Reader comments
Pignanelli & Webb: Educating immigrants would help Utah

Anonymous | 8:22 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

I've got nothing against the illegals coming here although I wish they would come legally. If I was trying to raise a family in a poor country I'd probably try to come as well.

My problem is their short-sightedness. They have to see that speaking Spanish is only going to harm them in the work force. Learn english. Assimilate. Become AMERICAN. Live the dream. Just don't ask us to change our society for you when you get here.

It used to be that immigrants quickly tried to fit in.

Not any more. Now they hold rallies bemoaning the fact that stuff isn't translated for them.

Yes! | 9:10 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Amen.

Western Civ is finished | 9:36 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

shocking! The powers that be want unrestricted (illegal)immigration into this state. The sad part is that they care very little for the illegals that are already here- they want an unrestricted flow of cheap labor- and for every illegal here working for 10.00 an hour there are 10 more in Central America that would come here to work for 5.00 an hour. When the illegals are "legalized" and given citizenship and are hurt at work and can no longer work then who picks up the tab? The taxpayer. Go ask native Europeans how well multiculturalism and overwhelming immigration works out.

Comments continue below

ten | 10:01 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

I'm neither noisy, threatening or a zealot. I think you have me mixed up with the Illegal crowd who march in the street, spitting on US citizens, demanding rights, waving foreign flags, and burning US flags. Say what you will, but it is apparent that it is the politicians vs the people on this issue. Thank goodness that the Legislators are in touch with their constituents.

zeezil | 10:21 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Those claiming they donï¿½t want to penalize the children of illegal aliens by creating a special status approach exclusively for them with specific tuition benefits such as in-state tuition is ludicrous. In point of fact, the children of illegal aliens are, themselves, illegal aliens. Additionally, one must consider the rampant issue of immigration benefit fraud that has been amply documented in one GAO report after another and one OIG report after another. We should also realize that if our nation was stupid enough to create such a lucrative benefit for such "children" that the fraud rates would be astronomical!

zeezil | 10:25 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Also realize that while these student illegal aliens are the children of illegal aliens they are not minors! We are talking about adult illegal aliens who would be provided with the opportunity to remain in the United States and file applications for their family members while being provided with a level of financial assistance our nation does not provide to United States citizen college students! This is the equivalent of you providing a steak dinner with all the trimmings to your neighbors kids each night for many years while feeding your own kids tuna fish and macaroni! If you did this as a parent most would question your sanity and they would be correct ï¿½ yet bureaucrats and politicians who favor this seemingly well-intentioned measure would be stabbing our own kids in the back while opening yet another Pandora's Box that would invite massive fraud!

Should All the Innocent be Punis | 11:17 a.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Many people believe these children should be punished for the sins of their parents and denied in state tuition. Do they also then believe that all people in a speeding car should get a speeding ticket? If this is good policy for the children, why not all people in a speeding car, including any children who happen to be riding. After all they are all going in excess of the legal speed limit.

If letting these children to have in state tution encourages law breaking, then so does not giving all people in a speeding car a ticket encourage the driver to continue speeding. No doubt if all were subject to a ticket the driver would be less likely to speed.

If it is good to punish the innocent who crossed a border, why is it not good law to punish the innocent who speed?

Free market Fred | 12:31 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

The free market extends to the work place. Restricting immigration of any kind is simply a socialist ploy to artificially keep wages high.

Jaime | 1:56 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Illegal immigrants would come here legally if they could. They cannot because our immigration system does not allow them any legal way to get here (besides somehow marrying an American citizen). It is a myth and a lie that immigrants nowadays "unlike previous generations" don't want to learn English and be productive. Ask any linguist--Immigrants today are learning English faster and better than immigrants of past generations. The problem is that most people don't take time to talk immigrants individually, or visit their English classes, or even learn the slightest bit about our current immigration laws. Instead saying "why don't you come here legally like our ancestors did?" The fact is, they come here exactly like our ancestors did, only now it has been declared illegal. The de-humanization of people with families who come here to work hard and follow the American dream, is appalling. These are people just like you, with families and hopes and dreams. And yet, why is it okay to hate them? Where's the compassion Jesus taught? Our neighbors to the South are still our neighbors and Jesus loves them and commands us to do so as well.

Stewart | 4:27 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Frank and LaVarr are simply joining in as The Deseret News and KSL fall in line in support of their corporate master(s) in support of cheap labor as they enable illegal immigration in opposition to U.S. sovereignty. We are really talking about low skilled entry level jobs where wages are being depressed by flooding the labor market with cheap foreign labor. Wages like commodities are determined by supply and demand. Over supply depresses wages just as it does commodities prices. This is what is enlarging the underclass at the expense of the middle class taxpayers who have to make up the difference of those paid below subsistence levels.

Remember "compassion" is also used to justify bad behavior by an enabler.

The Raven | 6:09 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

Utah should not be giving illegal aliens in-state tuition while U.S. citizens from another state have to pay a higher rate. Make the illegals pay the out-of-state tuition rate. If Elder Jensen, Frank and LaVarr, Chris Cannon, and other illegal alien supporters still feel strongly about the in-state tuition rate, let them pick up the difference between the two rates.

C. Jones | 8:57 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

What do you expect from two Deseret News sheep? There are about 100 reasons that illegal immigration is destroying this state and nation but these two come up with the only kind of benefit they could think of. They have to tow the newsapaper line in any case. If all the people who have been injured by illegals in the state would cancel their subscriptions it might send a message. Look at the New York Times, on their way out.

Mike | 9:21 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

I come in contact with Hispanic teenagers as part of one of my volunteer activities. They are at least as well mannered as the non-Hispanic kids, and although they tend to speak Spanish to each other, they speak English as well as anyone else. I have no doubt that they will be able to retain their culture AND integrate into the larger US culture. I don't fear the future.

hamm | 9:23 p.m. Feb. 17, 2008

I've lost any respect for LaVarr Webb. I would suggest he employ some logic next time he tries writing in the newspaper.

4SecuringUSAPost911 | 12:23 a.m. Feb. 18, 2008

LaVarr & Frank:
As a fellow Republican, I found your column as a subtle suck-punch in the face of those choosing to uphold border security during this post-911 era. We don't have border security thanks to the soft-on-the-undocumented now in this country. With close to 20 million such residing among us, your desires to aid the children of these would-be immigrants while noble, it is flawed. Like my extended family and relatives, do it legally! Laws lend order. Bending of such today, only breeds trouble, if not, civil chaos in the short years ahead.
Just why would you choose to not uphold Federal Laws which mandate that these illegals enter under the established statutory protocals? While your logic is not only silly, it's also dangerous. Instead, why not give the children of legal migrants already entered herein these privileges?

Thanks | 7:42 a.m. Feb. 18, 2008

I'm so glad to see so many cooler heads appear and state the case for moderation. It's scary to see the legislature moving in the direction of an extremist vocal minority.

Wilkey | 12:33 p.m. Feb. 18, 2008

Yep the businessmen favoring open borders are ALL ABOUT compassion, aren't they??? NO selfishness in it at all for them, is there? They're just good, decent-hearted folk who want what's best for us all.

And the "noisy zealots", Lavarr? They're called citizens and voters.

D-News is short-sighted | 9:38 a.m. Feb. 19, 2008

Have Messrs. Pignanelli and Webb considered the long-term implications of admitting millions of Mexican citizens, most of whom do not have H.S. educations and can't speak English? This will create an instant underclass---stuck in menial jobs. And what about their kids? Can you honestly say their kids will have the same opportunities as a native from the East Bench? Let's face it, we're looking at higher crime rates, more gang activity, and more expensive public services to be offset by the meager taxes on low wages. This is not wise public policy. Nor is it fair to favor Mexicans or Hispanics over everyone else in the world.

Geoff | 9:28 p.m. Feb. 19, 2008

At the very least, let's not give illegals free services while the rest of us pay for it.

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