Deseret News | Reader comments: Lack of insurance deadly

Reader comments
Lack of insurance deadly

Anonymous | 6:22 a.m. April 10, 2008

Note to Deseret News: health insurance is not the same as health care. Faulty studies that don't recognize that difference misinform the public. Your editorial continues that misinformation. Also, medicare and medicaid are not insurance programs, rather they are government-paid health care welfare programs.

Basic Health Care for All | 6:48 a.m. April 10, 2008

What is so wrong about every American having basic health care? Now that it is confirmed that lives are at stake, what are we waiting for?

We can go to the moon, wage war in Iraq, our business leaders take tens or hundreds of millions of dollars home every year, certainly our nation and businesses can afford basic health care for all.

David | 7:18 a.m. April 10, 2008

Suggestions that people on high deductible plans will not receive preventive care are little more than scare tactics. Those (such as myself) who voluntarily choose such plans are often very conscious of the benefits of preventive care and carefully make use of such care. Also, there are high-deductible plans where preventive care is covered 80 - 100% before the deductible is met. On such plans, that preventive coverage, combined with the high-deductible that must be met serve to encourage the use of preventive care more than plans where everything is covered at 80%.

I don't believe that people should be forced into high deductible plans if they can't pay for insurance, nor do I think that they should be prevented from choosing such plans.

People need to be educated, and they need to have options. We aren't going to improve the system through scare tactics and suggestions that some types of plans deter people from getting needed help. Nor will we improve the system by guaranteeing to the insurance companies that every citizen of Utah will be buying their products.

Comments continue below

David | 7:34 a.m. April 10, 2008

Basic Health Care for All -

A closer look at this study shows that the group issuing it is highly biased, none of the data is their own, and the "study" is extremely weak.

Let's be careful about taking every piece of news at face value or we are likely to end up with a solution that only bogs our system down more. Every American should have access to health care, but as anonymous said health care and health insurance are not the same thing.

Another Destructive FDR Legacy | 7:43 a.m. April 10, 2008

Just what we need, more government involvement in healthcare. Excessive government regulation and "tax incentives" are driving up the cost of healthcare. Get the government out of healthcare!

FDR and other no nothings introduced these problems during WW2. It's time to move on. Government-mandated socialism doesn't work.

stop the socialism | 7:49 a.m. April 10, 2008

Healthcare is the only industry in America unaffected by market forces. As long as agendas like the DMN editorial staff are advocated and accepted then the costs of healthcare are going to continue to go crazy. If you have unlimited demand and a limited supply then costs skyrocket. This notion that everyone is entitled to healthcare has to end. Demand-side changes to healthcare will bring lower prices and subsequently make heathcare more affordable for everyone
I just went through a hospitalization with only a major medical policy and I know how expensive it is. Oh.. and I paid all of my deductible which is more than what many people using our hospitals do

Majority | 7:56 a.m. April 10, 2008

Nice editorial but you got one key fact wrong. Most Utahns do not have good insurance through their employer. Over 25% of us rely on government programs like Medicare, Medicaid and Veterans benefits. The uninsured are usually undercounted by a lot but they are at least 15% of us. The underinsured make up a similar percentage. The "free market" system is broken and getting worse. That is why our state legislators' "reform" efforts are certain to fail.

Dave | 7:58 a.m. April 10, 2008

Using this same illogical logic it follows that everyone who dies while covered by health insurance was killed by health insurance.

Thinkin' Man | 8:12 a.m. April 10, 2008

Insurance isn't the problem, health care COST is the problem. If health care were affordable, there would be no need for insurance in routine care.

Let's treat the wound (cost), not the bandage (insurance)!

lost in DC | 8:36 a.m. April 10, 2008

We talked about this yesterday. I thought we had established that lack of insurance is not a disease. No death certificates list lack of insurance as the cause of death. While the uninsured may be less likely to get health care, it is the disease that eventually kills them.

I guess it's more sensational to cite lack of insurance as the cause of death because then it's easier for you to demand socialized medicine. Overly dramatic and emotional arguments weaken your cause.

I remember a Benny Hill skit poking fun at the British health system, where the working class patient was treated at a public health facility by an unsanitary, chain-smoking drunkard; operated on with a mallet to the head for anesthesia. The wealthy patient went to a private facility and was treated by buxom nurses and highly skilled doctors. Obviously there was significant exageration, but the point was well illustrated. Socialized medicine has the potential to move those currently in the middle class with health insurance into public health care, while only the wealthy (no longer those would good health plans) could afford really top-notch care. This was meant to be funny, not serious, like your argument.

Bet against yourself | 9:43 a.m. April 10, 2008

Thinkin' Man got it right. The fact of the matter is the Insurance Companies are a business. They don't care about you, they just care about your money. Ever wonder why sick people can't get insurance? That's right. The more healthy people they insure, the better their profits. Even if you have insurance, it's virtually impossible to get them to pay something without getting some sort of a run-around when it comes time for them to pay up.

It's a wicked wicked cycle: insurance leads to greater doctor bills, which leads to higher insurance. Factor in a few lawyers and we're all messed up!

It's not a government issue.

Ever wonder what things were like before insurance? I'm confident the medical system was more humane in their billing.

The insurance company, like a bunch of sharks, smelled blood and now works off of fearmongering and naive people who can't bear the unthinkable thought of being uninsured.

Tammi Diaz | 11:18 a.m. April 10, 2008

We need HR676 SINGLE-PAYER HEALTH INSURANCE PEOPLE
NOT PROFIT IS HEALTHCARE FOR ALL. The INSURANCE COMPANIES are only out for MONEY they are ACCOUNTABLE to there STOCK HOLDERS. The HEALTHCARE
REFORM BILL they pass at the LEGISLATURE is going
to FAIL BIG!

Wally1121 | 11:47 a.m. April 10, 2008

Insurance payment scams.

My wife recently had some lab work done. We went to an "approved" provider. They sent us a bill for $273.00. When the insurance FINALLY paid (after two delinquency notices), they paid less than $26.00! And under the plan, that's all the provider gets, and I am not responsible for the difference.

So ... if I have insurance, the provider gets paid peanuts. If I don't have insurance, I get GOUGED more than 1000% more to make up for it.

I lost my job last year and am paying THROUGH THE NOSE for the COBRA premiums. I tried to get private insurance, but due to "pre existing conditions", no one will sell me a policy at ANY price. I am not asking anyone to pay my premiums for me, or to go on welfare. I have money and am willing to pay for medical insurance, but can't get it.

What's wrong with this picture?

Reason | 1:20 p.m. April 10, 2008

(This is an update to a comment I posted yesterday.) This study seems suspect. Often half-baked ï¿½studiesï¿½ are created in an effort to push a political agenda, and are based on anecdotes and wild guesswork, instead of scientific and statistical standards. Often the flawed logic is that if two things happen at the same time, then, obviously, one of them caused the other. As a result, such studies are basically meaningless.

But even though such studies are meaningless, they can still be harmful, because too often theyï¿½re are accepted and used as the basis for foolish decisions on the part of lawmakers and government agencies. Yes, itï¿½s valuable for people to have health insurance, but, like most areas, when the government gets involved, there are shortages, lower quality, and higher prices.

Tammi Diaz | 1:59 p.m. April 10, 2008

With the bill that pass up in the legislature the
standard of HEALTHCARE will LOWER, The of Utah is
going to help pay for HEALTH INSURANCE for individual that cannot afford it. The INSURANCE
COMPANIES going to get CORPORATE WELFARE. We have
SOCIALISM police, fire and SOCIALISM EDUCATION WHAT
THE DIFFERENT, TIME FOR HR676 SINGLE-PAYER HEALTH
INSURANCE PEOPLE NOT PROFIT FAMILY VALUES

lost in DC | 2:29 p.m. April 10, 2008

Tammi, do you read what you write before you post your comments? Calm down a little and you will be able to communicate better. I know when I screw up my spelling or grammar it's because I get too worked up.

I can't really make sense of what you said because the grammar is garbled, but it looks like you said the standard of healthcare will lower. Do we really want a lower standard of healthcare? Did you mean the COST will be lowered, not the standard of care??

Anonymous | 4:01 p.m. April 10, 2008

What did I do this time to be censored by the DMN? I swear sometimes they are just too lazy to read the posts and go straight to delete.

digum | 4:36 p.m. April 10, 2008

I work in healthcare and this is how I see it. Providers are in a catch 22 in order to get patients they have to be on a preferred provider list, to get on that list they have to accept whatever the health plan will pay them. Furthermore, in order to get paid they have to hire someone to properly code the bill so they can get paid. If the bill is not properly coded payment is delayed.

I've longed been convinced that the real problem with rocketing health care costs may very well be the insurance system. To an extent it is socialized medicine, those who can afford to pay get a small copay in return. The small copay leads to less discretion and more visits. More visits lead to more testing, which leads to more billing, and that brings an increase in next years premium. Insurance companies should be focusing more on rewarding those who don't abuse the system. For example, refunding what you don't use from your deductible or applying it against next years premiums.

I think there are many viable options, but we need to get away from thinking of health plans as insurance.

Tammi Diaz | 4:36 p.m. April 10, 2008

Dear lost in DC: I was at COMMITTEES MEETING during
the LEGISLATURE SESSION. By making it MANDATORY everyone to have HEALTH INSURANCE, all it is a MONEY
for INSURANCE COMPANIES, it is a LOWER STANDARD CARE
that all INSURANCE have to PAY. GOOD HEALTHCARE IS A
PRIVILEGE NOT RIGHT.

Ed Meyer | 4:53 p.m. April 10, 2008

I expect the efforts of the Legislature will result in lower insurance costs for everyone which is a good thing. I'm concerned that insurance companies not be allowed to "cherry pick" the lower risk customers. It is also likely that many procedures currently funded under existing health programs would be cut back since, in doing so, cost would likely also be lowered. In some cases, that may be a good thing... ie: nose jobs and breast enhancement... in other cases though, it would be disastrous... ie: gastric bypass surgery for the morbidly obese is currently not funded by the state employee and educator's insurance funds which is silly since the costs associated with being overweight far exceed the cost of corrective surgery. It's a complex issue and I applaud the legislature for wading in on an issue that will likely not be politically popular... they are exercising statemanship... something all too lacking today.

Anonymous | 10:10 p.m. April 10, 2008

Tammi: Calm down, and try to get off the caps lock button.
How come gun ownership is a 'right', whereas health care is not? Where are our priorities?
Thankfully, I am covered under a socialist health care plan. Health care is, for me, not a privilege. It's a right, and responsibility, that I protect. And am willng to pay for. For myself and for common good.
The only way I can live in Utah, or anywhere in the United States, is to get insurance. Not for health care, but evacuation. Health care isn't an option in Utah.

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