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Vouchers appear doomed
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Homer S. | 12:51 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
As a Republican, I will not vote for vouchers. It won't help our public
education. I think the people behind this movement have a vested interest in
seeing private schools get more students. But I think the big reason I am
opposed to the voucher bill is the Republican legislature. They have proven by
the way they have reacted to opposition that they are being paid off by the
pro-voucher lobby. They seem dead set on taking aim at anyone opposed to
vouchers. Seeking retribution is Un-American. All it proves is that they really
aren't representing the people, but they are representing lobbyist and
their own self interests. I hope people take note of the legislatures who are
planning on taking aim at anyone that voiced an opinion against the vouchers.
Wait a minute | 12:57 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Of course they are going down.
LEGISLATORS - Please listen to the public
We don't want vouchers. We just want our public schools to be funded better than they are now. We want teacher pay to increase enough that teachers from other states WANT to come here. We need a teacher surplus in order to improve things in Utah. Please spend the surplus money on teacher salaries.
Also please let the voucher issue die. Don't bring back another bill next year. The public has spoken.
LEGISLATORS - Please listen to the public
We don't want vouchers. We just want our public schools to be funded better than they are now. We want teacher pay to increase enough that teachers from other states WANT to come here. We need a teacher surplus in order to improve things in Utah. Please spend the surplus money on teacher salaries.
Also please let the voucher issue die. Don't bring back another bill next year. The public has spoken.
Comments continue below
Wake Up UTAH | 1:32 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
If the teachers Union wants to stop vouchers and 81% of the democrats are for
them, that should tell us something. Vote YES.
Who believes polls? | 1:52 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
There are Lies, Damn Lies and Dan Jones. Everyone with a brain knows that most
polls are conducted to shape political opinions....not gauge them. We'll
see what happens on November 6th.
Israel Teitelbaum | 4:11 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
America's education monopoly is an enormous enterprise of over $500 BILLION
per year that generates over $2 BILLION per year into union coffers. Much of
this cash goes to generously grease the wheels of government, which generates
enormous political power.
I know it sounds very harsh to say this out loud, but factually the educrats are holding our children hostage in substandard schools (see Wall Street Journal editorial, below), often under horrendous conditions, in order to maintain this bonanza on the backs of hard-working taxpayers. How they get away with this day after day and year after year is difficult to explain, other than to say that he who controls the government gets to do whatever they please.
I know it sounds very harsh to say this out loud, but factually the educrats are holding our children hostage in substandard schools (see Wall Street Journal editorial, below), often under horrendous conditions, in order to maintain this bonanza on the backs of hard-working taxpayers. How they get away with this day after day and year after year is difficult to explain, other than to say that he who controls the government gets to do whatever they please.
Carl | 5:58 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
The mystery is why the media in general and both the organized sides on this
issue have done such a lousy job of explaining the real issues.
Several people I know have written to various writers and talk-show hosts, asking them to explain Education Funding 101: How is the money spent before the voucher law was passed? How does a weighted pupil unit work? What really happens to a school's funding, and when, if a student uses a voucher?
So far as we have seen, no one has ever given the voters that basic information.
Hundreds of people have written in these comments, with 40 variations of what they think happens, and the 2 ad sponsors have played up their projections of what might happen, but all the media delivers is polls?
Several people I know have written to various writers and talk-show hosts, asking them to explain Education Funding 101: How is the money spent before the voucher law was passed? How does a weighted pupil unit work? What really happens to a school's funding, and when, if a student uses a voucher?
So far as we have seen, no one has ever given the voters that basic information.
Hundreds of people have written in these comments, with 40 variations of what they think happens, and the 2 ad sponsors have played up their projections of what might happen, but all the media delivers is polls?
Really? | 6:28 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Leah Barker is being disingenuous. The pro-voucher side has outspent the
anti-voucher campaign by nearly half a million dollars. The pro-voucher network
is vast and well-funded. They've been pushing the lame idea of vouchers for
decades all across the country. Every time it has been on the ballot voters have
rejected it.
I, too, will be voting against Referendum 1.
I, too, will be voting against Referendum 1.
BigAl | 6:44 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I can Totally understand 81% of Democrats voting against vouchers since they are
so conditioned to accepting anything and everything provided Free by "The
Government" and are so receptive to voting as instructed by the Unions.
What I don't understand is the reported 50% of Republicans voting against.
These thinking voters will surely realize that opening up our failing school
system to the Free Enterprise method that has been the backbone of American
Business success forever can do nothing but improve education for our children.
Once they do, before next Tuesday, I think they'll vote intelligently as
they usually do. Let's all hope so!
Sad day | 6:51 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
This will be a sad day for Utah Education if this Referendum does not pass. I
know the Education Community thinks they will win by defeating this motion, but
it will be back and will keep knocking at the door. Their virtual monopoly will
stay in place for the moment. They will continue to insist that if they just had
more money and smaller classes they could succeed. Some of them really
don't understand that it is partly the system. If parents were more
involved in making some choices they would feel more connected and more
satisfied with the system. Other voucher experiments have proved this. John
Kasich in his book, "Stand for Something: The Battle for America's
Soul" says it as well as anyone. He states "We have a Higher Education
system in the United States that is the best in the world and a Public Education
system that is third rate?" His point is that Universities do well because
they deliver or they have no customers and are out of business. This is our
chance to make some small and meaningful changes to Utah's Public Education
system that would empower Utah's parents and children.
I�m still in favor.
For Public Schools | 6:54 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Monies should go/stay in public schools.
David Styvaert | 7:28 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
According to another article on this site ("Utah test scores are
startling") Utah ranks dead last in test scores and yet people are still
going on with their zombie-like support of the terrible public education system
in Utah. Good thinking everybody ... let's all support what's proven
to not work!
What's really happening here is that the same people who are victims of the Utah education system from a generation ago are now the voters who lack the critical thinking skills needed to see that vouchers are a good thing.
What's really happening here is that the same people who are victims of the Utah education system from a generation ago are now the voters who lack the critical thinking skills needed to see that vouchers are a good thing.
anonymous | 7:39 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
If voucher proponents really want to help low-income families, they should spend
their millions of dollars to provide thousands of scholarships to those same
families. What a waste!
Congrats to the DMN! | 7:42 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
This is exactly the headline I would expect from a newspaper intent on killing
the referendum. Congratulations to the DMN for continuing to demonstrate its
bias and in helping the unions spread their propaganda in their fight to
maintain control.
Voters: Read the bill and make a decision on your own. You'll only get partial truths from the media.
Voters: Read the bill and make a decision on your own. You'll only get partial truths from the media.
Annonymous to UEA | 7:46 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
To the Hinckley Institute and Mr. Dan Jones... Thank you for validating that the
UEA and friends...the ACLU, Mrs. Clinton, Ted Kennedy, Nancy Palosie, Barbara
Boxer, et al liberals will probably win the day on the Referendum. Thank you
all. I'm still voting yes.
Be sure to vote | 7:52 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
If people actually do show up at the polls, then this beast will get a
well-deserved stake through it's malicious heart.
Will the legislature learn any lessons from this public rebuke? Ha! We wish!
No, these are not the kind of guys who admit to having made errors. Instead, they're going to seek revenge against the very folks they're supposed to be representing.
Just watch - they'll take their wrath out on public schools this January.
We need to follow-up Tuesday's vote with another vote in November of next year. Vote every one of the pro-voucher legislators out of office.
Will the legislature learn any lessons from this public rebuke? Ha! We wish!
No, these are not the kind of guys who admit to having made errors. Instead, they're going to seek revenge against the very folks they're supposed to be representing.
Just watch - they'll take their wrath out on public schools this January.
We need to follow-up Tuesday's vote with another vote in November of next year. Vote every one of the pro-voucher legislators out of office.
arc | 8:16 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Shows how many people have actually read the voter information packet. We have
increased public school spending from $3 billion a year to $5 billion a year,
and someone is complaining we might spend less that 1/2 billion over 13 years to
make class sizes smaller using voucers.
$400 Million vs $65 billion to $100 billion.
To do anything the way the UEA wants, would cost much, much more. This is a good idea. Vote for vouchers.
$400 Million vs $65 billion to $100 billion.
To do anything the way the UEA wants, would cost much, much more. This is a good idea. Vote for vouchers.
John | 8:17 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Apparently the incessant drumbeat of anti- voucher rhetoric from the
teachers' union and the news media has been working. Sadly most of their
allegations are demonstrably false.
The abuse of office by some of those in the education bureaucracy, and some teachers, is proof tht they care more about maintaining their monopoly and power than educating our kids.
Despite the many fine teachers, overall the public schools are growing steadily worse, not better. The worst are little more than liberal indoctrination centers and baby sitters. No wonder parents are eager to have options!
Parents would do well to make any sacrifice necessary to send their kids to private schools. or take on the burden of home schooling.
It's for the children---- unless you are for the powerful teachers' union.
The abuse of office by some of those in the education bureaucracy, and some teachers, is proof tht they care more about maintaining their monopoly and power than educating our kids.
Despite the many fine teachers, overall the public schools are growing steadily worse, not better. The worst are little more than liberal indoctrination centers and baby sitters. No wonder parents are eager to have options!
Parents would do well to make any sacrifice necessary to send their kids to private schools. or take on the burden of home schooling.
It's for the children---- unless you are for the powerful teachers' union.
or "Bernick doomed vouchers" | 8:21 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Bob Bernick and the Deseret News doomed vouchers, along with the teacher's
union, the National Education Association and others who defend the status quo
of no merit based pay, less competition, and therefore less quality education
for our students. Our less than stellar educational expectations for our
students are not keeping up and with the industrialized world in training
students for a global economy. And other countries like India, China, and Japan
who turn out more engineers and scientists will only continue to fill the jobs
(even in Utah) since our students can't fill those positions. I agree that
parents, students and teachers must step up together to meet these challenges.
But the system must favor more competion, and allow people to spend their
towards a school of their choice, if we are too succeed.
Annette Bennette | 8:24 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Thank goodness, taxpayers are doing their homework. I like many people
don't have children in public school, yet I strongly support them.
Education builds a strong future. If we let certain special interest take our
tax money for their own designs,(even though supporters claim it comes out of
the general fund not school fund - it is still tax money). we limit resources
for public education. I don't use the fire department, UTA, or prison
system. Should I get a voucher because I choose to carpool instead of Public
Transportation or a tax voucher because I choose not to use the prison system?
Of course not! That would be ridiculous. Keep doing your homework you smart
taxpayers. Vouchers will only be another means of using our tax money for
special interests.
RAF | 8:27 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
The legislature made it clear that education would be held harmless by the
voucher law. That means that education would get no more and no less money than
what lawmakers gave them in the budget.
IF vouchers are defeated, I hope that state lawmakers will have guts enough to make it perfectly clear to the educators that they will NOT be getting any of the money that was set aside for vouchers. Lawmakers should take that set aside money and put it into other needed programs and make it crystal clear to educators that defeating vouchers in an attempt or desire to feed teacher's insatiable, protectionist and greedy demand for more money is not going work.
Education got what they got from lawmakers and they should not give them any more as a result of this effort to demonize any other good system of teaching our children.
I had five children and now have grandchildren in public schools and I'm all for adequately funding education, but in this instance the line has to be drawn somewhere and teachers told NO MORE.
IF vouchers are defeated, I hope that state lawmakers will have guts enough to make it perfectly clear to the educators that they will NOT be getting any of the money that was set aside for vouchers. Lawmakers should take that set aside money and put it into other needed programs and make it crystal clear to educators that defeating vouchers in an attempt or desire to feed teacher's insatiable, protectionist and greedy demand for more money is not going work.
Education got what they got from lawmakers and they should not give them any more as a result of this effort to demonize any other good system of teaching our children.
I had five children and now have grandchildren in public schools and I'm all for adequately funding education, but in this instance the line has to be drawn somewhere and teachers told NO MORE.
A Republican against vouchers | 8:50 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
The reason voucher proponents hold a mystical belief that they can thwart the
will of the people is that they do just that on a regular basis in the
legislature and in the Republican party convention.
These are the people who "booed" Barbara B. Smith at the convention because they think the LDS Church is too soft on abortion.
These are the people who wouldn't let Olene Walker on the ballot for Governor, even though she was an incumbent Republican and 70% of the voters in the state said they wanted her to continue in the job.
These are the people who insist that a mystical east coast union paid for the anti-voucher ads, when it was really the association dues of the hard working teachers in Utah schools.
These are the people who, early on, said that you couldn't be a good Mormon and vote against vouchers, even though the leaders of the church said the church has no official position.
These are the elitist, the powerful, the arrogant.
Utah Republicans need to attend their next caucus and recapture control of the party, for the good of the state and for the good of the future.
These are the people who "booed" Barbara B. Smith at the convention because they think the LDS Church is too soft on abortion.
These are the people who wouldn't let Olene Walker on the ballot for Governor, even though she was an incumbent Republican and 70% of the voters in the state said they wanted her to continue in the job.
These are the people who insist that a mystical east coast union paid for the anti-voucher ads, when it was really the association dues of the hard working teachers in Utah schools.
These are the people who, early on, said that you couldn't be a good Mormon and vote against vouchers, even though the leaders of the church said the church has no official position.
These are the elitist, the powerful, the arrogant.
Utah Republicans need to attend their next caucus and recapture control of the party, for the good of the state and for the good of the future.
samhill | 9:02 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I'm voting for vouchers as a way of protesting the obscene intrusion into
Utah politics by the NEA. I would also like us to at least try an experiment in
improving what I see as a bad and worsening public school system. The desperate
opposition to this attempt is simply more evidence of the lack of innovation and
interest in real student achievement that has been the hallmark of the NEA for
decades.
BriGuy | 9:08 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
It's sad that the fear tactics and lies from voucher opponents have
influenced so many people who do not take the time to look at the facts. Every
impartial analysis I have read blatantly shows their claims are false. Whenever
one entity has a monopoly on a product, the product is never good. Just look at
Microsoft.
yes | 9:08 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
This made my day. Good job Utah!
JBean | 9:10 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Holy Cow! That new website is really cool! (affordableprivateschools.com).
check it out--you can calculate your voucher, see tuition rates, maps, class
sizes, and other stuff. It's new, so not all details are up yet, but
they've got a great service there.
It puts the lie to everything the anti-voucherites are lying about in their ads (schools too expensive, etc).
Everybody should check this out!
And vote YES!
It puts the lie to everything the anti-voucherites are lying about in their ads (schools too expensive, etc).
Everybody should check this out!
And vote YES!
No name | 9:09 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I'm glad that we have decided to let other people outside of UT tell us how
to run our lives especially the federal government. It's ridiculous how
much money has gone into the fight against vouchers. Let's see what
happens next....I am all for the vouchers. I will vote Yes for the vouchers.
Anonymous | 9:14 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
What will it matter. The Governor will pull something off like he did Real Salt
Lake
Who put the link up? | 9:16 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I'm sorry but whoever added the link affordableprivateschools.com it is
ridiculous. It is absolutely untrue. Call the schools on the list and find out
that many do not accept vouchers. I work for one of the schools on the list and
we do not accept vouchers there at all. I wonder if the person who put the link
together realizes that you are misleading many people. Whoever is putting
together the info against vouchers should get their info correct. Most private
schools DO NOT accept vouchers. Althought, I will vote Yes for the vouchers.
Same Old Des News reporting | 9:16 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Why do you refuse to give both sides to any story?
A paragraph saying why vouchers are bad (59% of the people in Utah are against vouchers.)
Then paragraph after paragraph with quotes from the voucher proponents, spinning why vouchers would be good. You even give us a website to give more information on why vouchers are good.
I realize that you need to report on stories and quotes are biased, but at least give both sides.
I grew up in Utah, my parents only took the Deseret News because it was owned by the church, therefore the paper could not lie.
Not saying they lie, but only one side of the story gets out.
Please show some integrity in the way you present information. Contrary to your belief, people are not stupid. With the internet we can get information from many sources. Please just give us News and let us decide.
Save your Bias' for the editorial pages please.
The Deseret News has such a blatant bias that
A paragraph saying why vouchers are bad (59% of the people in Utah are against vouchers.)
Then paragraph after paragraph with quotes from the voucher proponents, spinning why vouchers would be good. You even give us a website to give more information on why vouchers are good.
I realize that you need to report on stories and quotes are biased, but at least give both sides.
I grew up in Utah, my parents only took the Deseret News because it was owned by the church, therefore the paper could not lie.
Not saying they lie, but only one side of the story gets out.
Please show some integrity in the way you present information. Contrary to your belief, people are not stupid. With the internet we can get information from many sources. Please just give us News and let us decide.
Save your Bias' for the editorial pages please.
The Deseret News has such a blatant bias that
ialwayshaveanopinion | 9:19 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Thing of all the money wasted on this thing that could have gone into other
areas. Very sad -- AND wasteful.
Elsie Gerald | 9:24 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Let the parents who want vouchers gather their children around the dining room
table in the evening and help them with their homework. Let the family enjoy
"going to school together". This is the way it was when I was a kid.
One on one should start at home with the parents. I am against vouchers because,
as I see it, it is the beginning of undermining an American institution that has
long served this country well. The result might surprise you! Vouchers for
special attention to the children would be dodging our parental responsibility
and give children a bad attitude that they are better than other people.
Let's get together, honestly, and save our public schools.
Anonymous | 9:25 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
After going to public school for my whole life, I would have liked the option of
choosing if I wanted to go to that school or not and not have to pay a price for
it. I wish the school vouchers would pass.
bob | 9:28 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
May they rest in peace for ever. Everyone should pay for their own kids
Lame | 9:43 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I went to the website. Smoke and mirrors. No information.
Show the whole country, but has only one state. Guess which one? Utah?
Just a list of what it costs to go to school at the schools. But a ton of information "still to come".
Good solid reporting by Tiffany Erickson and Bob Bernick Jr. I would hope that you are embarrassed to have your name on that story. It is one of the weakest efforts I have ever seen. Why did it take two of you to interview leah Barker and print what she said?
It seems a good twenty minutes went into writing this story.
Show the whole country, but has only one state. Guess which one? Utah?
Just a list of what it costs to go to school at the schools. But a ton of information "still to come".
Good solid reporting by Tiffany Erickson and Bob Bernick Jr. I would hope that you are embarrassed to have your name on that story. It is one of the weakest efforts I have ever seen. Why did it take two of you to interview leah Barker and print what she said?
It seems a good twenty minutes went into writing this story.
anonymous | 10:11 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I hope the polls don't keep the people at home. It would be easy to think,
Oh, the polls say it'll be defeated, I don't need to vote. Everyone
who has an opinion needs to get to the voting booths on Tuesday.
John | 10:15 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
In 2000, the stupid media talking heads declared Gore the winner in Florida,
before half the state had even voted. Many people in the western panhandle, upon
reading of his victory, decided there was no point in going to the polls, and
the debacle ensued. It was their fault we nearly tore the country in half.
The Deseret News should be ashamed of itself for poisoning the minds of the voters with such idiotic polling information that discourages people from making up their own minds.
The editorial staff of this paper, ought to resign based on the way they have handled this, and most other political issues through most of this century.
Truly pathetic.
The Deseret News should be ashamed of itself for poisoning the minds of the voters with such idiotic polling information that discourages people from making up their own minds.
The editorial staff of this paper, ought to resign based on the way they have handled this, and most other political issues through most of this century.
Truly pathetic.
braveheart | 10:19 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I'm shocked...the people actually voting against freedom. Seemed like a no
brainer once the lies
by the teachers unions were stripped away.
by the teachers unions were stripped away.
Gretzky | 10:34 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I won't vote for the vouchers simply because the Guv is voting for them. he
snuck the bill in last time. Huntsman needs to take a high colonic and go back
to being a tradewind ambassador...
remember the Alamo | 10:43 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Be very afraid for your political careers all representatives, senators,
governor and lt. governor who ignored the will of your constituents. The good
people of Utah will remember when it comes time to vote again. We don't
want our time and money wasted on another voucher fight and we will vote against
all pro-voucher candidates. We can forgive but we will not forget.
Steven Jarvis | 10:49 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Raf,
Your passionate hatred for Utah's public school teachers is quite complete. You really wanted that money I suppose. You should also direct your anger on the hundreds of thousand parents who stand against you and your special interest group. Without the huge support of parents behind the public school there was no way that teachers alone could have stopped this potential money-eating juggernaut.
The great thing is that for all you choice people out there, you still have the right to choose the mode of education for your child. That always existed in the most open state to parent choice in the nation. The backers of vouchers still have a noble opportunity to pump scholarship money into a private program to fund private 'vouchers'. We will see if this has really been a noble intent of these people, or just an excuse to get mine and other Utah taxpayers' money.
Your passionate hatred for Utah's public school teachers is quite complete. You really wanted that money I suppose. You should also direct your anger on the hundreds of thousand parents who stand against you and your special interest group. Without the huge support of parents behind the public school there was no way that teachers alone could have stopped this potential money-eating juggernaut.
The great thing is that for all you choice people out there, you still have the right to choose the mode of education for your child. That always existed in the most open state to parent choice in the nation. The backers of vouchers still have a noble opportunity to pump scholarship money into a private program to fund private 'vouchers'. We will see if this has really been a noble intent of these people, or just an excuse to get mine and other Utah taxpayers' money.
Anonymous | 10:50 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
If you could choose between sending your kids to a private school and public
education, which option would you choose? Do a poll on that.
Yusif Khan | 10:54 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I am voting for the voucher. Growing up in Afghanistan during the 1980s I know
what socialized education does to a country. America's public school are
not much different. They are broken and Utah is no different. Let those who
have to pay for schooling make the choice and not some democratic-liberal union.
Spare our children what I had to go through. Empower their parents and not the
bureaucracy.
Special Interests | 10:58 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
If vouchers don't pass, the thing the public will have learned is just how
powerful special interest money is in today's politics. This thing was
nearly law before education unions intervened and started pouring mad money into
propaganda campaigns.
Shouldn't Utahans be the one to decide Utah's laws, not money machines from outside?
Shouldn't Utahans be the one to decide Utah's laws, not money machines from outside?
Steven Jarvis | 11:16 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
braveheart???
We are voting to maintain freedom, and against creating a private school monopoly that will harm our children.
Vouchers burden private schools with few strings to begin with, but that will change if we can get an opening into the unregulated private education industry. A vote against vouchers keeps our private school system free from government intervention.
Our state has the best freedom for parents to go to any school or even home school if they so choose and provide transportation and any cost with that choice. We are maintaining that freedom with the vote against vouchers. Approving vouchers could drive up the costs of private school tuition as demand increases. We want the schools to remain affordable and vouchers will cause tuition rates to rise unacceptably and cause class sizes to go up in private schools. We don't want to destroy our private schools by adding vouchers to the mix either.
We are voting to maintain freedom, and against creating a private school monopoly that will harm our children.
Vouchers burden private schools with few strings to begin with, but that will change if we can get an opening into the unregulated private education industry. A vote against vouchers keeps our private school system free from government intervention.
Our state has the best freedom for parents to go to any school or even home school if they so choose and provide transportation and any cost with that choice. We are maintaining that freedom with the vote against vouchers. Approving vouchers could drive up the costs of private school tuition as demand increases. We want the schools to remain affordable and vouchers will cause tuition rates to rise unacceptably and cause class sizes to go up in private schools. We don't want to destroy our private schools by adding vouchers to the mix either.
Scooter | 11:17 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
I don't see how the pro-voucher people have out-spent the anti-voucher
people. Everyday over the past 2 weeks, in my mail, has been a anti-voucher
mailer (all have been torn-up & thrown away), when I have only seen 2
pro-voucher mailers ... Hmmmm ... Maybe when you attack something so much, it
must be good to have competition.
Vouchers are not only for those who are rich & well-to-do.
Remember class-division/attacks is what Karl Marx (Socialist) taught to those that wanted what others had worked for.
AIMHO
Vouchers are not only for those who are rich & well-to-do.
Remember class-division/attacks is what Karl Marx (Socialist) taught to those that wanted what others had worked for.
AIMHO
Utah test scores... | 11:21 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Whoever said Utah test scores were dead last needs to go back and read the
article from yesterday's paper again.
Utah is ABOVE average with scores that have been improving.
All that with the WORST funding in the nation.
Incredible job by our teachers and families.
Utah is ABOVE average with scores that have been improving.
All that with the WORST funding in the nation.
Incredible job by our teachers and families.
The True Special Interest Group: | 11:23 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Special Interests should have said:
If voucher's do pass, the thing the public will have learned is just how powerful special interest money is in today's politics. This thing was nearly law before the parent teacher association intervened and got the referendum started.
Think of all that wasted campaign contributions that PCE has poured into the state to get legislators to buy into vouchers. Gone. All gone. Think about all the money the special interest groups have been funneling into billboards, TV and radio ads, paid bloggers, that PCE has pumped into Utah's local economy trying to persuade Utahns that this is a great public policy. All that special interest money over the past twenty years has been a waste with this inevitable defeat.
If voucher's do pass, the thing the public will have learned is just how powerful special interest money is in today's politics. This thing was nearly law before the parent teacher association intervened and got the referendum started.
Think of all that wasted campaign contributions that PCE has poured into the state to get legislators to buy into vouchers. Gone. All gone. Think about all the money the special interest groups have been funneling into billboards, TV and radio ads, paid bloggers, that PCE has pumped into Utah's local economy trying to persuade Utahns that this is a great public policy. All that special interest money over the past twenty years has been a waste with this inevitable defeat.
Anonymous | 11:25 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Braveheart,
Voting against freedom? Are you kidding me? People can go to school where ever they want. They question here is who's going to pay for it. You may want to become a little more familiar with the topic.
Voting against freedom? Are you kidding me? People can go to school where ever they want. They question here is who's going to pay for it. You may want to become a little more familiar with the topic.
Eyes Wide Open! | 11:26 a.m. Nov. 3, 2007
Ill conceived! Flawed! Self-serving, Deceptive and disingeniously presented!
Totally unrepresentaive of the majority voting public! Shows the dominant
Republican party out of touch with the voters that put them in office who are
interested only in cowtowing to the wealthy and playing on the ignorance of the
average middle class - who takes the hit on all this crap! Worst of all... the
passing of a voucher referendum would create a hydra of special interest driven
agendas the like of which has never been seen in this nation... and Utah would
be the start of it all.
I'm going to be part of the voting public that ALL the polls say will defeat the voucher referendum. Oh while we're at it, isn't it about time that we voters reclaimed the status of this State having once been the most balanced state in the nation on politics where Dems and Repubs were in balance? Time to have a Dem governor when Repubs control the legislature, and the reverse, and to vote more Dems into the legislature. Economies do better and societies benefit more in moderate political climates.
I'm going to be part of the voting public that ALL the polls say will defeat the voucher referendum. Oh while we're at it, isn't it about time that we voters reclaimed the status of this State having once been the most balanced state in the nation on politics where Dems and Repubs were in balance? Time to have a Dem governor when Repubs control the legislature, and the reverse, and to vote more Dems into the legislature. Economies do better and societies benefit more in moderate political climates.
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Vouchers might have had a chance in Utah if they had been limited to the poor or lower income groups. By offering everybody a voucher it meant Utah would be footing the bill eventually for all kids attending private school, even those who could easily afford it.
There were also too many flaws and gapping lack of standards of accountability and school safety that made anyone who read the bill question why on earth were our representatives pushing this.
Then we have the paid bloggers, Sutherland Institute, the anti-liberal campaign, Oreos, Byrne and other nonsense that made the Pro Voucher campaign laughable and did more to kill any support from most who were undecided months ago. It is not easy to win when every few weeks or so one of your key approaches turns out to be shooting yourself in the foot.