
allegations of abuse of a child, the authorities have the right and obligation
to search the home question the occupants and remove the children. This was
just one big allegation that turned out to be correct. Good job Texas and good
luck.
patriarchal systems | 4:59 p.m. April 10, 2008
Whenever you have a patriarchal system, sooner or later the good ol' boys
in charge are going to try to get a little more than their money's
worth.
If they can persuade their female congregation that everything they do is "God's Will" - they've got
'em where they want 'em and inevitably things like this will (and have countless times before) occur.
If they can persuade their female congregation that everything they do is "God's Will" - they've got
'em where they want 'em and inevitably things like this will (and have countless times before) occur.
Inequity-Rights | 5:02 p.m. April 10, 2008
So... Children in the housing projects are abused and molested...probably at a
MUCH high rate than those children of polygamists in Texas. Why don't they
have swat teams and buses go round up all of them and take them into state
custody and find foster homes for them? WHY? I'll let you all figure that
one out.
I am totally against underage marriage, abuse, and tax evasion, kicking the lost boys out so that there would be more wives for grumpy old men; which some of these polygamists are guilty of. BUT, I doubt that they are ALL guilty of this. So why were ALL of their children taken away? It seems that this is a Nazi like approach...lets punish everyone that is a member of a certain religion because some of them have done bad things...
The bigger issue here is this: Were their constitutional rights viloated? I'm not condoning the things the polygimasts do...but if their rights are violated, what's to keep everyone else's rights from being violated. It's a scary precedence.
I am totally against underage marriage, abuse, and tax evasion, kicking the lost boys out so that there would be more wives for grumpy old men; which some of these polygamists are guilty of. BUT, I doubt that they are ALL guilty of this. So why were ALL of their children taken away? It seems that this is a Nazi like approach...lets punish everyone that is a member of a certain religion because some of them have done bad things...
The bigger issue here is this: Were their constitutional rights viloated? I'm not condoning the things the polygimasts do...but if their rights are violated, what's to keep everyone else's rights from being violated. It's a scary precedence.
carefulon religion | 5:09 p.m. April 10, 2008
Of course we should do all within the law to protect children.
If there was probable cause, the search should have occurred. It is hard to believe they had that kind of evidence that would allow them to take over 400 children into custody.
I am concerned about the Texan mentality. Having lived there, our family experienced extreme prejudice against us for our religious beliefs. My "born again" neighbors gossiped about us pretty continuously for the years we lived there and passed along CRAZY rumors that went beyond religion into things like our sexual lives/practices (fortunately I had some terrific neighbors who would laugh about this with me and made life not just endurable but quite pleasant and happy in spite of the few neighbors who perpetuated - and honestly believed - the crazy gossip)
My point - While most people I knew there were GREAT, there were definitely those who were nutso in their views of other people's religions. Some were absolutely unable to be tolerant of anyone who wasn't a born-again Christian - to the point of being fearful, conspiratorial, like I said - nutty. I hope that doesn't have anything to do with this situation.
If there was probable cause, the search should have occurred. It is hard to believe they had that kind of evidence that would allow them to take over 400 children into custody.
I am concerned about the Texan mentality. Having lived there, our family experienced extreme prejudice against us for our religious beliefs. My "born again" neighbors gossiped about us pretty continuously for the years we lived there and passed along CRAZY rumors that went beyond religion into things like our sexual lives/practices (fortunately I had some terrific neighbors who would laugh about this with me and made life not just endurable but quite pleasant and happy in spite of the few neighbors who perpetuated - and honestly believed - the crazy gossip)
My point - While most people I knew there were GREAT, there were definitely those who were nutso in their views of other people's religions. Some were absolutely unable to be tolerant of anyone who wasn't a born-again Christian - to the point of being fearful, conspiratorial, like I said - nutty. I hope that doesn't have anything to do with this situation.
Jackson | 5:12 p.m. April 10, 2008
To "Make it Fair": For years, there have been numerous reports of
child brides, arranged marriages, bigamy, slavery, and widespread child rape in
various Muslim enclaves in Dearborn, MI. The same with various upper-class
Jewish gated communities in and around LA. Or on any of the larger Indian
reservations.
Can you imagine the fallout over a raid like this to go in and detain all of them and then steal all their children?
Can you imagine the fallout over a raid like this to go in and detain all of them and then steal all their children?
O Polyamory | 5:12 p.m. April 10, 2008
The problem with the FLDS is not the existence of polygamy, but with a) it being
a requirement and b) with arranged marriages of children. Those two factors led
to a culture of sexual abuse of children and ostracism of other children, and
both were wrong. In order to make plural marriage work in a fair and equitable
manner, the Church of FLDS should have engaged in polyandry as well as polygyny!
Also, they should have made plural marriage optional rather than required, and
they should have abolished a) marriage of minors and b) arranged marriage of
minors.
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Latest comments
I remember Howard's comment and BYU's 22-23 loss to the Utes. BYU fans can...
This rivalry is heated and everyone hates everyone else because of the...
Thanks to commenter "Scotty" for putting it all in honest perspective.
It took an Aggie (Lavell Edwards) to drag the Cougars out of their decades...
Ha ha ha ha ha Seatle!!!! Way to go Utah.
No fez starting, gee could not have played with Kous to change things in the...
@20/20 -- Amen! @8:36 and Well Done--- perfect responses. Yes, let's...
I totally agree with anonymous. "Seal it", you pay 50 bucks a month to sit at...
First, the article you reference is about New York State. Second, the...
Never mind "little things". Bigger is always better!
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