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Church critics are offensive

People like you will apparently just never get the point. No one is telling you that you are wrong for believing in your religion. We are telling you that you are wrong for forcing others to live by your religious beliefs.

When it comes to tolerating you, you're right, I won't tolerate YOU forcing YOUR beliefs upon ME (and I won't apologize for it either).

The day marriage is legalized for two consenting adult sisters, homosexuals, or transgender bisexuals, would there be any doubt we are a society in decline.

Well I believe this is the beginning of a trend. The LDS church has had a lot of years with relitive peace since its been in Utah. But I believe the persacution that our ancestors saw is going to come back. But thats ok because those who are seeking the truth tend to ask more questions when the church is being slandered and vilafied. And you will see members and friends leave the church as you find out what their testimonies really are.

Homosexuality, like androgyny, might be an instinctive racial response to overpopulation, crowding, and stress. Both flourish when empire reaches its apogee. - Edward Abbey

And Lisa, I am getting far less tolerant of the superstitious, the religious, and the self righteous. I am getting far less tolerant of those that would force their believes on others. Those that believe that theirs are the only answers. I am getting far less tolerant of those that revel in their ignorance. Those that are proud of their ignorance.
Those that wear their idiocy and bigotry as a badge of honor.

Sometimes turning the tables helps to be more tolerant, compassionate, and understanding...

"I am offended by the fact that this person could spew her anger at a [MINORITY] that has been around nearly as long as the tradition of marriage between a man and a woman. I am becoming less tolerant of the people who tell me that I am wrong for believing in my [OWN FEELINGS]. I guess I am getting tired of these people telling me that I should be accepting of [THEIR PARTICULAR RELIGIOUS SENTIMENTS]; meanwhile, they have no tolerance for me. I hope we never give up our [FREEDOMS] to appease someone with different opinions [OR RELIGIOUS POINTS OF VIEW]."

@ Lisa, please think before you associate yourself with our Church. You're tarnishing our good name.

"I am very offended by the comments made by the "lady" who suggested the church helped defeat the idea of allowing gays to marry."

Uh, have you been reading the news? Our Church did engage in that deplorable act. By the way, we've elected a new president too.

"I am becoming less tolerant of the people who tell me that I am wrong for believing in my religion.I guess I am getting tired of these people telling me that I should be accepting of them; meanwhile, they have no tolerance for me."

First off, you don't sound tolerant at all so less tolerance from you may result in violence. Second, nobody is saying you are wrong. They are merely asking you not to tell them they are wrong. Maybe try increasing your tolerance level.

Finally, Brigham Young once said that only fools are offended when offense isn't intended but a greater fool is offended when offense is intended. I wonder which category you fall into? Good thing you live in Logan.

Let me get this straight, the LDS church mobilizes it's forces to raise 20+ million to push a gay marriage ban in CA, but it is offensive that people protest the church's actions?

I get it, kind of like it being offensive for people to come to Temple Square to tell you your religion is wrong, but it is not offensive to send young men out to tell other people their religion is wrong.

It seems to me to be a matter of perspective.

So, is Utah going to pass a marriage ammendment that says marriage is between One man and One woman? or is that betraying the church? How would you feel about Baptists coming in from Georgia to fight for this new Marriage ban?

The bottom line is that if people don't like political reaction to their actions, they should stay out of politics.

Thank you this is a great letter.

I think that the Utah boycott will fail. People will come to Utah for many reasons.

1. They will think the lines are short because everyone went other places.
2. They will be glad that the gay factor will not be around, and they will feel free to bring their kids.
3. It will back lash on california and people will actually avoid it like the plague.

"People like you will apparently just never get the point. No one is telling you that you are wrong for believing in your religion. We are telling you that you are wrong for forcing others to live by your religious beliefs."

Have you looked up the definition of marriage? The first and third definition both state "between a man and a woman." A fourth definition has been added now that states you can qualify it by stating a homosexual marriage. Even this shows that it is different than a traditional marriage.

When will you get the point? No one is stopping you from living your lifestyle. We are just not allowing you to call it marriage. I do not understand why you feel a need to call an orange an apple. It is different. It is not the same as marriage. Why must you force us to accept that they are the same?

re jackhp: No one is forcing religion down your throat. You don't have to do anything you do not want to. Do we not have a right to stand up and say I do not agree with you? Of course we do you just don't like it! From what I have seen those who don't like what just happened with Prop. 8 are acting like a buch of toddlers throwing a tantrum. Total classness I am not impressed!

jackhp is right! You expect us to tolerate you and your beliefs but you cross the line when you try to force those beliefs on me. All the GLBT community wants is equal rights, no more no less. Believe what you want to believe, but in this country, one belief system does not have the right to force those beliefs into legislation. That is immoral in itself. The LDS church and its members along with the other churches have all violated tax laws and have violated seperation of church and state and one day will be held accountable for its actions. Those actions are hurting tens of thousands of GLBT families in California and across the U.S. and now we're told our actions are disgusting. HYPOCRITES!!!!!!!!!! We are not going to take this lying down. We pay our taxes and now we have taxation without representation. The law has been violated here and there will be retribution! You ask us why are we getting involved with something that happened outside of Utah. Again, HYPOCRITES! The constitution is set up to protect the minority from the tryanny of the majority. The LDS church has ....

.... has violated its very own tenants. It has forgotten Christ's teachings of tolerance, non-judgement, love, understanding, and charity. But of course no one recognizes this because they are so brainwashed! They keep telling us "the very elect will be deceived in the last days." Well that surely has happened. But the very elect are the members of the LDS church and its leaders. The LDS church has indeed abandoned its own teachings and God himself. There I said it! The LDS church is now on Satan's side! Satan is the author of hate, bigotry, forcing everyone to live by God's laws, etc. That is what the LDS church and its members have done in California. And don't tell me the LDS church and its members were only a minority in this piece of legislation. The LDS Church and its members donated over $8 million dollars to this campaign. You are all liars and hypocrites! Don't tell us not to be angry, you have taken our rights away and spat upon the constitution! Again, you reap what you sow. The day of retribution is at hand.

The state should get out of the marriage business and leave it to the religious institutions from which it came.

That said, LDS Church members and others who campaigned for and voted for Proposition Eight (a.k.a. Proposition Hate) are guilty of engaging in institutional aggression to deny equal rights for peaceful people.

As "V for Vendetta" reminds us, there is an insidious relationship between clergy and crown.

I agree with the writer. If we allow any two consenting adults to marry, then what's next? A man with multiple wives? A man "marrying" women who are already married to other men? A man "marrying" underaged girls as young as 14? A man "marrying" a mother and her daughter? This is just sick and wrong, and if this were associated with a religion would be the sure sign of a cult!

I think the LDS church's efforts on prop. 8 have dealt a death blow to any Mormon's chance of being a serious presidential contender. Most people in this country are frightened by a group that can effectively vote as a huge block, the reasoning being, that the leaders, of said block, will wield too much power. This fear is especially strong in the religious wing of the GOP. I think, Mitt's, only hope is to run as a more secular candidate in the democratic party. (Lot's of luck on that one!)

It is interesting that the protestors continually talk about rights being taken away, when domestic partnerships already have EVERY right that a married couple has under California law. Prop 8 did not change that. The LDS Church is not against them having rights, they are against the redefinition of marriage. Interestingly, had Prop 8 not passed, we would have seen a loss of rights, the rights of parents and religious institutions. Read an article on NPR called "When Gay Rights and Religious Liberties Clash". So for anyone saying that this is about rights, they are correct but they are incorrect in their understanding of whose rights were at stake. And then we would really see a minority's belief forced on the majority. When it would be taught in schools (as it already has been), when people and institutions can not express their views in a rational manner without being labeled as bigots. I guess that many people think that as long as a value system being forced on others is more permissive, it is okay. A less permissive system should not even be allowed to be mentioned.

The Church is being made an example by a group for whom the barriers to reasonable dissent and personal restraint do not exist. Their answer to prohibitions on homosexual activity is that they simply want our freedom to do as they please is not reasonable. What society fights in its prohibitions of expanded homosexual rights are the extreme behavior that will be shoved into our daily lives until we one day see their grotesque behavior in our streets, shopping centers, and neighborhoods. Witnessing on television the bizarre behavior at one of their San Francisco gay parades is more than close enough.

Jackhp: You are right on, with emphasis.

Randy: Take the wool from your eyes. Our society has been in decline since Bush became president. Two wars, an economy down the drain, many Republican politicians and their friends in prison.

I don't understand: when two people vow to love each other -LOVE - how can that be a negative?

Isn't love is what Christ teaches?

I really wish Prop 8 would have been defeated. I was really looking forward to moving to California to marry my horse. And the poor FLDS followers in Texas could have really used a friendly state like California to move to so that they could marry their 14 year old children off to old men.

Oh well, I guess I have to drag my horse all the way to Massachussetts now. I feel so persecuted.