Reader comments
Educators like the money but not strings
29 comments | Read story
Salary increases | 8:13 a.m. March 6, 2008
I hope teachers hear what the UEA says up on the hill - especially younger
teachers. The UEA doesn't want the teacher salary increases, they want the
money to just go to the district and the district to decide what to do with it.
What do you think of that? This is the representation you are getting for that
money they withhold from your paycheck.
SLP | 8:50 a.m. March 6, 2008
I agree, I am in favor of the legislature directing monies especially to teacher
salaries. History shows that increases in the WPU, rarely mean increases in
teacher salaries. I also beleive that the majority of teachers are not aware of
the extent of the adversarial relationship that exists between the UEA and the
legislature.I consisder the UEA a roadblock to the much needed changes in Utah
education. That is why I have chosen to affliate with the Utah Council of
Educators, that encourages professionalism in education and a colleagial
relationship with Utah lawmakers.
maybe | 9:21 a.m. March 6, 2008
I am a teacher in the first years of my career and I don't believe SLP is a
teacher. You can't be "collegial" if that means not disagreeing
with ideologues who think software eliminates the need for smaller class sizes.
UCTE is funded nationally by All Children Matter, the Waltons' (Wal-Mart
billionaires) organization that funds voucher camopaigns across the country.
UCTE is their attempt to divide and conquer teachers' organizations that
actually fight for public education. It is "unprofessional" to claim
publically elected school boards should have their roles usurped by the state
legislature.
The WPU not getting to teachers is a lie. District admin. is less than 1/2 of 1% of Alpine District's budget. Teacher salary and benefits is by leaps and bounds the highest expenditure along with the capital costs of building new schools.
Shilling for privatization and UCTE on these boards is preaching to the choir, but it won't convince real teachers who know the truth behind the anti-public ed. lies.
The WPU not getting to teachers is a lie. District admin. is less than 1/2 of 1% of Alpine District's budget. Teacher salary and benefits is by leaps and bounds the highest expenditure along with the capital costs of building new schools.
Shilling for privatization and UCTE on these boards is preaching to the choir, but it won't convince real teachers who know the truth behind the anti-public ed. lies.
Comments continue below
Non-UEA teacher | 9:30 a.m. March 6, 2008
As a science teacher I quit UEA long ago.
I was proven correct last year when UEA fought the raise for science/math teachers. They opposed it again this year. Luckily it got through.
All the UEA does is create an adversarial relationship with the people that control the money. What purpose does that serve?
I love the fact that the legislature has been giving the money directly to the teachers and not the WPU.
I was proven correct last year when UEA fought the raise for science/math teachers. They opposed it again this year. Luckily it got through.
All the UEA does is create an adversarial relationship with the people that control the money. What purpose does that serve?
I love the fact that the legislature has been giving the money directly to the teachers and not the WPU.
"Local Control" Irony | 9:56 a.m. March 6, 2008
Our State Legislators love to shout about "local control" with the
feds. But that only seems to work if control is consolidated at the state level.
They always take issue with local control at the county, city or school district
level. Why do we even have school boards if our all-knowing legislators call all
the shots?
Anonymous | 10:59 a.m. March 6, 2008
To first year teacher,
You will soon see. The money doesn't necessarily go to the salaries of administrators. It does go to whatever project they deem worthy that year. It RARELY makes it to the teacher salaries.
Giving it straight to the teachers from the legislature is the way to go. UEA is left out of the negotiations and therefore it goes where it is needed.
You will soon see. The money doesn't necessarily go to the salaries of administrators. It does go to whatever project they deem worthy that year. It RARELY makes it to the teacher salaries.
Giving it straight to the teachers from the legislature is the way to go. UEA is left out of the negotiations and therefore it goes where it is needed.
Poor policy | 11:58 a.m. March 6, 2008
The legislature is so tricky.
I can't understand why they roll all these bills, many of which had already been defeated, into last minute blanket bills.
As for science and math teachers--enjoy the raise. As an English teacher who puts in more hours than anyone else in my school, it bothers me. Though I recognize the need for math and science, I find it hard to support this because some science, math, and technology teachers do not teach well or put in the time to be successful.
This bill may be what finally pushes me out of education.
I can't understand why they roll all these bills, many of which had already been defeated, into last minute blanket bills.
As for science and math teachers--enjoy the raise. As an English teacher who puts in more hours than anyone else in my school, it bothers me. Though I recognize the need for math and science, I find it hard to support this because some science, math, and technology teachers do not teach well or put in the time to be successful.
This bill may be what finally pushes me out of education.
SLP | 12:36 p.m. March 6, 2008
Reply to Maybe,
Get your facts straight UTCE is not fundd by ANY private foundations and that includes All Children Matter Last spring the UEA started a mailing campaign against UTCE , with the same false information you have just reiterated. UTCE Members dues cover all costs. And I I am currently a full time SLP in Jordan District. Alsoif I remember correctly "choice" is a fundamental right .If I felt that UEA was the best association perhaps I would have chosen to join, they are not the best fit for me and my professional goals. And besdies,the more information provided to our legislators,from perspectives can only do more for the education system.
Get your facts straight UTCE is not fundd by ANY private foundations and that includes All Children Matter Last spring the UEA started a mailing campaign against UTCE , with the same false information you have just reiterated. UTCE Members dues cover all costs. And I I am currently a full time SLP in Jordan District. Alsoif I remember correctly "choice" is a fundamental right .If I felt that UEA was the best association perhaps I would have chosen to join, they are not the best fit for me and my professional goals. And besdies,the more information provided to our legislators,from perspectives can only do more for the education system.
SLP | 12:56 p.m. March 6, 2008
In response to "Maybe" Get your facts straight. UTCE is not funded by
any private foundation and that includes All Children Matter. All operating
costs come from member dues. Last spring the UEA launched a mauiing campaign
with the same false information that you just reiterated. FYI, last year, UTCE
did not support the Voucher bills .I believe 'choice' is a fundamental
American right. I chose not to join the UEA, because I believe that they do not
promote my professional goals. UEA has done nothing to inspire confidence in me
as to their effectiveness. One more thing...I am a full time SLP in Jordan
School District.
Science Teacher | 1:23 p.m. March 6, 2008
See!? It's already beginning. As "poor policy" says above, the
rivalry begins.
BTW, isn't the extra pay for math and science only if I decide to work all summer long? Isn't that just "summer school"?
Pay us all fairly and equally.
Bring us up to nationwide averages and stop dragging us at the bottom of the barrel.
BTW, isn't the extra pay for math and science only if I decide to work all summer long? Isn't that just "summer school"?
Pay us all fairly and equally.
Bring us up to nationwide averages and stop dragging us at the bottom of the barrel.
Science Teacher | 1:31 p.m. March 6, 2008
The UEA is a toothless cat. If they had legit complaints, where is the
strike?
Adding money to the WPU and hoping it trickles downstream, into the river, through the rapids, and out to sea and just trusting the districts to get that into teachers' pockets is asinine.
Adding money to the WPU and hoping it trickles downstream, into the river, through the rapids, and out to sea and just trusting the districts to get that into teachers' pockets is asinine.
Perfect Job | 3:14 p.m. March 6, 2008
Imagine going to work everyday and not having to do anything. Imagine having a
three month vacation every summer and countless paid holidays during the year.
Imagine not having to worry about layoffs or job performance.
Those of us in the real world, who give a days work for a days pay and worry and stress over layoffs etc. are the real fools. We should have been teachers!
Those of us in the real world, who give a days work for a days pay and worry and stress over layoffs etc. are the real fools. We should have been teachers!
A Former UEA Local President | 3:27 p.m. March 6, 2008
I was associated with UEA as a local President for several years, and have had
my ins and outs with them. The trouble with UEA is that they fight for teachers
as a group and not individually, i.e. they fight for all teachers and fail to
recognize the benefit of lifting science and math teachers this year and then
going to bat for English and resource teachers next year. It would be far easier
to make a case on a subject to subject basis. The risk in this would be the
alienation of teachers in all of the subjects that are not on the front burner
at the moment (see the comment from the English teacher). The wisdom in raising
science and math pay is that these subjects are on the front lines for college
admission (English too) and students who major in these areas are apt to go into
higher paying professions. The pay will hopefully draw a few of those into
education where they are desperately needed.
On the other side: it wasn't until I left Utah and began to teach in another state that I realized the great asset UEA is to teachers.
On the other side: it wasn't until I left Utah and began to teach in another state that I realized the great asset UEA is to teachers.
Fairly and equally | 3:41 p.m. March 6, 2008
Most people don't think that fairly and equally are the same thing.
Teacher Karen | 3:54 p.m. March 6, 2008
Science teacher 1:31 obviously does not know that teachers are forbidden by law
from striking! Even the one day "sick out" from a few years ago was
not a strike.
I am a proud member of UEA, and my local association does a great job of negotiating a raise equal to the WPU percentage. If your local doesn't manage to do that, I suggest you ask to be named to the negotiating committe and do better.
For decades, the state legislature has ignored the needs of Utah's children and the need for decent wages for school employees. Only UEA was around to advocate for any improvment at all. We cooperated during the really tough times upon the promise that when times were better, we'd see greater compensation. Times got better and we were ignored for a long time. We cannot argue that actual dollars for education have increased recently, but that increase in amount has only paid for the increase in costs.
Finally, adding one or two thousand dollars per year to a salary that is half of what a science or math person could earn elsewhere will not convince someone who doesn't already want to be a teacher.
I am a proud member of UEA, and my local association does a great job of negotiating a raise equal to the WPU percentage. If your local doesn't manage to do that, I suggest you ask to be named to the negotiating committe and do better.
For decades, the state legislature has ignored the needs of Utah's children and the need for decent wages for school employees. Only UEA was around to advocate for any improvment at all. We cooperated during the really tough times upon the promise that when times were better, we'd see greater compensation. Times got better and we were ignored for a long time. We cannot argue that actual dollars for education have increased recently, but that increase in amount has only paid for the increase in costs.
Finally, adding one or two thousand dollars per year to a salary that is half of what a science or math person could earn elsewhere will not convince someone who doesn't already want to be a teacher.
maybe | 4:06 p.m. March 6, 2008
SLP
The Walton Foundation, Hume foundation, Olin Foundation, and Bradley Foundation all have donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to the AAE (For others, AAE is the parent of UCTE, like NEA to UEA), some for the express purpose of setting up new state chapters. They also advocate the corporate shill ABCTE certification that mercifully got cut from SB 281 in the last hour last night.
To be fair, I don't know if UCTE actually was set up with those funds. And I can believe that UCTE is not involved in all activities of the AAE just like the UEA does not advocate everything NEA does.
The problem is that the Waltons are funding that organization for a reason: to divide and conquer teachers. UEA is whiny sometimes, and I don't agree with everything it does. But they stand firm. I don't believe that the legislators would come around if we were just "nicer" to them. They have unyielding privatization philosophies and don't care what others think. They think teachers are lazy and can be replaced by computers.
A colleague I admire and my favorite BYU professor joined UCTE. I think that only encourages the legislature to ignore all teachers.
The Walton Foundation, Hume foundation, Olin Foundation, and Bradley Foundation all have donated hundreds of thousands of dollars to the AAE (For others, AAE is the parent of UCTE, like NEA to UEA), some for the express purpose of setting up new state chapters. They also advocate the corporate shill ABCTE certification that mercifully got cut from SB 281 in the last hour last night.
To be fair, I don't know if UCTE actually was set up with those funds. And I can believe that UCTE is not involved in all activities of the AAE just like the UEA does not advocate everything NEA does.
The problem is that the Waltons are funding that organization for a reason: to divide and conquer teachers. UEA is whiny sometimes, and I don't agree with everything it does. But they stand firm. I don't believe that the legislators would come around if we were just "nicer" to them. They have unyielding privatization philosophies and don't care what others think. They think teachers are lazy and can be replaced by computers.
A colleague I admire and my favorite BYU professor joined UCTE. I think that only encourages the legislature to ignore all teachers.
Re: Perfect Job | 4:14 p.m. March 6, 2008
Why don't you become a teacher if it is such an easy job?
I dare you, and others with the same opinion of teachers, to choose a subject or grade level and a school and call a teacher and volunteer to take their class for two days.
You are not allowed:
to use any of the teacher's lesson plans, you must write your own.
to leave the classroom during class hours, this means you cannot go to the restroom until a class break, lunch or after school.
You must:
be to school 30 minutes before school starts and stay 30 minutes after school ends.
correct all assignments and enter them into powerschool or whatever program is used before the next class period or the next day. This is so parents can check on their children's progress.
deal with parents who are upset that their child is not the star.
be prepared to handle all types of children, from all types of backgrounds. You cannot treat any child differently, no matter what.
do extra paperwork to fulfill NCLB regulations.
defend your job daily to those who thing you do nothing all day.
Any takers?!!!
I dare you, and others with the same opinion of teachers, to choose a subject or grade level and a school and call a teacher and volunteer to take their class for two days.
You are not allowed:
to use any of the teacher's lesson plans, you must write your own.
to leave the classroom during class hours, this means you cannot go to the restroom until a class break, lunch or after school.
You must:
be to school 30 minutes before school starts and stay 30 minutes after school ends.
correct all assignments and enter them into powerschool or whatever program is used before the next class period or the next day. This is so parents can check on their children's progress.
deal with parents who are upset that their child is not the star.
be prepared to handle all types of children, from all types of backgrounds. You cannot treat any child differently, no matter what.
do extra paperwork to fulfill NCLB regulations.
defend your job daily to those who thing you do nothing all day.
Any takers?!!!
Anonymous | 5:13 p.m. March 6, 2008
To Perfect Job:
Imagine putting a day-and-a-half worth of work each day and getting paid less than half of what you are worth. That is what a teacher does every school day. Teachers also don't get paid vacations or holidays as you suggest either.
Imagine putting a day-and-a-half worth of work each day and getting paid less than half of what you are worth. That is what a teacher does every school day. Teachers also don't get paid vacations or holidays as you suggest either.
Anonymous | 6:21 p.m. March 6, 2008
As a young teacher the real issue is not about pay. It really is the bureacracy
that is the road block...Unions, boards, etc. I know a first year teacher who
was recently fired because she was not a part of the UEA Union. Districts and
the UEA don't seem to really care about the teachers and students real
needs. A local district would rather invest millons in venture instead of
it's students-excuse me-what is more important. The classrooms lack
supplies and teachers lack assistants to aid them in their ability to teach the
large classroom sizes and the ever growing diverse population!!!!!!
WPU= No Way | 9:01 p.m. March 6, 2008
After years and years of watching the district take millions from the
legislature without giving any to fund salary increases, I'm really happy
that the state representatives found a way to get money to the teachers.
It's refreshing! Thank you to the Utah Legislature!!!
Re: Perfect Job | 9:08 p.m. March 6, 2008
I almost think you made your post to get a rise out of people. I am not sure
anyone could be as ignorant as what you posted. I think if you believe
teaching is the "perfect job" you should go be a teacher, then you
would have nothing to complain about. Why are you not a teacher?
RE:Perfect Job | 9:17 p.m. March 6, 2008
You can be a teacher. Go back to school get a four year degree. Teach for a few
years and then be told you have to go back and get endorsed in other areas such
as math or science. Once that is done you'll have to get a Masters Degree.
By then you will have taught for ten years. Now you are making the "Big
Bucks" (around $40k). Not bad for ten years work. It doesn't end
there...you will have to take continuous classes throughout your career to keep
your certificate current and if you don't well your out the door. Did I
mention that none of your schooling is paid for by the district you teach for.
Furthermore, you will be working in the summers to pay for that additional
schooling (loan payments). As far as holidays being paid...NOT. Your right
teaching is a perfect job and I recommend highly that you come give it a go.
However, since your earlier comments (3:14) are so accurate and you seem like a
nice person, I will warn you it is not for the faint of heart. It goes way
beyond that little piece of paper you posses called a GED.
Science Teacher | 9:50 p.m. March 6, 2008
I was going to respond to "Perfect Job", but it seems like my fellow
educators just schooled you.
HA HA!
HA HA!
Science Teacher | 11:18 p.m. March 6, 2008
Oh, and note to the UEA peeps above. You can't strike?!?
Just one more reason why I'll never join the toothless kitty that is the UEA.
All those dues and all you do is fight for WPU. Shame on you!
Just one more reason why I'll never join the toothless kitty that is the UEA.
All those dues and all you do is fight for WPU. Shame on you!
Children starving | 7:49 a.m. March 7, 2008
To the establishment advocate that said "Oh, we see your family's
starving. Let us paint your house."
From the vantage point of a parent, it looks more like the legislature is saying "Oh, we see your family's starving, but when we give you the money, you only buy beer. Because you can't control yourself, we will buy the food"
From the vantage point of a parent, it looks more like the legislature is saying "Oh, we see your family's starving, but when we give you the money, you only buy beer. Because you can't control yourself, we will buy the food"
RE:ANONYMOUS | 10:03 a.m. March 7, 2008
A teacher fired for not being a member of the Union. Why would anyone make such
an idiotic comment? Look deeper into why your friend was let go and I am sure
you will find a more suitable answer. The UEA actually has very low numbers
when it comes to their membership. You should say approximately 50% of all Utah
teachers will be fired because they do not belong to the Union, that would be
equally as accurate. The Union has far less power than people think. That is why
the numbers/membership is low. Please do some research before you post such
ridiculous statements.
Math and Science??? | 1:01 p.m. March 7, 2008
As a Math-Science teacher I would like to thank the Legislature for my pay
increase. I�m sorry for the rest of the dedicated teachers
of the other subjects. They deserve the money also. However, I believe the
Legislatures idea of paying more to math and science teachers will work. The
raise will not draw teacher that were headed to the business world (the money
wouldn�t be worth it) but for those that want to be
teachers it might persuade them go into math and science. My daughter wanted to
be a teacher. She was undecided as to go into math or Elementary Ed. She chose
Elementary Ed because the degree is so much easier to obtain. For an extra
$5000 a year she would have taken the road less traveled and been a math
teacher.
Anonymous | 6:03 p.m. March 7, 2008
In reality the UEA is a Professional Association, not an Union. They do
collective bargaining with the districts, they do lobby legislators, they do
make sure that the teachers are treated well by their employers, they do not
strike, anymore. The UEA had a one day "strike" in the
mid-1980's. The last time there was a real strike in Utah was when Jordan
District was on strike in 1981, that was one district striking for better
insurance and pay. It worked for a while.
Dave Hansen | 12:59 p.m. March 14, 2008
The UEA is a union. If it weren't a union then its parent organization,
the National Education Association, wouldn't have to make it's
finances available to the US Department of Labor.
Doing collective bargaining is the definition of a union. If the teachers union isn't a union, then I'm the queen of England.
Doing collective bargaining is the definition of a union. If the teachers union isn't a union, then I'm the queen of England.
Add your comment
Comments are monitored. Any comments found to be abusive, offensive, off-topic, misrepresentative, more than 200 words or containing URLs will not be posted.
Words Remaining
E-mail address: For internal use only. We may want to contact you to publish your comment (not your e-mail address) in the newspaper or for a separate story idea.
Related content
- Poinsettias need partners 2:00 p.m.
- Somali gov't replaces officials 1:55 p.m.
- Both candidates claim victory 1:44 p.m.
- BYU professor killed in crash 1:42 p.m.
- Vonn second to Goergl 1:28 p.m.
- Gas prices down 1.24 cents 1:17 p.m.
- Texas leads TCU in coaches' poll 1:09 p.m.
- USA Today Top 25 Poll 1:09 p.m.
- Another BCS mess 12:57 p.m.
- Several musicals break records 12:45 p.m.
- Y., U. to learn bowl destinations
- The forgotten ship: USS Utah
- Utahns want health care reform bills
- Snowy roads cause accidents, delays
- BYU basketball: Cougars crush Dons
- Tiger's SUV, personal life are a wreck
- Kurt Bestor: Joy for the world
- Jazz upset by Wolves
- Y. profs: Beck not all-knowing
- Branch president without a congregation
- Why is Y. ignoring spew of hatred?
312 - Letters: Liberal because LDS253
- Y. profs: Beck not all-knowing209
- Hate not limited to 1 in-state rivalry189
- Aggies shoot past Cougars179
- N.Y. Senate rejects gay marriage129
- George lost in rivalry hatefest112
- Unbeaten BYU takes trip to Logan105
- Ed Smart 'appalled' at testimony94
- Harpring's NBA career is over94
Trolley Square's annual Holiday Open House will feature visits with...
That does it — I'm having an affair! Thanks to Tiger Woods, David...
First, a big thank you to all who posted questions here for me to ask...
Latest comments
south summit had the best players all year
"Losing 24 seniors is not rebuilding." Golly, thanks for your opinion....
What the heck?? how come Riverton isn't even ranked? They toke second in...
@ no and lost in DC - you're dead wrong. apparently civic disobedience is...
T Wolves, Kings, Thunder, Rockets. All bad losses. The Jazz will look back...
hey got it right. Texas is better than TCU. TCU has a light schedule and...
So you'd let an undocumented person die? Really?
Amen, Brother, amen.
Most of your comments show just how stupid most of you are.
I just sent Senators Hatch and Bennet a Christmas Card - do the same. They...
Advertisements