Deseret News | Reader comments: Not family-values party

Reader comments
Readers' forum: Letters: Not family-values party

Logical | 1:17 a.m. July 4, 2009

Completely agree. The Gop is nothing but straw herrings burning the midnight oil of their tin foil-Rush O'Hannity tuned hats calling kettle black in glass houses. And they drink Capri Sun! It really doesn't matter what I say if I mention some kind of fruit drink, right?

Family values Party? | 4:51 a.m. July 4, 2009

It is my opinion that we view many actions of our Republican leaders with a double standard.

We tend to ignore their actions because of their politial beliefs. To me this is some what hypocritical. Many times our response is limited by the political party of the offender.

How many of our conservative political leaders were critical of former President Clinton while at the same time doing the same thing themselves?

Didn't some one once say let him that is without sin cast the first stone? That does not seem to be the case.

Brandon it is a difference in | 6:37 a.m. July 4, 2009

expectations. Where there are no values there are no expectations, and therefore no scandals. Relative and situational morality we see in so much of the left basically removes any expectation of moral behavior, it can all be explained (rationalized, justified) away. There is an expectation of personal morality on the right and when that expectation is not met there is a price to pay. Were there no expectations you would see people on the right talking about Mark Sanford the way the left talked about Bill Clinton. Or Mark Foley would have been given a standing ovation in the house and then made a committee chairman.

Comments continue below

Pithy | 6:48 a.m. July 4, 2009

However, unlike the dems, the republicans usually get rid of or ostracize, or take away their seniority position. The dems keep putting them in office - leaving the girl in the car to drown and not report it Teddy Kennedy; "I never had sex with that woman" Bill Clinton; gov of New York; and I could go on and on and on. I guess people will be people. Too bad they are all human.

Divide and Conquer | 7:08 a.m. July 4, 2009

As a party Republicans locally have done all they can to divide families with the effects of their unimaginative immigration bill that terrorizes and deports breadwinners leaving their families behind so the LDS church or some other group has to pay to reunite families. As a party, especially in Utah, the Republicans are the party of anti-education, anti-community, and for gated communities, privilege, and division. Thanks for the reminder that Republicans don't hold the high ground they always stridently claim by being negative about everyone else, including those Americans who are different, such as Hispanics--until they need to make a nod in their direction during an election year.

Robert Johnson | 7:13 a.m. July 4, 2009

Absolutely true. I think I can say for a fact that banning Republicans from marrying will do more to protect the sanctity of "traditional marriage" than banning gay marriages ever will.

Anonymous | 7:23 a.m. July 4, 2009

Brandon: Well said. What you say is true. I hope Republicans can move beyond their "God, Gays, and Gun" rhetoric and focus on true Christlike principles like love, tolerance and compassion.

Hypocrisy | 7:43 a.m. July 4, 2009

Well said! The Republican Party for a while has been about doing as I say, not as I do...

Good Examples | 7:45 a.m. July 4, 2009

Because Democrats are such good examples of keeping it in their pants. But you hit on a critical point - there is no party that best represents family values.

Democrats | 7:50 a.m. July 4, 2009

As opposed to democrats that revel in their vices and try to get every pervesion legalized? All are human, the individuals of a party are not the test, the test is the platforms they run on, the ideas are what are lasting not the puny humans whose lives are over with in a spark of time.

Brandon | 8:17 a.m. July 4, 2009

Brandon, Brandon. Should we aspire for goodness and morality or should we just succumb to the baser side of life, or even celebrate debachery, like the good libs do? Sure the conservatives have there problems, but they don't embrace dirtbags the way the dems do. These characters that you speak of have been shown the door, in the dem party they are glorified.

roger chambers | 8:38 a.m. July 4, 2009

There are progressives in both parties. Progressives hate the constitution, liberty, and individual rights. They only believe in collectivist
rights. Teddy Roosevelt, Woodrow Wilson, and FDR were progressives. Hillary Clinton stated that she was an early 20th century progressive like teddy Roosevelt and Woodrow Wilson.

Earl | 8:39 a.m. July 4, 2009

What the heck is a "straw herring?" I've heard of red herrings and strawmen, but this is a new one!

Gone Straight | 9:18 a.m. July 4, 2009

When they say "Family Values", the GOP means that (from now on), its OK to sleep with your soul mate, but don't seek gay sex in a bathroom or fondle Congressional pages.

Grimble | 9:28 a.m. July 4, 2009

Pithy said:

"However, unlike the dems, the republicans usually get rid of or ostracize, or take away their seniority position."

Ah, yes, and that's why we've heard so little from Newt Gingrich recently, and why Bill "Pass the Loofah" O'Reilly is so unpopular, and why Rush Limbaugh's ratings fell after he got caught in Carribean with a stash of Viagra, and why Sarah Palin dropped out of the VP race when her teenage daughted got pregnant. Oh, wait...

What Hypocrisy! | 9:59 a.m. July 4, 2009

The stench of hypocrisy coming from this letter is unbearable. What nonsense! What rubbish! The Demoncratic Party is complicit in the murder of countless unborn babies every day, is trying to destroy the family by redefining marriage, and has MORE unfaithful politicians than the GOP ever thought of having. I'm not condoning what these rascals have done, only calling the writer, the media, and the Demoncratic Party on their utter, stinking hypocrisy!.

Sanpete slim | 10:12 a.m. July 4, 2009

I wonder if we Americans will ever cease finding joy in the downfall of others. I hope so.

Republicans vs Democrats | 10:58 a.m. July 4, 2009

Democrats: Deny ever having anything to do with the opposite sex. (Perjury see Bill Clinton and murder see Ted Kennedy).

Republicans: At least take the heat and admit their passion for sex and they don't deny it or kill for it.

I see a difference!!!

Cora | 11:44 a.m. July 4, 2009

Repuplicans: Get caught, take the heat, admit their passion for sex,(any kind) and admit it. All the while lying about it, and loudly,constantly, preaching the bible and family values, pointing fingers at everyone who is not just like them.

Democrats: Deny it, take the heat, and the punishment, while never preaching they are the perfect humans.

Yes, I see the difference!!!!

Phantom | 12:09 p.m. July 4, 2009

It's an illusion to think the label you give yourself makes you less susceptible to temptation or that you'll fool anyone in the end. Given the right circumstances, ANYONE can fall from grace. Democrat, Republican, Christian, Atheist... whatever, it means nothing. Human beings are fallible creatures. Deal with it... and with less finger pointing.

@Pithy | 12:27 p.m. July 4, 2009

"the republicans usually get rid of or ostracize, or take away their seniority position.:

Like Warren Harding who used to sneak whores into the White House as well as fathering an out of wedlock child? Or Strom Thurmond's love child?

"The dems keep putting them in office - leaving the girl in the car to drown and not report it Teddy Kennedy;"

Kennedy was not accused in a sex scandal. It was leaving an accident and failure to report it. Whether he could have saved the girl cannot be known. He was not exonerated. His re-election was a decision of the Massachusetts voters, not the Democratic Party. Yes, his behavior was reprehensible but he admitted it. Compare that admission with Dick Cheney's shooting episode. He went to a friend's house and started drinking to cover up the fact that he was drinking before the incident. Nothing happened to him, did it?

" gov of New York; and I could go on and on and on."

Spitzer resigned ... or did you not know that?

Oh Please | 12:31 p.m. July 4, 2009

Republicans = hypocrites

Sally | 12:55 p.m. July 4, 2009

Let the sex games begin. Republicans! Democrats! But which is the party that purports to be the Party of Family Values.

The rumors. The gossip. The record shows that significant members of the Party of Family Values seem to deviate from their stated purpose. Forget Bill Clinton. He never said he was the leader of the Party of Family Values.

Unfortunately, there is no Party of Family Values. The Republicans are a joke! They say they are of high, moral standing, but they are like all the rest of us: imperfect!

Grist for the rumor mill. George Bush is accused of paying for an underage girl to have an abortion. Also, there remains the unanswered question of Margie Schoedinger, a Texas woman who filed a rape lawsuit against George W. Bush in December 2002. The only problem is that she later died from an apparent suicide.

It is well known that Bush was a Randy Dandy in his youth. However, his youth extended until his early 40s. But it is not clear if his Come to Jesus moment completely redeemed his errent behavior, but he soon became the leader of the Party of Family Values.

mark | 2:20 p.m. July 4, 2009

Brandon | 8:17 a.m. July 4, 2009 You bleat:
"Brandon, Brandon. Should we aspire for goodness and morality or should we just succumb to the baser side of life, or even celebrate debachery, like the good libs do? Sure the conservatives have there problems, but they don't embrace dirtbags the way the dems do. These characters that you speak of have been shown the door, in the dem party they are glorified."

What a childish thing to say, obviously you do not know many liberals, but like a child you believe things just because others have told you they are true. You believe in fairy tales. Cute in a way.

Maybe if you actually knew liberals you would find out they are good people that raise good families.

They have been shown the door? Really? Sanford and Ensign are still in office and the GOP leadership has put no pressure on them to leave.

Philanderer Newt Gingrich is back, even being talked about as a presidential contender; criminal Limbaugh is revered; pet of FOX News Dick Morris, john with tax problems; convicted felon Oliver North; perjurer Mark Fuhrman; Philanderer Rudy Giuliani, GOP presidential hopeful.

ECR | 2:41 p.m. July 4, 2009

"The Democratic Party is complicit in the murder of countless unborn babies every day..."

The Supreme Court is who determined that abortion was legal, not the Democratic Party. The last (Republican) president appointed two so-called conservative justices and what has changed?

Gus Talwynd | 2:44 p.m. July 4, 2009

When you think you are better than others, more rightous or more moral, and you do something to contradict that assumption, you lose all credibility. If it is kept as a secret and comes out later (as it inevitably will), the hypocrasy is only enhanced.

Anonymous | 6:36 p.m. July 4, 2009

Family values, what a crock. We don't even know what it means, except to know we have them and are willing to judge others based on our beliefs.

KM | 7:32 p.m. July 4, 2009

What are family values?

1- don't kill the unborn members of your family.

2- recognize that God is great, and man is nothing.

3- keep the commandments - don't cheat on your spouse.

4- love others.

I'm sure there are many more family values that could be listed, but this is a start...

sutton | 9:34 p.m. July 4, 2009

KM... In other words, Worship the way *I* want you to...

FAMILY VALUES | 9:51 p.m. July 4, 2009

DO NOT challenge the lunatic right about their never ending drum beat about FAMILY VALUES.

No matter what level of hypocricy their leadership arrives at, the followers will continue to be dragged down with the weight of the "do as I say don't do as I do" crowd.

@sutton | 10:23 p.m. July 4, 2009

Where did KM say anything about worshipping the way he/she does? Are we a little paranoid of godly people?

mark | 11:23 p.m. July 4, 2009

You know KM, I could not figure out what was bothering me about your little list of "family values", aside from the obvious god is great shtick, and then it hit me, you say nothing, directly, about living children, not a word. The closest you come to saying anything about children is to "love others."
Then I realized what a very sad list of "family values" it is.

If your vote kills my wife U die | 11:54 p.m. July 4, 2009

What Hypocrisy! | 9:59 a.m. July 4, 2009

"The stench of hypocrisy coming from this letter is unbearable. What nonsense! What rubbish!

"The Demoncratic Party is complicit in the murder of countless unborn babies every day..."

You and the Republican Party are both complicit in the deaths of pregnant women. You believe that you know everything and that no woman is intelligent or moral enough to make the right decision so why try persuading them when you can forbid these inferior women to do as you say.

If they die because Republicans are wrong then God will bless the Republicans and demand that their murder victims forgive them for their votes killing them or burn in hell. Those women really have two choices. Forgive those whose votes killed them or burn in hell because God will not punish those who murdered them. God bless America where strangers get to vote on the life of our loved ones.

Isn't it great to live in the land of the free (free to vote). We get to read such wonderful posts from a nobody who thinks they have the say on my wife's health and life.

KM's gets a vote on my life too | 12:00 a.m. July 5, 2009

mark,

"You know KM, I could not figure out what was bothering me about your little list of "family values", aside from the obvious god is great shtick, and then it hit me, you say nothing, directly, about living children, not a word. The closest you come to saying anything about children is to "love others."
Then I realized what a very sad list of "family values" it is."

He doesn't care about living children.

They don't mean anything to him and the life of the unborn child is more valuable than that of the woman who may die if she's denied an abortion, her living children's becoming orphans or her husband being a widow means nothing to him.

Of course KM has a say in the matter. The mother, her family, doctor and religious leaders must be forced to debate with other voters and prove to them that her life is threatened before being granted permission to have an abortion. IF THOSE VOTERS ARE WRONG AND SHE DIES they will get to return home to their family while their victims grieve their votes killing their loved one.

mark | 1:45 a.m. July 5, 2009

KM's gets a vote on my life too | 12:00 a.m. July 5, 2009
I understand what you are saying, I hear you. But being a guy I try to stay away from the abortion issue, except for saying that I, being a guy, will never have to make the decision of whether or not to have an abortion personally, and also to say that if it were men that gave birth then abortion would not even be an issue.
About KM's list: I do believe that KM must care about living children, but it is very telling that the top things he names as "family values" does not include raising, nurturing, teaching, and loving children. Very telling indeed.

Anonymous | 12:25 p.m. July 5, 2009

KM, it is funny that you and others talk about Abortion. I was reading the bible the other day and came to an interesting passage, Exodus 21:22.

It says, "If men strive, and hurt a woman with child, so that her fruit depart from her, and yet no mischief follow: he shall be surely punished, according as the woman's husband will lay upon him; and he shall pay as the judges determine."

So, I looked up mischief meaning at the time and it means additional harm. So, translating this to current time I took it to mean If a man does something to cause a woman to lose her unborn baby, but the woman does not suffer any additional harm, the punishment shall be only what the father wishes and the court allows.

So, if the father approves of an abortion and wishes no punishment for the person perfroming the abortion, doesn't mean that the woman is free to have an abortion?

Seems that the hebrew laws of the Old Testament (you know the same ones as Leviticus that talks about homosexuality) clear the way for abortion.

I'm confused.

Bender Rodriguez | 5:45 p.m. July 5, 2009

The only difference between a Republican & Democratic politician getting "busted" for extra-marital tomfoolery is that sometime preceding said event the clown from the GOP will have given a speech on family values.

Anonymous | 5:55 p.m. July 5, 2009

Mormons rule. Mitt for supreme leader~

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