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Readers' forum: Rocky is anti-LDS Church
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Jayson | 9:47 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
Well Slade seeing as how I spent 19 years growing up in Utah and now live in
California I have one question for you. Are you just plain down right ignorant?
You talk about such an intolerant place filled with crap jobs and yet people
still keep moving there to make it their home because of the fact that this
Mormon culture you obviously just love and adore fosters family values. Not
only that, but it fosters individual accountability and responsibilty. Not to
mention the emphasis on bettering oneself through education and hard work. But
you probably completely missed that in your reading up on the poor dumb
Mormons....
Rocky Anderson like most politicians is only capable of seeing things from one side of the aisle. However when it comes to open mindedness he is just as close minded as everyone he attacks.
Rocky Anderson like most politicians is only capable of seeing things from one side of the aisle. However when it comes to open mindedness he is just as close minded as everyone he attacks.
Non LDS Making Utah Home | 10:22 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
I would agree that the members in Utah are different from the members out of
state. However, it breaks my heart to see that the principles of the church is
judged by individual actions. We all have our FREE AGENCY to act as we please.
So dont judge the church on a select few individuals who truly do not exemplify
the principles of the church.
I think we all have the common goal of wanting what is fair and safe for our community. Lets not be a victim of judging an organization (the LDS Church), for the actions of its FREE AGENTS. Dont forget the many good things that the Church has done throughout the world in relief efforts.
I think we all have the common goal of wanting what is fair and safe for our community. Lets not be a victim of judging an organization (the LDS Church), for the actions of its FREE AGENTS. Dont forget the many good things that the Church has done throughout the world in relief efforts.
Comments continue below
Jann | 10:25 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
I am lds and lived in SLC area for 16 years before I got married and moved back
to Nebraska where I was raised. At the time, DeeDee was mayor and every one
seemed to be upset with her antics to. As far as Utah is concerned, it is a very
beautiful state and I have several really good friends that I have not seen in
years. The town where I live the lds population is of course, the minority and
where I work people seem to have a problem with the church because they chose
not to understand it and believe alot of the nonsense that goes around. I work
at a state mental hospital and in my opinion it is not a place condusive to talk
about religion. I try my best to live my beliefs but I am not perfect and
neither is anyone else. I always got along really well with non members when I
lived in Salt lake. I had a good friend who was catholic and we always had a
joke between us that she wouldnt convert me to catholism and I woundnt convert
her to mormonism and we got along real well. We had a close relationship and I
lost track of her long time ago. Utah was very ugly when it was settled by the
saints but after all the persecution in other areas it was better for them to be
left to there own constraints where they could practice there beliefs. Who cares
what religion rocky or mitt is . I just vote for the person that I think can do
the best job. People back here are very friendly and they wave when you drive
down the street even if they dont know you. I dont many places like that.
Keith R | 10:29 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
Much of Utah's growth has been because of the influence of the LDS church
in the state. Rocky Anderson is nothing more than an ACLU leftist. Some should
be seen, not heard.
Regina R | 10:38 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
Rocky, move to San Francisco. As an ACLU lawyer, you will be successful there.
Rick in Kearns | 10:56 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
The leaders of most religeons, as is the case with those of the
"Mormon" church, often do, and will continue to do and say those thing
which they feel stongly about. The leaders of the "Mormon" church have
the same rights as those of any of you, to make their feelings known! They have
a right to make statements about their beliefs! America is suppose to be a land
of religeous freedom!!
The "Mormon" church does not and will not tell anyone how to vote, or who to vote for! Every election time statements are issued telling members (and any others willing to listen) to study out the issues/candidates for themselves, and to make their/our own best decisions!
The church leaders want that which is best for ALL of humanity (whether you believe them or not) not just what is best for the church.
To be so narrow minded as to think that a truely religeous group is only interested it its own agenda is just that - NARROW MINDED!
I read all of the earlier comments in this topic, why so much negativism? Why not be realistic and allow one another their own opinion? After all as I said earlier, America (and yes Utah is part of America) is suppose to be a land of freedom!
Rocky has his right to make a fool out of himself if that is his desire. It is too bad that his actions unfortunately reflect so badly on the city and the state!
I am a "Mormon" and proud of it! I have friends of other religeons, color, cultures and ethnicities! We get along fine because we RESPECT each other!
As the LDS leaders have admonished, study out the issues and vote according to your own commitments and concience, religeous or otherwise.
The "Mormon" church does not and will not tell anyone how to vote, or who to vote for! Every election time statements are issued telling members (and any others willing to listen) to study out the issues/candidates for themselves, and to make their/our own best decisions!
The church leaders want that which is best for ALL of humanity (whether you believe them or not) not just what is best for the church.
To be so narrow minded as to think that a truely religeous group is only interested it its own agenda is just that - NARROW MINDED!
I read all of the earlier comments in this topic, why so much negativism? Why not be realistic and allow one another their own opinion? After all as I said earlier, America (and yes Utah is part of America) is suppose to be a land of freedom!
Rocky has his right to make a fool out of himself if that is his desire. It is too bad that his actions unfortunately reflect so badly on the city and the state!
I am a "Mormon" and proud of it! I have friends of other religeons, color, cultures and ethnicities! We get along fine because we RESPECT each other!
As the LDS leaders have admonished, study out the issues and vote according to your own commitments and concience, religeous or otherwise.
UtahBornNRaised | 11:46 p.m. Sept. 2, 2007
Dear Mr. Decker,
I agree that Rocky is clearly anti LDS. However, the comment that "he believes LDS is the worst thing to happen to Salt Lake City" is funny since SLC exists because the saints settled it and made it what it is. I'm thinking it's the other way around...ROCKY'S the worst thing to come to SLC, the bigot. I say vote him out and get someone in with an open mind.
I agree that Rocky is clearly anti LDS. However, the comment that "he believes LDS is the worst thing to happen to Salt Lake City" is funny since SLC exists because the saints settled it and made it what it is. I'm thinking it's the other way around...ROCKY'S the worst thing to come to SLC, the bigot. I say vote him out and get someone in with an open mind.
Goodbye, Utah :( | 12:07 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
So much to say, not enough space...
Having just moved back to Utah after 10 years in Seattle, I'm sick to my stomach. I was told that Utah has changed, that the "member/non-Member" rift has all but vanished. We've only been here 3 months and have already been ostracized by 2 of our neighbors once they discovered we weren't in the "club". It's truly sad that this goes on here. After living in Seattle, witnessing a thriving and successful community filled with people of all cultures and religious beliefs (who don't even ask...or care what their neighbor or coworker believes), I am very disheartened to read these comments. They have put my worst fears into black and white text. The rift does still exist, even in "Quin's" subtle and unintended comment "we treated him as our own" (referring to a non-Member). How would he be treated if they knew otherwise?
My husband and I have come to the sad conclusion that we cannot raise our baby boy here after all. This is not the kind of community that we had hoped it would be. I'm especially sad because my entire LDS family lives here and will not truly understand our reasons for leaving again.
A devout LDS cousin once told me, "We Mormons live in a sheltered, small world...and we like it that way. We don't want to know what happens outside of our bubble." I am fully aware that he speaks for himself, but I still have to wonder...
On a side note, every non-Mormon I've asked about Rocky has said he's the best thing that's ever happened to Salt Lake. Are there any non-Mormons who are anti-Rocky, and vice versa? Is this a tell-tale pattern? Just curious.
Having just moved back to Utah after 10 years in Seattle, I'm sick to my stomach. I was told that Utah has changed, that the "member/non-Member" rift has all but vanished. We've only been here 3 months and have already been ostracized by 2 of our neighbors once they discovered we weren't in the "club". It's truly sad that this goes on here. After living in Seattle, witnessing a thriving and successful community filled with people of all cultures and religious beliefs (who don't even ask...or care what their neighbor or coworker believes), I am very disheartened to read these comments. They have put my worst fears into black and white text. The rift does still exist, even in "Quin's" subtle and unintended comment "we treated him as our own" (referring to a non-Member). How would he be treated if they knew otherwise?
My husband and I have come to the sad conclusion that we cannot raise our baby boy here after all. This is not the kind of community that we had hoped it would be. I'm especially sad because my entire LDS family lives here and will not truly understand our reasons for leaving again.
A devout LDS cousin once told me, "We Mormons live in a sheltered, small world...and we like it that way. We don't want to know what happens outside of our bubble." I am fully aware that he speaks for himself, but I still have to wonder...
On a side note, every non-Mormon I've asked about Rocky has said he's the best thing that's ever happened to Salt Lake. Are there any non-Mormons who are anti-Rocky, and vice versa? Is this a tell-tale pattern? Just curious.
Love these comments | 12:13 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
They remind me that many non-Mormons stay in Utah despite the supposed
oppression of the Mormon Church and alleged bigotry of its members precisely
because it makes them feel better to have a Big, Bad, Mormon Boogeyman to blame
all their problems on.
ALRP | 1:59 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
To complain about UTAH being LDS dominated is stupid and ignorant. That is just
like some one moving to the country and griping about the farm odors. I was born
& raised in Utah and am LDS I chose to live in the midwest as a result of
employment, & as such still live here even after retirement. I love Utah
& still believe it is a great state. If one does not like there elected
officials vote them out. This is a free country and we have free speech. It is
apparent some people have to much free time on their hands with nothing better
to do gripe,therefore get a life.
Plain and Simple | 5:25 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Thanks for posting my comment. Looks like you cant handle the truth your
selves. How pathetic. Whats the point of this silly comment section if you
cant use freedom of speech.
Plain and Simple
Plain and Simple
Rose | 6:15 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
If I have my history correct the LDS church settled Salt Lake City. Would you
want someone to come into your home and start rearranging all the furniture???
Dry south | 8:17 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Your mayor thinks Utah is the only state in the union that regulates alcohol.
He should travel a little. He would find that there are dry counties throughout
the south and parts of the midwest. I moved to MS six years ago from SLC. It
is much more difficult to buy alcohol here in MS than it is in Utah. Although,
I do not drink, I am familiar with the liquor laws in the south. Cities and
counties each have the power to regulate alcohol. The county I live in is a dry
county. However, the major city within that county is wet. The city does not
allow the sale of alcohol on Sundays. It only allowed the sale of cold beer two
years ago. The board recently voted to allow the sale of alcohol until 1:00 am
on week nights when the local college football team has a home game. So Rocky
needs to get a life and quit complaining. If a Democrat is elected president
next year the best thing he or she could do is to appoint Rocky as an ambassador
to a middle eastern country. Then he can complain about the sale of alcohol and
the local Muslim influence all he wants.
Seabass | 9:44 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I love the Mayor! please support him, I love the USA ! and the State of USA! I
guess he is free to make comments
Bob | 10:27 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Love Rocky and will hate to see him go. He is a breath of fresh air in this
state. Much better then Hatch who just agrees with everything GW says.
Aaron | 10:49 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Whoever wrote in under "I Don't Get It," yes, I do judge it
self-righteous to tell people who don't love everything about Utah culture
to just move. I am using the words of Elder Ballard. His meaning is very
clear, yet people like you continue to ignore his counsel. If you don't
like what your leaders are saying, then YOU can just move, because I am the one
who is backed up by the Brethren you purport to follow.
What kind of crack are you smoking to suggest that the right to practice your religion is being challenged again? Rocky is obnoxious and sometimes crosses the line, but who cares? What you apparently want is a theocracy. No one is saying they hate Utah, only that they want to be able to live without having Mormonism shoved down their throats.
I find it really troubling what I'm seeing on here. Angry ex-Mormons who can't leave the Church alone, bigots who just tell people not of their faith to shut up or leave, and arrogant out-of-state Mormons who paint Utahns with a broad brush and mistakenly and stupidly believe they are not committing the same sin of pride. God help us.
What kind of crack are you smoking to suggest that the right to practice your religion is being challenged again? Rocky is obnoxious and sometimes crosses the line, but who cares? What you apparently want is a theocracy. No one is saying they hate Utah, only that they want to be able to live without having Mormonism shoved down their throats.
I find it really troubling what I'm seeing on here. Angry ex-Mormons who can't leave the Church alone, bigots who just tell people not of their faith to shut up or leave, and arrogant out-of-state Mormons who paint Utahns with a broad brush and mistakenly and stupidly believe they are not committing the same sin of pride. God help us.
KL | 10:55 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
How does a subject go from Rocky Anderson and his dealings with the LDS church
to seerstones and blood atonement? Amy you are way off base here. and then the
personal attacks about using online Monikers? isn't that what posting
comments online is all about?
you're a pretty angry person aren't you?
you're a pretty angry person aren't you?
Rude Dog | 11:00 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I own a home there but live on the other side of the world and like to check
in.
Rocky ranting about candidates following the direction of LDS leaders is purposefully dishonest.
LDS church leaders have better things to do than dial up local leaders and tell them how to vote, if they did, it would be all over the front page of the Tribune (but then again, maybe they have an encrypted line down to the floor of the legislature that only mormon legislators have access to).
If the church has a position on an issue, it is usually stated publicly and politicians choose how to vote. Keep in mind, the "Church" does not vote for or endorse candidates.
Rocky appears to be anti-voter rights. He objects to voters exercising their right to elect politicians who utilize a set of values to govern (partly faith-based) that he disagrees with.
It is odd that Rocky is anti-voter rights since those same voters propelled him to a well-paid, visible position despite his lack of leadership, intelligence, charm or other qualifying characteristics.
If Rocky is not anti-voter rights, then he is anti-LDS since he only appears concerned with LDS voters exercising their democratic rights.
For you church vs. state posters, there is nothing that requires a politician to check his religion at the door when governing. If a political practice or law crosses a line, then you or Rocky should get a lawyer and challenge it in court (checks and balances) and stop complaining about others exercising their right to vote.
BTW, all institutions, religious or otherwise, may influence politics within the limits of the law. In relation to other major denominations, the LDS church is relatively inactive in doing so.
Rocky is an embarrasment to Utah as are many of you.
Rocky ranting about candidates following the direction of LDS leaders is purposefully dishonest.
LDS church leaders have better things to do than dial up local leaders and tell them how to vote, if they did, it would be all over the front page of the Tribune (but then again, maybe they have an encrypted line down to the floor of the legislature that only mormon legislators have access to).
If the church has a position on an issue, it is usually stated publicly and politicians choose how to vote. Keep in mind, the "Church" does not vote for or endorse candidates.
Rocky appears to be anti-voter rights. He objects to voters exercising their right to elect politicians who utilize a set of values to govern (partly faith-based) that he disagrees with.
It is odd that Rocky is anti-voter rights since those same voters propelled him to a well-paid, visible position despite his lack of leadership, intelligence, charm or other qualifying characteristics.
If Rocky is not anti-voter rights, then he is anti-LDS since he only appears concerned with LDS voters exercising their democratic rights.
For you church vs. state posters, there is nothing that requires a politician to check his religion at the door when governing. If a political practice or law crosses a line, then you or Rocky should get a lawyer and challenge it in court (checks and balances) and stop complaining about others exercising their right to vote.
BTW, all institutions, religious or otherwise, may influence politics within the limits of the law. In relation to other major denominations, the LDS church is relatively inactive in doing so.
Rocky is an embarrasment to Utah as are many of you.
Gardiner | 11:20 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Mormons today "pop-a-vein" everytime they hear the word liquor. Joseph
F. Smith said the following:
�Some of our pretended pious people... were shocked and horrified by seeing the symbol of the All-Seeing Eye and the words 'Holiness to the Lord' in gilt letters over the front of Zion's Cooperative Mercantile Institution.... pious Mormons found that Z.C.M.I. SOLD TEA AND COFFEE, AND TOBACCO, and at the drug store, Z.C.M.I. KEPT LIQUORS of various kinds for medicinal purposes. It was terribly shocking to some of the Latter-day Saints that ... LIQUOR SHOULD BE KEPT FOR SALE. Has it injured me, in any sense of the word, because Z.C,M.I. drug store kept LIQUOR for sale? Has it made me a drunkard? Have I been under the necessity of guzzling liquid poison? Have I made myself a sot because liquor was KEPT FOR SALE BY Z.C.M.I.? I am not the worse for it, thank the Lord. And who else is? No one, except those pious Mormons who in open day or under the cover of night would go into the drug store and buy liquor to drink.... Those who were the most horrified at seeing the All-Seeing Eye and 'Holiness to the Lord' over the front door of Z.C.M.I., I will guarantee are the ONES THAT HAVE BOUGHT THE MOST TEA AND COFFEE, TOBACCO AND WHISKEY THERE.... It does not matter to me how much tea and coffee Z.C.M.I. sells, so long as I do not buy it. If I do not drink it am I not all right? And if the poor creature that wants it can get it there, that ought to satisfy him. IF HE COULD NOT GET IT THERE, HE WOULD NOT PATRONIZE Z.C.M.I. AT ALL, BUT WOULD GO SOME WHERE ELSE TO DEAL.� (Conference Report, April 1898, page 11)
�Some of our pretended pious people... were shocked and horrified by seeing the symbol of the All-Seeing Eye and the words 'Holiness to the Lord' in gilt letters over the front of Zion's Cooperative Mercantile Institution.... pious Mormons found that Z.C.M.I. SOLD TEA AND COFFEE, AND TOBACCO, and at the drug store, Z.C.M.I. KEPT LIQUORS of various kinds for medicinal purposes. It was terribly shocking to some of the Latter-day Saints that ... LIQUOR SHOULD BE KEPT FOR SALE. Has it injured me, in any sense of the word, because Z.C,M.I. drug store kept LIQUOR for sale? Has it made me a drunkard? Have I been under the necessity of guzzling liquid poison? Have I made myself a sot because liquor was KEPT FOR SALE BY Z.C.M.I.? I am not the worse for it, thank the Lord. And who else is? No one, except those pious Mormons who in open day or under the cover of night would go into the drug store and buy liquor to drink.... Those who were the most horrified at seeing the All-Seeing Eye and 'Holiness to the Lord' over the front door of Z.C.M.I., I will guarantee are the ONES THAT HAVE BOUGHT THE MOST TEA AND COFFEE, TOBACCO AND WHISKEY THERE.... It does not matter to me how much tea and coffee Z.C.M.I. sells, so long as I do not buy it. If I do not drink it am I not all right? And if the poor creature that wants it can get it there, that ought to satisfy him. IF HE COULD NOT GET IT THERE, HE WOULD NOT PATRONIZE Z.C.M.I. AT ALL, BUT WOULD GO SOME WHERE ELSE TO DEAL.� (Conference Report, April 1898, page 11)
WesternEasterner | 11:42 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
There's good and bad in every group. My good friend is LDS who lived in
Utah for 10 years but now resides elsewhere. He basically has the philoshopy of
"If your okay with me, I'm okay with you." He doesn't
avoid or look down on or assume negative things about someone simply because
they don't share his religious beliefs.
He's had the experience of people taking cheap shots against him due to his beliefs, but there are also plenty of non-lds people who like him and have no problems with him whatsoever.
Whereas his former girlfriend is an LDS woman living in Utah who has more than once proclaimed "I don't associate with non-lds people, they are a bad influence." Which is an ironic statement considering that she's had her own immoral moments.
Bottom line is that you'll find good people & bad people in every group. No specific group has a monopoly on morality.
He's had the experience of people taking cheap shots against him due to his beliefs, but there are also plenty of non-lds people who like him and have no problems with him whatsoever.
Whereas his former girlfriend is an LDS woman living in Utah who has more than once proclaimed "I don't associate with non-lds people, they are a bad influence." Which is an ironic statement considering that she's had her own immoral moments.
Bottom line is that you'll find good people & bad people in every group. No specific group has a monopoly on morality.
Mike | 11:49 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Ed from Vegas, Very good.
AMEN.
AMEN.
Gardiner | 11:52 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Why do Mormons think you have to agree with them on EVERY point, or else they
classify you as anti-Mormon? Do they believe that all their positions are
"God Given" even on zoning and planning matters? I say wake-up, and
realize there are usually very good arguments for both sides on zoning and
planning issues, and realize that that their "corner" on "all
truth" does not necessarily extend to "zoning and planning
matters!"
Anonymous | 11:56 a.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Rocky has done a good job. I think some people here, especially the mormons,
forget that there has to be a separation between church and state. Where as, the
mormons probably would want the entire state under mormon laws. And that would
be terrible, it will not happen so that is a good thing.
Scott Gerlach | 12:21 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I find it funny that the disclaimer about abusive, offensive, off-topic, or
misrepresentative comments doesn't seem to apply to any of this. DesNews
should've blocked most of these posts. I thought you were discussing Rocky
Anderson, not bashing Mormons and everyone else.
Amy Bjorge, I'm sorry you've had a negative experience, and that no one here seems to be helping. You religious choices are yours, and we should respect that. You might remember, though, that talking about "Joe" instead of "Joseph" does tend to be a trigger when people are seeking to take offense at comments. (Yes, everyone, I used the "offense" word on purpose!)
I'm not a Utahn, never have been. I've been active and inactive in the Church, and spent 13 years deciding which direction was right for me. I expect everyone else should have the same courtesy afforded to them.
Concerning Rocky, he's a politician. That means that he tries to find the expedient way to get elected to the next office, while hoping to accomplish something positive along the way. He's done both good and bad, from what I've seen over the years, and would probably be considered an average politician in general if you remove the inflammatory commentary.
The two easiest ways to be remembered/get elected in Utah are to 1. Support the Church unswervingly or 2. Appear to be in opposition to the Church. Knowing that, it's a matter of choosing your expedient. Rocky has both loved and hated the Church in the press over the years. We'll probably never know how he really feels about it, until he retires from politics.
Please, people, stop fighting. Religious tolerance is a core American value. And separation of church and state exists in the courts, not the Constitution. "Can't we all just get along?"
Amy Bjorge, I'm sorry you've had a negative experience, and that no one here seems to be helping. You religious choices are yours, and we should respect that. You might remember, though, that talking about "Joe" instead of "Joseph" does tend to be a trigger when people are seeking to take offense at comments. (Yes, everyone, I used the "offense" word on purpose!)
I'm not a Utahn, never have been. I've been active and inactive in the Church, and spent 13 years deciding which direction was right for me. I expect everyone else should have the same courtesy afforded to them.
Concerning Rocky, he's a politician. That means that he tries to find the expedient way to get elected to the next office, while hoping to accomplish something positive along the way. He's done both good and bad, from what I've seen over the years, and would probably be considered an average politician in general if you remove the inflammatory commentary.
The two easiest ways to be remembered/get elected in Utah are to 1. Support the Church unswervingly or 2. Appear to be in opposition to the Church. Knowing that, it's a matter of choosing your expedient. Rocky has both loved and hated the Church in the press over the years. We'll probably never know how he really feels about it, until he retires from politics.
Please, people, stop fighting. Religious tolerance is a core American value. And separation of church and state exists in the courts, not the Constitution. "Can't we all just get along?"
John Lambert | 12:23 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I live outside of Utah and am LDS but would not say I do not much care for or
like LDS people in Utah. I would say there is too much devisiveness in Salt
Lake City, but it is Rocky's "The Council is dominated by the LDS
church", Rocky's bar hopping when he knows that many residents of Salt
Lake City see bars of dens of iniquity, Rocky's flip-flopping on Nordstrom
when the LDS church bought Crossroads, Rocky's fighting the sky bridge with
every weapon he can muster that creates the division.
I think we all need to love eachother and see beyonde our differences. However it will be a lot easier if Salt Lake City has a mayor who does not activily try to create a system that openly and proactively attacks the values of many of its citizens.
If Salt Lake City wants to be a successful tourist area, it should promote family friendly, non-alchoholic tourism, because that where it can have strength. It will never be able to compete with Las Vegas on the same field, but only by emphasizing its unique strengths.
I think we all need to love eachother and see beyonde our differences. However it will be a lot easier if Salt Lake City has a mayor who does not activily try to create a system that openly and proactively attacks the values of many of its citizens.
If Salt Lake City wants to be a successful tourist area, it should promote family friendly, non-alchoholic tourism, because that where it can have strength. It will never be able to compete with Las Vegas on the same field, but only by emphasizing its unique strengths.
Camilla Parker | 12:48 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
You all make me sick. There will always be things that you don't like about
Utah, and Salt Lake City. Ever heard the phrase,"You can't please
everyone?" The LDS church is here to stay. Alcohol, bars, smoking and
democrats (and so much more) are also things that are NOT going to go away. Just
learn to get along, or keep your mouths shut. I personally think Rocky Anderson
has done quite a few good things. He has also messed up here and there.
He's only human. Just like ALL OF US. If you think you can do better, run
for office.
SLaker | 1:14 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
So, John Lambert, should SLC be a dry, alcohol-free, LDS only Family Friendly
destination, where everyone and everything revolves around the LDS faith, or
should it have a balanced mix? Trust me, SLC will NEVER be a Las Vegas, no way,
no how, not even close, and that's a good thing!
C. Sense | 1:52 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Rocky is anti-Mormon because he wants everyone represented, not just Mormons?
Stop playing the persecution card. You're not being persecuted when people
who are different than you have a voice. The people who do not have a voice are
the ones being persecuted.
Andy - CT | 2:06 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Grew up in Bountiful andWe have been gone from UT for almost 20 years - What
have we learned from living in AZ and CT is
1) Yes we can all get along and respect each other - all churches
2) Mormons and non Mormons have the same goals regarding famlies
3) Diversity is good
4) If you think Rocky is Liberal you should try Connecticut politics - Whew
5) If you think the LDS Church gets involved in politics - you shoud see other churches involvment it puts the LDS church to shame
4) Having had to defend my religion on numerous occasions it is ok to know the whole history of the LDS Church - all religions have the skeletons in the closets - Is is personal faith that matters
5)I have great neighbors - who have helped me on numerous occasions - Non Mormon by the way.
6)The world is alot bigger than SLC and or Utah
We hope to move back to Utah because that is where family is - Hopefulley our Liberal views will be accepted by our fellow Latterday Saints.
Thanks for Listening
1) Yes we can all get along and respect each other - all churches
2) Mormons and non Mormons have the same goals regarding famlies
3) Diversity is good
4) If you think Rocky is Liberal you should try Connecticut politics - Whew
5) If you think the LDS Church gets involved in politics - you shoud see other churches involvment it puts the LDS church to shame
4) Having had to defend my religion on numerous occasions it is ok to know the whole history of the LDS Church - all religions have the skeletons in the closets - Is is personal faith that matters
5)I have great neighbors - who have helped me on numerous occasions - Non Mormon by the way.
6)The world is alot bigger than SLC and or Utah
We hope to move back to Utah because that is where family is - Hopefulley our Liberal views will be accepted by our fellow Latterday Saints.
Thanks for Listening
Charles | 3:06 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Don't try to argue with Amy Bjorge. She is the resident ex-mo who has never
said anything good about the LDS Church or Utah from what I've read.
She likes to write letters to the DesNews and complain about everything. You will not win in trying to argue with her.
Just let her spout off and ignore her. Most people who have been around a little have learned that she is a one-trick pony and has more knowledge and intellect than any faith believing Mormon.
She has yet to go to the lecture circuit because I'm sure she is scared to get booed off the stage and shown that her intellect isn't as great or as in depth as she thinks it is.
She rejects people who have faith; people who follow the admonition of Christ who said, "ask and ye shall receive"; mocks the confirmation of the Holy Ghost and anything else that is holy and sacred.
Amy won't go away, but the more you feed her, the bigger she gets. Let's put her on a diet!
She likes to write letters to the DesNews and complain about everything. You will not win in trying to argue with her.
Just let her spout off and ignore her. Most people who have been around a little have learned that she is a one-trick pony and has more knowledge and intellect than any faith believing Mormon.
She has yet to go to the lecture circuit because I'm sure she is scared to get booed off the stage and shown that her intellect isn't as great or as in depth as she thinks it is.
She rejects people who have faith; people who follow the admonition of Christ who said, "ask and ye shall receive"; mocks the confirmation of the Holy Ghost and anything else that is holy and sacred.
Amy won't go away, but the more you feed her, the bigger she gets. Let's put her on a diet!
.... | 3:07 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Quin
I guess you hope your comments will echo an eternity, but alas not so.
Your method of just conveniently sweeping aside your sects history is a common thread.
When it comes to the LDS and �Minorities� in general, echoes of the past have a voice. Persecution of minorities is a cold hard fact of your history, and I don�t blame your ignorance that has produced your pontification.
I guess you hope your comments will echo an eternity, but alas not so.
Your method of just conveniently sweeping aside your sects history is a common thread.
When it comes to the LDS and �Minorities� in general, echoes of the past have a voice. Persecution of minorities is a cold hard fact of your history, and I don�t blame your ignorance that has produced your pontification.
<^> | 3:25 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I just wish the LDS would leave this pontification at church, along with all the
prescription drugs and fictional morals
Lilburn Boggs | 3:30 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Scott Gerlach,
Religious Tolerance a core American value? Since when?
Religious Tolerance a core American value? Since when?
SLaker | 3:40 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
C. Sense, you said it. With some of these people here, it's OUR way, OUR
religion, or NO WAY! There is no in between--only black and white. THAT,
people, is the main source of contention, and it needs to end. Why no
complaints here about Park City, which in it's latest advertising campaign,
all but seceded from the state of Utah, proclaiming itself the "Independent
Republic of Park City". Why do you suppose Utah's number one tourist
destination, and significant generator of dollars, would feel compelled to do
that?
Gretzky | 3:41 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I am voting for Dave Buhler...outstanding!!!
www.daveformayor.org
www.daveformayor.org
Ken Goddard | 4:10 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Why I declare. There is plenty to do along the wasatch front. You can 1) go to
church, 2) eat out and pay 8% tax, 3) shop till you drop, and, 4) have and take
care of children. What more to life is there? But I am at a loss to determine
what LDS stands for in all these various comments. My best guess is "lets
donate suckers".
KL | 4:58 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Okay, everyone is tired of reading how much better people think they are because
they are not members of the LDS church, because they are members of the LDS
church or because they so much better than everyone because they are members of
the LDS church who live outside of Utah. EVERYONE: Grow up and love your
neighbor. Stick to the topic that the original article was about. Rocky is
neither friend or foe to the Church or SLC. He is just there. Elect the one
you like and move on.
Anonymous | 5:01 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I'm sure that mormons would consider the night life great if it consists of
FHE, church, pay 10%. Yup, great night life!
Anonymous | 6:07 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
The LDS church does invest and could be investing its money in many other things
elsewhere. However, they chose to lay aside some of it to help improve the city
and state that first truly welcomed them in and allowed them freedom. They first
made the city what it is and they are trying to make it nice again for all of
us. Rocky Anderson is a good mayor. Yes he does some interesting things, but
he is good too. However, just because a Mormon might get elected to office next
doesn't mean that he will be a puppet of the church. The last time I
checked Mormons didn't have strings attached to them and we are able to
make whatever decisions we want. We also know that we must accept the
consequences for our choices whether good or bad. Being LDS doesn't make
me better than any one else. I have many friends who are not LDS and whome I
admire very much for their dedication to God and other things. We're all
in this together so we should work together to make this a better society. The
LDS church is trying to help the people of SLC make their city better.
Can't the people and the church just work together? Or is that just a silly
ideal that we have given up long ago? I know I'd rather work along side
someone peacefully than stand next to them and hate them. Hate gets us no
where.
Jeff | 6:58 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
I've never understood why people like Rocky move to Utah and torture
themselves with apparent hatred for the LDS church. Here's a newsflash,
the LDS church isn't leaving Utah anytime soon regardless of frequency or
magnitude of negative comments from Rocky or anyone else. Given that reality,
it seems psychotic to stay in Utah if you're anti-LDS unless you prefer to
be an unhappy person, which also may be psychotic.
Doug Barber | 7:39 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
When I first came to Utah as an adult, I found the LDS helping my brother and
asking nothing in return except that he be willing to serve in the same sort of
work parties that had helped him. I am not young and I am not naive, and for the
life of me, I can't figure Rocky's problem.
Kathy | 11:51 p.m. Sept. 3, 2007
Amy, you're are such a hypocrite. Without the Mormon Church your husband
would still be sitting on his buns back in Norway. You seem to forget that it
was the Church that brought his family here. I for one know why you are so
consumed by hate. Why don't you fess up the true reason that you hate the
church so much. I'd be interested on hearing your version.
Terry | 1:25 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
It's funny how people talk about their freedom to protest or complain about
whatever, but never take the time give a good argument using any logic or
reasoning as to why they feel so strong about something.
Some of the extreme comments Rocky has made about President Bush, the LDS church and Republicans in general (for anyone that truely pays attention to this) would make any reasonable person question his sincerity and ability to represent Salt Lake City fairly. Why does he breed more hate between mormons and non mormons by saying that the mayoral candidates only want to serve the interest of the mormon church? That is rediculous, especially given that it is a federal law and church policy to not interfere with politics. All candidates as well at Mitt Romney for that matter, have a mind of their own and do not report to their church leaders any more than any other mayors or presidents would report to the leader of their respective religions. Comments like Rocky's should sound partisan to almost anyone, even extreme liberals who are willing to look at them for what they are. Rocky cares more about getting national attention and a democratic nomination to a cabinet or similar national party post than to bring any semblance of unity and respect to SLC/Utah. Sad thing is, even most democrats can see right through him for the partisan joke he. With so many ridiculous partisan comments, Rocky has embarrassed the residence of Salt Lake City and the entire state on various occasions for his own political gain. We need elect non partisan candidates to office and the upcoming presidency for that matter that want to work together and do not seek to inflame one group against another.
Some of the extreme comments Rocky has made about President Bush, the LDS church and Republicans in general (for anyone that truely pays attention to this) would make any reasonable person question his sincerity and ability to represent Salt Lake City fairly. Why does he breed more hate between mormons and non mormons by saying that the mayoral candidates only want to serve the interest of the mormon church? That is rediculous, especially given that it is a federal law and church policy to not interfere with politics. All candidates as well at Mitt Romney for that matter, have a mind of their own and do not report to their church leaders any more than any other mayors or presidents would report to the leader of their respective religions. Comments like Rocky's should sound partisan to almost anyone, even extreme liberals who are willing to look at them for what they are. Rocky cares more about getting national attention and a democratic nomination to a cabinet or similar national party post than to bring any semblance of unity and respect to SLC/Utah. Sad thing is, even most democrats can see right through him for the partisan joke he. With so many ridiculous partisan comments, Rocky has embarrassed the residence of Salt Lake City and the entire state on various occasions for his own political gain. We need elect non partisan candidates to office and the upcoming presidency for that matter that want to work together and do not seek to inflame one group against another.
Reader | 5:27 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
All of these comments make me sad.
Sub-Odeon | 6:36 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
I'm moving back to Utah after having been gone for 14 years. As a
semi-active LDS person, I continue to be mystified by the non-LDS who reside
in-state, yet whine and gripe endlessly about the LDS influence. That's
like living in Italy and whining that the Catholics or Pope have too much
influence, or living in Saudi Arabia and whining that the Muslims and the
Islamic clerics have too much influence.
If you find the LDS church and its members to be annoying or distasteful, I suggest you find a new state and/or city in which to reside. Because the church isn't going away any time soon, regardless of how much you might wish for it to go away.
Now, as for the ex-mo contingent... That's a whole different thread. Basically I think there are two kinds of ex-mo folk:
1) those who get over it and move on with their lives
2) those who are bitter and hateful and carry a grudge
I feel sorry for those in category two, if only because it's plain how miserable they make themselves; so miserable in fact they have to export their misery to their fellow human beings.
If you have left the church, that's your choice. If you got kicked out of the church on account of your behavior, again it has been your choice. Nobody is to blame but you.
And if you simply cannot stand living in a state with funny liquour laws or a religiously "conservative" culture, I invite you to exchange places with me up here in the Puget Sound. They will love you up here, and you will love it up here. (assuming you can get over the astronomical cost of living, that is...)
If you find the LDS church and its members to be annoying or distasteful, I suggest you find a new state and/or city in which to reside. Because the church isn't going away any time soon, regardless of how much you might wish for it to go away.
Now, as for the ex-mo contingent... That's a whole different thread. Basically I think there are two kinds of ex-mo folk:
1) those who get over it and move on with their lives
2) those who are bitter and hateful and carry a grudge
I feel sorry for those in category two, if only because it's plain how miserable they make themselves; so miserable in fact they have to export their misery to their fellow human beings.
If you have left the church, that's your choice. If you got kicked out of the church on account of your behavior, again it has been your choice. Nobody is to blame but you.
And if you simply cannot stand living in a state with funny liquour laws or a religiously "conservative" culture, I invite you to exchange places with me up here in the Puget Sound. They will love you up here, and you will love it up here. (assuming you can get over the astronomical cost of living, that is...)
Sub-Odeon | 7:06 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
One final comment, on the booze debate.
If you feel like the world is going to end because Utah regulates liquour more closely than, say, Nevada, then you obviously have a more serious problem than Rocky Anderson (or the LDS church) can help you with.
If you feel like life cannot be "fun" unless you have unrestricted access 24/7 to a variety of vices (gambling, strip bars, booze, et al) then you obviously have a larger problem than either Rocky (or the LDS church) can help you with.
No, not every LDS member is on their game about leaving the non-LDS in peace, where personal choice is concerned. Bad behavior amongst the saints is always going to be a big concern for the LDS church; it's why we inside the church hear it from the leadership all the time about how we need to shape up and stop pointing so many fingers.
But really, SLC is just one city and Utah is just one state. If you can't stand it there, do what I did in 1993: MOVE! Pick a point on the map and go. Nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to stay in Utah. Whatever "chains" you think bind you there, are probably in your imagination. Moving to a new city and a new state will be doing both yourself and your Utah neighbors a big favor. If you simply cannot stand Utah or its LDS population, you owe it to yourself to remove yourself from the situation.
If you feel like the world is going to end because Utah regulates liquour more closely than, say, Nevada, then you obviously have a more serious problem than Rocky Anderson (or the LDS church) can help you with.
If you feel like life cannot be "fun" unless you have unrestricted access 24/7 to a variety of vices (gambling, strip bars, booze, et al) then you obviously have a larger problem than either Rocky (or the LDS church) can help you with.
No, not every LDS member is on their game about leaving the non-LDS in peace, where personal choice is concerned. Bad behavior amongst the saints is always going to be a big concern for the LDS church; it's why we inside the church hear it from the leadership all the time about how we need to shape up and stop pointing so many fingers.
But really, SLC is just one city and Utah is just one state. If you can't stand it there, do what I did in 1993: MOVE! Pick a point on the map and go. Nobody is holding a gun to your head and forcing you to stay in Utah. Whatever "chains" you think bind you there, are probably in your imagination. Moving to a new city and a new state will be doing both yourself and your Utah neighbors a big favor. If you simply cannot stand Utah or its LDS population, you owe it to yourself to remove yourself from the situation.
Castle Pines,CO. | 8:28 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
It is amazing to read every morning the comments from Salt Lake about the LDS
Church and people and Mr. Anderson. When are people going to grow up and start
working on what themselfs bring to the table and quit being so comsumed by other
people. You waste so much time and effort wining about my poor group that you
forget that a lot of people moved to the Salt Lake area for the free handouts by
the LDS Church and other Church's trying to out do the LDS Church. It was
funny to ready the comment that the LDS Church should pull out of Salt Lake
City, that was as stupid a comment as I have read, it won't happen. Yes, I
live in the Salt Lake valley until I could not take the infighting and be around
people with out Love. I found that people like Mr. Anderson were not going to
change my live and belief but I did not want to have my family live in a verble
battlefield and that is what the State of Utah has become and it is on both
sides. Make change with your vote and service and things will be better, but not
with your mouth.
Perspective | 8:28 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
Let's see what Rocky has generated in the messages above: Cooperation of
collatoration or divisions and animosity...you be the judge of the responses on
this web site!
Roger B | 9:11 a.m. Sept. 4, 2007
I heard a saying not too long ago that is sooo true, especially when thinking of
Mayor Anderson and most of the comments on this board...
You can leave the LDS Church, but you can't leave it alone!
You can leave the LDS Church, but you can't leave it alone!
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I think Rocky Anderson need to chill out, there is nothing wrong with LDS and NON-LDS people coming together to make a city better. Isn't that the Christian thing to do? Salt Lake City is a beautiful city and a wonderful place to live, but Mayor Anderson is killing the welfare of the city with his childish and selfish antics.