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Poll sheds light on widespread bias against Romney, LDS
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Robert Brown | 1:17 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I am LDS and I have followed news stories of Romney's campaign almost from
the beginning. I am saddened to see that Evangelical Christians have
essentially created a religious test for political office. Their bigotry
against the LDS church has been planted and nurtured by the pastors of their
local congregations and national leaders for years. When their local leaders
show anti-LDS videos, distribute anti-LDS pamphlets and pay professional
anti-LDS detractors to come to their churches and present anti-LDS seminars
under the guise of "religious education," how can we expect the rank
and file members of their congregations to form an unbiased opinion of LDS
people? I do not think Mitt Romney can say anything in "the speech"
that will win Evangelical Christians over to support him in significant numbers.
The prejudices and bigotry of literally generations will not be overcome in a
mere 45 minute speech. I hope I am wrong.
Mr. Peel | 4:19 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
""What's relevant is there is this bias out there, supposedly in
a religiously tolerant society. Let's have a discussion and hopefully that
will decline."
How could you possibly suggest that this is not a religiously tolerant society? Perhaps you have confused 'tolerate' with 'advocate'. As a Christian, I love mormons just as I do all people; but I cannot support a faith that believes in many gods, even though it only worhips one, as this is contra to scripture. This does not make me hate LDS members. Nor does the LDS claim of being the 'only true church on earth' offend me, as I know otherwise. You have witnessed my tolerance; I disagree, and yes, this will in some part keep me from voting for a mormon president.
Before someone suggests that I am a bigot, I will be willing to discuss this point with any mormons lining up to vote for a muslim or scientologist, at any level of political office.
How could you possibly suggest that this is not a religiously tolerant society? Perhaps you have confused 'tolerate' with 'advocate'. As a Christian, I love mormons just as I do all people; but I cannot support a faith that believes in many gods, even though it only worhips one, as this is contra to scripture. This does not make me hate LDS members. Nor does the LDS claim of being the 'only true church on earth' offend me, as I know otherwise. You have witnessed my tolerance; I disagree, and yes, this will in some part keep me from voting for a mormon president.
Before someone suggests that I am a bigot, I will be willing to discuss this point with any mormons lining up to vote for a muslim or scientologist, at any level of political office.
Comments continue below
Tom | 4:27 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Perhaps the bias has something to do with Joseph Smith's first vision where
he asks God which church to join and Joseph hears God say they are all wrong and
an abomination.
As much as LDS people do not like their beliefs being disparaged, neither does anyone else like being told their religion is wrong, especially by the prophet and founder of a religion.
As much as LDS people do not like their beliefs being disparaged, neither does anyone else like being told their religion is wrong, especially by the prophet and founder of a religion.
Anonymous | 5:27 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Much of the negative feelings towards LDS stem from the national publicity of
Warren Jeffs and his cult in Colorado City AZ.
Sid Brechin | 5:34 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I think that members who live in areas where LDS is fairly common don't
know how difficult it is to be LDS in areas where we are about 0.1% of the
population. It is different if you have to travel 40 to 70 minutes to get to
church. Especially if you no longer drive. Dating is almost impossible and
misconceptions abound. Ask some RM's about the stranger misconceptions
they have been told.
The stress of trying to live church standards when all around you regard it as being rediculous and unnecessary is very real. You become an outcast in your own community and for some in your own family.
Support is pretty much limited to the odd visit by Missionary's. They too are relieved to run into members. It's been years since I've seen a home teacher and I have no idea if there are even any single LDS ladys in my age group anywhere near here.
I retired young because I got ill and cannot really travel. I had planned on traveling the world to study a variety of languages. Now at 53 and retired 2 years I have no idea of my role in the World.
The stress of trying to live church standards when all around you regard it as being rediculous and unnecessary is very real. You become an outcast in your own community and for some in your own family.
Support is pretty much limited to the odd visit by Missionary's. They too are relieved to run into members. It's been years since I've seen a home teacher and I have no idea if there are even any single LDS ladys in my age group anywhere near here.
I retired young because I got ill and cannot really travel. I had planned on traveling the world to study a variety of languages. Now at 53 and retired 2 years I have no idea of my role in the World.
lamonte | 5:48 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
The professors mentioned in this article really shouldn't be surprised by
the bias against Mormons. They live in the south (Vanderbilt University s in
Nashville), the heart of evangelical Christianity, and they should know that
especially Baptist preachers, in some congregations, spend a portion of their
regular Sunday sermons spreading hatred and deciept about the Mormons. Last
week the Washington Post published an article by Mary Jordan about the Mormon
Church in Nigeria. A man named Joshua Ebiloma expressed why he joined the
Mormon church and the article stated, "He immediately liked what he heard
inside, especially that no one preached that people of other faiths were going
to hell." I won't claim that no one ever makes a disparaging remark
about other religions at an LDS sacrament meeting but the church leadership -
local or church wide - will never degrade another religion. That is not the
case in the evangelical church and so the only information many evangelicals
have or accept about Mormons is the bigoted opinions of ministers trying
deparately to hold on to the cash cows.
Ruth | 7:38 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
out of all the candidates, republican or democrate, I believe he is the one with
the most dignity. I dont see him crashing and burning on his words or his
politcal stands. He is what he is and will be the same today and tomorrow. I
would feel secure with someone like him in the White House. He is a man of his
word with nothing to hide.......
Observer | 7:49 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
This article helps me see the wisdom of Elder Ballard's talk last general
conference about the benefits of having L.D.S. Church members simply get correct
information about the Church to the citizens of the world.
Hold On | 7:55 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I find it interesting that this report, though I have not read the polling
information in whole, states that bias and discrimination is higher against
those of the LDS faith than against women or blacks; this almost makes
discrimination against those of the LDS Faith and OK behavior.
Thoughts?
Thoughts?
dc | 8:12 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Isn't it all about losing members to the LDS faith ?
Dave | 8:13 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Probably the the poll showing half of Americans aren't aware Romney's
a Mormon is accurate, and probably nearly as many as that don't know
anything about Mormonism. But for those, such as I, who are aware of some of
its kooky beliefs, we're not admirers of that anti-Christian sect.
But that's not the only reason given the opportunity, I'll vote against Romney. Another is that he was a draft dodger whilst I was fighting in Viet-Nam. There are those who equate money-grubbing success with patriotism, but I, of a family on this side of the Pond since 1732,don't.
Giuliani was also a coward & he, his hedonism aside, too forfeits my vote.
But that's not the only reason given the opportunity, I'll vote against Romney. Another is that he was a draft dodger whilst I was fighting in Viet-Nam. There are those who equate money-grubbing success with patriotism, but I, of a family on this side of the Pond since 1732,don't.
Giuliani was also a coward & he, his hedonism aside, too forfeits my vote.
What ? | 8:33 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Who cares, Mormons need not apologize for who they are. Just because MR wants to
run for president doesn't mean Mormons have to change the way they live and
go about thier everyday lives. I love it here and I'm not a Mormon. If you
want to get outside the Wasatch Front go for it.
Less Judgmental | 8:43 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
It is always interesting to me when someone says that "YOU need to change
your opinion of ME" yet this person refuses to evaluate their own opinions
of others.
Mormons want others to accept them as being Christians, but one thing Mormons will never change is the doctrine that they are God�s only true church � something about others being "an abomination in God�s sight."
Sounds a little hypocritical to me.
Mormons want others to accept them as being Christians, but one thing Mormons will never change is the doctrine that they are God�s only true church � something about others being "an abomination in God�s sight."
Sounds a little hypocritical to me.
Tai from Barstow | 8:50 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I will never vote for Mitt Romney. His religion has nothing to do this. Come
to think of it... I'm a Mormon too.
I will never vote for Mitt Romney because of his love affair with socialism. He liberal record on Gun Control, Abortion, Gay Civil Unions, Taxes, and other issues, repulses me.
The first woman Senator for Florida was Paula Hawkins, herself a Republican in the South. She never used her Mormon faith as a gimmick or prop.
The same can be said of J. Rueben Clark, a US Ambassador to Mexico, and current US Senator Bob Bennett.
Nobody cares about their religion. Romney's camp is simply saying, "if you don't vote for Mitt, you are a bigot", and that just isn't true.
Mitt Romney is a liberal, and that's what seperates him from Fred Thompson, Ron Paul, and Mike Huckabee.
I will never vote for Mitt Romney because of his love affair with socialism. He liberal record on Gun Control, Abortion, Gay Civil Unions, Taxes, and other issues, repulses me.
The first woman Senator for Florida was Paula Hawkins, herself a Republican in the South. She never used her Mormon faith as a gimmick or prop.
The same can be said of J. Rueben Clark, a US Ambassador to Mexico, and current US Senator Bob Bennett.
Nobody cares about their religion. Romney's camp is simply saying, "if you don't vote for Mitt, you are a bigot", and that just isn't true.
Mitt Romney is a liberal, and that's what seperates him from Fred Thompson, Ron Paul, and Mike Huckabee.
TyWebb | 9:27 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
"When I place my hand on the Bible and take the oath of office, that oath
becomes my highest promise to God. If I am fortunate to become your president, I
will serve no one religion, no one group, no one cause, and no one interest. A
president must serve only the common cause of the people of the United
States."
I'm not sure how someone makes a statement like that knowing what we all know about the "covenants" made in the temple. If I were still a member, I'm not sure how I could get around a statement like that.
That guy will just about say anything to get into office. Deplorable
I'm not sure how someone makes a statement like that knowing what we all know about the "covenants" made in the temple. If I were still a member, I'm not sure how I could get around a statement like that.
That guy will just about say anything to get into office. Deplorable
The Rev. Fr. Philip Mullen | 9:35 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
As an Orthodox Lutheran Christian Pastor, I would never vote for a Mormon or any
candidate for public office adhering to a Non-Christian religion. Mitt
Romney's "Mormon Speech" was a sad promotion of syncretistic
heresy, and a false vision of America's exclusively Christian national
political heritage. Moreover, Romney gave no consideration to the traditional
Civic Use of God's Moral Law as the universal basis for all other law and
laws. Nor did Romney make any real distinction between the world's false
religions and the Holy Christian Faith, even claiming -- against God's Word
-- that everyone was a child of God! Of course, God wants everyone to become His
child -- which only happens through His gift of Faith in Christ alone.
Beyond his Mormonism, Romney has proved himself to be a political trimmer -- willing to compromise the sanctity of innocent human life and other fundamental human rights, while favouring Sodomy. In summary, Romney's record indicates that he is unbelievable and unworthy for public office.
Who is worthy? My family and I are supporting Christian Patriot and Veteran, The Hon. Duncan Hunter for US President in 2008.
In Christ's Love,
+ The Rev. Fr. Philip Mullen
Columbus, Ohio, USA
Beyond his Mormonism, Romney has proved himself to be a political trimmer -- willing to compromise the sanctity of innocent human life and other fundamental human rights, while favouring Sodomy. In summary, Romney's record indicates that he is unbelievable and unworthy for public office.
Who is worthy? My family and I are supporting Christian Patriot and Veteran, The Hon. Duncan Hunter for US President in 2008.
In Christ's Love,
+ The Rev. Fr. Philip Mullen
Columbus, Ohio, USA
Dixiespice | 9:53 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I have lived in many areas of the country and the world. I am a member of the
LDS church and was also in the military for a good many years because of my
ex-husband. This is one of unnoticed microcosms of our society, where predjudice
resides in abundance. At one of our duty stations,in the south, we had a Baptist
pastor who targeted us as soon as he knew we were LDS. He would create problems
and harass us constantly, asking carefully worded questions to, "trip"
us up at command functions. Being of superior rank, he used that to express his
bigotry and prejudice in the work place as well. He went as far as to create a
confrontation, which came to the attention of an officer superior to him and
LDS. The officer quietly took him aside and handled the situation. The man was
still predjudices but the open hostilities has ceased. How sad, in this world
where information abounds, people are encouraged to learn and decide things for
themselves, that this sort of bigotry and predjudice is alive and well.
re: TyWebb | 10:04 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
If Mitt truly is seeking office to serve the people, then he is definitely
living the standards of the LDS church. Christianity is all about serving
others, not just your own religion. I see nothing wrong with the statement that
he will not serve only one religion and one interest, etc.
Re: The Rev.Fr Philip Mullen | 10:22 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Thanks for telling us who is worthy!. Good luck with this Duncan Hunter guy, too
bad he won't get elected local dog catcher. Oh and by the way I would never
vote for a judgemental, bigoted, self proclaimed Orthodox Christian Pastor
either.
Minority believer | 10:25 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
To Less Judgemental...
Sounds like you are actually more judgemental. Doesn't every religion think it is the only correct one? Did the early Christians? Do Muslims? Do Roman Catholics or Eastern Orthodox? I've been voting for Evangelicals for years. I have no religious bias when it comes to voting for a candidate. I missed the part where Romney asked you to convert. The hypocrisy lies in a place where you have not yet looked.
Sounds like you are actually more judgemental. Doesn't every religion think it is the only correct one? Did the early Christians? Do Muslims? Do Roman Catholics or Eastern Orthodox? I've been voting for Evangelicals for years. I have no religious bias when it comes to voting for a candidate. I missed the part where Romney asked you to convert. The hypocrisy lies in a place where you have not yet looked.
Phil Scoville | 10:36 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I support Mitt Romney. His economic record shows he can make change in
government and big companies. Give him a shot at the federal system and I think
he'll make a huge dent in federal deficit.
Jeff Morgan | 10:37 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
His speech will do little to change the opinion of those who will not vote for a
mormon like the rev. Romney is a good man who did a good job with the olympics
and in Boston. The only way he has a chance is if he focuses on what we so
desperatly need in this country... A leader with the ability to get things
done.. Look at his track record...But maybe the rev would be happier with a
morally defunct Hillary Clinton....that would prove the point.......
Jacen | 10:40 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I'm a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, am serving
as a branch secretary for a Spanish speaking branch in Salt Lake, and my middle
name literally happens to be, "Christian". Jesus of Nazareth or Jesus
Christ, whichever you want to call him is the foundation of my faith. Prophets
and apostles are not celebrities and politicians are not apostles. I've
met Mitt before - to me, he falls into a category of fat loaded Latter-Day
Saints who I don't blame for seeking prosperity. I'm a film graduate
from the University of Utah and things haven't been easy in that regard.
I've seen very polar views from ex-members of my faith and
misunderstandings about my industry from my own faith. Regardless of all things
else, I think Mitt is a very responsible, brilliant leader. Nobody who struts
around with the cash he has could be THAT stupid - I wish he'd give me some
of it to make a movie I've been working on. I don't like a lot of the
LDS movies that have been produced - ego filled but true - The End for now -
Henry Drummond | 10:42 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I fear that Reverend Mullen has demonstrated why Governor Romney's speech
though well written will do precious little good. The fact is that there are
many powerful people in the Republican Party who in fact do NOT want a
separation of Church of State.
When these groups confined themselves to issues such as abortion or gay marriage it seemed like a good idea to involve religion in government. Unfortunately that same power that can be used to force through ideas you agree with can just as easily be turned against you.
I think Reverend Mullen's comments are typical of the evangelicals working against Governor Romney's candidacy. They are in fact willing to disqualify someone for public office because of theological differences that have nothing to do with being President.
The ironic thing is that for years many in the Mormon Faith including Governor Romney have helped these same people gain respectability and even joined them in pushing through "moral" legislation in the states and halls of congress. Now they are finding that that these same people are working against them.
They have sown the wind and now are reaping the whirlwind.
When these groups confined themselves to issues such as abortion or gay marriage it seemed like a good idea to involve religion in government. Unfortunately that same power that can be used to force through ideas you agree with can just as easily be turned against you.
I think Reverend Mullen's comments are typical of the evangelicals working against Governor Romney's candidacy. They are in fact willing to disqualify someone for public office because of theological differences that have nothing to do with being President.
The ironic thing is that for years many in the Mormon Faith including Governor Romney have helped these same people gain respectability and even joined them in pushing through "moral" legislation in the states and halls of congress. Now they are finding that that these same people are working against them.
They have sown the wind and now are reaping the whirlwind.
How do we know | 10:51 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I believe that the 'media' try to brainwash the American people. Big
money comes from very rich people to help move their agenda along the way. If
you want to know if the Church of Jesus Christ is the Savior's true church,
look into what is taught and find out for yourselves. Don't just believe
what you read and hear and don't take another person's word for it.
You have the right to choose.
Find out for yourself.
Find out for yourself.
John | 10:53 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
"dc" is actually right. It is all about losing members to the LDS
faith. The LDS religion is the only one that purposely approaches people of
other religions to convert them to their religion. Another big issue with
others is that the LDS religion is elitist. When one says that they are the
only true church, they put down others whether or not they mean to. Other
churches believe that you are saved by the grace of God, not by what church you
attend. It is true that other religions do not understand the LDS church. It
is also true that LDS members do not understand other religions. Mormons tend
to put others below themselves because they are not members of the "one and
true" religion. Like it or not, that is the fact of the matter. Just an
end note. I have been asked by many Mormons to attend church with them... and I
have. But when I ask them to attend with me, the answer is generally that they
are not interested. Why would they be... they belong to the true church. Get
the point?
Misconceptions... | 10:53 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Reading these messages..everyone should know that it was Jesus Christ that told
Joseph Smith in the grove that "he should join none of them, for they draw
near to me with their lips but their heart are far from me." It's
funny to see all these evangelical minsiters and pastors on this website that
are offended at this...but nothing has changed still with all these pastors and
ministers. They still draw near with their lips, but their hearts are far from
where they should be. I will go out on a limb and say all these people that
wouldn't vote for Romney because he is a "mormon" are biased,
uninformed and show a lack of judgement. Everyone should go to a meeting at the
Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints before they judge what the mormon
religon is all about. Unfortunately all their opinions are biased, uninformed,
and prejudice. There's no way Romney is getting elected because People are
ignorant and wont vote for him because he is mormon, and not becaue of his
character and leadership. Good luck with Hillary Clinton!!!
Matt in Tucson | 10:59 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Evangelicals are *NOT* Christians. There actions and intolerant attitudes show
loud and clear the do not follow Jesus. Also, their doctrine does not come from
the teachings of Jesus, but only from Paul. Indeed, Evangelicals should be
called "The Cult of Paul." They are fond of labeling Mormons,
Catholics, Jehova's Witnesses, and anybody else that doesn't believe
like them as "Cults."
Elder Bryan R. Taylor..... | 11:05 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Hey Mr. Reverend Philip Mullen...
So your saying that unless you have faith in Jesus Christ your not a child of God? Once again...that is why Christ told Joseph Smith in upstate New York (palymra, NY) that he should join none of them..for they draw near to me with their lips..but their hearts are far from me. You are just one of the many that are so misinfromed, and biased in your beliefs that you don't even know the King James Bible. Last time I checked the Bible..we are all Sons and daughters of God.
So your saying that unless you have faith in Jesus Christ your not a child of God? Once again...that is why Christ told Joseph Smith in upstate New York (palymra, NY) that he should join none of them..for they draw near to me with their lips..but their hearts are far from me. You are just one of the many that are so misinfromed, and biased in your beliefs that you don't even know the King James Bible. Last time I checked the Bible..we are all Sons and daughters of God.
Arla | 11:26 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I find it unbelievable that people look at "Mormons" as non-christian.
The very name of our church is "The Church of Jesus Crist of Latter Day
Saints". The word Mormon is merely a nickname that has been handed down
during the persecution of the Saints during the 1800's. I just don't
get it! We open our prayers in the name of the Father and close them in the name
of Jesus Christ. If were were not Christians would we even recognize The Father
and His son Jesus Christ. It is sad to me that MR is being targeted on his
religious preference. Our country was founded on the right for each person to
worship how and where he wants without prejudice. It is troublesome to me that
Pastors and Ministers can preach against the Church from the pulpit as
non-Christians and the congregations believe what is being said. If I wanted to
know about Catholism I would not ask my Bishop. I would go to the source for a
true picture. I challenge everone to do the same. Even if I were not LDS, I
would vote for Mitt because of his high moral values. Get with it people
Daddy | 11:30 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Look how Utah Republicans treat Utah Democrats at the polls. This is the
nation's best example of Mormons in office. Utah Mormons want the world to
embrace Mitt, and yet they dis-respect anyone who is a Democrat in Utah and
nationally. Maybe D-News readers should go back and look at the comments left
when Senate Majority Leader Reid was in town.
What is really sad is that Romney would not have to bow to the evangelical bigots if he would have run as a Democrat. There would also be no need to flip-flop.
What is really sad is that Romney would not have to bow to the evangelical bigots if he would have run as a Democrat. There would also be no need to flip-flop.
Mike | 11:33 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I need a definition of "Orthodox Lutheran Christian" as Rev. Mullen
calls himself. According to the "Orthodox" Catholic faith - his
break-off from Catholisism is a heresy. What gives him the authority to define
what is "Christian", the Nicene Creed? That was a heretical joke! No
man taketh this honor unto himself, but he that is called of God, as was Aaron -
Heb 5:3. Mr. psuedo-pastor,Mullen, were you called of God as was Aaron? Oh ye
scribes pharisees and hypocrites!
RE:Rev Mullen | 11:43 a.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I from Texas appreciate your remarks, but wonder what the Catholic Church said
about the Luthern Church when they did not agree with the teachings of
catholisism.
Having just listened to Mitt's speech, I am inspired as an American.
pm
Having just listened to Mitt's speech, I am inspired as an American.
pm
Josh | 12:11 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Dixiespice and others...
What makes you think that non-Mormons have not studied the LDS religion and figured things out. People constantly say "take a moment to explore our beliefs and then make a decision."
MANY people do that, and what they decide simply is that they do not agree with the LDS religion and its doctrine. They have done what you ask of them, but if they decide it's not for them, they are criticized and often condemed (dusted off shoes) for THEIR beliefs because they dont feel the same way you do.
What makes you think that non-Mormons have not studied the LDS religion and figured things out. People constantly say "take a moment to explore our beliefs and then make a decision."
MANY people do that, and what they decide simply is that they do not agree with the LDS religion and its doctrine. They have done what you ask of them, but if they decide it's not for them, they are criticized and often condemed (dusted off shoes) for THEIR beliefs because they dont feel the same way you do.
elpasoan | 12:30 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
An interesting questions would be to ask what the real title of the Mormon
church is.
Clifton | 12:46 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
To John: Listen up Buddy! Your assertion that LDS know nothing about other
religions is nonsense. While I can't speak for other LDS, I can tell you
with all sincerity, that I am one that does. Since the advent of the computer,
I have made it a point to study other religions, and for the most part know what
makes them tick, and most protestant,(including Lutherans)Catholice, ect have
means to try and bring people unto Christ. A few days ago, I come across an
Evangelical Anti-mormon site located in San Antonio,TX. Its primary reason for
being, was attempting to Evangelize LDS, especially at Temple open houses and
dedications. One of their prime methods in addition to "Witnessing"
was "Confrontational Evangelizing" a type of "In your face"
Evangelizing.Organizations like this THINK they know us, but fall short of the
truth and have to resort to fabrications about us of the worst kind.
Mitt Romney? Since its early yet, I haven't made up my mind who I will vote for, but to be sure it will not be based on what religion he/she belongs to, but rather what they can do for this country.
Mitt Romney? Since its early yet, I haven't made up my mind who I will vote for, but to be sure it will not be based on what religion he/she belongs to, but rather what they can do for this country.
Can Christians be Bigots? | 12:53 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
The Answer: Yes
Bottomline: The poll does shed light on widespread BIAS. Anyone who justifies that they would not vote for an Evangelical, a Baptist, a Lutheran, a Mormon, a Catholic, even a Scientologist, or a Muslim, based on their religion alone, is a BIGOT.
The country has checks and balances to separate Church and state. America has nothing to fear. I would elect anyone with any religion, if that person best represents my political stance.
Bottomline: The poll does shed light on widespread BIAS. Anyone who justifies that they would not vote for an Evangelical, a Baptist, a Lutheran, a Mormon, a Catholic, even a Scientologist, or a Muslim, based on their religion alone, is a BIGOT.
The country has checks and balances to separate Church and state. America has nothing to fear. I would elect anyone with any religion, if that person best represents my political stance.
Clifton | 1:16 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Reference Dave's comments; "Kooky beliefs"; "Anti-Christian
Sect" Claims to know the Curch! Anti, I thing means against, and when has
the Church been against Christians? Kooky Beliefs" Try Modern/tradional
Christian belief in the "Holy Trinity"
Mitt Romney a draft dodger? I too am a veteran of the Viet Nam war and 30 year Military retiree and have had to deal with my share of draft dodgers, concientious objecters and assorted ant-war rabble-rousers during my time. Because Mitt was on a mission to France during this period, hardly seems fair to lable him a draft dodger. We had the draft then, and if "men of the Cloth" were drafted like Doctors then the Military should have been over-run with Chaplains.
Your choice to vote for who you wish Dave!
Mitt Romney a draft dodger? I too am a veteran of the Viet Nam war and 30 year Military retiree and have had to deal with my share of draft dodgers, concientious objecters and assorted ant-war rabble-rousers during my time. Because Mitt was on a mission to France during this period, hardly seems fair to lable him a draft dodger. We had the draft then, and if "men of the Cloth" were drafted like Doctors then the Military should have been over-run with Chaplains.
Your choice to vote for who you wish Dave!
To: Josh | 1:26 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I'll answer your question. Reading the posts from "non-Mormons"
doesn't give me any reason to believe the people who made those posts know
much of anything about "Mormons". Many of those posts misrepresent
doctrines or only partially understand beliefs they hold against
"Mormons."
I have many great friends of other faiths. Most deem themselves Evangelicals or Born Again Christians. I respect their Christlike lives and they respect mine. That is why they can't understand how their pastor uses church to preach against "Mormons". None of it matches me, the "Mormon" they know for themselves. It catches them off guard when their pastor tells them I am not "Christian". One expressed that he hoped I would be saved, because I am the most Christlike person he knows.
I love my friends. I am grateful that none of them want to condemn me, but only have concern for me. I know my friends are doing their best to follow Christ. And though I believe this makes them "Christian," it does not matter to me if their church preaches that I'm not "Christian". Christs own people rejected him because they knew not what they did. But Christ knows his own.
I have many great friends of other faiths. Most deem themselves Evangelicals or Born Again Christians. I respect their Christlike lives and they respect mine. That is why they can't understand how their pastor uses church to preach against "Mormons". None of it matches me, the "Mormon" they know for themselves. It catches them off guard when their pastor tells them I am not "Christian". One expressed that he hoped I would be saved, because I am the most Christlike person he knows.
I love my friends. I am grateful that none of them want to condemn me, but only have concern for me. I know my friends are doing their best to follow Christ. And though I believe this makes them "Christian," it does not matter to me if their church preaches that I'm not "Christian". Christs own people rejected him because they knew not what they did. But Christ knows his own.
John | 1:27 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
Gee Clifton, I found you very knowledgeable and, by the way, very in my face.
What was it you said about in-your-face evangelizing?? See, isn't it great
to fight about religion? I'll bet God is happy now. And, obviously you
won the fight because we all know what church is true. I'll slink back
into my corner now. You win. If it helps us be friends, the fact of the matter
is that I think Mitt would be the best president, but my opinion has zero to do
with religion.
VKM | 1:38 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I'm glad that Mitt gave me and the rest of the LDS community permission not
to vote for him as a Mormon. With that I suspect he will lose most of Utah
because all I hear is "Isn't it great we'll have an LDS
president." They know nothing else about him.
Now I can vote for John McCain with a clear concience.
Now I can vote for John McCain with a clear concience.
slmg | 1:49 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
There seems so many that are willing to put other candidates beliefs and
devotion to there religion down while basing there vote for Mitt Romney solely
on the fact they and Mitt Romney are LDS. They are soooo judgemental, I keep
reading JFK was not a truly devoted Catholic, that Hillary Clinton is morally
bankrupt, Guiliani is morally unfit, Huckabee is a religious nut. Since when are
these people so imperfect and Mitt Romney is so perfect? He is not, he is just
like everyone else with the same faults and failings and not about to be
translated. We are electing the President of the United States so lets stick to
the program and be concerned about the policies that they putting forth and how
they will effect EVERY citizen of this great country.
Eileen | 3:42 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
There is a lot of controversy over Mit Romney's faith. If a relgion says
there is more than one way to heaven than it is considered a cult. I will not
vote for someone who takes their orders from the head heirarchy of a Church.
In the Bbile Jesus said" I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes
to the Father except through me."
I will vote my conscience.
In the Bbile Jesus said" I am the way, the truth and the life, no one comes
to the Father except through me."
I will vote my conscience.
Anonymous | 6:51 p.m. Dec. 6, 2007
I started taking pictures with my Rollie. I have taken pictures with my Nikons
since 1973. I love my Patagonia. I don't go to the snow to ski. I normally
go to Kirkwood. My Toyota was been great!
Notice Mitt only used Mormon once? He used faith. It human to be specific when we are proud of something. We avoid naming what embarrasses us.
Mitt sure slipped out of saying Mormon or LDS. He did learn how to lie for his lord well.
Notice Mitt only used Mormon once? He used faith. It human to be specific when we are proud of something. We avoid naming what embarrasses us.
Mitt sure slipped out of saying Mormon or LDS. He did learn how to lie for his lord well.
Hey Anonymous | 5:54 a.m. Dec. 7, 2007
Rollei, not Rollie ;) And I've been Nikon ever since too !
Faith is the underpinning of all commonality amongst religiously affiliated people, that's all he's saying. He was quite direct about his commitment to his religion. I'll bet he's surprised if 50% of the country doesn't know he's LDS too...
Faith is the underpinning of all commonality amongst religiously affiliated people, that's all he's saying. He was quite direct about his commitment to his religion. I'll bet he's surprised if 50% of the country doesn't know he's LDS too...
lou | 7:18 a.m. Dec. 7, 2007
50% of the people dosen't know Milt Romney is a mormon ?? come on his
father George Romney the senator from Michigan was a mormon ...... he ran once
,but dropped out the next day ...tell those 50%of those people to looked up the
history of politics
anon. | 9:32 p.m. Dec. 8, 2007
(partial cross-post)
With all due respect, the tone of the discussion suggests we all need to look in the mirror...
Case in point: Huckabee has been accused of playing up his religion to get the evangelical vote in Iowa; now he currently holds lead in the GOP polls. Arguably, when he refers to himself as the "Christian leader" in his Iowa ads, the subtext is that the other leading candidate in IA, i.e., Romney, is not. I think this factors into his lead, despite his campaign's denial.
Yet, how often do political races in Utah feature politicos touting "Utah values", or prominently featuring their (large) families in their campaign literature. Surely, we must admit that these are "code words" to the UT electorate referring to the candidate's religious affiliation.
Doctrinal differences notwithstanding, when we cry foul about Huckabee courting the evangelical vote, perhaps we should also take a long, hard look in the mirror. If, as a national minority, we (LDS) are looking for acceptance in a religiously pluralistic society, then it had better start with us extending the same courtesies to those of other faiths in areas where we are the majority.
5th generation LDS; former SLC resident
With all due respect, the tone of the discussion suggests we all need to look in the mirror...
Case in point: Huckabee has been accused of playing up his religion to get the evangelical vote in Iowa; now he currently holds lead in the GOP polls. Arguably, when he refers to himself as the "Christian leader" in his Iowa ads, the subtext is that the other leading candidate in IA, i.e., Romney, is not. I think this factors into his lead, despite his campaign's denial.
Yet, how often do political races in Utah feature politicos touting "Utah values", or prominently featuring their (large) families in their campaign literature. Surely, we must admit that these are "code words" to the UT electorate referring to the candidate's religious affiliation.
Doctrinal differences notwithstanding, when we cry foul about Huckabee courting the evangelical vote, perhaps we should also take a long, hard look in the mirror. If, as a national minority, we (LDS) are looking for acceptance in a religiously pluralistic society, then it had better start with us extending the same courtesies to those of other faiths in areas where we are the majority.
5th generation LDS; former SLC resident
Jeff C. | 1:23 a.m. Dec. 29, 2007
Mitt Romney's speech was supposed to be about his faith. He spoke a lot
about my faith not his. I never heard him speak of many gods, men can become
gods, salvation by grace after all you can do, when the profit speaks the
thinking has been done ;) How about those trusting only in their Bibles are
fools? Jesus sweating in ghe garden as our atonement. Jesus birth in
"Jerusalem". If he honestly and actually spoke of his faith and its
teachings, he knows that no one would vote for him outside of the membership. It
was a business as usual a speech full of word games. There is a lot of talk
about bias and not knowing any Mormons. I went to your church, your seminary,
etc.. I know you and when it comes to Mitt. Mitt doesn't fit. You Mormons
act ashamed of your faith and afraid to speak up and tell it like it is. Mitt
came across as either ignorant or deceptive about his faith. He does not get my
vote.
Jay | 9:00 a.m. Jan. 4, 2008
No offense to all the LDS people out there, but I don't think Romney should
be President and I will not vote for him; however this is for a variety of
reasons not simply limited to his LDS faith. However, that's the point we
are on, so what I'm going to say is, like it or not, religion and morality
reflect numerous laws and policies in our society. I'm not sure what LDS
people believe precisely, but I do know that it doesn't exactly comport
with the Christianity that I numerous other Americans profess. Moreover, Romney
is a closet racist. His stance towards illegal immigrants borders on something I
hear coming out of the minute men group....BTW great fence they built with all
those contributions! hahaha
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I know there will be many jumping in here with indignation about the level of prejudice, but given the above 2 points, we can stop complaining and do SOMETHING!!
First, get out of your LDS-only circle and be friends with non LDS. Work alongside non LDS in community, school, social groups that build up society in someway so that people can see what we're all about.
Secondly, we need you out here outside the Wasatch Front. If you are mobile, can go on a mission, or take a job assignment somewhere else - DO IT!!
I think everyone there has this idea that the world knows who we are now (thanks to the Olympics??) but this article illustrates just how obscure we are.
I know a Swiss journalist who went to the Olympics and came back saying he 'didn't see any Mormons'. Maybe you guys in Utah are a bit TOO QUIET!!