Deseret News | Reader comments: Boy Scouts organization places weight restrictions on some outings

Reader comments
Boy Scouts organization places weight restrictions on some outings

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Scout Mom | 11:20 p.m. June 3, 2009

When will we quit fat bashing? It's possible for people to be "overweight" and still active and healthy. I'm considered "obese" because of my BMI, but my blood pressure is great, blood sugar is great, heart is healthy, cholesterol is low, etc. I swim, walk, dance, and hike. I eat whole grains, fruits, vegetables, and lean meats. I eat minimal high fat/sweet foods. Isn't it time to define health without using a scale?

To Scout Mom | 11:41 p.m. June 3, 2009

The BSA is not intending to "fat bash." They're trying to prevent medical emergencies. Certainly, the criteria isn't perfect and could be made more complicated in order to accommodate people who are healthier than their BMIs would indicate. But they're not fat bashing. They're looking out for their volunteers.

bad criteria? | 12:12 a.m. June 4, 2009

I think the idea is good but maybe the criteria they are using is bad. Why not set limits on cholesterol levels. Say no one over total cholesterol of 175 can do it. Also, no one who smokes,has diabetes, or high blood pressure. I would think all these factors would be a better predictors of heart attacks than weight or BMI.

Comments continue below

this scoutmaster.... | 1:40 a.m. June 4, 2009

runs marathons thank you very much!

Fat boy | 1:42 a.m. June 4, 2009

Maybe the BSA is going from preaching to meddling! LOL

American Citizen | 2:26 a.m. June 4, 2009

Weight Restrictions? No problem. Most of the scout troops I see only do the usual Friday 5pm to Saturday 10am campouts anyway.

If the leaders have to park more than 100 feet from their campsite, they balk because that's too far to carry their Camp Chef grills for the breakfast they fix for their boys. The boys deserve better.

Scoutmaster | 5:53 a.m. June 4, 2009

My BMI is at an over weight level and always has been. It is just the way I was built. I have a 34 inch waistline, am 6'3", and have a body fat percentage of about 10, well within the healthy range.

This regulation is stupid, it fails to take in your actual physical condition as well as body type. Long and short of it if your BMI is over about 32, then stick to driving your car to camp grounds, is what BSA is telling us.

I guess I will stick to running marathons and Ironman Triathlons.

Also... | 6:04 a.m. June 4, 2009

I'm sure the BSA are looking out for their volunteers, the boys, and everyone else involved for a number of safety issues.

But who knows? Maybe this is attorneys talking, as well. Maybe they're worried about liability issues in our overly-litigious society. Think about it: overweight, unhealthy, clogged-artery leader has a heart attack on the trail where no help can be found. Then something happens to one of the boys, too, as a result of the incident. Ambulance chasers are busting down the doors of the families of those involved, looking to make a quick buck off the BSA.

It could happen. It wouldn't surprise me if that's part of the BSA's motivation.

Brother | 6:31 a.m. June 4, 2009

My brother was a Scout leader for 18 years.
People appreciated his service, enthusiasm and loyalty, but the wiser ones didn't follow his example with regard to eating.
His choice of obesity cost him his life before reaching 50.
And that cost his troop (and family) an otherwise great leader.

Boo Hoo | 6:49 a.m. June 4, 2009

When will fat people stop whining?

The problem here is serious. I personally know of scoutmasters who can't hike a short trail with their troop because they are simply too fat.

Being overweight causes knee and back problems, puts you at higher risk of diabetees, heart disease, stroke and a multitiude of other problems.

Most scout troops I work with don't even go backpacking any more because the scoutmaster can't do it. That is pathetic.

No wonder many boys loose interest in scouting so quickly...what do they have to look up too? That fat guy in kakhi shorts who can't walk? Nice...

I for one applaud the BSA for taking this step. A scoutmaster should be the example of fitness and health as well as knowledge and spirituality. In short, he should live the Scout Law and Oath.

re: Scout Mom | 7:01 a.m. June 4, 2009

Don't be fooled in believing you can't have a heart attack. Don't have hard feeling for a good organization that is trying to save your life and set a good example to save the lives of millions of young boys.

This is a good move to fight obeseity. Much better than government regulations over fast food restruants like they do in the liberal cities.

metamoracoug | 7:04 a.m. June 4, 2009

This is a matter of liability. It is intended to make it possible to save lives and prevent lawsuits. Whether own is healthy or not is immaterial. The fact is simple: obese individuals are more likely to have heart attacks and stroke as well as many other health difficulties.

The quote from the 40-year-old scout leader is classic. "I understand and support it but it's sad that it will exclude many good leaders." Wouldn't they be even better leaders if they led by example? Obesity is rapidly becoming the number one health issue in the United States due to all the risks involved with it.

When are we as a people and individuals going to start taking personal responsibility for our actions instead of blaming someone else for our problems?

Chubby Little Cubby all Stuffed | 7:06 a.m. June 4, 2009

When I was a boyscout we had an obese fellow who helped in scouting. He always was last on the hikes and once the boys locked him out of his own car and chanted "Jabba the Hut! Jabba the Hut!" while he fumed at the boys. The poor man deserved better.

Fat people have serious health hurdles that may not be conducive to the activities boyscouts have to do. The boys aren't stupid, they pick up on any weakness.

I've noticed that in the church scouting program the leaders generally avoid calling those who are significantly overweight. I think this rule has been in place informally for a while now.

To: To Scout Mom | 7:07 a.m. June 4, 2009

Don't kid yourself. The BSA is interested in one thing only: limiting liability to prevent a lawsuit.

I'm a junior high school teacher | 7:09 a.m. June 4, 2009

and I just lost 30 pounds by making a deal with my students. If I lose the weight by the end of May (I started in February) then all of my classes get a pizza party. It cost me $231 for the pizza but I had 180 supporters everday. You would never thought I was obese or had any health issues by looking at me. I did have several minor health issues before the weight loss and now have none.

Even though me losing weight was all about me it grew to be about all of the students. They are more aware of obesity, it's consequences, and the importance of a helathy life style.

Good job Boy Scouts.

Leaders? | 7:10 a.m. June 4, 2009

this countyr and world need leaders, not rationalizers.
i'm glad boys get inpired by scout leaders to overcome problems and temptatons, not just give in to apetites.
Anything to encourage leaders to wake up and take charge of thir own behaviros would be a boon for the young men they lead.

Delight in Fatness | 7:10 a.m. June 4, 2009

@Scout Mom... I assume you're a woman. Female bodies are generally better equipped to deal with excess fat. The health risks to men being obese are far more pronounced. Besides you're never gonna be a scout leader... again because you're a woman. And since high adventure scouting is high impact, it's doubtful the leader could keep up with the young men if they were severely impeded by their body weight.

God is bigger than the boogieman | 7:13 a.m. June 4, 2009

There was a fat kid in our scouting program. He was a nice guy but nobody really treated him very nicely. I think if the boys were encouraged to scale their activities to each boy's level of ability, and were taught to encourage each other in doing better, this could go a long way to dispelling some of the knee-jerk aversion boys feel towards those that are different than them.

Anonymous | 7:22 a.m. June 4, 2009

The BSA is not "fat bashing". The volunteers are important, and need to take care of themselves for the sake of the young people they are leading.

Re : Bad criteria | 7:22 a.m. June 4, 2009

Get I won't be called as a scout master! I have high cholesteral. Actually your number is off a bit. Anything under 200 is normal. But I like the 175 number. That would mean I could improve my health without running the risk of being called as a scoutmaster. Just having a little fun.

Tommy Tuba | 7:23 a.m. June 4, 2009

I'm offended. I go on these activities to burn calories. This policy is not in the best interest of the Boy Scouts. Next time I'm asked to donate $500 , the answer will be NOOOOO!!!!!

Knowwhat | 7:28 a.m. June 4, 2009

What about fat scouts? There are more over weight and out of shape boys in the BSA than ever before. Scouting has turned in to a sham. These over weight scouts have their eagle awards and even passed the physical fitness merit badge, at least someone signed it and said they did.

BMI is flawed | 7:46 a.m. June 4, 2009

While the BSA is correct in taking action, the fact that they are using BMI as the standard is the problem.

BMI is flawed and by BMI most Americans are obese, but by practical observation that's not the case. It would have been much simpler to just say that the leaders must submit to physicals and get a doctors not just like the young men must for so many activities.

discrimination | 7:49 a.m. June 4, 2009

If you're overweight and feel discriminated against then you know how gay people feel when they're kicked out of the Boy Scouts.

Can't have cake and eat it, too | 7:52 a.m. June 4, 2009

The Boy Scouts of America discriminate against gay scoutmasters. It shouldn't be any surprise that they've chosen to place restrictions on obese scout leaders, too.

Tom | 7:56 a.m. June 4, 2009

I will no longer financially support BSA. Sorry but NO THANKS!

Just a thought . . . | 8:12 a.m. June 4, 2009

I think the intent here is good. But wouldn't a better way be to get a Dr. approval if you are over the limits? Plus, the restrictions don't start until next January- if it were me I would start a program to get in better shape before January so that I could participate. What better way to set a good example of health and fitness to these young (and sometimes overweight) boys? There is no fat bashing going on here. The BSA probably is trying to avoid lawsuits but I think they are doing it with the best interests of the boys and leaders in mind. Americans are overweight, there is nothing wrong with a large organization like this promoting health. But there are those that may fall outside the limits they have set but can still do these activities just fine. I think if those individuals had Dr. approval then it should be okay for them to participate.

HUh? | 8:13 a.m. June 4, 2009

how come the article doesn't say what the actual restriction is? is it bmi? is it just weight? what is it? i am a exercise and sport science major and think bmi is a load of fluff. you can be short and muscular and according to bmi your overweight. get a clue BSA

I think the | 8:24 a.m. June 4, 2009

BSA is well within there bounds to start this policy. The scouting program is becoming scared to death of lawsuits for anything bad that happens during a scouting activity. Maybe somebody has already filed a lawsuit for a heart attack during a required hike for the boys. Next they will limit big kids from doing extreme activities so they don't become a potential lawsuit either. A few years ago I went to my first roundtable meeting. One class was where we went over restricted activites for the boys. Almost everything on that list were the activites that I did as a scout. Things we just up and did with our leaders. Now those activities are restricted or severely limited. That first roundtable really changed my attitude towards scouting. With all the lawsuits that they handle every year, they are really struggling to provide the scouting experience us older guys enjoyed as kids. As good as the scouting experience was designed to be, they are really struggling to keep afloat right now. This is due to all of the frivilous lawsuits that have came their way.

Buckeye Ute | 8:37 a.m. June 4, 2009

I am a scout leader from Ohio in an LDS Church sponsored troop. I had my physical done yesterday for scout camp. The form has the weight restrictions on it but the doctor can sign you off for all activities if he has done a full workup and deems you to be in good enough health to participate in all activities. The BMI is one of the factors that can be used to determine a leaders ability to participate in all activities.

Scout Camper | 8:44 a.m. June 4, 2009

Nothing ruins scout camp faster than the scout leader who has a heart attack.

So your fat... | 8:48 a.m. June 4, 2009

Hey, you fat guys and gals can still climb mountains with your boys. Just don't do it as a scout activity. All organizations have to protect themselves from being sued, and this decision by BSA is one way the BSA is protecting itself.

Also, keep in mind, fat people, that you are getting older and less capable of continuing the stressful activities you've done in the past. In a few years you may have a different attitude about this decision than you have right now...

Matthew | 8:50 a.m. June 4, 2009

To "BMI is flawed"
I won't defend BMI but when I look around me at my fellow Americans I see mostly obese people. So if the BMI says most Americans are obese that is a point in its favor. For the record, if I lose one more pound I will no longer be "overweight" according to the BMI. But I will still be what I call fat. I need to lose at least ten more pounds before I will consider myself "fit." My weight exploded from 165 to 185 in one month due to a hypothyroid condition and then crept up to 215 over the next two years. I finally went to a doctor and discovered the hypothyroid condition. Boy are those extra pounds slow in leaving!

As for 6'3", 34 inch waist and BMI over 32? I'm skeptical, but perhaps you do just have truly massive thighs, pecs, and biceps.

Protest Snacker | 9:02 a.m. June 4, 2009

I will no longer financially support the BSA, instead I choose Crispy Creme Scouts... and the girl scouts who sell those cookies...

Anonymous | 9:12 a.m. June 4, 2009

do these restrictions apply to fat scouts as well?

slsorensen | 9:49 a.m. June 4, 2009

This is just another nail in the coffin for Scouting. It is hard now to find leaders and the more restrictions you place on them it gets even harder. With all the regulations place on Scout activities now it makes it difficult to have good activities that the kids actually enjoy. My 11-year old sums up Scouting this way: Scouts make things that are fun to do un-fun. We choose to do the activities outside of the Scouting organization because we can make them fun again.

Deseret Dawg | 9:55 a.m. June 4, 2009

This is absolutely the last straw! The Boy Scouts allow openly gay scouts, but launch a "pogrom" against Scout leaders who aren't sculpted like Hulk Hogan?

That's it! Not only will I never support the Boy Scouts again, but I will lobby against them. Their tax exemptions everywhere should be withdrawn.

RE: Matthew | 10:06 a.m. June 4, 2009

"As for 6'3", 34 inch waist and BMI over 32? I'm skeptical, but perhaps you do just have truly massive thighs, pecs, and biceps."

"Scoutmaster" posted that he is in the overweight category. That puts his BMI at 25-29.9. That puts his weight between 200-239 pounds at 6'3" with a 34 inch waist, not at all unreasonable.

How do I know? Because that describes me as well. I exercise regularly, have low cholesterol, low blood pressure, etc. I regularly have people peg my weight at about 180, but am a solid 220. If you were to meet me, you would not think twice about my build being large or small, its looks just average.

I have broad shoulders that spread my weight out up top and unusually large legs (thanks to cycling) that are hidden by my slacks. So most people never notice that I am "overweight" according the BMI.

Just for fun here is how BMI breaks down (weight if you are 6'3"):

Underweight = 239

RI Reader | 10:09 a.m. June 4, 2009

Just one more reason to stay away from the BSA. They have become the most selfish, arrogant and "elitist" body I have ever seen. Like all good LDS men, I have a scout uniform in the closet, but it is a size 2X. I guess it will stay in the closet now for many more years.

I hope they enjoy a leadership corps of skinny, arrogant white men teaching boys that fat is evil .... and gay is evil ... and handicapped is evil ...

If it weren't for western mormons, I'd bet they'd also say "Mormons" are evil ... but we fund too much of their ridiculous little selfish world.

J Crunch | 10:21 a.m. June 4, 2009

The form can be found by googling boy scout health form and it applies to all adults (not just leaders, dads too) as well as boys. For the record, the gentlemen who says he's 6'3", if he's over 260, he's out of luck according to the restriction.

Scouter | 10:26 a.m. June 4, 2009

I had one fifty-year-old Scoutmaster growing up that would fall into the obese category by BMI, but every scout camp I went to he was up at 5 in the morning running from anywhere between 5 and 15 miles. Of course, he's an army veteran and also a black belt. Does that mean he should be excluded from activities?

Stop with the excuses... | 10:30 a.m. June 4, 2009

I call horse snit on those who say they are healthy even thought they are in the obese range of the BMI. (unless you are a body builder) I am a Scout Master and I applaud the top brass of the organization for taking this stand.

Sure the BMI is not best measure of health but it is the most practical. The BSA doesnt have a traveling doctors office that can do regular blood work for every leader but with a tape measure and a scale, the can regularly check the BMI of leaders.

LVIS | 10:35 a.m. June 4, 2009

This seems like a weighty matter, for sure. Unfortunately, we don't have the real skinny on the why's and wherefore's. Yes, it may seem a bit heavy-handed, but maybe we should lighten up a little until we have the details. On a scale of 1-10, not sure where this really ranks in importance.

OathMan | 10:45 a.m. June 4, 2009

Have we all forgotten that all scouts and leaders take an oath to keep themselves "physically strong?" The problem with Mormon scouting is they try to make it a program for everyone, when it really isn't.

BMI is stupid | 11:15 a.m. June 4, 2009

My husband looks great at about 220 lbs - at 6'0". He has just about the heaviest bone structure of anyone I've ever met (I call his hands meat hooks they are so big), and is built very stocky. By BMI he's supposed to weigh around 180 - he'd be a walking skeleton at that weight.

Anonymous | 11:21 a.m. June 4, 2009

It depends on what they use for the credentials of "overweight," in my opinion if these leaders are not to be allowed on hikes. A height to weight ratio is a terrible and flawed way to measure this, at 6'2'' 240 pounds I would not consider myself overweight for my size... I am a big football player. I honestly could not drop below 200 if I tried, and if that was the line that they draw for leaders to go, I wouldn't be able to do it. It's a stupid rule, and there must be a different way to measure it.

Anonymous | 11:24 a.m. June 4, 2009

It would make more sense to remove Scout leaders who pose dangers to Scouts by allowing them to start fires and camp in flash flood zones in Zions National Park.

iron man skeptic | 11:27 a.m. June 4, 2009

I think I saw you big BMI folks in the Salt Lake Marathon. You were the ones we had to wait 10 minutes for to cross an intersection. Seriously, just because you can hobble your way through at a pace a child could walk faster than, doesn't mean you're in great shape.

mymy | 11:53 a.m. June 4, 2009

meanies.

SJ | 12:05 p.m. June 4, 2009

One more outlandish policy to add to my growing frustrations with the BSA! I think the BSA has become a shadow of what it started out as over 100 years ago.

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