Deseret News | A Hispanic cleric criticizes Romney's stance on illegals

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A Hispanic cleric criticizes Romney's stance on illegals

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Anonymous | 11:17 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

To: totally unrealistic | 9:52 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007
The Jews were in Germany LEGALLY. The government decided to exterminate them and anyone who looked like them. We just want immigrants to come here legally like so many others have done in the past.
We don't have all the power to punish unless they are citizens. If they commit other crimes sometimes our only recourse is to send them back. It takes them about 2 weeks to return.

Compare apples to apples please.

To: Hispanic Cleric | 11:37 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Mr. Cleric, If I was you I'd bash on Mitt Romney too. Isn't that the goal of all Evangelists? Keep Romney out of power? Do whatever it takes to keep the mormon church from being seen as "ok" I'd be worried if some of my Hispanic congregation would vote for a man like him. If they vote for him who knows what they'll support next. Maybe they'd even support his church, and that takes money out of your pocket. We wouldn't want that.

jtm | 11:44 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Mitt Romney is the only candadate with the guts to say what all of America feels. Why are we giving up so many resoures to people that don't even belong here. They have no allegance to this country, they are here to get what they can from this country with out any regards for her people or her laws. I'm not even a Mitt supporter and still think he's right on about this situation.

Comments continue below

The Real Lee | 11:50 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Isn't representative democracy great? There's at least ONE Republican who is understanding and sympathetic to the real lives of people. The AG is a good man even if he can't drive a motorcycle.

"Inalienable rights bestowed by our Creator" are not restricted to only US Citizens! It's not that legal Hispanics support "illegal", it's just that we don't like the nativist mentality & emotional harangues that vigilantes pose as their hatred for all things "Mexican" - despite the fact there are many who are not of Mexican heritage - has a negative impact on all of us. If some folks could be less hateful, we would be willing to reason with folks and find resolutions. Animosity on one end provokes a similar response on the other.

Jewish person | 11:54 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

That is quit correct ANONYMOUS II. Jews were very legal in Germany, they had lived their for centuries. They were even Germans. The only thing that separated them from mainstream Germans was their religion. They were a mixed German race. So whoever is writing on here about Jews being illegal in Germany knows nothing about history. You need to take a history class before you spew stuff all over the internet. There are European Jews all over Europe and they are not illegals.

Anonymous | 12:06 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

First, the law is the law, regardless of who you are. Second, if we are going to deport people for being illegal aliens, we ought to look at substance over form. Are these people hard working? Do they contribute to society? There are a lot of "legal" citizens that are definitely not benefiting "American" society. For example, murderers, rapists, theifs, etc. and some of these are "upstanding" citizens that operate here as "legal" citizens, although they do not act "legally". Why not deport everyone who is not a "benefit" to society, not just people thwarting the immigration laws alone. I suppose you need to find a country that will take them. May australia since that was where England sent their "scalawags, ruffians, and neredowells". But, i like Australia so maybe we could just ship them to the moon.
Anyway, it also appears they could make it a simpler process of coming into America for immigrents, not just people from Mexico, and maybe have a probation period to test whether they are contributing, or not to society. Memorizing your president's name and saying the pledge of allegiance could hardly qualify someone as a "citizen".

Re: Too Hispanic Cleric | 12:11 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Amen Brother.

You know depite all of his tough talk Romney still supports a "path to legalization" for illegals already in the country. That particular item is not very popular with hardcore conservatives but he has stuck to it.

Lets face it our government has completely failed us on this issue. The current policy leaves the boarders wide open, rewards people who violate immigration laws, and discourages legal immigration by making it difficult and totally subjective.

Illegal imagrants DO NOT HAVE THE RIGHT TO BE HERE, THEY HAVE THE PRIVELAGE. That being said, I think those who are here working and trying to make an honest living or want to come here and do so should have the opportunity to LEGALY become citizens. It's good for the economy and it's good for America.

Silvia | 12:23 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

We don't need illegals coming here and bringing their drugs, murder and crime here to make Mexico more wealthy.

Hillary | 12:24 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Why are people always confusing the issue here? It is not a matter of being compassionate or Christlike. Those who want the laws (and borders) enforced are not hateful, uncompassionate people. How ridiculous to think that just letting everyone and anyone come right in to the USA is a compassionate idea. It would destroy our country! Those who continue to play the "compassion card" are naive and possibly uneducated on the deeper issues involved here. I think a classical history lesson is what is needed for the bleedhearts who accuse the rest of us of being heartless. Wake Up!

Anonymous | 12:24 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

How dare the law-of-the-landers insist Mexicans should leave.
Every treaty with Native Americans has been broken.
Every one!
We are a nation of lawless criminals who should not be here.

my opinion | 12:27 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Several points here;

1. What part of ILLEGAL doesn't the reverand understand?
2. During the Spanish-American war, the U.S. had control of Mexico all the way to Mexico City. There is a reason we gave part of it back after the war.
3. Most illegals don't or can't vote anyway; so why should Romney be worried?
4. Ship them all back to whatever country they are from along with the papers to fill out and file.

Dennis | 12:29 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

If we give te illegal hispanic the benefits they want then we would have to do it for everyone who is illegal. We require the legal citizens to prove residency and the LDS misionaries have to prove they have lived ere after their mission. The illegals are no more citizens by sneaking in then are those living in Mexico or any other nationality who does not follow the law.

Robo | 12:31 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

So, we should open our borders to whoever and however many people want to come here? How could we possibly assimilate the literally hundreds of millions that would love to live in the USA? Like it or not, there HAS to be some limit placed on the number and makeup of immigrants allowed into this country and we have to know who they are. The government's job is to set those numbers and requirements and effectively administer the laws. I don't think the answer to prevention is just a fence, but rather in removing the incentive to come here illegally and increase the incentive to do so legally (simplifying the process, clear specification of requirements, etc.) The issue of dealing with those already here is problematic, but I think it should involve incentives of some type for those who are here illegally to declare their presence and then those who don't declare after the allowed time frame get deported when found. I don't think they should be placed ahead of people trying to do so legally, but they could at least be issued a worker card of some type and get appropriately into the system.

LUCY | 12:45 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Looks like illegals are a narrow minded bunch who refuse to have any respect for any kind of law. They are self centered and do not care about much of anything but themselves. What shame to be so wrapped up in oneself. This not very Christian. Also, they are only concerned about ONLY their welfare.

Leo | 12:48 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

I think we should give Mitt credit for his stance as this is about law and order. I also think Romney will find a way to rectify any impression that this is about being Anti-Hispanic. Mitt is not anti Hispanic.

Keep your opinion | 12:52 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

To my opinion:
1. We (Christians) don't understand the "ILLEGAL" part of being HUMANS. No a HUMAN being is an ILLEGAL, here in the US or any country for that matter.
2. You want to go back in history? Okay, let's deport or "ship them all back" like you say, ALL the current ILLEGALS in the U S since 1492.
3. Mr. Romney should be worried, because he is a practicing Mormon and Mormons are Christians. The voting right shouldn't matter at ALL.
4. Again, if you "ship them all back", you won't have people who actually do the jobs you like to pay for at the current price.
Be REAL, Be Educated and after all Be HUMAN.

John Reynolds | 12:57 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

They just don't get it.
If we keep allowing this illegal flood to continue,
we'll be a Third World country within a generation.
It's about regulation and planning, not about the
illegals themselves. Laws are in place to keep our nation whole and to retain its existance.

CougarKeith | 1:07 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

There are PLENTY OF GOOD MEXICAN AMERICANS in this country who agree with those who want Border Control. If you want to live in the United States, DO IT LEGALLY! Why are Presidential Candidates worried about hispanic voters? What are ill-eagle allians allowed to vote in the country all the sudden? The ones allowed to vote are here LEGALLY and did it CORRECTLY! What is the Problem?

I have no problem with anyone coming to the United States to Live as long as they do it LEGALLY, and are here Legally! They should learn English before being given citizenship, and be able to write their name legibly and be able to read at a 6th grade level. I don't care if they are from Mexico, Eastern Europe, Nazi Germany, Iran, Iraq, Communist China, Antarctica, The North Pole, or another Galaxy! Just Secure The Boarders, And Do The Right Thing With ALL ILLEAGLES, SEND THEM BACK! Tatoo a little mark on thier right arm so when they try to cross again, we deny them access because they won't leave when they say, they will stow away in the states.

Not a Nazi! | 1:08 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Anonymous at 12:05 is a Nazi! Elimination of all who don't "contribute to society" in his/her eyes is what the Nazi's did. That's why this hateful rhetoric bothers me. It's a short step from one group you don't like - irrespective of how justifiable the rationale may seem to you - to another group and soon, who knows? Maybe all the evangelicals will wipe out the Mormons for "justifiable reasons", of course.

Iron Axe | 1:08 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Does this so call Cleric knows what breaking the law means or is that one of his teachings? to break the law of the country, perhaps he no speaks Engrish....someone ought to let him know that ILLEGAL is wrong in the eyes of God, all humans and ALL border crossing......Mitt Romney believes in doing things right.....and that includes row row row your boat..........

Fred | 1:13 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Wow! A Hispanic/Cleric ... supports illegal immigration? Since when is this news?

Why don't you do some real work and find a Hispanic Cleric who is opposed to illegal immigration.

Sammy | 1:23 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Somehow, what Hispanic Luis Cortes says here, has a very big "blackmail" tone to it... Either you Americans let illegals into the USA, or WE WON'T VOTE FOR MITT ROMNEY. This Hispanic Cleric doesn't seem to be too religious to me. He sounds more like a WAR-MONGER! And doesn't believe in keeping laws. A Pretty scary guy. I think Americans need to keep a watchful eye on this guy.

To AZmom | 1:28 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Makes me sad to know that you are an LDS and base your opinion on Illegals because of that Article of Faith.
Don't Jesus broke the Jews law numerous time to show what the gospel (being a follower) was about?
Do you know what the spirit of the law is?
Or you just accept it when it's convenient for you?

So, you love your neighbor ONLY if they are LEGALLY in the U S?
You have some repent process to go over before you can claim to be a MORMON.

M Butler | 1:38 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Somebody said:

It took less than 6 months to learn English because they wanted to be citizens of the USA. English was spoken in their homes. Their children learned English as a first language and the Scandinavian languages second.

If you believe this, I'll sell you a bridge in Brooklyn.

NOoooo NAZI's Here! | 1:38 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Gee Wiss, I don't know what everyone is squawking about on this post. Hitler had Jewish blood in his veins too. Jews were NEVER illegals in Germany. They were some of the riches GERMAN JEWS in Germany. Hitler was ashamed of his Jewish blood. So the guy got real evil and crazy. However, It has absolutely nothing to do with Mexican illegals coming to America. So quit the Nazi propaganda! It doesn't work well in the USA!

DD | 1:48 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Yeah, that pesky 12th Article of faith. That's been a burr in the side of LDS illegals for years. It makes them think twice about how they're going to answer that honesty question during the temple recommend interview.

I think we should vote to just retract that article completely. We should also get rid of D&C 58. Obviously, LDS church members are above following the silly laws of man. That's just too high of a standard to achieve, maybe they could have a more rigid law to replace the Gospel and it's silly requirements to live honestly.

Or maybe they could create a sub-church with easier standards to live by, but reduced blessings. Does that sound like a good idea random poster intent on living a Christlike life by purposely breaking the law?

Somehow I don't think the actions of Christ, who demonstrated the progression from the rigid law of moses to the laws of the Gospel, were meant to be an example to us to disobey rules and laws today.

To the second Azmon 2 | 1:48 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

You don't know what you are talking about. You need to read the scriptures. Perhaps learn to read and speak English as well. Its not our faults that you are here illegally breaking our laws. You need to REPENT! and quit pointing the finger at everyone else in America.

GO MITT ROMNEY! WE LOVE YOU!!!!!!!!!!

Why would I buy a bridge? | 2:27 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

To M Butler. My scandinavian ancestors did not pass on their Danish to their children at all. How long it took them to learn English I do not know, but they learned to speak it well enough to function. I'm sure that some Scandinavians were quite proficient within 6 months. I figure if missionaries can learn to speak a foreign language so can anyone else who really tries. Hispanics who come to this country need to learn English for their own economic well being as well as the cultural cohesiveness of our culturally diverse country. Yes English is a difficult language, but they chose to come here, so they need to learn the language.

freaky scripture people | 2:30 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

I find it freaky that there are those who live their lives by the literal interpretation of scripture. When this happens - there is no chance of any discussion on any topic whatsoever and things stagnate.

eliminate common "threat" | 2:34 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

In fascist regimes the identification of Enemies/Scapegoats are used as a Unifying Cause: The people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial, ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.
Does any of this sound familiar?

USA | 2:34 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

You want to come here, live the laws period!

Become a tax payer, speak english, aid in defense... I could go on.

Mitt for Pres!

Zacko | 2:43 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

All who take time to air their opinion here should also be airing it to their legislators. It would be a pleasant problem for the mail boxes of our senators and congressmen to be full of these opinions so they can know how we feel.

I for one feel blessed every day that I live in this representative republic.

It is obvious that even with all of the problems so many are always complaining about that the US is preferrable to Mexico.

Anonymous | 2:49 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

To: eliminate common "threat" | 2:34 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007
Because we want everyone to live by the same laws does NOT make us fascist. It sounds more like the equality many have been dreaming of...

Elimination of law breakers | 2:51 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

To eliminate a common threat...Sounds like a very good idea. We don't need threats here in the USA, to come here and murder our people, steal our hard earned money from us Americans. Also need to eliminate those who come to the USA to sale their evil drugs to our children. Laws are very good to have. Laws help keep the evil OUT! Doesn't sound fascist to me. It sounds as though we still have the fascist person still on here obsessing. Is that the only word you know?

To DD and the AZmom | 3:05 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

So, do you honestly think that Joseph Smith and the first LDS presidencies as well as the LDS pionners NEVER broke the law to get the gospel where it is and will be in the future? Poligamy, rings a bell?
LDS settlements in Utah (it was part of Mexico at that time) tells you something?

Is the law of the man higher that the laws of GOD?

Kris | 3:06 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

What wonderful American people you are. People that get to sit in your air conditioned and heated offices, staring at a computer screen. Pretty comfortable, huh? I wonder how you would all feel if you made 5 dollars a day trying to support your families. No wonder they are coming across. When I see that are complaining working in the fields where these Mexicans are not complaining, then I will begin to see your point of view.
Don't be ignorant and say that you must speak English. Have you ever tried to learn a foreign language? By the way, the country's second language is Spanish.
Please tell the father of 6 that he needs to go back to Mexico where he won't be able to feed his family.
If you kick out the Mexicans, you kill the economy, period.

Russ | 3:06 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

The immigration system is BROKEN! In the rule of law (which we follow)there are a few things we need to do.
1. Stop people from entering illegally.
2. Change the laws to make coming here legally feasable and affordable. ($2000 to get a green card when you follow the law with attorneys fees)
3. Set up a system where people can go, apply and get a work visa on the spot. This should apply particularly to parents of US citizens.
4. Deport the crimials (anyone convisted of a crime here or still here illegally after a given date).
5. Make employers liable for hiring undocumented worker.
I would love to see a "open border" where people can enter legally and quickly and keep those not willing to follow simple rules out.

Anonymous | 3:09 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Give me a break!
If I had a dime for every time I read a posting about "illegals" (Mexicans) being blamed for "crime increase" "drug sale", "tax fraud" "violence" "welfare cheats" blah, blah, blah, I'd be rich.
This is EXACTLY what the 3rd Reich pulled on the people of Germany to bond them together to rid the country of their "undesirables."
You're just upset because the word fascist is much nastier than the word liberal.

To---eliminate common threat.?? | 3:10 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

I was wondering if this person who is OBSESSED with the word "fascist" might try to add a new word to their vocabulary. Their are a great many other words in the ENGLISH language.

Anonymous | 3:15 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Mitt will say anything to win. Mitt: as a Christian do you favor water boarding or electric shock?

Anonymous | 3:18 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Just as "Elimination of law breakers" tells us Mexicans"murder people" "steal from people" and "sell drugs to children" (all disgusting generalizations of a people who are by and large fine human beings) this is the same tactic used by the 3rd Reich to pin negative labels on Jews to eliminate the perceived common threat.

What's the message? | 3:19 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

For a group of citizens who believe they have much to offer their government and fellow citizens. Is it wrong to say the illegal immigrants are sending the wrong message to Americans by deserting their own country, a country that undoubtably could use a few good men around?

LIVE FREE OR DIE | 3:24 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

That's right, your not a real American (or should I say 'Mercan) unless you pay taxes, shop at Walmart, watch American('Merican) Idol, and your grand daddy was born on this side of the border.
Never mind if your country is corrupted, economically disabled, and you have no prospect for a decent future for your family. You should'nt cross our borders and work for pennies at jobs no one on posting on this commentary would accept.
You should'nt be allowed to help our economy, simply because you want to provide sustinance for your families you often leave behind.
No let's make our clean cut 'merican kids go out and pick the crops.
Let's all try to realize just how much illegal immigrants effect our day-to-day lives.
Try not to eat any foods picked, prepped, or processed by illegal hand for one week.
It would be impossible.

to person obcessed with fascism | 3:29 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

There is mental help for "obsessive" behavior. However go back to Mexico for your treatment.

shim hill | 3:54 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Why be strident? I think anyone who is not a criminal (felon, killer, thief) should be able to come here. We had better be learning spanish; skip the mandarin stuff.

To-- Live or Die | 4:00 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Take it up with your Mexican government. It's not an American problem. Please quit trying to make Americans feel guilty for the neglect of your own Mexican government. We have many many American families here in the USA who live in poverty.

Relocated Southerner | 4:36 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

I have no trouble with LEGAL immigration. The reason most Americans are so worried about the Mexican border is that's because the majority of illegal immigrants are just walking across that border. I realize we have illegal immigrants from several countries, but the fact that it's so easy to just walk across the border from Mexico and into this country, and our country does offer such a higher standard of living than Mexico, makes it so tempting and much easier for the Mexicans to ILLEGALLY immigrate here. I have to agree with what Dennis Miller said on national TV a while back: "We don't mind you coming into our country; we just want you to sign the guest book when you do." Unless you are Native American, you are descended from immigrants in this country, but most of them came here LEGALLY and through the proper channels. Illegals should not be pushed to the front of the line ahead of those LEGAL immigrants who are attempting to do it the right way.

Good for Mexico | 4:38 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

It's a great deal for Mexico (one of the world's wealthiest countries) to export 1/8th of their population, of which less than half have a H.S. diploma, to the U.S. where business interests line their pockets and try to dupe the public into thinking there wouldn't be food on the table otherwise. Nonsense. The taxpayer will have to foot the bill to support these 12 million or so, poor and poorly educated folks and their very large families.

If that's our choice, anyway, or we feel compassion demands taking on the poor of the third world, why favor just Hispanics? Why not the Filipinos, or Hmong, or Sudanese? Isn't it racist to allow Hispanics a place of priviledge in the immigration process without giving others an equal opportunity?

How Fascism works | 4:39 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Fascism can sneak up on a country, especially in unstable economic times. Yes, I know, I know, ...
the government tells us "the economy is just peachy (pay no attention to the devalued dollar, lowest home starts in 16 years, in debt up to our ears, etc.) All is well. Keep spending".
Fascism starts off with constant use of patriotic mottos, slogans, symbols, songs, and other paraphernalia. During wartime extreme nationalism really takes off.
Then even though there are widespread domestic problems, the military is given a disproportionate amount of government funding, and the domestic agenda is neglected. Guess who used to be CEO of defense contractor Halliburton? Dick Cheney! Surprise! Surprise!
Then it enters into a stage where people are rallied into a unifying patriotic frenzy over the need to eliminate a perceived common threat or foe: racial, ethnic or religious minorities; liberals; communists; socialists, terrorists, etc.
Sound familiar?

JCNY | 4:51 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Well "Live free or die's" comments are true (and riddles with good ol'fashion rhetoric, which I myself am chockfull of) I donï¿½t necessarily agree with "to--live or die's" the unfortunate truth is we can no longer think in terms of "them and us" the world has become so advanced and shrunk (no not literally) that it unfortunately becomes our problem. I donï¿½t want to deal with it but what choice do we have? Be arrogant? Thatï¿½s just repairing the dam with chewing gum.

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