Deseret News | Romney seems disingenuous

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Readers' forum: Romney seems disingenuous

lamonte | 5:24 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Harald - your assertion that anyone in the Mormon church "must pay 10% of his gross income to the church" is an indication that you need to be educated in the requirements of church membership. I have been a churchgoing Mormon for all of my life but I have not always paid tithing. No one ever sent me a bill or passed the plate in front of me at church. Yes, it is true that to be considered a member in good standing I must make the choice - on my own - to pay tithing but only the bishop knows that standing. As far as the person next to me is concerned I am a tithe payer. But even if I am not I can still attend church each week and learn the gospel, I can still have home teachers and be one as well and I can accept callings in my local ward. While I am reasonably certain that Mitt Romney is a full tithe payer, let's not make assumptions we aren't sure of. Now concerning your education about the Mormon Church, I know some nice young men who would like to visit you...;-)

Chad | 6:56 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Is it impossible to want to share your faith with others and still be tolerant of their views? I think not.

Harald does not even attempt to be tolerant of the mormon religion, while insinuating that Romney lied about being tolerant himself. It seems to me that this letter is disingenuous - nah, let's use the real word - hypocritical.

Mike | 7:14 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Harald,
Do you really think that God, or any religion that purports to represent God, should force you or me or anyone else to accept and follow any religious point of doctrine? It seems very clear that God has not 'struck down' those who disagree with Him. Should it not then be possible that those who profess a belief in God, be as tolerant as God and allow others to follow the dictates of their own conscience?

Comments continue below

grundle | 8:42 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

And the letter writer claimed Mitt is "disingenuous"?

Maybe some serious introspection would be in order here.

Get It Right | 9:00 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

The letter writer and some responders are clearly not well educated in religion. Mormon doctrine would result in more people "going to Heaven" than almost any other religion's doctrines, since all but Satan's followers go to a place of wonderful glory. Sharing one's beliefs is just that, no more. Mormons don't preach to anyone who doesn't want to listen, nor do they force anything on anyone. And from the beginning, Mormons have been more tolerant in letting others worship how, where, or what they may than most other Christian flavors--that's history. To this day, some refuse to return the favor.

Anonymous | 10:14 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Proclaiming that you're "one of the club" is meaningless in the eyes of God.

John | 10:48 a.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Hey Anonymous,

You got any scripture to back up your claim? You have any information on God that you are holding back? Do you speak for God on this topic?

Off the top of my head, I can think of "one Lord, on Faith, one Baptism" as an implication that there "one club" as you like to put it.

Unless you have something to the contrary, you have once again, built a strawman, and knocked it down, all by yourself.

Anonymous | 12:10 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Only a neurotic fool would proclaim that he "speaks for God." And this brand of neurosis is becoming commonplace in today's authoritarian-riddled world.
What in reality is happening is a mass-hysteria directed by man (as those calling the shots are the one's who gain) who love their power-trips.

Randy | 12:40 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

All this Mitt Romney/Mormonism, Huckabee/Christianity, Giuliani/Catholicism, et al, makes it more evident than ever, that as much as possible, religion and politics should be clearly and unambiguously separate.

2-bits | 12:46 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

This may be a little off-topic, but why do those outside the faith seem to be the most offended by Tithing?

You rarely hear someone who is paying tithing complain, but you frequently hear those who don't complain bitterly about others having to pay tithing. That just seems strange to me. You would think the people putting out 10% would be the ones complaining, not the other way around.

Basically it sounds to me like this guy is bitter about something. I don't know if it's the church or Romney or if he just didn't get his nap today.

It may help give creedence to his opinion if he would explain what qualifications he has to judge others and label Romney as "Disengenuous".

GWB | 12:51 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Lamonte, I have just one question for you.

When you say, "But even if I am not I can still attend church each week and learn the gospel, I can still have home teachers and be one as well and I can accept callings in my local ward."

Without paying a full tithe, Can you hold a Temple Recommend?

Are you being Disengenuous? You know very well that entrance to the Temple is considered the most sacred of rights in the church, but you must pay a full tithe to get the recommend from your Stake President (at least I was the last time I went).

I know it is fun to attack people who may express views we do not like, but to deliberately leave out a fact does no one a favor.

In my opinion, whether Mitt is a tithe payer and temple attender is irrelevant to his campaign to become President of the US. The relevant question is "Is he the best man for the job."

His record as Governor (pro-choice) should be sufficient to make that decision, not what church he attends.

Anonymous | 1:09 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

No "2-bits" nobody is offended by tithing.
What is offensive is the ostentatiousness of some LDS types who brag about it as though nobody else in the world gives to those in need. (notice I did NOT say gives to their church)
It's reminiscent of the guy who would give you the shirt off his back --- and then brag how much he paid for it.
"The worst sin is that of pride." - Jesus Christ

IM | 1:12 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Yeah Haraldm, you make no sense. None whatsoever.

lamonte | 1:53 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

GWB - You should read my entire post before criticizing it. I clearly stated that to be considered "a member in good standing" one should make the choice to pay tithing. Yes, this means that to obtain a temple recommend you need to be a full tithe payer. I thought my earlier statement made that clear but, as you have pointed out, my using of "LDS terminology" may have been unclear. What was absolutely clear, however, is that paying a full tithe IS NOT required to be a member of the Mormon church, to perticipate every week (and more) in church activities and to learn gospel truths that will help a person in so may ways in their lives. Tithing is not compulsory in the Mormon Church, as Harald seem to indicate, but it is a requirement for attendence at the temple, which is the ultimate goal of membership in the church.

Anonymous | 6:34 p.m. Dec. 10, 2007

Hey, if tithing to your church is important to you -go for it. Just don't put yourself on any sanctimonious pedestal or look down on your brothers and sisters who aren't as "worthy" as you.
I keep my tithing, method of worship, and spiritual business private - as Christ said to.

Agnostic Person | 12:16 p.m. Dec. 13, 2007

I can't argue with pure logic that Harald brings to our attention. I am an agnostic and throughout my life, I have had people from various religions try to convert me to their faith. Their religous docterine varies somewhat from religion to religion and each individual will mention that his/her faith is either somewhat more truthful than other religions or that his/her faith is the only true religion. This odd behavior from religious people is what prevents me from converting to their various religions.

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