Deseret News | Reader comments: Hughes denies any wrongdoing

Reader comments
Hughes denies any wrongdoing

Cry me a river | 2:58 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

If the tables were turned Mr. Hughes would be arguing that the timing of the investigation is only determined by how the complaint is processed by the system.

Anonymous | 3:08 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

If you are culpable, investigations and accusations will come up at the most inconvenient times. The answer is not to decry the timing of the allegations, but to ensure you are above reproach so that allegations may not be made.

itsjustme | 3:35 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Democrats everywhere will do anything they can to get a toehold on anything political, that they perceive to give them an advantage. Look at what they are doing to Sarah Palin in Alaska. Anything to smear a Republican, so they don't have to answer for their own misdoings.

Comments continue below

jake | 3:47 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Et tu Brute?
Think about it, those who bully oh so often do not truly know those they call friend. Look around Mr. Huges the people you trust the most are most likely to toss you to the wolves. You do know that you are the designated sacrificial lamb, don't you?

On second thought your friend Curtis is a known good guy, he won't hang you out to dry...

RE: Anonymous @ 3:08 | 3:57 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Well said. Poignantly true.

Bill Keshlear | 4:10 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

It could well be that Riesenï¿½s conduct, instead of being unethical as Karrenberg suggests over and over and over again, was required by Riesenï¿½s oath of office and principles of transparency and accountability in government. Shouldn't we protect whistleblowers from retaliation (Utah Code, Section 67-21-3)?

Although the committee seems to have sacrificed rights of Utahns to see for themselves what their state government is up to, Riesen has not forfeited his First Amendment rights.

There obviously are many factors involved in filing the complaint, some completely beyond the control of any single person - such as the availability of information and the coordination of multiple schedules of busy people.

In any event, there's no timing requirement for filing a complaint and itï¿½s not unethical to have a political motivation.

RE itsjustme | 4:19 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

I love how you can ignore the fact that there have been ethics violations and call it a political tactic.

People like you who will vote blindly are becoming very old and tired - even in Utah.

So far... | 5:14 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

all the above comments are political in nature. Hughes is guilty per the democrats, Reisen is per the republicans. Let's let the process work first, shall we.

Anonymous | 5:16 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Anon 3:08,

You can't be serious. Based on your philosophy, why bother even having jury trials? The accused are automatically guilty by your standards.

And Bill Keshlear, thanks for admitting that this is political.

Me | 5:26 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Vote ALL the bums out!

Who Represents Whom | 5:33 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

The Utah Constitution provides for a General Counsel to the Utah Legislature. Greg Hughes, Phil Riesen, and Sheryl Allen each have their own private attorney before this committee.

It looks like Sheryl Allen and Susan Lawrence consulted with the Attorney General's office concerning the alleged bribe.

So, where is the Legislative General Counsel in all of this? Do they represent anybody? Everybody? Nobody?

A little misquote | 6:15 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

"REPUBLICANS everywhere will do anything they can to get a toehold on anything political, that they perceive to give them an advantage. Look at what they are doing to Barak Obama. Anything to smear a Democrat, so they don't have to answer for their own misdoings."

Both parties are corrupt. The Republicans always attack public education with policies like No Child Left Behind (NCLB), and private school vouchers, and here in Utah by saying the IB Program is anti-American and that we are idiots for questioning their logic when we disobey. The Democrats have their own sore spots into deviancy. I'll let others elaborate on their evils.

However, it is what we got. It was unethical IF Hughes offered compensation for a Voucher vote. That does not matter if he has a R or D by his name, it is still against the rules for one legislator to offer or intimidate another in order to get a vote.

It is not unethical to report this. Curtis should have done it, not Reisen. However it isn't an ethics question, rather a procedural one.

Barnum was right! | 6:46 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

A sucker born every minute. Let's forget the felony charges & misdirect the focus as to the timing. Even the most loyal Hughes supporters have got to see through this sorry defense!

I've had it | 7:48 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

So let's all continue to vote for Republicans so we can see more of this "stuff" in the news the next 2 years.

After all, the "R" is more sacred in Utah than whether a person is ethical, has morals or can do the job he or she is elected to do. Utahns would vote for PeeWee Herman if he had a 'R' next to his name.

Draper | 8:23 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

To Barnum was right: Unfortunately, the fans of Greg Hughes do not see through his sorry defense. They actually support him and have put signs all over Draper proclaiming their devotion. They are imbeciles with bad judgment and are as nasty as he is. Of course, OJ Simpson also has unethical morons following him, too.

C.W. | 8:46 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Even if they find that Hughes has done A LOT WRONG, nothing will be done to him because HE'S A REPUBLICAN!
Theres no such thing as ethics in the Utah legislature and I thought everyone knew that!
The issue of "ethics reform" has come up time and again in the state legislature and the Republican majority makes sure that it never even makes it out of committee!
"Ethics" violations in Utah - always - anything ever come of it - NEVER!

Utah Politics is Corrupt | 8:59 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Both the Dems and Reps in this state are shamefully corrupt. It is just like southern state politics out here in the west! It is truly disgusting.

I live in Draper, home of Greg Hughes, and while I realize this is a state-level situation, I have to say it really isn't much different than what is going on in our city council. Our city council "people," everyone of them, is only interested in their own wealth and benefit. They vote based on how it will impact them personally, not on what is best for the city or a particular neighborhood.

The exact same thing is going on at the state level. They call it "part of the political game" but in truth it is part of "what is best for me and my family."

Anonymous | 9:04 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

Until voters take accountability then we deserve the corruption that exists. If you vote blindly for anyone just because of their political party then you are bound to have corruption. Time and time again we have seen that you can't allow any political party to have unchecked power.

Don't try to compare this to Govenor Palin. She is unqualified and her campaign rhetoric has been distasteful.

BAAAAAAAAAAA | 9:06 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

And we wonder why Utah's reputation is so bad...how many national businesses have been scared away by the blind sheep mentality?

BAAAAAAAAAAA

What??? | 10:40 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

I just don't get it. If Hughes has done all these things (and knowing him I suspect he has) then what difference does it make if it came out months ago or now? Guilt is not dependant on time. It is or it isn't. There are those on this ethics committee who have been super buddies with Hughes. So, how come they don't recuse themselves? Again, I just don't get it. Methinks we are being bamboozled.

Anonymous | 11:01 p.m. Oct. 13, 2008

BAAAAAAAAAAA, I work in both Utah and California. You are lucky we have the legislature we do in Utah. No debt. Their biggest sin is a good chunk are those dirty, nasty, ugly Republicans.

Well California Democrats took ethics to a new low years ago. And California businesses who care about ethics and don't care about beach, parties and taxes are fleeing in droves. Then there is the Republicrat Terminator who is trying to borrow about 7 billion from the taxpayers of other states.

So Democrats, me thinks to protestest too much.

Anonymous | 12:06 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Phil Riesen is a disgrace to the Utah Legislature. That dirty scumbag should be the one under investigation immediately prior to an election. Phil Riesen is a dishonest, sleazy politician doing his best to take out the more conservative Republicans, without even a nod to integrity or factual accuracy. Phil Riesen is arguably the most hardcore extreme leftist in the legislature, and if today were 1798, he would be suffering severe abdominal pains due to pitchforks.

Sideline | 6:26 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Why is it that David Irvine is in the middle of every punitive measure against voucher supporters? Walker, right before a primary; Hughes, right before an election..... Yea, this isn't politically motivated and the ethical UEA has nothing to do with this .... Right.

EdM | 6:31 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

I am amazed at the comments of people here both pro-Hughes and anti-Hughes. Let's just say that this letter was NEVER leaked in the first place. Why would Lawrence, who is out of office, relate to ANYONE what took place if what took place was NEVER going to be investigated? Blame Riesen all you want for leaking the letter. I thank him AND Rep. Allen for pushing for reform, knowing full well it could cost them THEIR re-elections as well. As for Speaker Curtis and for Rep. Hughes....I hope they are voted out of office. Yes, I am voting for McCain in November so please don't play the R or D card with me. Oh, I am also a born-again Republican. Thanks, and let's have a nice day playing "nice" with each other, could we?

James | 6:38 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Anonymous @ 12:06 AM: I hate to tell you this, but all politicians are a disgrace. It does not matter whether they are right or left they are the scum of the earth.

Constitution | 6:39 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

For all those who believe in the US and state constitution, the problem here is not the Ds or the Rs, the problem is the lack of checks and balance. When one party (any party) controls all three branches of government and holds private meetings to decide issues, our constitutional form of government is compromised. The Rs have owned the legislature, the governors mansion and they appoint the judges (some who have been leaders in the Rs party) for the last 30 years. The Ds did it before that and it has never worked well.

The don't murmur against your church leaders does NOT apply to your political leaders, they should be questioned by the press, by the people and by each other in a public forum, not behind closed doors with oaths of secrecy. Freedom of the press was another constitutional check and balance.

Whether we like it or not, we need at least two parties controlling Utah. We have not seen any party have a chance except the Ds and Rs in my lifetime. I support the Ds on this one issue alone, until they control at least one house in at least one branch of government.

Brad | 6:54 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Someone needs to do an investigation into the Davis Education Association. Didn't Allen work there?

Anonymous | 7:10 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

"Democrats everywhere will do anything they can to get a toehold on anything political, that they perceive to give them an advantage. Look at what they are doing to Sarah Palin in Alaska. Anything to smear a Republican, so they don't have to answer for their own misdoings."

Hah hah! Sorry dude: Sarah Palin has done this to her self.

And don't forget the Legislature that authorized the investigation, and the investigation committee both have a strong Repub majority.

No, this was her own doing. (but good try!)

Check out the Anchorage Daily News (AK's biggest paper) editorial today.

It just gets worse | 7:12 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

So now Rep. Allen says that Curtis offered her ethics reform in exchange for her not filing any more ethics complaints.

It sounds like the quid pro quo just goes on and on. When will it ever stop?

Look for the Truth | 7:32 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

This is what happens when one party is in power they do not start out corrupt but they end up getting corrupt!
We need to make sure we have a around a 45 to 50% mix to keep them honest!

If it was not for Phil Reisen bringing this out into the open you would not have heard anything about it! Thank You Phil!
That is why all meeting should be open to the public to keep from having the good old boy mentality!!

The Republican majority would have sweep it under the rug again!

Come on Utah wake up quit being sheep and following
the republican party over the cliff!!!

JMT | 7:36 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

More than anything I am shocked at the ignorance of these comments.

Utah has appointed judges from among their own leaders? I've worked around the State legislature for almost 20 years now, can name you almost every legislator, Dept head, county commissioner, etc and cannot name a single one that was appointed a judge. Who are you referring to?

Whether Hughes is guilty or not anytime you have a complaint that is 2 years old, it involves people who have won elections, the timing is political. Period.

And the guilt. How many who have posted here have ever been to the legislature while in session? The halls are literally packed on many days, 90% of them being lobbyists. Look at the donations. Every one of them is a result of how the legislator voted, or the lobbyists hopes they will vote.

And how many times do you guess special interest groups promised election support for a Yes or No vote? Do you think people donate just for fun? Are you naive? And now apparently Greg Hughes has had a similar conversation as that which has gone on for 200 years now, and he is guilty?

Seriousily?

Utah Republican | 7:39 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

I'm a republican and I think that Hughes should resign!

Mark in Draper | 8:37 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Greg Hughes is an embarrassment to the Republican Party in Utah. His actions are inexcusable. I hope the people of his district in Draper can clearly see his shameless unethical conduct and vote him out of office on Nov. 4.

Draper Voter | 8:49 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

I for one do not like the ethical taint on this topic. I feel there should be much more disclosure to monies recieved by these political rock stars. I will not vote for Hughes, whether or not it was a bribe. After all he implied that she could get campaign contributions by voting against her values. Hughes, however is not the most guilty politician in Utah. They are on all sides.

I know Susan | 8:58 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

The comments attributed to Hughes indicate a significant ability to rationalize the obvious. Susan has high ethical standards and would not have even discussed the situation with Rep. Allen if she had not felt that it was inappropriate. Susan did have a difficult race. It is very likely that Hughes and PCE knew this and felt she might be 'persuaded' to change her position. If it looks like a duck......

Mavericks | 9:09 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Mavericks break the rules. On Wall Street. In Alaska. In Utah.

"Vote for a maverick and watch America fall apart," is a compelling campaign slogan.

Utah Democrat | 9:17 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Regardless of the outcome of this investigation we will still have questions about the corruption of our legislators.

Democrats and Republicans need to press their legislators to support real ethics reform, if they do not commit to real reform DO NOT VOTE FOR THEM.

Ban Gifts
Limits on contributions from PACï¿½s, Corporations & individuals
Defined uses of campaign contributions
Independent Non Partisan Ethics Commission

randy | 10:33 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

and what is the problem here ?? this is business as usual folks ... did you ever think your heart determined how you made decisions ?? especially in politics money is the golden rule (those with the gold make the rules)

we the utah voters are the stupid ones .. we keep putting incumbents back in office so they can continue their power struggle at our expense

remember .. incumbents out ... challengers in

why the comments on this article ??

the checks and balance system has always been in politics .. got a check ?? put it on my balance

as for the ethics .. money has always been the bottom line for decision making ... money talks regardless the position or concern

we the stupid people of utah keep the insanity alive by continuing to elect the same people over and over

lets get it this time utah .. vote out the current person (incumbent) and vote in the challenger and maybe the cycle has a chance of breaking (notice i havent said anything about party)??

Anonymous | 10:58 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Never re-elect anyone!!!!

Mark | 11:47 a.m. Oct. 14, 2008

The only way to stop the corruption is to put an end to the money sloshing around in our system. Lobbying and campaign/election laws are the areas that need the most attention.

Val | 12:24 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

To Sideline: Why do you consider David Irvine's, involvement to represent his client, Rep Sheryl Allen, in her sworn testimony before a legislative committee, as being a "ï¿½punitive measure against voucher supportersï¿½" Rep. Sheryl Allen was called (did not volunteer) to testify before the committee and David Irvine was fulfilling his responsibility, as entitled under our system of government, as her attorney/advisor at this hearing. The fact that David Irvine shares the same political viewpoint as his client regarding vouchers has no bearing on her testimony before this committee or his role as her legal counsel. Rep Allen's testimony was not motivated by the voucher issue. She was called to testify, under oath, as to her knowledge/involvement of the events surrounding the original charge submitted before the committee by former Rep Susan Lawrence.

Val | 12:47 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

To Brad (6:54am): Why does someone need to investigate the Davis Education Association? What bearing do the actions of the DEA have on this hearing regarding whether Rep Hughes did, or did not, violate Utah House Ethics Standards? As to Rep Allen's association, the answer is yes ï¿½ at one time, she was associated with the DEA. She was also past President and a Board Member of Davis County Schools, and currently is Foundation Director for the Davis County School District. But to reiterate, this has nothing to do with whether Rep Hughes, or possibly others, violated House Ethics Standards.

JMT | 1:54 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Val, I would be very interested to have both a financial and performance audit done of the Davis Foundation. It could be very interesting to see Rep Allen's compensation versus her work schedule.

Nationwide there has been several cases, always brushed under the rug, of entities with interests before government agencies to employee elected officials.

I know that Rep Allen worked at the Davis Foundation prior to her election though it would be interesting to see what has taken place while she works both within public education and for the legislature.

Possibly this should be a threshold for all legislators. I remember one legislator who worked for a bank, received very good compensation and was rumored to do little to no actual work. Yet when the banks and credit unions got into a legislative fight this legislator was 110% for the banks.

With a job performance audit with published results voters could see if the legislator happened to work for the entity or if they were simply a way for the entity to buy a vote on capitol hill.

Interesting idea.

hues and cries | 2:07 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

Ask yourself this. If Greg Hughes came upon a letter in October from a democrat accusing his democratic opponent of bribery, would he sit on it until after the election, or release it to the media immediately?

RE Annonymous 10:58 am | 2:24 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

No kidding. Lets rethink our state, local and national term limits. We don't have to make a law, just VOTE.

Greg | 2:59 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

was the big pusher of the Vouchers with friend Curtis.

This thing gets worse by the date, now alligations comming forward. We all know this is full of ethics and bad tast.

Lets ouster Curtis and Greg Hughes!

Val | 4:37 p.m. Oct. 14, 2008

To JMT: As for that kind of data (financial & performance), you would have to get it from the Foundation. As for her work ethic on the Utah Hill, during the legislative session and off-session legislative commitments, she has not been loafing. You can check this out by going to the state legislative website. It mentions her kudo's from various organizations (many not related to education) and you can examine her submitted legislation and compare it to others in the House and the Senate, along with which bills successfully passed both chambers and were signed by the Governor, not to mention her many committee assignments. But there is no question that she is pro-public education and she makes no bones about it (her B.S. and M.S. degrees are in education and administration). This position runs counter to many of the constituents in her district, but she is a very effective legislator and she keeps winning elections by significant margins in her conservative-leaning district (Bountiful 19).

Constitution | 6:39 a.m. Oct. 15, 2008

THe Wasatch County Republican Chair was given a position as a state judge. I am sure there are more. The real power is not in the courtroom, or the capitol it is in the party. That is the problem. The people, not the party should run our government.

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