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Utah Jazz: Trade rumors have Jazz discussing Boozer to Bulls
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Anonymous | 9:53 a.m. July 10, 2009
Trade boozer, ak, miles, and suton or fez to the bobcats and bring in bell,
okafor, diaw, and gerald wallace...overall the team gets a ton better...you get
something for boozer, you get rid of ak's contract, you give them a kid
with upside in miles but no work ethic and then suton or fez to round it off...
CommonSense | 9:57 a.m. July 10, 2009
The only trade the Jazz should make is trading AK and Matt to the Rockets for
TMac. I am not a TMac fan but consider:
Some insurance on TMac contract if he doesn't play
TMac contract expiring
What killed us in the Laker series was Kobe's help defense because he left Brewer alone (and not having Memo). If TMac is healthy by then, he would definitely open up the offense down low and allow more penetration by Deron.
I am actually pretty high on next year with this crew if we remain healthy. Korver should have a better shooting year.
Some insurance on TMac contract if he doesn't play
TMac contract expiring
What killed us in the Laker series was Kobe's help defense because he left Brewer alone (and not having Memo). If TMac is healthy by then, he would definitely open up the offense down low and allow more penetration by Deron.
I am actually pretty high on next year with this crew if we remain healthy. Korver should have a better shooting year.
Are you crazy nick | 10:03 a.m. July 10, 2009
why on earth would chicago give up john salmons... he is the only scoring threat
the bulls have after ben gordon left
PS your trade idea was horrific
PS your trade idea was horrific
Comments continue below
The problem with Boozer | 10:04 a.m. July 10, 2009
and Okur back is no interior defense. Both are good on offense. Boozer made
comments he should not have but is not relevant. Boozer is injury prone but
Millsap is an adequate back up.
However, that whole system, that approach has become to expensive to maintain. It has to be changed and the Jazz have to maintain the offense while getting better defense.
Okur, Boozer and Millsap are all replaceable. Okur is staying for 3 years. That means Boozer and/or Millsap will have to be replaced with better defense. That takes an artful trade not a dump.
Look at what Dallas just did with Stackhouse's 7 Mill contract. Now that is good GM work. Boozer is a good/great player compared to Stackhouse and he provides 13 Mill to work with.
The Jazz have a defense problem. The contenders rank highest in FG defense. The Jazz are in the middle of the pack.
That has to be solved by player changes (or a coaching change) before the Jazz can contend.
As an organization the Jazz do not make enough changes. They over pay because of the emphasis on continuity and no change.
However, that whole system, that approach has become to expensive to maintain. It has to be changed and the Jazz have to maintain the offense while getting better defense.
Okur, Boozer and Millsap are all replaceable. Okur is staying for 3 years. That means Boozer and/or Millsap will have to be replaced with better defense. That takes an artful trade not a dump.
Look at what Dallas just did with Stackhouse's 7 Mill contract. Now that is good GM work. Boozer is a good/great player compared to Stackhouse and he provides 13 Mill to work with.
The Jazz have a defense problem. The contenders rank highest in FG defense. The Jazz are in the middle of the pack.
That has to be solved by player changes (or a coaching change) before the Jazz can contend.
As an organization the Jazz do not make enough changes. They over pay because of the emphasis on continuity and no change.
Blauch | 10:16 a.m. July 10, 2009
Apollo Sun
Millsap started 31 games last season and averaged 16 and 10. That does not seem very limited considering Boozer at 24 only averaged 17ppg
Last Feb the Jazz averaged 107 ppg without Boozer where they won 10 out of 11. They have no problem scoring.
Tyrus Thomas may not even stay with the Jazz. This trade is to cut Boozer Salary so the Jazz can resign Millsap. Of Course the Jazz want to get something of value in return.
That being said with Thomas the Jazz can run Millsap at Center (last season he played over 700 minutes at Center - and he was just fine), Thomas at PF and AK a Small Forward. They combined last year about 4.5 blocks a game last year.
Jazz sends Boozer to Chicago - (12.5 million)
Chicago sends Tyrus to Utah and Heinrich to Portland (14 million)
Because Portland is 8 million dollars under the cap and they are taking 9.5 million dollars in salary they need to shed 2 million and send Bayless, Fernandez, Outlaw or Webster to Chicago.
I don't think this is the last trade - I believe that Miles will also be gone.
Millsap started 31 games last season and averaged 16 and 10. That does not seem very limited considering Boozer at 24 only averaged 17ppg
Last Feb the Jazz averaged 107 ppg without Boozer where they won 10 out of 11. They have no problem scoring.
Tyrus Thomas may not even stay with the Jazz. This trade is to cut Boozer Salary so the Jazz can resign Millsap. Of Course the Jazz want to get something of value in return.
That being said with Thomas the Jazz can run Millsap at Center (last season he played over 700 minutes at Center - and he was just fine), Thomas at PF and AK a Small Forward. They combined last year about 4.5 blocks a game last year.
Jazz sends Boozer to Chicago - (12.5 million)
Chicago sends Tyrus to Utah and Heinrich to Portland (14 million)
Because Portland is 8 million dollars under the cap and they are taking 9.5 million dollars in salary they need to shed 2 million and send Bayless, Fernandez, Outlaw or Webster to Chicago.
I don't think this is the last trade - I believe that Miles will also be gone.
James | 10:16 a.m. July 10, 2009
Actually come to think of it Webster would be an awesome fit in the Jazz system
also! But yeah honestly Tmac would bring so much to the jazz! Everyone forgets
he gets injured because he does so much. By coming to the jazz he would play in
a system and not have to work hard to make his team win compared to Houston. He
would provide the jazz a player besides Dwill that can create his own shot with
ease. Overall i say if jazz get the boozer deal done they better pull the Tmac
deal. Tmac is not washed up look how Amare came back after knee injury. Jazz
would be set!
CommonSense | 10:18 a.m. July 10, 2009
It seems almost 3/4 of all player contracts expire next year. Should be
interesting.
Dear Trade Gurus | 10:25 a.m. July 10, 2009
All of you need to remember, a trade requires the other team also wanting to do
the deal. Everyone talks about getting rid of AK's contract. That would
required someone wanting to take on AK for that price. In the perfect world for
jazz fans the Raptors would trade Bosh for Booze, and the Rockets would trade
TMac for AK. Unfortunately, it takes two teams to complete a deal.
We should trade AK for Lebron. Idiots.
We should trade AK for Lebron. Idiots.
Finances | 10:28 a.m. July 10, 2009
The Jazz would be wise to be very careful on the financial side. This recession
is going to be very long. It may well collapse again in 2010. The cap will be
much lower in 2010 and 2011.
Expiring contracts present a great opportunity to remake the Jazz into a contender by improving the defense while maintaining the offense. That will need to be done over 2 years or more now that Okur has extended.
As far as the Miller empire losing money, it mainly depends on their fixed cost structure. On the dealerships it is partly a matter of controlling inventory costs. If they have low fixed costs and hold down inventory costs they can survive a couple of years of 60% sales/revenues.
They will have interest expense on the locations/buildings. If that is low enough then they have to control interest expense on inventory. They should have already reduced inventory.
I suspect that the Miller group is in okay shape. They may also have each dealership as a separate entity (LLC). Weaker dealerships could be jettisoned without effecting the stronger ones.
Expiring contracts present a great opportunity to remake the Jazz into a contender by improving the defense while maintaining the offense. That will need to be done over 2 years or more now that Okur has extended.
As far as the Miller empire losing money, it mainly depends on their fixed cost structure. On the dealerships it is partly a matter of controlling inventory costs. If they have low fixed costs and hold down inventory costs they can survive a couple of years of 60% sales/revenues.
They will have interest expense on the locations/buildings. If that is low enough then they have to control interest expense on inventory. They should have already reduced inventory.
I suspect that the Miller group is in okay shape. They may also have each dealership as a separate entity (LLC). Weaker dealerships could be jettisoned without effecting the stronger ones.
Liabilities | 10:30 a.m. July 10, 2009
The offense that Boozer brings when he comes to play is great... but the fact he
has missed 1 of every 3 games he should have been able to play takes away even
more of his scoring threat if you factor in the inconsistency that missed games
brings, and him having to play catchup just to regain his stamina reduces his
production to 1 of every 3 games... far too much salary for someone that is that
much of a drag. Unless he can play a full season like 2 years ago, a trade needs
to happen.
I don't know if i like this trade, but I don't think it is the only one the Jazz will explore. As far as keeping Okur... I think it is a good idea as he spreads the floor and provides more offense than any other player on the team. I like the idea of playing him as PF and perhaps then using a bulked up Kufos as center, and bringing whomever is brought in off the bench.
NO matter what happens, I am always excited to see what the new season brings. GO JAZZ!!!
I don't know if i like this trade, but I don't think it is the only one the Jazz will explore. As far as keeping Okur... I think it is a good idea as he spreads the floor and provides more offense than any other player on the team. I like the idea of playing him as PF and perhaps then using a bulked up Kufos as center, and bringing whomever is brought in off the bench.
NO matter what happens, I am always excited to see what the new season brings. GO JAZZ!!!
Cap Space | 10:50 a.m. July 10, 2009
Cap space is at a premium right now. Every $ of cap space is worth 2$ to teams
in the lux tax.
POR is not going to blow that on Millsap. They need a PG and know that they can use their cap space to get one of the best in the up coming fire sales. In the next 6 months POR can steal a PG using their cap space.
70% of the teams will be in the lux tax in 2010 and maybe a higher percentage in 2011. Cap space will be even more valuable.
That will drive the price of good players down as teams stuck with expensive overpaid "stars" on long term contracts fire sale younger talent.
The Jazz have to stop spending too much on old players. They obviously did not learn.
The Jazz need to position for 2 years of falling caps. They need to get better on defense while maintaining the offense. They had 33 million to work with. They already blew a 10 million of that.
I hate to say the Jazz are dumb but I can't say they are smart until I get some evidence of it.
Same pattern as always.
POR is not going to blow that on Millsap. They need a PG and know that they can use their cap space to get one of the best in the up coming fire sales. In the next 6 months POR can steal a PG using their cap space.
70% of the teams will be in the lux tax in 2010 and maybe a higher percentage in 2011. Cap space will be even more valuable.
That will drive the price of good players down as teams stuck with expensive overpaid "stars" on long term contracts fire sale younger talent.
The Jazz have to stop spending too much on old players. They obviously did not learn.
The Jazz need to position for 2 years of falling caps. They need to get better on defense while maintaining the offense. They had 33 million to work with. They already blew a 10 million of that.
I hate to say the Jazz are dumb but I can't say they are smart until I get some evidence of it.
Same pattern as always.
Hank McCoy | 10:51 a.m. July 10, 2009
re: STEVE-O | 5:20 p.m. July 9, 2009
>>Just glad to know they're gonna dump Boozer. I just don't like watching the guy play basketball, or talk afterwards.
>>Just glad to know they're gonna dump Boozer. I just don't like watching the guy play basketball, or talk afterwards.
Rumors from Boozer's Agent | 10:52 a.m. July 10, 2009
The only legitimate "rumor" which was confirmed by the Blazer's
GM is that the Blazers want Millsap. Isn't it a funny coincidence that the
day a big trade for Millsap is confirmed, the somehow an unsubstantiated
"bigger" trade regarding Boozer gets floated around. It's like
"don't pay attention to Millsap, watch Boozer!". And nobody is
confirming these ridiculous trade rumors. In fact O'Connor was on a plane
from Orlando to SLC... how could there have been any talk with him??? I think
it's all drummed up by Boozer's agent to try to keep his boy in the
spot light.
nick | 10:54 a.m. July 10, 2009
re:anonymous
jazz get:derrick brown, played awesome in summer league;emaka okafor;gerald wallace;raja bell
bobcats get: boozer;ak;cj;first round pick
jazz get:derrick brown, played awesome in summer league;emaka okafor;gerald wallace;raja bell
bobcats get: boozer;ak;cj;first round pick
Jazzfan101 | 10:56 a.m. July 10, 2009
These 3 Trades need to happen:
Trade #1:
Utah: Gets Thomas and Greg Oden
Portland: Gets Hinrich, Fesenko, Noah
Chicago: Boozer
Trade #2:
Utah: Gets Tyson Chandler
NO: Gets Turiaf, Maggette
GS: Gets AK, Koufos, just through him in to get rid of a center to make room for oden.
Trade #3:
Utah: Gets T-Mac
Houston: Gets Collins, Miles, Knight, keep Matt dont trade him, and make T-Mac earn his starting spot and battle it out with Matt, it will make him work harder. Resing Milsap for cheap. So Jazz get Thomas, Oden, Chandler, T-Mac. Utah Jazz starting line up Williams, Brewer, T-Mac, Okur at PF, Chandler at Center. plus your bench is stacked with Thomas, Oden, Milsap, Price, Matt, Korver, Maynor. Wow can someone say Champions for sure!
Trade #1:
Utah: Gets Thomas and Greg Oden
Portland: Gets Hinrich, Fesenko, Noah
Chicago: Boozer
Trade #2:
Utah: Gets Tyson Chandler
NO: Gets Turiaf, Maggette
GS: Gets AK, Koufos, just through him in to get rid of a center to make room for oden.
Trade #3:
Utah: Gets T-Mac
Houston: Gets Collins, Miles, Knight, keep Matt dont trade him, and make T-Mac earn his starting spot and battle it out with Matt, it will make him work harder. Resing Milsap for cheap. So Jazz get Thomas, Oden, Chandler, T-Mac. Utah Jazz starting line up Williams, Brewer, T-Mac, Okur at PF, Chandler at Center. plus your bench is stacked with Thomas, Oden, Milsap, Price, Matt, Korver, Maynor. Wow can someone say Champions for sure!
Nellie will Trade | 11:08 a.m. July 10, 2009
Give him Boozer, A.K., & Miles for Biedrins, Maggette, Turiaf, & Wright,
the money works and so does the sense of it. NOW we are ready to play.
jbra80 | 11:24 a.m. July 10, 2009
Apollo sun: Who are these decent PF's you speak of? Under scenario we get
Millsap back, that's 1. AK plays 4 positions so he doesn't really
count. You can't be counting Kosta or Suton, can you? So really, we'd
have Millsap with Thomas backing him up, quite the log jam huh?
And to the trade guru post: The Rockets were the team looking into the AK for McGrady trade. If the article was correct, we backed out of talks. It makes sense for both teams, especially with Harp's contract thrown in. Without Yao, the Rockets are going to have to go to a defensive minded team that focuses on ball-movement on offense, like Adelman's offense in Sacramento. They'd have Ariza/Battier/Kirilinko at the 2/3/4 positions. Pretty good D.
Let's just hope the Jazz do something to improve team and gain flexibility next year
And to the trade guru post: The Rockets were the team looking into the AK for McGrady trade. If the article was correct, we backed out of talks. It makes sense for both teams, especially with Harp's contract thrown in. Without Yao, the Rockets are going to have to go to a defensive minded team that focuses on ball-movement on offense, like Adelman's offense in Sacramento. They'd have Ariza/Battier/Kirilinko at the 2/3/4 positions. Pretty good D.
Let's just hope the Jazz do something to improve team and gain flexibility next year
Boozer Bandwagon:Don't Trade | 11:46 a.m. July 10, 2009
This will be the best trade that was never made. What does Tyrus Thomas do for
us other than give us a chance to keep Milsap and save some money? We are much
better off with Boozer than with Tyrus Thomas and Milsap combined. Boozer will
stay healthy this year and give us the best chance at a title - who wants to
rebuild?
STEVE-O | 11:49 a.m. July 10, 2009
To James:
Tmac doesn't HAVE to work that hard in Houston either. He chooses to take all the pressure on himslef. He feels like he needs to score 35 points every game in order for his team to win. Then he gets hurts and the Rockets excelled without him.
Tmac will never be a team player, and as a result will always overwork and always be hurt. We don't need a guy like that on the team. Also, he's going to be out until Midseason minimum so we'd be trading AK for esentially nobody.
The only reason the Jazz should trade AK for Tmac would be to shorten that ugly contract by one year. They'd basically be throwing in the towel on the 2009 season with hopes of signing some players during next year's free agency.
Tmac doesn't HAVE to work that hard in Houston either. He chooses to take all the pressure on himslef. He feels like he needs to score 35 points every game in order for his team to win. Then he gets hurts and the Rockets excelled without him.
Tmac will never be a team player, and as a result will always overwork and always be hurt. We don't need a guy like that on the team. Also, he's going to be out until Midseason minimum so we'd be trading AK for esentially nobody.
The only reason the Jazz should trade AK for Tmac would be to shorten that ugly contract by one year. They'd basically be throwing in the towel on the 2009 season with hopes of signing some players during next year's free agency.
Apollo Sun | 11:53 a.m. July 10, 2009
To: 'Blauch | 10:16 a.m. July 10, 2009'
Are you joking? First of all you compare Millsap's best production, to Boozer's worst (when he had just come back from injury). Why not compare him to Boozer's stats from the season before (when he was healthy) which was 21.1 pts and 10.4 rebounds.
Millsap is already 24, so he's not gonna have much more upside.... well at least not that much more than a 27 year old Boozer! His baskets come mostly from simple dunks or putbacks under the basket. While Boozer has a vast array of shots to hit teams with.
Point is, as much as i agree that trading Boozer for the right guys makes sense. Don't be under any illusions that Millsap is a better player!
And NO.... at 6'8'' he most definitely can't play at Center!!!!!!!!! Ridiculous comment!
Are you joking? First of all you compare Millsap's best production, to Boozer's worst (when he had just come back from injury). Why not compare him to Boozer's stats from the season before (when he was healthy) which was 21.1 pts and 10.4 rebounds.
Millsap is already 24, so he's not gonna have much more upside.... well at least not that much more than a 27 year old Boozer! His baskets come mostly from simple dunks or putbacks under the basket. While Boozer has a vast array of shots to hit teams with.
Point is, as much as i agree that trading Boozer for the right guys makes sense. Don't be under any illusions that Millsap is a better player!
And NO.... at 6'8'' he most definitely can't play at Center!!!!!!!!! Ridiculous comment!
Boozer | 11:55 a.m. July 10, 2009
may be valuable when he plays. When does he play? A great player always injured
isn't very valuable. So the Jazz get Thomas... the Jazz don't
sacrifice much to get cap space.
It's a business, folks. Gotta make the deals you think will make money (or not lose money) in the long run.
It's a business, folks. Gotta make the deals you think will make money (or not lose money) in the long run.
Anonymous | 12:31 p.m. July 10, 2009
Here's a trade idea
3 team trade with utah golden state and charlotte
Jazz get turiaf, maggette, okafor, and gerald wallace
golden state gets boozer fensenko ajinca and suton possibly
charolette gets kirlenko harpring and miles...
THis trade works with everyone's contracts and everything. You get more inside presence with turiaf and okafor, athleticism from maggette and wallace along with scoring and rebounding.
3 team trade with utah golden state and charlotte
Jazz get turiaf, maggette, okafor, and gerald wallace
golden state gets boozer fensenko ajinca and suton possibly
charolette gets kirlenko harpring and miles...
THis trade works with everyone's contracts and everything. You get more inside presence with turiaf and okafor, athleticism from maggette and wallace along with scoring and rebounding.
ncjazzfan | 12:38 p.m. July 10, 2009
If the Jazz somehow ended up with Pryzbilla, Thomas and Fernendez by loosing
only Boozer and maybe Fez..........that would be great. Millsap and Pryzbilla
would cover Boozers points.....and the interior defense would be greatly
improved. When Fernandez played against that Jazz last year he was very good.
Very poised and just gave you the impression that he could do what he wanted.
Not sure why his playing time seems to have decreased later in the year.....but
I'd be happy if the Jazz ended up with those 3 players.
Chadders | 12:38 p.m. July 10, 2009
Ok stick with me here a second I just came up with a stat I would call actuall
average. Basically you would generally expect a player to play about 75 of your
82 games a year on average(92%). If they play more it is like a bonus and less
it would hurt their stats. So to be fair I only used the last 3 seasons for
Boozer (2 of those are his best seasons).
year 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09
games played 74 81 37
ave points 20.9 21.1 16.2
ave rebounds 11.7 10.4 10.4
total points 1549 1708 599
total rebs 867 844 385
actual ave points 20.7 22.8 8
actual ave rebs 11.6 11.3 5.1
actual ave all 3 years combined
17.1 points & 9.3 rebs
Boozer should be a 3rd guy. He isn't terrible but he's not quite a 20 and 10 guy. By the traditional average he is but by what you'd expect to get he isn't. Good player but not great.
year 2006-07 2007-08 2008-09
games played 74 81 37
ave points 20.9 21.1 16.2
ave rebounds 11.7 10.4 10.4
total points 1549 1708 599
total rebs 867 844 385
actual ave points 20.7 22.8 8
actual ave rebs 11.6 11.3 5.1
actual ave all 3 years combined
17.1 points & 9.3 rebs
Boozer should be a 3rd guy. He isn't terrible but he's not quite a 20 and 10 guy. By the traditional average he is but by what you'd expect to get he isn't. Good player but not great.
Hello | 12:43 p.m. July 10, 2009
Anonymous,
You should really try to undestand how trades work. You have to give another team something of value for them to give you what you want. The Bobcats will not give you a bunch of the key players for nothing. Unless, the GM there want to get fired.
You should really try to undestand how trades work. You have to give another team something of value for them to give you what you want. The Bobcats will not give you a bunch of the key players for nothing. Unless, the GM there want to get fired.
STEVE-O | 12:56 p.m. July 10, 2009
@ Nick..
HA HA hA! You're trades are great! I love your sarcastic humor. I wanna try one:
Jazz Get: 3 racks of Basketballs, some used underarmor, Batum.
Blazers Get: DWill, AK, Boozer, and a 1st round Pick.
or Maybe.....
Jazz Get: Raja Bell, Greg Ostertag out of retirement, and a few Bobcats Cheerleaders.
Bobcats Get: Boozer, Ak, Memo, and throw in a 1st round pick for kicks! This is fun!!
HA HA hA! You're trades are great! I love your sarcastic humor. I wanna try one:
Jazz Get: 3 racks of Basketballs, some used underarmor, Batum.
Blazers Get: DWill, AK, Boozer, and a 1st round Pick.
or Maybe.....
Jazz Get: Raja Bell, Greg Ostertag out of retirement, and a few Bobcats Cheerleaders.
Bobcats Get: Boozer, Ak, Memo, and throw in a 1st round pick for kicks! This is fun!!
BullsFan | 1:03 p.m. July 10, 2009
Mr. Paxson DO NOT make this trade! As a Bulls fan in Utah, I have watched Boozer
do nothing but sit the bench with injuries and when he is in the line up, he
under performs. The Boozer who could get you 25 and 10 on any given night is
long gone. Tyrus Thomas is an athletic freak and I expect in the next year or
so, he will come into his own as a dominant post player who can also extend
defenses and cause match up problems. I can't stand Boozer and if my Bulls
make this trade, it will do nothing but set them back and for what??? A cry
baby, injury proned cancer who might play 25-30 games. No thanks!
James | 1:09 p.m. July 10, 2009
Tmac still would excell in a jazz uniform! He doesn't trust his teammates
in houston see in utah he has proven winners and would realize he is coming to
an already good team! Plus Sloan wouldn't let him play like he does in
houston and so he would do good with the jazz.
Deth | 1:32 p.m. July 10, 2009
I am so sick of this rumor already...when I know nothing is actually going down.
Plus..reading some of all these posts with all the stupid trade ideas...most of you sound like 2nd graders. Lets trade Collins for LBJ...that works right?
Plus..reading some of all these posts with all the stupid trade ideas...most of you sound like 2nd graders. Lets trade Collins for LBJ...that works right?
Building on anonymous | 1:47 p.m. July 10, 2009
k here is a trade possiblitly i see for the jazz that actually works with the
contracts...
4 team blockbuster
Jazz get corey maggette ronny turiaf from g.s, thomas from chicago, gerald wallace and ajinca from bobcats...
golden state gets kirlenko and harpring from jazz, boris diaw from bobcats, and larry johnson from chicago
bobcats get heinrik from chicago, korver from jazz, wright from g.s and beindris from g.s
chicago gets boozer and miles from jazz, augistin from bobcats, and davidson from g.s that puts the jazz starting five something like
williams
maggete
wallace...
okur
turiaf
with
brewer, thomas, fez, millsap and maynor with the main subs. for the jazz
it seems like a good one that everyone benefits in some way and the bulls actually get even more cap room coming into next year with the expiring contracts they would take on and getting rid of heinriks 3 year deal...jazz get a solid core that would be there for the next 3 years
4 team blockbuster
Jazz get corey maggette ronny turiaf from g.s, thomas from chicago, gerald wallace and ajinca from bobcats...
golden state gets kirlenko and harpring from jazz, boris diaw from bobcats, and larry johnson from chicago
bobcats get heinrik from chicago, korver from jazz, wright from g.s and beindris from g.s
chicago gets boozer and miles from jazz, augistin from bobcats, and davidson from g.s that puts the jazz starting five something like
williams
maggete
wallace...
okur
turiaf
with
brewer, thomas, fez, millsap and maynor with the main subs. for the jazz
it seems like a good one that everyone benefits in some way and the bulls actually get even more cap room coming into next year with the expiring contracts they would take on and getting rid of heinriks 3 year deal...jazz get a solid core that would be there for the next 3 years
re: Tyrus | 1:55 p.m. July 10, 2009
What does Thomas bring to the Jazz you ask...exactly what Boozer does not
bring...defense! TT averaged about the same number of blocks per game as Okur,
Boozer and AK combined in less minutes.
James | 2:45 p.m. July 10, 2009
Thomas brings talent! He can hit a jump shot and attack the rim with quickness!
Has anyone seen his block on Bosh and then on the next play dunked on
J'Oneal? Enough Said! As far as for defense he straight up blocked Lebron
so there is alot of defense in this kid, Jazz should pull the trigger and get
Webster from Portland why there at it! I remember him lighting up the Jazz for
24 points in 1 quarter he has upside!
Blauch | 3:29 p.m. July 10, 2009
Apollo Sun -
Did you even watch the Jazz last season. Millsap played 700 minutes last season as Center. 700 Minute he was on the court without Okur, Fess, Collins or Koufas. 300 of those minutes were with AK (AK did not play center) and 400 minutes with Boozer (Boozer does not play Center).
I compared Boozer production when he was 24 to Millsaps production when he was 24. SAME AGE. (Actually I used his 23 year old production 17 and 9 - when he was 24 he averaged 16 points 8 rebounds a game)
I would love to compare Boozer 21.1 ppg when he was 26 to Millsap 26 year production - but Millsap is not 26. No one knows what it will be.
Power Forwards peak in scoring (meaning their highest ppg) comes when they are 27 or younger - Boozer turns 28 in November. While Millsap is over 3 years younger (he turned 24 in February) -
To say Millsap will not improve. It took Boozer 5 year to get to 20 points a game - How can anyone say Millsap won't become a 20 ppg.
Did you even watch the Jazz last season. Millsap played 700 minutes last season as Center. 700 Minute he was on the court without Okur, Fess, Collins or Koufas. 300 of those minutes were with AK (AK did not play center) and 400 minutes with Boozer (Boozer does not play Center).
I compared Boozer production when he was 24 to Millsaps production when he was 24. SAME AGE. (Actually I used his 23 year old production 17 and 9 - when he was 24 he averaged 16 points 8 rebounds a game)
I would love to compare Boozer 21.1 ppg when he was 26 to Millsap 26 year production - but Millsap is not 26. No one knows what it will be.
Power Forwards peak in scoring (meaning their highest ppg) comes when they are 27 or younger - Boozer turns 28 in November. While Millsap is over 3 years younger (he turned 24 in February) -
To say Millsap will not improve. It took Boozer 5 year to get to 20 points a game - How can anyone say Millsap won't become a 20 ppg.
Miles | 3:53 p.m. July 10, 2009
Has anyone noticed that most big guys in the league don't score or
can't shoot. Exceptions are Duncan and Gasol. Most teams get their
scoring from the outside except Jerry's teams. So for that reason, Boozer
does not have many options for the money he is demanding. Most bigs in the
league are for rebounding and defense. Not for scoring. The Jazz on the other
hand look for their bigs to score and play no defense. Just backwards from the
rest of the league. No wonder we don't have any banners here in Utah.
Anonymous | 6:39 p.m. July 10, 2009
I don't think this is really about Boozer vs. Millsap. I think this is
about going cheap, locking in a decent PF at a cheap price. I'd rather
they let them both go and look for someone who is both healthy and a great
player, even if costs more. That seems a much better option than locking in
someone cheap but not great for the long term. I think there is no more desire
to win a championship, only a desire to survive a recession.
CJ3 | 7:35 p.m. July 10, 2009
Hate to break it to ya, Blauch, but every time Memo leaves the floor Boozer
slides to the 5, and Millsap plays the 4. That's when all were playing.
It's also one of the reasons Boozer's defense appears worse that it actually is...he gets the opposing team's toughest post assignment.
It's also one of the reasons Boozer's defense appears worse that it actually is...he gets the opposing team's toughest post assignment.
Apollo Sun | 5:33 a.m. July 11, 2009
Thank you CJ3
Blauch, you may have watched the Jazz last year, but you clearly don't understand what you're seeing if you thought that Millsap was playing Center.
The point is that Okur/Koufos/Fess will rotate at 5. Millsap and Thomas will probably play the 4. My original point was that receiving a backup for Millsap (who isn't exactly an all-star YET) for Boozer (who is a two-time all-star) doesn't make sense. Yes salary wise it keeps us under the cap, but unless we can play Thomas at 3, and have Millsap and him on the floor at the same time, i think there are better options out there. Try not to blindly love all things Millsap and instead think constructively!
Blauch, you may have watched the Jazz last year, but you clearly don't understand what you're seeing if you thought that Millsap was playing Center.
The point is that Okur/Koufos/Fess will rotate at 5. Millsap and Thomas will probably play the 4. My original point was that receiving a backup for Millsap (who isn't exactly an all-star YET) for Boozer (who is a two-time all-star) doesn't make sense. Yes salary wise it keeps us under the cap, but unless we can play Thomas at 3, and have Millsap and him on the floor at the same time, i think there are better options out there. Try not to blindly love all things Millsap and instead think constructively!
CJ3 | 10:24 a.m. July 11, 2009
My pleasure, Apollo.
jbra80 | 11:32 a.m. July 11, 2009
To CJ3: How many centers out there really are their teams toughest post player?
Count them up, i'd love to hear how many tough centers there are in the
league.
To Miles: How many championship teams has their been w/o an offense run through their 4 or 5. Every Laker championship team was run through their post, sure they have Kobe but Phil Jackson runs it through their bigs to keep Kobe from being selfish and screwing it up. The Spurs, the Heat, every championship team except for Jordan's teams have had dominant big guys. True most have had a great guard or wing player but you have to have both and you have to play inside/out. Why do you think Cleveland couldn't get past Orlando, they had nobody to guard the 4/5 positions or more to the point, Orlando's 4/5's didn't have to guard anyone. I agree we need more D out of our bigs though, thats a good point. Maybe we just run everything through CJ next year and everything will work out.
To Miles: How many championship teams has their been w/o an offense run through their 4 or 5. Every Laker championship team was run through their post, sure they have Kobe but Phil Jackson runs it through their bigs to keep Kobe from being selfish and screwing it up. The Spurs, the Heat, every championship team except for Jordan's teams have had dominant big guys. True most have had a great guard or wing player but you have to have both and you have to play inside/out. Why do you think Cleveland couldn't get past Orlando, they had nobody to guard the 4/5 positions or more to the point, Orlando's 4/5's didn't have to guard anyone. I agree we need more D out of our bigs though, thats a good point. Maybe we just run everything through CJ next year and everything will work out.
non-fan | 11:59 a.m. July 11, 2009
What the Jazz need to do is trade all the players and fold. These guys are all
way over paid. They are generally spoiled brats with egos wider than the state.
And the fans who follow them so closely need to get a life and spend their time
and money on things that really matter in life.
todd from santa ana | 6:38 p.m. July 11, 2009
the frustration and anger in me increases almost on a second by second basis.
How does Kevin O Connor sleep at night?
How does Greg Miller?
They take the fans for "granted"
I am humiliated to tell others as I am a Jazz fan
Watching other teams get better. Players staying here opting in is bad enough. Mehmout is not a true center. If he played #4 maybe. However, we could have either Snoozer or Millsap/Thomas
I do not believe any trade will happen. It has been a few days now and no new rumors or real news anywhere.
O Connor was in Orlando.
O Connor does not have the intelligence or creativity to do sign and deal moves, trading for cap relief.
The Jazz are in serious trouble
Signing Okur to an extension as a time with cap changes and just focused on damage control is beyond stupid. It is same ol dumb decisions
The next dumbest is SLoan possibly being here for several more years.
I do not believe he will leave in 1 year, what else does he have to do?
Everything-players picked starts with real GM
Sloan and his "worthless Sloanaholics"..
How does Kevin O Connor sleep at night?
How does Greg Miller?
They take the fans for "granted"
I am humiliated to tell others as I am a Jazz fan
Watching other teams get better. Players staying here opting in is bad enough. Mehmout is not a true center. If he played #4 maybe. However, we could have either Snoozer or Millsap/Thomas
I do not believe any trade will happen. It has been a few days now and no new rumors or real news anywhere.
O Connor was in Orlando.
O Connor does not have the intelligence or creativity to do sign and deal moves, trading for cap relief.
The Jazz are in serious trouble
Signing Okur to an extension as a time with cap changes and just focused on damage control is beyond stupid. It is same ol dumb decisions
The next dumbest is SLoan possibly being here for several more years.
I do not believe he will leave in 1 year, what else does he have to do?
Everything-players picked starts with real GM
Sloan and his "worthless Sloanaholics"..
Cj3 | 11:24 p.m. July 11, 2009
I'd be happy to J bra (bra?! Really?...)! OK, shall we start in the West,
with the requested "quality centers?" Feel free to debate the merits
of them.
Last season there was Shaquille O'Neal, the All-Star co-MVP, Marcus Camby (former DPoY and shotblocking specialist), Pau Gasol (played more minutes at the 5 than starter Bynum), and one of the fellas many Jazz fans seem to want, Joel Przybilla. Nene Hilario, or another fan fav trade wannabe, Tyson Chandler, Tim Duncan, Andris Biedrins (bet you know nothing about him... but you should), or Yao Ming???
Those are some quality 5-spot big men right there. Really, if you wanna go East, just lemme know...brah.
Last season there was Shaquille O'Neal, the All-Star co-MVP, Marcus Camby (former DPoY and shotblocking specialist), Pau Gasol (played more minutes at the 5 than starter Bynum), and one of the fellas many Jazz fans seem to want, Joel Przybilla. Nene Hilario, or another fan fav trade wannabe, Tyson Chandler, Tim Duncan, Andris Biedrins (bet you know nothing about him... but you should), or Yao Ming???
Those are some quality 5-spot big men right there. Really, if you wanna go East, just lemme know...brah.
jbra80 | 7:47 a.m. July 12, 2009
So Gasol, Yao and Duncan were the tough matchups defensively for a PF playing C
about 5-10 minutes a game. Nene is a PF playing C, Chandler has no offensive
game except for catching oops, Camby has no offensive game, Biedrins and
Przybilla are just big stiffs on offense. You make me feel better about Memo as
our Center. Poor Boozer, no wonder we think he can't play D. Let's go
east!
CJ3 | 9:46 a.m. July 13, 2009
The Jazz switch on D in the post all the time, partly because Okur is slowto
rotate, and partly by design. Boozer plays the bulk of the minutes on Gasol and
Duncan, 2 of the premier post-men in the league. Memo does get Yao, maybe
because both have such slow feet.
Your Memo comment pulled a smile out of me. Funny.
Boozer doesn't play the bulk of the minutes on the rest of the players named, but I did want to point out that there are quality 5s out there, and Booz will get the switch on em quite often. Biedrins has upped his offensive production every year.
Booz gets Aldridge, West, and forget the Clipshow, they're irrelevant, and does a great job on em.
Don't forget to defend Shaq's offense vs Booz.
East comin, after worky time.
Your Memo comment pulled a smile out of me. Funny.
Boozer doesn't play the bulk of the minutes on the rest of the players named, but I did want to point out that there are quality 5s out there, and Booz will get the switch on em quite often. Biedrins has upped his offensive production every year.
Booz gets Aldridge, West, and forget the Clipshow, they're irrelevant, and does a great job on em.
Don't forget to defend Shaq's offense vs Booz.
East comin, after worky time.
jbra80 | 7:24 p.m. July 13, 2009
You make some alright points, but that doesn't make me feel any better
about Booz's D. No excuses, he just doesn't try hard enough.
As for Shaq, I forgot about him but he is a shell of his former self, probably still too much for Booz, but his size causes problems for everybody.
Sorry no free pass for Booz, you have to play both ends of the floor.
I'm glad you like the Memo comment. On that list of players he's a border line all-star depending on injuries, and i'm not a big Memo fan.
As for Shaq, I forgot about him but he is a shell of his former self, probably still too much for Booz, but his size causes problems for everybody.
Sorry no free pass for Booz, you have to play both ends of the floor.
I'm glad you like the Memo comment. On that list of players he's a border line all-star depending on injuries, and i'm not a big Memo fan.
CJ3 | 9:58 a.m. July 14, 2009
Shaq had a resurgent, All-Star season, and it could be argued Booz did the
better job on him, defensively, than anyone else.
That said, Boozer's D is much better vs guys he can get his strong body up under. Against the quicker bigs he really struggles, exposing the front of the hoop for the opposing offenses. Memo's lack of quickness further exposes the Jazz's D at the rim.
I agree wholeheartedly about Okur. The deal for 2 years was the right one.
Out East for a moment...
Dwight Howard, at the Summer Olys, said Boozer was his best defensive competition in working on his offensive post game. That is out of anyone on his Orlando team, and anyone in Beijing.
That includes Bosh and Tayshaun Prince, 2 guys that many fans want to trade for.
Booz should be at his best this year. And on his best behavior.
That said, Boozer's D is much better vs guys he can get his strong body up under. Against the quicker bigs he really struggles, exposing the front of the hoop for the opposing offenses. Memo's lack of quickness further exposes the Jazz's D at the rim.
I agree wholeheartedly about Okur. The deal for 2 years was the right one.
Out East for a moment...
Dwight Howard, at the Summer Olys, said Boozer was his best defensive competition in working on his offensive post game. That is out of anyone on his Orlando team, and anyone in Beijing.
That includes Bosh and Tayshaun Prince, 2 guys that many fans want to trade for.
Booz should be at his best this year. And on his best behavior.
jbra80 | 10:27 a.m. July 14, 2009
I'm not saying he's not capable of playing D, he just seems unwilling.
I know coach k requires you to play d at Duke, so maybe playing around him at
the Olympics did it for him. If his payday next year won't do it, nothing
will. I just don't want to see him walk after next year for nothing.
CJ3 | 2:48 p.m. July 14, 2009
Agreed. I'd take Salmons off of the Bulls hands any day.
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