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Plans for Cottonwood Mall leap forward
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This is exciting ! | 2:07 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Peter, please vote Yes...
Darrel | 6:44 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Granite is going to contribute money to help a commercial enterprise? I think
some ethanol has gotten into the drinking water.
Student - further behind | 7:33 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
How is this a good thing for Granite District schools? Why should students
suffer / fund a commercial enterprise?
It is quite concerning that more residents don't speak up in outrage. Let's take away from the students to give to businesses...
It is quite concerning that more residents don't speak up in outrage. Let's take away from the students to give to businesses...
Comments continue below
Anonymous | 7:52 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
The RSL staduim and now THIS!?!? Where are the priorities?
Anonymous | 8:07 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Wow, all this angst. The School District isn't losing any money. They are
going to keep getting exactly what they are now until construction is complete.
Then they will get 25% of what they will get at the end of the 20 year
period.
This 25% is an increase of roughly $700,000 a year more then they are getting now. And at the end of the 20 year period, they will be getting almost $4,000,000 more then they are getting now.
They aren't losing any money the decision. They are in fact going to be getting more.
So would all of the people who are upset that the School District voted for this be willing to get more money without losing money?
This is something that everyone should want the School District to do. Think of the children first. Thankfully, they did.
This 25% is an increase of roughly $700,000 a year more then they are getting now. And at the end of the 20 year period, they will be getting almost $4,000,000 more then they are getting now.
They aren't losing any money the decision. They are in fact going to be getting more.
So would all of the people who are upset that the School District voted for this be willing to get more money without losing money?
This is something that everyone should want the School District to do. Think of the children first. Thankfully, they did.
Thanks 8:07... | 8:39 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I'm so tired of people whining that this is "taking" money from
the kiddies...do your research...with this approval, the amount of money from
the Cottonwood Mall directly to the Granite School district goes from 137,000 to
900,000 instantly. Then, in 20 years, it jumps to 4 Million. This is a win-win
for everyone, especially the city of Holladay, who stood to lose their anchor
economic base. Give it a rest. Students will not "suffer" unless
nothing happens at Cottonwood Mall.
Anonymous | 8:40 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I think this sounds like a wonderful project that will enhance Holladay and
bring much needed revenue. I just wish they'd also decide something on
that big patch of vacant land where Partner's, etc. used to be. What a
fiasco that has been. Let's hope the mall project turns out better and we
have something besides another blighted area to contend with.
Jaded | 8:43 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
How ironic. Salt Lake County officials fight giving RDA funds to the Real Salt
Lake Stadium, even though the team pledge not to take any RDA funds from
schools. Now they're happy to throw 20 million into a developers pocket
with no questions asked. Where's the economic viability study?
Where's the press conference raking the owner through the coals? Now we
know the the RSL stand at the county was nothing more than politics.
SLC gal | 8:57 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Anyone else imagining "The Ventitain" in Vegas???
Re: SLC gal | 9:05 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Would love the Venetian. Don't know if the gondolas in the winter would be
very fun. I can only imagine the high school kids pushing them playing
accordians in frozen ponds and snowing.
In all seriousness, it isn't a bad idea to theme it. I think a great mall is to take it one step further and completely replicate Venice with the square, Il Doge's palace, St. Peters Shoppilica, the Bridge of Sighs (could be a cool location for books or computer stuff or Spencers gifts) and the Rialto bridge. I would shop there.
In all seriousness, it isn't a bad idea to theme it. I think a great mall is to take it one step further and completely replicate Venice with the square, Il Doge's palace, St. Peters Shoppilica, the Bridge of Sighs (could be a cool location for books or computer stuff or Spencers gifts) and the Rialto bridge. I would shop there.
Anonymous | 9:10 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Jaded, the RSL money was from the TRT, Transient Room Tax. This is payed by
visitors to the hotels in the county.
The main problem the county had with it was that the hotels that were "funding" the stadium are all in Downtown SLC and the stadium is in Sandy where the "funding source" will not see an impact.
If the stadium would have been allowed to be in Downtown SLC like originally planed prior to Curtis stepping in and trying to take the glory, the County wouldn't have had a problem with it.
This story is about the Cottonwood Mall redevelopment. Which will not take money away from the school district but will rather give them more.
The main problem the county had with it was that the hotels that were "funding" the stadium are all in Downtown SLC and the stadium is in Sandy where the "funding source" will not see an impact.
If the stadium would have been allowed to be in Downtown SLC like originally planed prior to Curtis stepping in and trying to take the glory, the County wouldn't have had a problem with it.
This story is about the Cottonwood Mall redevelopment. Which will not take money away from the school district but will rather give them more.
Way to go GSD Board! | 9:18 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Wow, some public officials with vision and foresight, what a concept!! I agree
with Anon 807 and Thanks 807 - people are so quick to jump to conclusions that
they don't see the benefit to this vote.
GSD doesn't write a check to anyone, and they aren't "gambling" with the kids' money (as Van Tassell from the Taxpayers Assoc said last night). If anything, the gamble would be for the Board to have voted no in hopes of luring another developer in without the RDA status. And ooh boy - then we could watch the mall sit vacant for another 2-3 years and watch the traffic at Macy's and TGIF totally dry up - wouldn't that be the way to go?!
Here's a story problem for all you well-educated "tax advocates": do I want $171k (and shrinking) to spend on our kids, or do I want to give them $900k/year now and $4 MILLION+ in a few years? Hmmm - let me think about that one...
GSD doesn't write a check to anyone, and they aren't "gambling" with the kids' money (as Van Tassell from the Taxpayers Assoc said last night). If anything, the gamble would be for the Board to have voted no in hopes of luring another developer in without the RDA status. And ooh boy - then we could watch the mall sit vacant for another 2-3 years and watch the traffic at Macy's and TGIF totally dry up - wouldn't that be the way to go?!
Here's a story problem for all you well-educated "tax advocates": do I want $171k (and shrinking) to spend on our kids, or do I want to give them $900k/year now and $4 MILLION+ in a few years? Hmmm - let me think about that one...
Ray | 9:26 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I don't get it. With this money now going to build the 'mall',
where will future funding in the next few years for additional schools, teachers
salaries, needed county improvements, etc, come from-- a tax increase perhaps?
It seems we are mortgaging our future now to pay for the REAL and now a mall.
John | 9:27 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
WHAT THE HECK????
Granite School DIstrict is in the mall development business?
I thought they were supposed to be teaching kids to read and write, and that schools are all begging for money.
I guess I was wrong, they have $52M laying around [forcibly taken from us TAXPAYERS!] to "invest" in some Ponzi scheme that may pay more someday?
This is WRONG on so many levels!
Never, NEVER! again tell me our schools need more money!
VOTE AGAINST EVERY POLITICIAN WHO SUPPORTS THIS NONSENSE!
Granite School DIstrict is in the mall development business?
I thought they were supposed to be teaching kids to read and write, and that schools are all begging for money.
I guess I was wrong, they have $52M laying around [forcibly taken from us TAXPAYERS!] to "invest" in some Ponzi scheme that may pay more someday?
This is WRONG on so many levels!
Never, NEVER! again tell me our schools need more money!
VOTE AGAINST EVERY POLITICIAN WHO SUPPORTS THIS NONSENSE!
Thanks and Way to Go Are Right | 9:36 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
If the project goes off as planned there will be a huge advantage. In the
meantime, the district will still get more than it is getting now for a 20-year
period. Like four times more each year.
Where were all the naysayers when the board met? More than 200 people attended the meeting and only two spoke against the project -- one of them being with the Utah Taxpayers Assn. -- and his remarks were comical. The other was a gentleman who opposes the principle of tax increment funding. He presented his opinion in a most impressive manner.
Where were all the naysayers when the board met? More than 200 people attended the meeting and only two spoke against the project -- one of them being with the Utah Taxpayers Assn. -- and his remarks were comical. The other was a gentleman who opposes the principle of tax increment funding. He presented his opinion in a most impressive manner.
Bob | 9:52 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
The RDA is a commercial scheme to steal money from the taxpayers. It was used
in downtown SLC and other places. The idea is to redirect tax money from its
proper place to the construction of private projects. This is a definately a
Conservative Republican thing.
Get the facts | 10:03 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Read the information available on how this RDA actually works and increases
money going to schools by bringing in over a half billion dollars into our
state.
www dot cityofholladay dot com - Cottonwood Mall section on the left menu.
www dot cityofholladay dot com - Cottonwood Mall section on the left menu.
Alwayzwrite | 10:31 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
The Cottonwood Mall area is a lowly and depressed area. Even $70 mil will not
boost this area. My goodness, there are residences in California worth more
than $70 mil.
Spike | 10:39 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
If Granite School District has all this extra money sitting around buring a hole
in their pockets (especially after buying the old hospital and turning into
their newly upgraded offices), why aren't they spending it on an upgraded
education for our kids now?
Frankie | 10:57 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
This sounds cool and a good fit for that area. I'm not down with corporate
wellfare. However, if the government is paying for infrastructure such as
streets, that sounds like it may be fair to me. We all paid for our houses, but
we did not pay for the streets we live on.
@ John | 11:02 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Don't blame Granite School Board...the State Legislature forces the school
boards to vote on RDA's, so blame them. Man, people love to comment on
things they know so very little about. This is a good thing for Holladay, a
good thing for GSD, and I defy anyone to prove to me how either lose a single
cent with this approval. GET INFORMED, and only then whine! Try me!
grewupthere | 11:17 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I grew up in that area and have seen it turn into a small ghetto. Kudos for
everyone and anyone to develop it and make it more accomodating for all the
neighboring residents. Businesses bring in people, and people fill schools.
Excellent endeavor.
Re: @ John | 11:22 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
@ John - what happens if the new project is a bust? How much will the GSD get
back? GSD should not divert a single cent to this project, certainly not when
Utah schools rank 49th in the nation!
Rick | 11:27 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
This whole thing is sure confusing. I guess it is best to try to keep a
coolhead because there is much more to this than what is seen, but shere are ALL
the answers that are non-biased towards one thought or another?
Ed | 11:57 a.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Hello..people...GSD HAD to do this deal or else end up looking at an
eastside-westside split, since Cottonwood Heights would have raised holy heck
about them (GSD) being the one entity against this deal. Then they (Cottonwood
Heights) would have pushed like crazy for another eastside-westside split..and
then all of our property taxes would be going up to pay for the split in the
district. GSD had no choice...another quid pro quo deal.
John | 12:01 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Looks like there may be one (or more) very strong proponents of this boondoggle
writing comments that seem to have access to insider information.
Maybe the Deseret Morning News reporters could track down where they are posting from.
My bet is that the educrats (or the RDA folks) are trying to BS the public every way they can to slip this deal through before anyone starts asking why a school district is even allowed to commit SCHOOL money to "investment" schemes.
Thay are doing it to harvest the free money that just grows on trees? Sorry, I don't buy that one.
Who would be fronting that $52M if the school district did not? Why are they passing up this good deal? Is ANYONE connected with Granite School District benefitting in ANY way from this deal, directly or indirectly, now or in the future?
This whole deal smells worse than brine shrimp!
Maybe the Deseret Morning News reporters could track down where they are posting from.
My bet is that the educrats (or the RDA folks) are trying to BS the public every way they can to slip this deal through before anyone starts asking why a school district is even allowed to commit SCHOOL money to "investment" schemes.
Thay are doing it to harvest the free money that just grows on trees? Sorry, I don't buy that one.
Who would be fronting that $52M if the school district did not? Why are they passing up this good deal? Is ANYONE connected with Granite School District benefitting in ANY way from this deal, directly or indirectly, now or in the future?
This whole deal smells worse than brine shrimp!
Renee | 12:03 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I would like to see the plans for the "village."
Welcome to Education | 12:08 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
For those of you trying to present your logical side of the argument to just
have it totally ignored in the next couple of reponse (meaning they did not read
much if anything you wrote). I would like to introduce you to some of the
parents of students we try to educate. Good examples for the need for breeding
licensure amoungst homosapiens.
Corrections to previous stuff | 12:10 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
To: "Thanks 8:07"
No, the district's tax revenue do not go up to $900,000. It does increase from $137,000 to $172,000 immediately, though.
Then, as the property's taxes increase, the district get's an additional 25% of the increase. After 20 years, the district gets its full share of the new taxes on the completed project. It is NOT $4 million; closer to $2.1 million.
The hand-wringing by some district officials is that over the 20-year RDA's life, because of the increase in the property's value the district will forgo collecting $52 million in FUTURE tax dollars, until the 20 years is up.
No doubt, without Granite's participation, this developer would back out and some other developer would create a less lucrative project.
No, the district's tax revenue do not go up to $900,000. It does increase from $137,000 to $172,000 immediately, though.
Then, as the property's taxes increase, the district get's an additional 25% of the increase. After 20 years, the district gets its full share of the new taxes on the completed project. It is NOT $4 million; closer to $2.1 million.
The hand-wringing by some district officials is that over the 20-year RDA's life, because of the increase in the property's value the district will forgo collecting $52 million in FUTURE tax dollars, until the 20 years is up.
No doubt, without Granite's participation, this developer would back out and some other developer would create a less lucrative project.
Anonymous | 12:27 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
We need a Neiman Marcus or a Bloomingdales
To John... | 12:29 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
You're still not getting it, pal...NO ONE IS WRITING A CHECK, DIVERTING
FUNDS, or OTHERWISE! This is simply GSD saying to the developer: "You can
pay 22% of your property tax bill for 20 years, which STILL brings us in more
money than if you didn't develop. At the end of 20 years, though, we want
the full 4 MILLION tax bill." It's not access to "insider
information", it's doing one's homework. There are several sites
dedicated to informing the public on this issue, TRY ONE! EVERYONE in GSD and
Holladay stands to gain from this project. The only one spewing the BS here is
you!
slclifer | 12:32 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
so much for family values in Utah. This is terrible. I am very dissapointed in
the Board. This is terrible choice.
@ Corrections... | 12:40 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
You're the one who's mistaken...check the Holladay Chamber of Commerce
official statement, his numbers were correct.
What happens | 2:15 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
What happens if the mall isn't there in 20 years?
to: what happens | 2:31 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Of course the mall will be there in 20 years. I have three children in the
Granite School District from 1st grade to 9th grade...so I'm in this for
the long haul. I have been to the meetings, I've done the research and
this is going to benefit EVERYONE who has kids in the GSD now and in the future.
And...those who do not.
I would imagine that a huge percentage of the posts here have not done research beyond today's paper. I was at the meeting last night...were you?
I would imagine that a huge percentage of the posts here have not done research beyond today's paper. I was at the meeting last night...were you?
What happens | 2:39 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I'm just asking. Malls fail.
Alvin | 3:47 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
The Granite School District board placated the east side by rebuilding an
un-needed Wasatch Junior High School. Now they are pandering to them again on
the Cottonwood Mall. What happens when the east side splits off into a new
school district? For once do something that is best for the whole district.
to John | 4:30 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Jordan School distric is in the home construction businness, why should not
Granite be in the mall business? Check out the housing units being built by
Jordan School district on 13th west and about 110 south just in front of South
Jordan Elemantry school.
Steve - Re: Alvin | 4:38 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
The new East side school district (in progress now) is split from Jordan NOT
Granite. People within Granite District's boundries aren't effected
or part of it. The City of Holladay isn't part of it either, it's
their neighbor to the south (Cottonwood Heights and others) that are.
About Cottonwood Mall, though I've always prefered Fashion Place I have fond memories from childhood of Cottonwood as well... I'll miss it. It's a shame it turned into the ghost town it became in the end. What's being built in it's place is something totally new and different and should be a very nice addition to the area.
About Cottonwood Mall, though I've always prefered Fashion Place I have fond memories from childhood of Cottonwood as well... I'll miss it. It's a shame it turned into the ghost town it became in the end. What's being built in it's place is something totally new and different and should be a very nice addition to the area.
outside observer | 4:38 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Funny that SL County supports this project for GGP, but won't support SAME
concept with much less at stake for soccer stadium. RSL chose not to ask the
Jordan District to give up money, instead wanting 100% of their tax portion
staying in the schools. SO, county and Corroon make a stand against Dave
Checketts because it is popular, but give this less noticed developer $20
million. I don�t disagree with the decision, but I
certainly doubt his honesty and integrity.
Pat | 6:21 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
I had no idea the Granite School District had so much power to give away $50
million.
In the next ten years, until the Mall starts giving back all these big bucks, the taxpayers in Granite District should not be asked for any additional tax money.
Apparently, the District has money to burn!!!
Word "burn" reminds me how the District decided to rebuild Wasatch after the fire. Property could have been sold for enough to build three new schools somewhere else. The property alone could have been sold for mega bucks. Besides, there wasn't actually even a need in that area for another Jr. High.
I don't think our school or State money should be used for any commercial endeavor, including REAL.
In the next ten years, until the Mall starts giving back all these big bucks, the taxpayers in Granite District should not be asked for any additional tax money.
Apparently, the District has money to burn!!!
Word "burn" reminds me how the District decided to rebuild Wasatch after the fire. Property could have been sold for enough to build three new schools somewhere else. The property alone could have been sold for mega bucks. Besides, there wasn't actually even a need in that area for another Jr. High.
I don't think our school or State money should be used for any commercial endeavor, including REAL.
MINNIE | 7:11 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Sounds like a lot of "secret combinations" going on here!!
OK Pat | 8:36 p.m. Jan. 16, 2008
Let's just leave it the way it is...or build something smaller. Oh I know,
another Wal Mart. That should do well in Holladay.
There is NO POWER GIVE AWAY! Please do not speak of things you don't know. Get informed!
There is NO POWER GIVE AWAY! Please do not speak of things you don't know. Get informed!
Great deal. | 9:12 a.m. Jan. 17, 2008
Owning a home a block north of the redevelopment site, I couldn't be
happier that this is getting done.
A bad deal for Granite would have been sitting on an empty mall the next 10 years. The building site has many difficulties being that it is in a massive flood plain.
I guess living in Utah, a lot of people around here are the definition of jumping over a dollar to grab a penny.
Bypassing this project would have been the definition of jumping over a dollar to grab a penny. I think people struggle with math out here.
A bad deal for Granite would have been sitting on an empty mall the next 10 years. The building site has many difficulties being that it is in a massive flood plain.
I guess living in Utah, a lot of people around here are the definition of jumping over a dollar to grab a penny.
Bypassing this project would have been the definition of jumping over a dollar to grab a penny. I think people struggle with math out here.
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