Deseret News | Reader comments: Gas company won't display yule cross

Reader comments
Gas company won't display yule cross

Robby | 8:06 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Good for Mr. Jones. I would much rather do business that a company that leaves personal religious beliefs at home rather than parading them in front of the world.

It was really the only decision a prudent business person could make.

Ron | 8:52 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Ok Jeff (guy quoted in article as opposed to the decision) let's by all means get Christ back into Christmas and while were at it put Muhammed back into Eid (this time of year as well) and Moses back in Hannukah (Jewish holiday this time of year) and some pagan deities back into Winter Solstice (also this time of year) ... bet you'd like that eh Jeffro?

Tony | 10:54 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Mithra, and several other ancient gods', birthdays are December 25th, not Jesus'.The Bible alludes to the fact that Jesus was not born in December. Therefore, not only does Christ not belong "back" in Christmas, he never really belonged there in the first place. Either that or Christmas does not belong on December 25th. The church "hijacked" the December 25th date from pagan religions instead of creating their own "holiday". HOWEVER, Texas Gas is a privately owned (as opposed to government owned) company. The decision on whether or not to display religious symbols on their property lies with them. It is an internal matter. Legally, they are free to display them. I, however, applaud their decision not to honor a myth.

Comments continue below

Bruce M. Herbertson III | 10:59 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

This may seem very contradictory. I feel as an atheist that if a person wants to or doesn't want to place a religious symbol up is up to them. I personally decorate for the Winter Solstice and all of my decorations are purely secular. I don't find it offensive if someone says Merry Christmas or the like to me. Where I work we sold Christmas trees this year. I am glad that the company didn't decided to call them Holiday trees. Again let me reiterate that I am an atheist and find nothing wrong with a company, private person displaying religious symbols. As for placing them in governmental offices or land that is a different story that I won't go into. I for one will be celebrating the Winter Solstice with my family and loved ones this year and hope that all who are religious or not have a safe Solstice, Christmas, Eid, Hanukkah, what ever holiday one observes.
Bruce

Steve | 11:10 a.m. Dec. 18, 2007

"Leave the matter of religion to the family altar, the church, and the private school, supported entirely by private contributions."

Ulysses S. Grant

Tony | 11:21 p.m. Dec. 18, 2007

Frankly, I've never heard of a "yule cross". Supposedly, Christmas marks Christ's birth, yet the cross is a symbol of his death. Seems contradictory to me. Are you celebrating his birth or commemorating his death? Either way, Christmas trees and wreaths and other such decorations are symbols of the secular aspect of the season due to their pagan roots. As such, I as an ahteist, have no problem with them. Similarly, I have no problem with the term "Christmas", since it has become a generalized term for the season in the same way "Kleenex" is a generalized term for tissues or "Xerox" for photocopiers of any brand. An example of this is "Christmas tree" which combines elements of both the sacred aspect (the word Christmas denoting Christ) and the secular (a pagan tree). Christmas despite it's name, has more pagan aspects than secular, and owes it's popularity to commercialism anyway. Wasn't that long ago Chrstians tried to ban Christmas anyway, now they want to monopolize it. Another example of christian hypocrisy.

Bill McK | 6:40 a.m. Dec. 19, 2007

I think its great! If you want to practice a religion fine do it at home on your own time. As an Atheist I would be upset to work there where someone else is displaying a symbol that has nothing to do with the work I do and would indicate my support of religion and a specific relgion at that. Religion is a private matter, don't force it on others.

Bruce M. Herbertson III | 2:21 p.m. Dec. 19, 2007

I work and live in the "Bible Belt" and see nothing wrong with people displaying religious things. Where I work we have many people put up religious sayings holiday cards, and letters of thank you from churches in the area for donations that we make. I am an atheist as well and don't feel the least bit offended. If it is a public building like a court house, city hall or any sort of government establishment then no I don't think that religious things should be displayed. Don't get me wrong I would ultimately like to see people come to the truth and realize that there is no god or higher power. But I also realize that some people need to have something to believe in to get through life and be happy. I find that I am happier now that I have come out as an atheist.

SP | 6:34 p.m. Dec. 21, 2007

Well done, Texas Gas! Highly commendable behavior to accept all people of al beliefs into your domain.

Kelly Ireland | 4:36 a.m. Dec. 22, 2007

Good job. Religion should always be kept private, no matter what the religion is. Mainstream religious beliefs do not make them better than any other belief system. I congratulate the company for taking the initative for maybe they will set an example for other businesses and people alike.

Jose. | 10:04 a.m. Dec. 22, 2007

Bravooooo!!!!

Zahr Dalsk | 11:07 p.m. Dec. 22, 2007

I am very glad to see that america is beginning to free themselves from religion.

The time of religion is over. There is no need to delude ourselves with lies anymore. As a Canadian I am glad to see that our southern brethren are also embracing freedom from religion.

(Christmas is a pagan celebration, by the way, to all those Christians who thought it was theirs.)

I am a Canadian. My philosophy is of Humanism, Transhumanism, and Atheism. I am a left-wing libertarian. I support a peaceful, united humanity free from religion and racism, on a planet with a clean environment, and if all the people of the world were to unite follow this idea, then perhaps we could end such a great deal of suffering.

Vote for the Green Party!

henry | 8:03 a.m. Dec. 23, 2007

Very glad to know this CEO was kind enough not to put up a cross, I hate christmas for that very reason. For one month religon is forced on us and we are suposed to like it.

Chase | 2:34 p.m. Dec. 23, 2007

I am disappoint actually, I don't think that religion in America is a bad thing. It teaches good morals and gives people reason. I am an atheist for no other reason than the fact that I don't believe in a diety. I don't feel that I have the right to tell others how to believe or complain about some cross somewhere. And Christmas was born from Christianity Henry, no one is forcing religion on you. You are not a target. They are just celebrating what they believe. Believe what you want to believe and allow others to do the same. Christianity is not destroying America, the government is. I am with Bruce on this topic.

Frank | 7:23 p.m. Dec. 23, 2007

I find it offensive to have someone's religious beliefs shoved in my face. Why is it allright to put huge crosses up, some right in my walking path when I can't put a "garage sale" sign up without a city permit? Good for Mr. Jones. And another thing,I am all for religious institutions paying their fair share of taxes like the rest of us do. These houses of religion should be self supportiing.

Chase | 9:38 a.m. Dec. 25, 2007

I don't see anyone hanging a big atheist symbol up anywhere. However, it's not illegal. We have the same rights they do.

Taylor | 10:20 p.m. Dec. 26, 2007

Texas Gas is taking a step in the right direction. Religion is a personal activity, and has no place being pushed in business. If TG employees want to put little crosses or miniature trees in their cubicles and offices, that's great, and they should be allowed to do that. I agree that the presentation of business should be neutral. After all, it's not Texas Christian Gas, just Texas Gas. So, way to go Texas Gas! Glad to see that somebody out there in the business world is taking a respectful stance towards the rights of all our citizens! And by the way, it's not a yule cross, it's a Christian cross. Yule is celebrated with evergreen trees and wreaths :)

josh | 2:47 a.m. Dec. 28, 2007

Hi guys. I am a christian, and want to say thank you to Chase and Bruce. Although Texas gas has the right to do so. I don't think it is pushing religious beleifs on anybody. All it's saying is that that's what they believe and nothing more.

Pam | 6:36 a.m. Dec. 28, 2007

First of all, they have every right to put up a cross, because it is a private company. Secondly, I think people are going overboard with this new politically correct world a few on the left want us to live in. Does somebody wishing you a Merry Christmas or Happy Hannukuh really offend you atheists. All you have to do is kindly wish us a happy solstice in turn, and everybody is happy. Religion really is the greatest thing that happened to this world. It brings out the best qualities of humanity in those who follow it (except of course for a small number of extremists).
I truly believe they should keep the sign. If nothing else, for tradition's sake; it has been up four generations.
To all those atheists who think they are under attack in America, you are wrong. The only thing being hijacked is Christianity, morality, and all races of religion, until we are left with a society devoid of peace, love, justice, compassion, charity, humility and grace.
May Jesus bless EVERYONE this CHRISTmas season and bring all our atheists brothers and sisters who have gone astray back into our Christian family so we may celebrate together.

Wayne | 11:28 a.m. Dec. 28, 2007

Christians have strayed so far from the teachings of Jesus Christ that I don't see how they can really call themselves Christians. Their only connection to Christ
is that they believe in him. They preach love thy neighbor, but will cut his throat if he openly denies their beliefs. We don't need crosses to remind the non-believers of this fact.

Bruce M. Herbertson III | 11:38 a.m. Dec. 28, 2007

Pam I have to somewhat disagree with you. Yes there are some atheists out there that want christians to stop believing in their faith. Those atheists give those of us who aren't like that a bad name. But as for your comment that religion is the greatest thing that has happened to this world. I beg to differ. Religion has poisoned societies and has killed people in the name of god. Christianity being one of the worst of them. While I feel it is your right to believe what you want and to say what you want. I don't get offended when someone says merry christmas to me because I simply say merry solstice or you have a good one too. What does offend me is when I do tell someone I am an atheist. They in most cases will start preaching to me, quoting bible verses and try to convert me. Then they get offended when I reject their ministry. Most atheists would just love it if "christians" would just leave us alone to our own beliefs. Celebrate the season your way. We will celebrate our way. I agree there are extremists on both sides.

Rob | 5:10 a.m. Dec. 31, 2007

Well good for them for not putting up that eye soar.

It is good to read Atheist postings, it shows the they are closer to stepping put further and without fear of retribution from the religously deluted nuts. Religion has had it to easy for far to long, to call someone an extremist for their verbal expressions is incorrect. There is nothing more extreme then Religious Fundementalism and the atrocites carried out in the name of gawd.

There is more then a 'few' on the left Pam, hate to break it to ya but religion is dark age rubbish of wish-thinking and fantasy.

Religious practices, like binge drinking, should be done on ones own time.

"The Government of the United States is in no sense founded on the Christian religion"--John Adams, 2nd President of the United States

Confused and Frustrated | 6:03 p.m. Jan. 1, 2008

I'm so tired of stuff like this. Christmas is a time to celebrate the birth of Jesus Christ. EVERYONE KNOWS THIS!! the constitution and our rights are based on the Bible, so why shouldn't we put up religious signs? I just don't get it.

Anonymous | 6:16 p.m. Jan. 1, 2008

Lots of Christians are all about fairness right up to the point where they have to actually PRACTICE fairness, then they call it "Political Correctness" so they can object to it. Talk about your "flip-flop"....

Mike | 10:54 a.m. Jan. 2, 2008

Poor Pam. She means well, she really does. Right?

The poor dear has a problem with the "...new politically correct world..." and thinks things have gone overboard.

Pam, does the politically correct world bother you as much as the religiously correct world does me? You see, you assume that your atheist brothers and sisters, having gone astray, have done so from Christianity. Isn't it possible that some of them - those who've strayed - were Jews or Muslims? Could it even be possible that some atheists were NEVER associated with ANY religion?

Pam bemoans the hijacking of Christianity. When it's gone, what remains will be a "society devoid of peace, love, justice, compassion, charity, humility and grace." Pam, are we to understand that Christianity has a patent on those qualities? Did they not exist before the birth of your savior?

Pam, feel free to celebrate your religion with your family, but, please, don't expect me to celebrate with you.

Awu | 11:14 a.m. Jan. 2, 2008

"...the constitution and our rights are based on the Bible, so why shouldn't we put up religious signs?"

The US constitution is NOT based on the bible. Yours was the first country to separate church and state. There is not one single mention of a god, bible, of Christian in the whole document. "In God We Trust" only started appearing on your money in the 1950s for example. A president is not even required to swear on the bible.

Why does this myth continue to be propogated?

Chase | 2:56 p.m. Jan. 2, 2008

I just wish that everyone would leave everyone else alone and let them believe and live how they see fit. If you got a problem with some huge cross somewhere then take a freakin detour or put up a big atheist symbol somewhere. Everybody needs to stop crying about god. Weather he exists or not doesn't change the fact that in america he will always be followed and worshipped. I believe like Bruce, I think that religion has gone too far in some aspects like the rediculous concept of holy wars. This is what we need to address, not some decoration over a gas station. If you wanna find the real problems with religion then go visit Africa or the middle east. America have the very least of religious issues but yet we all cry over one little cross. GROW UP!!

Todd | 2:23 a.m. Jan. 6, 2008

Pam, I've just got to disagree with you, although I respect your opinion and am glad that you've stated it.
My bottom line; what makes me proud to be a free thinker is that I am glad that you have found something you believe in that makes you happy. If everybody in the world wishes to believe there is a god exept me, that is fine. Such matters are quite personal, and I show no negative animous towards anyone who has differing spritual opinions ... just keep it out of my government. The faith based initiative that Bush issued years ago has been an assault on the integrity of the constitution of the united states. The religious zealots who want my children to pray in tax funded schools are absolutely off base and in direct violation of the first ammendment.
If religios zealots would just keep quiet, so would the atheists.
Peace be with you Pam

Joe Eugene | 10:29 a.m. Jan. 6, 2008

Ironic that AWU, seemingly not an American, has to be the one to school Americans on our Constitution. The Constitution is in no way based on the Bible, not even on Biblical principles, no more than US law is based on the ten commandments. The gas company is a non-issue, as private entities may do as they like (within building codes, etc.). As a private citizen, I would consider it offensive that the g-d GAS COMPANY for goodness' sake is telling me to be a Christian.

Bottom line: you believe your nonsense, I'll believe mine, we will all get along just fine.

Bruce M. Herbertson III | 10:28 a.m. Jan. 7, 2008

Christopher Hitchens is right. "Religion Poisons Everything"! Religious wars have been fought in the name of god. People have been murdered in the name of god. People have lost their jobs in the name of god (though illegal in this country) it still happens. I am not offended by religion and peoples beliefs and religious symbols. What I am offended by is that the supposed christians and faith believers constantly insist on trying to convert me. I am a very peaceful person and when this happens it angers me. I love this country mainly because our constitution makes a distintion of seperation of church and state. Freedom of religion to include freedom from religion. At work I was recently accosted by a stack of $1 bills all stamped with something religious. It is bad enough that I have to put up with "In God We Trust" on the money. Do we as Atheists need to be subjected to such assaults? No! Take your poisonous religion and keep it to yourself. If you are happy then fine. But leave us atheists, free thinkers, agnostics, and the like alone. That is all we ask. Stop trying to convert us!

Merry X-mas | 12:01 a.m. Jan. 8, 2008

Christmas isn't owned by the Christians. It's a holiday owned by pagans of all sorts, primarily because it's when the Sun (that's with a U) begins to rise again in the sky. That's right: I'm talking about winter solstice. What a surprise that the day (or time thereabouts) was already celebrated.

Brett | 11:23 a.m. Dec. 4, 2008

this is all trash. People should be able to do what they want even with religion.
God is real. Read the Bible. The Four Gospels state very clearly that God was born in a manger. How would we be here with out a God this could not have happened by chance.

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