Deseret News | Current focus concentrates on retaining LDS members

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New Harmony: Current focus concentrates on retaining LDS members

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Anonymous | 2:09 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

To Senior
You have helped me understand the meaning of being a senior. Than you!!

Not perfect? | 2:06 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I'm certainly not perfect, but if I ever did the things our early Church leaders did, I would be instantly excommunicated. It's really hard to justify their actions as minor imperfections.

How many of you have ever married another man's wife, or a 14 year old girl, behind your current wife's back? How many have been convicted of bank fraud? These are not MINOR imperfections! Why does the Church seem to gloss over them as if they were?

How do they expect to retain members when they do?

Mike | 2:16 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I want less active members to return to the fold just like I desire non-members who are searching for greater meaning in life to investigate the Church. Both are important.

In the meantime, you will be hard pressed to find any religious organization of any size anywhere that even comes close to the activity rates of the LDS Church. In South America where I served my mission, the Catholic members use to laugh when we asked if they attended church. They were by and large "traditional" Catholics only. They attended a couple of times a year and at the baptism of their children.

With regard to the type of people you find in the various congregations of the LDS Church, I would say you can find almost anything you want to find. They are all there, good and bad.

The LDS religion is a powerful influence for spirituality and goodness in my life and the lives of those I love. I would desire that all have access to it, but I realize and respect that people will always do there best to find happiness in there own ways.

"Don't give up". The pursuit of happiness is a worthy goal.

Comments continue below

Re:Latter Days | 2:11 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

When are those Latter Days comming? I bet you think in this lifetime. Do you know every so called prophet thought that the "Last Days" were comming in their lifetimes. Even Joe Smith thought that very same thought. The is a term used for people who "remain faithful no matter what" it's called BLIND FAITH and it is very scary. David Coresh had it.

anoymous | 2:12 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

i looked on the WEB for SHEILDS, i COLULDN'T FIND ANYTHING PLEASE GIVE ME SOME HELP TO FIND THE ORGANIZATION. THANKS

Yo Yo Yo | 2:20 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Here's a solution (and I've heard they're trying this model in Chile): Make meeting 2 hours instead of 3. Keep Sacrament and Relief Society/Priesthood, but take away Sunday School to do at home. I think some converts think it's too long! This is not a statement based on laziness, its a statement of focusing on learning with the family. Turn Family Home Evening on Mondays to a Sunday School hour at the home on Sundays. Mondays can be so hard to get everybody together. Why not do it on Sunday?

Ernest T. Bass | 2:28 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

To Already made up your mind:
Why is it that church historians and writers who bring up the mistakes of leaders are excommunicated? There is no open dialogue. Non at all. The church pretends the JS never did marry teenaged girls.
They pretend Brigham Young wasn't an enormous racist. They forget many false prophecies.
You are the one who's already made up your mind.

William a baumgardner | 2:30 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I've sat here today & read all of the comments on this web page.It reminds me of what The Lord said about "luke warm saints making Him sick & He will Spew them out of His mouth"! So to all of you "so called" members of THE CHURCH OF JESUS CHRIST OF LATTER DAY SAINTS, your time is drawing very short, as is you leader, satan.Yes, I know I spelled his name with a small "s". I intended to to show how small he is in the whole realm of things pertaining to this world & the TRUE GOSPEL of JESUS CHRIST.I know that the Church is TRUE & it does not matter a hill of beans if NONE opf you know it! If you don't, thats your problem, not mine. I love to teach anyone the truth if he/she wants to hear it, but I don't waste my time with anyone that wants to contend it. I'll pray for all of you poor lost souls.

Paul | 2:32 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Blah, blah black sheep
Have you lost your will?

Yes sir, yes sir,
For many reasons still.

One for the constant, benign rhetoric of boring, boring, BORING correlated lessons,
One for the erroneous 'check list' modality promulgated to become a spiritual person,
And one for the constant bad policies (not doctrines)
Which influence leaders and other members to marginalize out-of-the-box (many times due to circumstances beyond their control) members.

"Don't give up."
On what, or who are you saying this to?
Tell this to the local, yokel leadership, and narrow-minded, clique-oriented membership in so many wards and stakes.

Or is this just more of the same ol' 'blah, blah, blah' while "the caravan (continues to)march(es) on" in the same ol' way?

I hope not, but I would suspect that it is.

Up to each person | 2:40 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

If retention is really up to the individual, not the ward or church, I wonder why we bother to send out missionaries. Surely, people have free will, and they could choose to investigate and join the church is they really wanted to, right?

Where is the happiness? | 2:37 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

The message I have read from many of these comments is, if I want to be happier in my life, I must leave the LDS Church. If I stay a member of the LDS Church, I am somehow suffocating myself and denying myself a more meaningful life.

Okay, so let's look at the lives of those who have left the LDS Church, and since so many people who have left Mormonism have praised the Internet, the best place to start would be websites and blogs written by ex-Mormons.

For the most part, all I see on these sites is hate, hate and more hate. All I read is cuss words, cuss words and more cuss words. These people claim the LDS Church lies about its doctrine, but after doing a little research, I discover many of these same people aren't being honest themselves.

So, if leaving the LDS Church means I will find happiness by being bitter; if leaving Mormonism means that cuss words and nasty comments will become my daily vocabluary. Then I will stay LDS for the rest of my life.

From that perspective, ex-Mormon websites and blogs have convinced me how wonderful the LDS Church really is.

Fallible humans? | 2:43 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

People keep posting about how the church is made up of human beings, and human beings are fallible.

True.

But, isn't the church supposed to help make human beings better? Less fallible? More compassionate? More willing to help their fellow people?

If the people in the church are no better than the people outside of it, what is that point?

Frank | 2:40 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Mormons have changed their religion so much that they have replaced the concept of Zion with a conservative political ideology.

Anonymous | 2:40 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

If I'm unhappy with my existence, I just look at what I'm not doing right and I try to correct it. Sometimes just praying or reading the scriptures daily can bring a ray of sunshine into my life. I think what everyone forgets is that the LDS church is administered by "people", normal, imperfect human beings like you and me. We all have to own up to our personal responsibility as disciples of Christ. The Lord is not going to do your homework for you. Every person has to be responsible for their own salvation. Some people want to do what they want, but every choice has a consequence and when that consequence slaps them in the face they're quick to blame it on their church leaders or church members. Sometimes people are spiritually weak and need to be helped along the path, but in the end...everyone needs to understand the game plan and be accountable for their own decisions.

Tyler | 2:41 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I have been home from a mission for almost 5 years. In those 5 years I have married in the temple, had children, served as YM president and now in the E.Q. Presidency. For the latter part of 2007 I felt discouraged with all the meetings and it felt like I was dragging my family to church each week. I also has lost the habits of studying the scriptures and praying daily. As 2008 was upon me, I set a goal to pray and study the sciptures daily and be prepared to participate in my sunday school lesson. As I have done this, I have regained the companionship of the Holy Ghost. I now see the meetings as a chance to help others spiritually and physically and I am excited to participate in my sunday meetings. As I have regained focus in my own worship, my church worship has come back into focus as well. It's worked for me, perhaps others may benefit from the same.

Anonymous | 2:41 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I question all early church practices.There is some strange history in the church. I have been told by many that my church is a FRAUD! The only thing I have ever found to be a fraud was polygamy! I don't get off on the silly stories told by some of the G A's.
It was nothing but lusty old men looking and using God for the purpose of having more woman in in their lives. I wonder how God feels about these men using his name for their lusty practice. The more wives these guys had the better off you were in the church back then and higher in the church. Whoever cared about the feelings of woman? apparently they didn't matter. Please don't ever believe in this malarkey that it was just fine and dandy. There are diaries that prove different you fools!!!!!

Zoro | 2:42 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

If the Church stopped worrying about programs and got back to the principles of our faith, we'd have that old time spiritual power back that could retain converts.

Rufus | 2:43 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Too many meetings.... enough said.

Maybe this will help? | 2:44 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

How can the Church hope to retain its members when they keep firing and excommunicating anyone with questions?

A Long-Inactive Member | 2:50 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

To Mormon Emeritus: I heartily enjoyed your post. To an extent, I share your underlying feelings about membership. My slant on it, though, is to ask the church - with real intent - which it wants and needs more, to expunge us or wrestle with the angel over the "retention problem." Pretty rhetorical, as President Monson has already indicated the latter. Somehow I think the blessing obtained won't be what's expected, however.

Don Guyman | 2:52 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

The church in Utah is too conservative. There, it is a church for white-collared Republicans and businessmen. When the Utah church is able to openly be the church of all races, peoples and political persuasions, then we'll grow like the prophet wants us to.

Mark | 2:49 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

We often give new members so many reasons to give up. So many stresses within the church and who really wants to be a cultural and political Mormon? So much judgment in Mormon culture. So many ways to fail. So many antidepressants.

Anonymous | 2:56 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

This is sad, sad, sad.
Why can't they just allow people to exercise their free agency and mind their own business?

20/20 | 3:03 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

It's not blind faith. You wouldn't understand that even if I were to explain it.

The Real Question | 3:04 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I do not pretend to diminish the seriousness of being treated poorly in this Church. Yes, there are humans in all churches and all are prone to mistakes and some mistakes can truly drive an individual out of that church. But for me, the question truly centers on whether or not Jesus Christ and Heavenly Father restored the keys and authority to Joseph Smith? Unfortunately that history or story is far from the clean version we all received in Sunday School and that has shaken my testimony of it. The question for me has nothing to do with the Savior or the atonement as that is taught in all christian churches. The question is did things happen as Joseph Smith testified they did? If I believe they did then I have an obligation to follow the teachings of the gospel as taught in the LDS Church whether I agree with them all or not. If I do not believe it then I need to let go and move on with my life - respecting and loving my family and those who continue to believe and hope they in turn treat me the same. Time to hit my knees!

two cents | 3:06 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Some go inactive because being active means taking church callings that occupy your entire life and exclude all nonmembers from your time. The ward is your life.......which is ok for some people, but others have associations and relationships that go beyond that scope, and are shunned for doing so.

Anonymous | 3:24 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

People are presented or are indoctrinated into the LDS world.
Some stay.
Some exercise their free agency and realizing it's not for them quit.
Why not just leave them alone?

Christian Convert | 3:24 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

After 30 plus years in the LDS faith I have never realized how much emotional and spiritual pain supposedly "ACTIVE" LDS members can caused. I am now a convert in the Roman Catholic Church. I am acitive in various lay ministry programs in my parish and diocese. I have found much peace, compassion, forgiveness, and hope which I have never experienced in Mormonism. I am content that my search for true Christian practices and values is within the faith I currently embraced. Perhaps, the leadership and hierarchy of the LDS Church should realized that doctrines may sound superior in comparison to other denominations; however, true Christian application of "a Christlike Character" is very much alive and well in all denominations.

Josh | 3:23 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

When I share my testimony and personal feelings about the gospel, I hope that whomever I'm talking to listens respectfully, even if they don't agree. It seems like I owe others the same courtesy, even if their personal experiences with the LDS Church have been negative. It's OK to have questions and concerns, and maybe fewer people would be disaffected from the church if more of their member friends would listen respectfully without judging or jumping to conclusions. That being said, I know from my own experience that the gospel is true, and only hope that sharing that knowledge will allow others to feel the peace and joy that I have in my own life. That peace is absolutely real, and it's why I'm a member of the church.

To Mike re activity rate | 3:25 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Mike you said you would be hard pressed to find another church with the activity rate of the LDS church. Umm, either you simply cannot accept anything that reflects negatively on the Church or you are entirely uninformed. Reactivation initiatives as this article addresses is driven in large part by the extremely high inactivity rate in the Church!! In some overseas branches and wards the activity rate is extimated at 10-20%. In the US you are probably around 40%. Overall the general consensus is that actual active membership is probably about 4.5 million of the 13 million member number announced. And these are numbers from hard core members who have followed these trends for years and want the Church to succeed not anti numbers meant to shed a poor light on the Church. There is a HUGE pool of people who once were baptized and no longer attend that the Church is rightly focusing on - whether those people want it or not. But to say the activity rate is good is not looking out of the Utah County ward box at all! Google LDS activity rates and you will become a little more informed.

Various | 3:28 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I don't see anyone mentioning the biggest barrier to convert retention - THREE HOURS every Sunday. The Church is experimenting with two hour blocks in other parts of the world. When will it be rolled out in the United States?

Here's my new theory of how the church works. Those that serve well in their lower level callings receive higher callings that free them from having to sit in Primary for two hours or worse, Gospel Doctrine and EQ/RS. Underperform and you are relegated to two hours of HECK.

Attention spans have changed over the years. When will the church schedule?

WWJD | 3:28 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I have a unique, heretofore unmentioned idea for addressing retention, not to mention for missionary work and conversion: Follow Christ, and "love thy neighbor as thyself."

The question, "Who is my neighbor?" was answered with the parable of the good Samaritan. After the Priest and Levite -- devote men, no doubt -- passed by the man beaten and robbed, the despised Samaritan gave of his time and substance to care for the man, saw that he was lodged, fed, his wounds nursed and bandaged. This isn't meant to be a factual account of an actual event, folks, it is meant as a metaphor.

Reasonable, rational, sincere, honest, loving, kind people sometimes question their faith. Those who lecture rather than listen, who judge rather than love, who return debate with debate, rather than apologizing and turning the other cheek are far, far from the spirit of the Savior.

WWJD | 3:29 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

To those who question, I say, "seek, and ye shall find," to those who are hurt or hurting, I say, "Come unto [Christ] all ye that labor or are heavy laden, and [Christ] shall give you rest. If you have sinned, I say, "Forgive them, Father, for they know not what they do." For those who have experienced rejection, or who haven't been embraced, may I just say those people are there in the pews. If you will take the tiny step of introducing yourself around, you will find someone through whom Christ will show his love.

LDS Culture | 3:32 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

The LDS culture breeds the doctrine of self-righteous superiority...whatever that means...."we are marching on to glory..." I've been inactive for 5 years...missionaries contacted me via telephone twice due to some special PROJECT Home Teaching assignment from the ward. Never heard from them since.

Improve retention....what a joke!!!

Hoorumph | 3:34 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

If you want to see real Mormonism, go anywhere outside the Utah /Idaho version of it, and see wards where rich and poor of all ethnicities reside in harmony with each other. The Utah Cultural aspects of Mormonism are an abomination. ( you got long hair, go to a ward in West Valley, not Olympus cove)......The cultural stratus and class division in wards and stakes here IS the reason I quit attending. In South America there are Stake presidents who are poor and look like the homeless here.......do YOU want them leading YOUR meetings?

re: Formerly Active | 3:43 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

First, may I say I am truly sorry for your loss.

I had a very similar experience some years ago. My father was dying, and I was being drained of physical, emotional, and spiritual strength, with little or no response from my Ward. When my father died, I contacted the Elder's Quorum President, my former councilor, and he told -- no one. Not one person from my ward showed up at my father's funeral.

Some months later I heard a talk by President Eyring, who looked me straight in the eye -- out of 200 people -- and said, "I want you to know whatever you are going through, the Savior went through that, and more, and He understands your pain, and what you are going through will help you understand and succor other people."

That was exactly right. My pain, the loneliness of neglect, has helped me recognize and reach out to others. I taught my ward how to reach out, too, and they did in subsequent circumstances.

I pray you will feel God's love, and I'm confident you will feel it -- abundantly -- as you forgive some and reach out to others.

Many Mansions | 3:43 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

"IN MY FATHER'S HOUSE ARE MANY MANSIONS" for Christians....Jews....Moslems...Buddhists...and for Christians (Catholics, Episcopalians, Baptists, Methodists, Presbyterians)....by the way, are Mormons Christians?

Mind Your Own Business! | 3:43 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I think the problem with the church is obvious. Just read this entire blog and it will tell you exactly what is wrong within the church. I see a big division on the rise.

What someone else posted awhile back on one of these blogs made sense to me? Why donï¿½t members learn to mind their own business and not everyone elses business. Everyone elseï¿½s business is NOT YOUR business, so MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS! And please stay out of my business. It might be the answer.

CB | 3:44 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

One of my dearest friends is a woman I use to visit teach 10 years ago (I have since moved and we still keep in touch). She was totally inactive and very angry with the church, but she allowed me to come to her home to visit. I would listen to her complaints about the church and over time I came to love this woman, she is a dear friend, and her angst with the church is her problem, but it does not keep me from appreciating the person that she is and the friendship we have. Will she come back to church? I pray that she does, but if not, it does not change my concern and caring for her.
The church is a vehicle whereby we assist each other towards perfection, of course we are not perfect, nor is any ward or stake. Neither does everyone have a testimony, even though the may have travel through the 'whole program'. Perfection is found in the Gospel of Jesus Christ. We are making choices every day, choices that will finally terminate in the place we are most suited for. Thank you Jerry for your concern for the lost sheep.

what about zion? | 3:48 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

As long as retention means keeping attendance at meetings up, it's a futile effort. The Church needs to decide if it wants to build Zion or not. Right now, there's hardly any difference between LDS society and the society in the world at large. In Utah, the focus is on building bigger houses, portfolios and other signs of worldly success. If the Church returns to basics and focuses on eliminating poverty, disease, ignorance, etc., by applying consecration, the issue would switch from retention to managing all the people who would join the effort.

Happy Day | 3:56 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I know this is not a loving and kind blog. But Happy Valentines Day to ALL those who believe in LOVE and God.
In-active-member!

re-Brent | 3:56 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

You're too easy. Sounds like you made your mind up long ago and were just waiting for an excuse. You have one, happy?

observer | 3:59 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Is there any other place in America where a person's religion, or lack thereof, is such a big point of discussion, virtually all of the time?

Listening In | 3:57 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

This has been a very interesting conversation. It has brought many thoughts to my mind.

1. There is a great difference between the Church and the Gospel. The Gospel of Christ is true, the Church has it's own cultural oddities that do not always conform with how the Savior himself would act.

2. No matter what the idea, we shouldn't be swayed by the mistakes of others, but decide our own beliefs and then stand with them. If you believe something is true, stick to it, don't worry about what another 'believer' does. Are these principles true for you? You will find humans in every walk and belief of life. The Church has no monopoly on hypocrisy and weakness.

3. I thought what Jeff Kelly said had a great deal of truth in it. We are hindered in our service and outreach by needing an assignment and by having everything so formalized (a place for everything and everything in its place). Also, we do tend to think the world revolves around us and we have fear and mistrust of outsiders. All too true. Again, it comes back to the Gospel of Christ, not the Church . . .

Nothing wrong... | 4:00 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I appreciate the honesty that so many have demonstrated in their messages of facing up to the difficult decision of investigating the history and doctrines of the church.

Thank you, so much for sharing.

As Jesus said, 'the Truth will set you free.'

Imperfect but trying | 4:05 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

To the post at 12:47P.M.

Actually, I really was wallowing in self pity. "Was" being the key word. Until I realized that if I wasn't part of the solution, than I was part of the problem.

And you are exactly right. People who leave the Church do not need anyone's pity, least of all their own self pity.

I stand by my earlier comment: people need to receive Christlike love. The way to do it is to live like Christ lived, and love like he loved, and not concern ourselves with how others may not be giving us that same love. Yes, I still have regrets that I cannot perfectly offer this in the way that you and others can receive it. I'm trying, though.

What gets me, is that like you, I used to have expectations of others to not treat me in this way or that way, and yet I didn't realize that I was holding them to a higher standard than I hold myself. What had I done to lift another? Why must others always lift me? Who is at the giving end, if we are all critics, waiting at the receiving end?

Jazz Fan | 4:10 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

Absolute Truth should be able to bear absolute scrutiny.

I can't understand why the LDS church tells its members that: 'the thinking has been done.'

Why, when it comes to a person's eternal soul are they not allowed to ask tough questions about everything and anything in Mormonism? I ask questions of everything I do, in fact, I question everything. And if my eternal soul is at stake I'd sure expect some answers from people who call themselves general authorities, and prophets, and that I don't ever have to worry about them because I'll never be led astray.

The LDS church has a lot of questions to answer if they ever want me to join. And they can start with coming clean on their history. That's All.

MoJules | 4:10 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

I left Utah 5 years ago, I now live in Missouri, I believe that the retention problem has so many sides to it. My daughter was raised in the church, left it while she had a guy on a mission. I know that at this point in her life she won't go back to the LDS church, I have encouraged her to go to some church, to be learning about Christ. She now seems to have lost her belief in Christ as the Son of God, that is pretty sad. In the ward I am in, we for a long time would have a convert a month, we would see them a couple of weeks and never again. I believe that there is more hope in retaining a new convert than there is to retain people that grew up in the church. For those who grew up in the church and served and loved the church, then left, there seems to be more hostility and unwillingness than with someone that is new to the church. But I believe that there are many out there, who left in their early teens, that would love to come back. I hope they do.

HELP!!!!!!!! | 4:12 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

JOSH
You are so correct! I am too busy for a church calling and my spouse is as well. What time we have we try to spend it together. I don't fine church callings keep a lot of it's members in a spiritual mood. However there are those who do well with them and need them. So be it! BUT NOT FOR ME!

Long Time Member | 4:19 p.m. Feb. 14, 2008

when I was a child I wanted to know the truth about Jesus Christ. I wanted to know all about him, I asked guestions of many pastors, but did not recieve the answer I could accept as true.

I was raised in one church and joined another as a boy. when I was around seventeen years old, I started smoking. My pastor called me in and asked me if it were true that I had started smoking, I told him yes, he then asked me if I intended to stop, I told him no, he then informed me that I was no longer a member if that church.

about 25 years later, I met my wife and she invited me to go to church with her, I did go with her to The Church Of Jesus Christ Of Latter-Day Saints (Mormon) in the first Sunday School class, several questions I had had all my life were answered.

after studing the teachings of the LDS for 2 years I come to KNOW I had found what I was searching for.

Now it does not matter to me who does or does not fellowship me, I know the gospel is true.

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