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Comments about ‘LDS officials to meet with gay group’

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Dialogue will be unprecedented move for church

Published: Monday, April 7 2008 12:18 a.m. MDT

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I seriously doubt it...

"Jonathon | 7:19 p.m. Apr. 7, 2008
Why can't the church change its doctrine? It wouldn't be the first time. The year I was baptised into the church (1978) was the same year the church made a major break with its past and began allowing blacks to hold the priesthood. Apparently it took god that long to get over his racism and see all races as equal. Now if only he could get past his sexism and homophobia, maybe the church could join the twenty first century... "

Unreal

I new alot of people who left the church in 1978 because blacks could now hold the priesthood. I am happy that the leaders who ran the church changed their rules in 1978 and wouldn't it be cool if the rules were changed once again for these loving people who are being shunned by the LDS church?

Reed

This is directed to all you hypocritical, self-righteous members of the LDS faith.
First, know that I am a happily married, heterosexual male member of the church.
Next, consider a few facts. Roughly 10% of the human population is homosexual. Most do not "choose" their sexual preferance any more than I chose to be right handed. Many have the same moral standards as any good member of the church, yet they are forced to live a lie or abandon their faith.
It is not for us to judge these people (ANY PEOPLE). God will take care of that so don't worry. We will all get our just reward. Perhaps better to focus on the commandments such as, "Love thy neighbor" than to look down your nose at those you deem less righteous than yourself. There is an old joke that says the world is divided into two groups of people: the righteous and the unrighteous. And the righteous do the dividing.
You can attend church all you want, go to the temple regularly, pay your tithing, serve in your calling, but if you can't truly love your fellow beings, well... good luck. You're going to need it.

Saddened

As an active member of the LDS church who happens to have same gender attraction, I am saddened by the amount of intolerance that is being conveyed in these comments by other members of my faith.

The fact of the matter is, the LDS church has an abysmal track record for retaining gay members. Even those of us who choose to not act on our attractions are often made to feel dirty and unclean for simply having them by these sort of self righteous and hateful comments. For that reason, many (if not most) of us choose to remain fully closeted - fearful of how other members of the church will treat us if they knew of our inner most secrets.

I am not a member of Affirmation; however, I welcome this news. While I don't expect any major shifts in church policy to be the result, I am hopeful that this will pave the way for better understanding and compassion.

RE: REED

Another person who "get's it"!!! Thank you. Love the comment about the righteous do the dividing, well put!!!

CFB

It is not selfrighteous to have values and morals; no one is forcing anyone who believes such ideas to remain in the church--though immorality applies to everyone in every situation--they want everyone to condone conduct that insults members who try to live teachings; they want a pass, to only accept what they selfishly desire, and the destruction nature of live-style over along period of time is well documented by socialogical studies, same sex relationships fail, and do not last, so why support them?

Sub-Odeon

Can someone please explain to me why it's the job of the church to make homosexuals feel better about themselves, and their sin?

Homosexuals experiencing guilt and anger over their failure to rectify doctrine with choice, either need to seek their priesthood leadership and get right with God, or abandon the church and get psychological counseling in order to get over their bitterness at the Lord and the LDS faith.

God does not create us to sin against him. All of us have free will. Denial of the appetites is part of our lesson here on this fallen Earth. If you feel an undeniable urge to have sex with your own gender, and you're LDS, it's up to you to come to grips with your choice. Either decide to deny yourself and abide by the gospel, or learn to live in sin and forget about the LDS church. Because there cannot ever be a time when LDS doctrine smiles on homosexual activity. It won't happen.

Hard words. But these are hard times. And the church is not a therapy group for people who can't get over themselves.

No Name Calling

To Reed,

Whoa there! Let's not ruin this discussion with name calling, accusations, and condemnations. By far the majority of the LDS members posting here have shown love and understanding. It seems to me that most of the negative comments are coming from people who want to call others self righteous, intolerant, etc., etc., etc.

How about being tolerant of people who choose to accept the Lords word found in many many scriptural references and the words of modern day prophets that homosexuality is a sin?

Most of us who believe that also accept the Lord's teachings about loving sinners and reaching out to help them. We know that we are sinners also. None of us can point fingers at those who feel same sex attraction and judge them for the temptations they face. All of us are trying to overcome our own weaknesses.

We cannot get back to heavenly father by trying to change his standards on any issue. We have to change to match those standards. None of us can meet those standards without the help of Christ through the atonement.

Let's work together to help each other do that.

Sagacious Inquisitor

Reed and reReed,

Would you agree that quite interestingly on these pages; it often appears that the dividing is done by both parties evenly? Yet, one party seems more vilified for holding a contrary, politically incorrect and old fashioned opinion.

Sadly, in our modern and "enlightened" world, what is sauce for the goose really ain't for the gander.

Mc

I had a neighbor who was a young mother struggling with alcoholism and financial problems. I truly cared about her and her family and tried to help with AA meetings and being a friend. She confided in me about feelings of same sex atraction as well as interest in other men besides her husband. I tried to help her keep her family together, but when she wanted me to meet her "boyfriend," I began to see that what she wanted from me was acceptance of her behavior, not help to overcome her problems. I could not accept behavior that went against everything I believe in and she could not change me, so I was not what she wanted in a friend. I'm sure that she feels that I rejected her friendship and did not care about her, but that was not the case.

The problem I see with many homosexuals is that they equate loving them with accepting their lifestyle. If we don't accept it then we don't love them. Accepting sinful behavior (hetero or homosexual) that is openly displayed is just as difficult for me as changing sexual attraction would be for someone who is homosexual.

Don't Blame Genetics

All of us, myself especially, face temptations and I don't blame anyone for the temptations they face. However, I feel like I have to comment on the excuse I hear again and again about a genetic link to homosexuality. I want to make a few points.

1. A genetic link is irrelevant. Heterosexuality is in most peoples genes but that doesn't make it ok for them to be philanderers or pornographers.

2. If homosexuality were a genetic trait then it would have self selected itself out of existence long ago. Homosexuals do sometimes marry heterosexually and have children, but if homosexuality were genetically linked the trait would tend to eliminate itself.

3. If homosexuality is genetic then why is there no strong tendency for it to run in families? I have known many homosexuals but I have never met one that came from a family with many of them.

I am not a scientist and can't prove whether genetics has anything to do with homosexuality or not but let's not use genetics as an excuse for any of our sins whether they are related to sexuality or not.

signs of civil war

Always dividing people.
Always setting groups apart from each other.
Never a meeting of the minds.
The same mindset that occurs before a civil war.
Always a "right is right!" mentality.

RE: Sagacious

No, I don't think that the dividing is done evenly. When those who oppose me and my lifestyle to the point of a constitutional amendment to prevent my enacting my civil rights. I can't concider that as even division. When those in opposition call me a pedophile not because I have violated a child but because I am attracted to other men, that is not even. When I read and hear time and again how those like me are going to be the downfall of society I can't see that as even, nor would I call it an even division when I must conform to the standards of normalicy as dictaded by those who think they are all knowing or else face retribution that in the past has included physical violence. No, I wouldn't call that an even division.

WYO Reader

To "Don't Blame Genetics"

AMEN!

Supportive ex-communicated membr

This is in response to Mormon Mom and others out there who may have despaired because of perceived lack of support by the LDS church in this matter. There have been several organized groups that have formed through the years that have taken positive steps to support members of the church who deal with these feelings of SSA (Same Sex Attraction). One in particular [Evergreen} has received incredible support from the church. The challenge has been to get the word out to the Stake Presidents that they do exist. The Church's Family Services, from what I understand, does have information regarding some of these support groups. Others can be found through internet searches. Do a search on Same Sex Attraction and you may find some of this information. There are psychologists and others doing positive, constructive research of this, that many of us deal with. Do not be troubled by all the emotional outbursts and controversy about this...there is help out there and has been for some time.

kindness

Having just married in the temple a woman who has a gay son, I am encouraged by President Monson's decision to have Church officials meet with the Affirmation group. Too many Church members' words and actions betray the loving kindness our Lord Jesus Christ would have us model as His followers, and opening up an official dialogue with these disenfranchised Saints is simply the right thing to do.

Becoming divorced after a twenty-three year marriage taught me much about what the Lord would have us say and do towards others who suffer estrangement from the fellowship of the Saints, much of the teachings coming in the form of scorn, ridicule and estrangement from family, "friends" and other members of this Church named after Jesus Christ.

I endorse _any_ action which sincerely seeks "to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the captives, and the opening of the prison to them that are bound" (Isaiah 61) including any of us who feel after the Savior out of desperate need.

Christ would have us do no less.

different

I have to assume that all those people who see no difference between being gay and being tempted to steal, drink alcohol, not pay tithing, cheat, overeat, act selfishly, and speed in traffic (among the many cited) are not close to anyone who is gay.

Those who know and care about gay people know that sexual orientation is not a mere temptation to do something the church prohibits, but is fundamental to one's very identity. They see that Church members treat gay people very differently than people "who struggle to not be selfish" or to give up coffee.

Bodacious

Just another reason I am glad I don't go to church..to much stoning going down.

Happiness

My father struggled with homosexuality throughout his life. Early in his marriage he acted on the temptation for the first time causing great pain to his wife and family. He did his best to repent and for years was free of the sin. During that time he accomplished great good. He brought the gospel to many people and raised his children in the church. He still felt temptation. Life wasn't easy but he did his best.

In his later life he became discouraged because of an illness that was a direct result of his earlier problem. He gave up and gave in to his temptation. He divorced my mother and isolated himself from everyone that loved him and instead chose to associate himself with others that had the same temptation.

Eventually he was murdered by one of his homosexual partners who stole his money to buy drugs.

I don't know what will happen to my father. I don't know what circumstances caused him to face the temptations he faced. I know only this, God prohibits homosexuality for the same reason he prohibits all sin. It does not and cannot make people happy.

We love and miss you dad.

Freeman

So Reed calls those LDS members opposed to homosexuality "self-righteous" and "hypocritical." He blasts them for passing judgment, yet that is exactly what he is doing in telling them "good luck--you're going to need it." Who's the hypocrite?

Furthermore, loving your neighbors does not mean condoning, supporting, or even accepting their behavior. You can accept a person without accepting his/her lifestyle. It's absurd to suggest that in order to love my neighbors I have to approve of anything and everything they choose to do. My own father is gay (one of the founding members of Affirmation) and I still accept and love him as a person, even though I disapprove of his behavior and lifestyle.


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