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Comments about ‘LDS officials to meet with gay group’

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Dialogue will be unprecedented move for church

Published: Monday, April 7 2008 12:18 a.m. MDT

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Let's learn from each other

I didn't say, nor mean to imply, that all homosexuals are trying to force their agenda. However an awful lot of them are. I am just trying to express why straight people sometimes feel threatened by homosexuals.

Certainly there are many people with same gender attraction that are in the church who are living the gospel as well as they can. I respect those people very much. Having had a homosexual relative I am aware that this is an extremely difficult temptation to resist for those who suffer from it. It is very damaging to the self esteem of those involved.

I hope that all people in that position know that there are many many people in the church who care and are willing to help. We won't reject you for your temptations any more than we want to be rejected for ours. We aren't perfect. I know that people aren't always understanding about this issue. We need to do better at reaching out to those who are honestly striving to overcome this problem.

Let's learn from each other

I have one question in addition to my comments. You state that you are asking for us to put a stop to the public judgments that you experience. What specifically do you mean? How can we be less judgmental?

I'm asking this sincerely, not sarcastically. I really want to know. We are not going to change our beliefs about homosexual activity being a sin but if there is something that we can change in our behavior so that we can avoid making you feel like we condemn you or reject you, then tell us. We are willing to improve on that account.

Freeman

To Amazing 9:25am:

Your characterization of members of the LDS church as people are "afraid to allow themselves to think outside of what the Church says is right and wrong" is completely ignorant and insulting. First, we are encouraged to question the doctrines of the church and find out for ourselves whether or not they are true. Second, our world does revolve around the church--it is a lifestyle, not a one-hour Sunday appointment. Third, we are happy to let homosexuals do whatever they want, except make us change our doctrine to accomodate their lifestyle. Therein lies the problem--many don't want to be "left alone," they want to CHANGE what we believe and FORCE us to validate their actions. I find it "amazing" that you can't see that.

Anonymous

There are a lot worse things in this world then who a person loves. I don't consider loving someone a "sin". BYU should change their policies. What you do in you spare time outside of school is no ones business but your own. These comments make me sad seeing how close minded this state is. What happened to Love one Another?

Anonymous

Also, I don't believe being gay is a choice. I know some people that wish they could change it. But you can't change the way you feel. I wish people would stop looking at it as a "disease" and try to "cure" homosexuality. That is insane.

Response to Anonymous

It is a choice.

Wendy

I am very excited by this news. No, I do not believe the church will change its stand and do not want it to because of pressure from gay groups. But we offer no reason for our gay brothers and sisters not to jump ship and go with the gay lifestyle. We offer no support, understanding or love. Just disgust and "youre a sinner". Who would stay for that? We need to offer alternatives. Right now a person with SSA can choose a life of loneliness and hiding their true feelings within the church or leaving the church and having love, respect and understanding and a relationship. When we offer an alternative such as support, respect for their struggles, honor for them staying strong and not giving in, lovingly being welcomed into our homes for fellowship, then we may help keep these beloved sons and daughters strong in the gospel. I hope this is a step towards that. Thank you so much Pres. Monson for opening up this communication. I love you and hope that this is the beginning of helping many fine people who need support and many families who are impacted by this issue. A Mom

the Ogre

I am glad the church is opening an official dialogue with Affirmation, but I would like to point out that an unofficial dialogue has already been going on as through conference talks and church discipline.

It is very simple: the church must stay firm when any-person, of any gender or lifestyle, commits sexual sin. The church, however, must demystify positions about homosexuality. Many gays and lesbians feel insulted by recommendations to Evergreen or claims they have the problem.

I personally want the discussion to get away from sex. The dialogue must be in-depth avoiding superficialiality like BYU's honor-code and the teachings, doctrine, and policy regarding temple-attendance and temple-marriage. The church has been abundantly clear on both issues, but maybe a new one needs to be addressed: hatred versus love.

Latter-day Saints are called to love everyone. I must love the neighbors who drink often and party late. I cannot be concerned about the way they live, instead I must focus on my own personal righteousness. The general membership's love for every member must be affirmed regardless of how others live or have lived. Love and hope must be reinforced. Hatred must be avoided, when the gospel centers on love.

the Ogre

To Ray:

I disagree with: "Diversity=Divide." The church and its members are very diverse. There is nothing to fear from diversity in the general population of the church. The gospel, however, is simple and applies to everyone regardless of who they are and how diverse the world and church is. There is no way for us to be carbon-copies of each other and nor should we pursue this.

Damon

To Wendy and the Ogre:

Thanks to both of you. Wendy, you make an excellent point that I don't think many memebers understand. We need to feel love and be given a viable option. If the Church membership shuns you, then you feel justified in pursuing whatever lifestyle might seem best.

Ogre, you made a similar point. You are right, both of you. These are the attitudes that Church can promote and this is the positive and effective change that I hope to see happen in these meetings. The Church has been making efforts to move members more towards attitudes of love. We just aren't there yet. It reminds me of a passage from D&C, I think...

"I (God) will forgive whom I will forgive, but of you it is required to love all men."

To Damon

Yes it is a passage from D&C
Its D&C 64:10

SLD

"The Lord has not changed his view on the matter and neither can His church."

Principles do change and have many times in the course of the LDS Church history. That is why we have divine revelation. If you don't believe in divine modern day revelation, you are rejecting your own church and its values.

I won't hold my breath for gays to suddenly be welcomed into the fold, but what hubris to say you know what the Lord wants from now until eternity.

forgiving is not the same

as embracing or condoning or approving behavior choices.

you can love the sinner but still recognize that he is engaged in (and declines to abandon) harmful behavior.

you can love and forgive the sinner without compromising your values and beliefs.

SLD

Damon,

my heart goes out to you. I wish more members would take to heart the message of love and acceptance Christ preached. Hate, judgment and intolerance are always wrong.

I'm heterosexual, but I remember how hard it was when I was pretty much the only woman my age in the ward who didn't have children (infertility issues). I sometimes felt that there was no place in the church for someone who was different. It was very lonely. I can only imagine how much harder it is to be in your position. I hope you find peace - in or outside of the LDS church.

Choices, eh?

If you don't like their rules, what's keeping you in it? Everyone brings up whether or not homosexuality is a choice or not, and no one brings up whether religion is a choice or not.
There is little difference between the attitudes of a religious person claiming with every breath that their church is true and a MLM marketer claiming their product/system will get rid of all your problems.
If the LDS church wants to think the way they do, let them be close-minded and leave. You won't miss much. I don't.

The Nature of True Love

Many posters insist that to forgive and love homosexuals you must embrace and accept their values and choices.

That is not true.

Some parents find themselves faced with the heart and gut wrenching situation of a child who has "come out". Often they adapt to the situation by forsaking their previous beliefs and buying in to the "stepford wives" homosexual mantra;
(it is just the way he is.
there is nothing wrong with it.
he was born that way.)

But true love means never giving up on your loved ones, no matter what.

It is an incredibly delicate balancing act to maintain a loving relationship and lines of communication without becoming a facilitator.
(do you paste on blank grin and play nice for "commitment" ceremony pictures or stay away. etc)

You don't have to buy into the choices to show your "love", in fact true love will help you find the strength to never give up.

Don't give up hoping they will get back on a path to realize their full potential for joy and happiness.

Don't give up on the one's you really love.

Don't get tired and give in.

Damon

The scripture says LOVE, not forgive. Similar to, Love thy neighbor. I think it's fair to say many negative statments given here aren't in the spirit of loving your fellow man or even in trying to provide any sort of real solution. Rather, these statements are driven by fear and hate.

No one is saying that you should agree or have to agree, but you can choose not to hate. You can choose to have compassion, you can choose to try and understand. And whether or not the "other side" chooses compassion and understanding the commandment is the same.

SLD- I know your pain. I have family members who have struggled through the same trial. Often, I've found the Church can be a very lonely place for those of us who don't fit the mold.

I appreciate your well wishes for my happiness.

Re: More to the Equation

I am a single woman in the church and am expected to remain chaste and clean until I marry. The LDS church expects the same whether you are gay or straight. You are to be morally clean. A gay man or lesbian woman CAN go to the temple if they are not participating in immoral relationships and are trying to stay pure. If they are not partaking and remain morally clean, they are granted the same blessings and can fully participate in the church. Why is it that being gay somehow makes some people think they have a right to break the simple morality laws? It is not having homosexual tendancies that is the issue as far as worthiness is concerned. If you are not participating; if you have the urges and do not participate in the activities; if you are trying to live the laws of morality and chastity -- you are worthy. I liked what was said in "more to the equation" -- yes there is more then sex. But that is the LAW that is broken so often. I have to be morally clean; everyone needs to obey the same standard.

Damon

To The Nature of True Love:

I appreciate your comments. I agree that loving (or forgiving) someone doesn't require agreeing with or embracing theri choices or values.

However, I don't think it means that you must constantly point out where you might disagree and how you believe they ought to change. This would only breed discontent.

Not giving up may mean, allowing them to make a choice and allowing God to handle it. Not giving up may mean loving your family member and their partner, even though you don't agree with the choice they make to be partners.

One of the primary principles of the gospel is agency...ones right to make a decision. If God is willing to honor that decision and love anyway, shouldn't we?

to Damon 3:36pm

You are also right. I really do believe it is an incredibly delicate (and difficult) balancing act. And your comment about agency really is the final word. Our Father in Heaven loves us all, and loves us enough to let us have our agency. As earthly parents we can only do the same ultimately.

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