i have known polygamist women---i have seen generally happy people but with a tendency to secrecy---i have also seen solemn curiosity about the way i and my family lived---i think that polygamy itself is probably as much a personal choice as any other life style if it is lived by informed adults---as such i think that just raising the marrying age to 18 is not enough---there also needs to be some method of education in those closed communities to provide real choice to their members; whether that is seminars, more tv or internet, or requirements for outside living prior to marriage---i personally do not feel that God wants that lifestyle for us in America but recognize there are several other lifestyle choices that are not supported by God either as our prophets have let us know---i have always considered that critical thinking combined with high standards and self discipline would bring us all closer to a better world and polygamy per se need not be a detriment

I don't believe there are any happy women in polygamy. I believe there are a lot of women who are living in denial because they really have no other choice.

Polygamy is immoral and degrading to women.

This whole organization makes we want to THROW UP.

I'm tired of reading about this small sect of backwood hillbilies from Hildale. I'm tired of every polygamist posting every time an article appears. They want to withdraw from society, and at the same time influence society to support them. They break rank with the LDS church, then expect help from them when they need it. Please go away! You are an embarrassment to every westerner! Please intermarry, you gene pool is really stale.

Sad to read that some are so irritated that they find it necessary to become rude and downright un-Christian. The 6:41 a.m. poster, I hope, never considers themself a Christian.
I know 1 polygamist family quite well. It is very basic to say that the make-up of that family is obviously (to everyone except to themselves) a self-defeated, deceptive group of 5 origional wives and 30 children who were origionally blind to the FACT that 1 man cannot support nor be a "father" to that many children. So, at the onset, this group has purposely produced children as fast as possible and leaves it up to "cleverness" and young mothers to do a fathers` job of SUPPORTING. That and gov`t deception (food stamps, etc).
The lifestyle is perpetuated by isolating the children and "accepted" paternal elevation (to the point of rediculousness).
Adult polygamy should be a choice, in my opinion, as long as the FATHER can support TOTALLY the family without "brainwashed" very young women carrying the financial burden.......At present (and during the past), the men "ran the show" for their OWN benefit and spiritual "advancement".
I wish the best for all polygamist children. Sad.

It is not choice or preference for or against polygmy, It is an obidience to the commandment of God as revealed to the prophet Joseph Smith. If it were not for the persecution of the gentiles and the abuse of some unjust men and a few husbands polygmy is the best family way to live a happy and complete life in accordance with God's law for the well being of man.

Cats comment and the one by polygamy dominating headlines makes me want to throw up. I consider one of the founding members of Principle Voices a very good friend. I am "Mainstream LDS" but that doesn't prevent me from respecting her choice to live her beliefs. I wonder if all these sanctimonious "Christians" would tolerate Abraham and the other prophets, including Joseph Smith if they were alive today. I love the Prophet Joseph, but that doesn't stop me from knowing that what he said publicly in Nauvoo--denying plural marriage existed, did not prevent him from privately practicing a celestial principle. And yes it is still an eternal principle, even though not currently sanctioned by the Church. LDS -- re-read Section 132. Stop blanketing all fundamentalists with the same brush--anybody remember the Golden Rule out there? I know there are happy women in the principle. Allow them the same courtesy you would like accorded yourself.

While I do not support polygamy, to treat everyone equal we would have to apply the same test to everyone for the FATHER to be able to support TOTALLY his family as suggested by Pat at 7:34.

One of the great problems faced in our society (in my opinion) is fathers who do not have the long-term committment to their families. I certainly don't have the answer, but the number of single mothers who need public assistance to even survive testifys to the problem.

The father's support of his family is not always limited to financial either. It seems in many areas, the motto must be "IF THE GOIN GETS ROUGH - GET GOIN !"

While the article is about pologamy, some of the same problems that we critize of that lifestyle certainly be problems for others as well.

I hope that we can find the right solutions to encourage proper family relationships.

"the well being of man." What about the well being of woman?

Some of the arguments sound familiar to those pushing the gay-lifestyle 30 years ago.

Here's how it should go. . .

When the polygamists go to congress to voice their views. . . ARREST THEM - TAKE THEM TO COURT - CONVICT THEM - PUT THEM IN PRISON!!!

Boy, you'd see this whole thing die down like a bucket of water on a camp fire.

Nuf said!

In the book "Sex & Reason" by Richard Posner, the author offers the argument that polygamy has been outlawed because these large polygamous clans threaten the power and authority of government.

In a free country, I like the government's power and authority to be threatened.

I've known many polygamists and some are good folks, some not so good.

So long as one isn't harming anyone else, the government should leave them alone (in the meantime, it's understandable why they would be secretive, given the laws punishing polygamists).

How is it that the church believes the Prophet Joseph Smith's revelation for polygmy was a true commandment of God, but now they say that later church presidents received instructions to stop polygmy. This seems strange, it puts a limitation on God's capacity to see future events, when He gave Joseph Smith the revelation if it were for only a time He would have revealed to Joseph Smith that it was for a short time only. So who is in error: God, Joseph Smith, todays church leaders; who are we to believe. Is the church just giving in to the Gentiles.

Out of the 1000's of plyg families, there are probably less than 1 dozen that are
1. Self sufficient (the father makes enough money to care for all of his wives and children with out the need for any state aid)
2. The wives were all of age and entered the relationship willing and un-coerced(no "placements" by the profit)
That's it, the other 99% are 1. poor (lying and deceiving to recieve aid to support themeselves and thier children) 2. "placed" into the marriage 3. Follow a false profit (convicted pedaphile) 4. Lack basic educational skills 5. Controlled and manipulated by men

Prinicple voices - I think you should put your efforts into helping these women in children that are stuck, trapped, in abusive arrangements instead of pushing for an agenda that really cannot be pulled off financially by the average American family

I, too, am tired of the immoral polygamist headlines. Since when did adultery become such important news? These people are sex maniacs, sex abusers, and need to be all rounded up and thrown into the nearest jail along with their goofy prophet. I'm truly tired of feeling sick at my stomach everyday while reading the news and looking at their repulsive pictures. Rotten worms!

Re leave the polys alone,---as long as they are not harming anyone?

What planet are you from? The Flds polygamist learn to abuse from day ONE! Their cult is a SEX cult. Women are brainwashed from the time they are babies to believe they are here only to serve for a mans purpose and to be sexual abuse from the time they are children on up. One thing about the polygamist columns, within the news, you can get a chance to read the comments of the most stupid people who were ever born into this world. A bunch of duh nothings!

Pat, Christianity never requires the acceptance of sin. Please think before you post next time.

It's prophet not profit, otherwise you made some good points. My LDS prophet never would tell me to break any laws...these fake fundamentalists think they have to break this one law...which leads to breaking other laws and mooching off the welfare system. I'm glad that they are trying to raise the marriage age to 18 and I hope they can all stick to that. In the ancient bible days and in ancient LDS polygamy, the men had to be able to totally support the wives. I know because my great great great grandfather was a wealthy business man and married two sisters that were in their twenties who would not have had a chance to marry otherwise. When the word came from the prophet to end polygamy, he still supported the wives but all of his children married only one wife or husband. These so called fundamentalists are in a state of defiance and apostasy. When are they going to realize this?

Let's say, for the sake of argument, a social group formed and polygamy was proclaimed legal. Also the argument used to legalize it was so persuasive that it could not be denied in any society, and was now universally accepted throughout the world. If that were the case would the LDS Church change its stance on its doctrine? I think before this can be asked, one needs to have a clear understanding of how polygamy functions in this day and age. Marriage is ordained of God. The Church, in my view, is not going to do anything to permit or allow the degradation of the family or the institution of marriage. We need to know where polygamy, in its present form, is heading and not be deluded into thinking that just because someone utters the words "polygamy" that it is the same institution which formed in the days of the Church be it modern or ancient; and that it is simply the term 'polygamy' that makes it holy--like a magic of some sort. The Church has made its doctrine very clear.

The FLDS live an anarchist lifestyle, sequestered away from the normal population in order to hide the what they "believe" is a required religious practice. In this country, polygamy is illegal.

To futher complicate things, it's morally degrading and freedom suppressing to deprive the women of this sect from a proper education, marry very young women to much older men after suppressing their education to know any different (Taliban?), perpetrate the same crimes again unto the next generation, fail to properly father their sons - many of whom have been evicted from the sect to avoid competition.

The FLDS has missed one of the most fundamental beliefs Joseph Smith advocated, and that was to uphold the laws of the land. Polygamy aside, I find it repulsive that FLDS men marry girls aged 11-18. Those girls are deprived of their freedoms before they even understand what freedom is. Those poor girls are not aware they are breaking the law.

The basis of most religions is obedience to God. What about lying, slavery, child abuse, deception, and theft? What about a parent's obligation to all of their children?

Some FLDS are no doubt nice people, but polygamy is still wrong.

I would like to point out again that Joseph Smith NEVER taught that plural marriage was required for the celestrial kingdom. Neither did Brigham Young.

If you read your Book of Mormon you will find that "many wives" is defined as an abomination before God. It is only to be practiced when "commanded by God." That Commandment was withdrawn in 1890.

I feel terribly sorry for these people. Enabling them and accepting their behavior does not help them or the children that are also being victimized.

I repeat: Polygamy is illegal, immoral and degrading to women, not to mention all the other illegal activities that typically accompany the practice. The fact that "Maintstream LDS" thinks this illegal behavior should be tolerated makes me want to THROW UP SOME MORE.

To Taft: We don't know that the Lord DIDN'T tell Joseph Smith that it was for a short time only. Many (I would venture to say most) of the revelations Joseph Smith received were not recorded. I think it is highly probable that Joseph did know that it would only be for a short time until the purpose was fulfilled.

Joseph Smith counseled the people to "stay with the main body of the Church. That is where the truth will be." He foresaw that there would be a lot of these little splinter groups that would try to claim authority. HE WAS WARNING THE PEOPLE NOT TO BE DECEIVED. Unfortunately, many are.

I need educating on a very important subject.

Why do polygamous women resort to criminal activity by defrauding the food stamp and social services programs of both the State and Federal governments?

Why do polygamous law enforcement and polygamous judicial courts don't interface with County and State law enforcement and judicial systems, but act as a law totally unto themselves?

Why do the men of polygamous sects are determined to not step forward and speak for themselves instead of hiding behind the skirts of their multiple wives?

Why don't the polygamous communities, their leaders and residents simply admit that wrong has taken place, clean it up, and set checks and balances in place to make sure such things don't happen again, and when they do that consequences are swift and sure.

And lastly, why doesn't the Mormon Church squarely admit and accept that these break off polygamous sects are part of its history, doing and culture, just like the many break offs of other foundational Christian, Islamic, Judaic, Hindu and Buddhistic religions have seen as part of their ongoing history?

So the Mormon Church has break off polygamous sects... the Mormon Church itself is not its sects, but itsOwn UniqueSelf.

Who are the gentiles, are mormons gentiles or are people of utah gentiles if not are they jews, do the gentiles not like the mormons, if so why.

re - Ruby 2:14pm

the gentiles are the people that are gentile to their children and treat them gentiley. If you would ge gentile to everyone and kind to everyone, there wuld be no problems.

It's important to treat women gentiley since they may be fragile and you should treat fragile things like women and children gentiley.

And yes, most jews are gentile, as most people are gentile, and should be and that's a good thing. Only people like Willie Jessop are not gentile to others, and many FLDS men are not gentile to their families. They should be gentile, though, since it is the right thing to do. Being gentile to others is a good thing.

Understand? Are you gentile? I would hope so - it's better than being the opposite, which is mean and rude and rough-treating.

I liked the homophone swap: profit for prophet. It fits.

NEVER commanded, polygamy. Where do you people get that, from?? Just because polygamy was practised in the O.T. by Abraham, etc. does not mean that God commanded it. If it were so, then God MUST HAVE commanded slavery.
One man...one woman, that was the ratio...from the beginning of creation. In the N.T. Jesus re-affirms it.
.

I am outraged that a group would think only one person can hear God's whisper! I have been in many situations where I feel something on my heart and just have to act on it. God chose to use me as a vessel in those situations. God doesn't just choose women to breed but He also can use them for His will in other situations. How dare anyone try and stand between God and the vessel He chose.
As good ole Willie says "We don't believe their evidence is credible." "We don't believe they obtained it legally, but we'll stand up in court and face the allegations," he said. "We believe in our innocence." What does that say about 1 of the ten commandments? Dah! Let's see he is admitting that they are guilty by just stating the evidenced isn't credible! Wow! Keep talking Willie you make me laugh! :)The way he openly admits the only defense they have is to fight against the evidence. Standing on one leg will get tiring. They believe in their innocence! Give me a break after that statement. I think these parents should even be in trouble for lack of education for their children!