Deseret News | Utah Utes football: Johnson, Sakoda, Whittingham headline All-MWC honors

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Utah Utes football: Johnson, Sakoda, Whittingham headline All-MWC honors

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What determines OPOY? | 9:57 a.m. Dec. 4, 2008

It hurts to see our brethren from the TDS so upset over the throttling they got from the Utes. It hurts so good. The moaning and groaning and silly rhetoric they use to try to make themselves feel better - entertaining. It's so pathetic it's almost cute. If you want to determine the guy with the best skills - have them do a skills challenge. Maybe Max could win the long throw. But the OPOY is the guy that MAKES IT HAPPEN for his team on the field. No one else is even close to BJ in this regard. Surprised he wasn't the unanimous choice (as well as King Louie). Plus, according to Collie, I guess our guys are just living better. And surely that makes BJ all the more deserving.

Anonymous | 10:42 a.m. Dec. 4, 2008

I vote Collie for Dang Impressive Player of the Year Award, or Maxie... Hey, Krueger is still open!!

defense? | 12:15 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

I think it's funny that all these Cougar fans are on here saying that Utah's defense is the reason they won all the games when they were the ones saying the Utah defense wasn't that good all year long. Hate to break it to you, but Brian Johnson does deserve the First Team All MWC honors. Can you say 30 of 36 for 303 yards and 4 touchdowns? Brian came through when it counted. And that's really what matters right? Coming through in clutch moments? Isn't that what the "Quest" is all about?

Comments continue below

Re: reply Just like Heisman | 1:33 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

Last time I checked, special teams was considered offense.

Re: danburtreynolds | 1:38 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

You've proved my point. Yes, you're right, the overall team record does play into the voting for OPOTY, but it shouldn't. That's my point. IT SHOULDN'T MATTER whether you play for the best or worst team...if you're the best offensive player, then you're the best offensive player. End of story.

Collie got snubbed twice this year--once for the Biletnikoff award and now for the MWC OPOTY award. How much does a guy have to do to get recognized for being the best?

danburtreynolds | 2:04 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

RE: danburtreynolds:

IF overall team record shouldn't play a role in the decision what does? What should the criteria be? If it was based purely on stats then there would be no need to vote. Johnson was the most integral part on the highest scoring offense in the conference. He lead (an intangible) his team to a 12-0 record including victories over 3 top 25 teams. He wasn't perfect, but no player in the league was (max's picks, Collie's drops)

By the way, Collie is not the best receiver in the nation, so he didn't deserve the Biletnikoff award.

more than stats | 2:46 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

Bottom line, BJ led the utes to a perfect season with 3 quality wins. Over the team that beat USC, over top 25 TCU, over top 25 byu. Win at Michigan when Michigan had some respect in the first game of the year.

BYU - no quality wins (sorry you were a controversial call away from losing to the worst team in college football).

It doesn't matter because Utah had the perfect season. BYU if you have forgoten what a perfect season means, that you beat every team on your schedule. Thus they are going to take the bulk of the awards.

Re:Re:reply Just like Heisman | 4:29 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

Are we talking about the same sport? There are three phases in Football: Offense, Defense, and Special Teams. Is it that hard for a Cougar fan to understand!

Re: danburtreynolds | 4:32 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

Stats should definitely take the majority of the decision; voting gives way for bias in amid the bureaucracy. Even still, how do you compare stats between a quarterback and a running back or a wide receiver? There will inevitably be a voting component to the decision.

My point is this: how can you call someone the player of the year, most valuable player, best player, etc., when he doesn't perform as well as the next guy? Why does the OPOTY have to go to the QB of the team that won the conference? Why does the Heisman always end up in the hands of the QB from the team that won the national championship?

What basis do you have for saying Collie isn't the best receiver? He leads the NCAA in total catches, total receiving yards, catches per game, receiving yards per game, #2 in yards per catch, and #3 in touchdowns. He had no fumbles and no interceptions on his part. He had 10 consecutive games of 100+ yards of receiving. He most definitely deserved the award.

danburtreynolds | 5:28 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

RE: danburtreynolds:

Now this is a discussion I can get into. First of all, I appreciate your view, and agree that it is very difficult to compare stats across positions.

I have to go with my family for a few hours, but will be back to address your points.

danburtreynolds | 7:38 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

RE: danburtreynolds

As I was saying, I agree that it is difficult to compare players from different positions. Along those lines, I find it hard to say that Collie deserved the award over Johnson, and vice versa. As for why it consistently goes to a QB, I think it is the nature of position. The QB gets more blame and more credit than he should depending on the success of the team. The other point about a QB getting the award is that he is involved in every offensive play. It difficult to say a player who touches the ball on average 10 times a game has as big an impact on a game as the player who touches it 60 times a game and makes more decisions. The receiver may be better at his level of involvement, but the QBs involvement is so much greater it is difficult say the receiver has a bigger offensive impact. I think it is why you rarely see a pro team (Lions notwithstanding) build from the receiver position. The U/BYU game is a good example Collie was good, Hall was bad BYU lost.

re: danburtreynolds | 7:41 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

I'm glad we can discuss this as intelligent people and leave emotion at the door. I'm interested to hear your perspective on this whole deal.

danburtreynolds | 7:48 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

continued

As for why I don't think Collie deserved the award.

First of all, I think Collie is very good. But, I don't think he is the best receiver in the game. Fundamentally, it probably comes down to the different emphasis that we put on stats. I think they are important, but, not the deciding factor. I think stats are only good at evaluating players in a more controlled setting like the pros or within a conference where the playing field is more level. In my opinion, Collie would not be the first option if he played for OU, Texas Tech, Florida, Ok St or Missouri. I think that each of those teams have players who are bigger/faster/more dynamic and all around better receivers. Florida maybe not as much because technically Percy Harvin is a running back even though they line him up a lot as a receiver. But, I think that Maclin, Crabtree, Bryant, Inglesias, are better receivers, even though their numbers aren't as good as Collie's. That's just my opinion, but that is how I can best answer your question.

Re: danburtreynolds | 8:43 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

You've got some good points. I agree with your argument about the QB touching the ball more and making more decisions. On the other hand, having the best QB is only half the battle; you still need good receivers and running backs to make the plays. I guess it's the nature of the beast.

I appreciate your honest and informed answer. I hope BJ goes out with a bang in his last bowl game and can post the same stats he did against BYU. If anything, he's probably the most improved MWC player this year.

danburtreynolds | 9:34 p.m. Dec. 4, 2008

RE: danburtreynolds

I appreciate that we could have a good discussion vs the general Jr. High name calling that usually takes place on this board.

You're right about having to have good skill players. In reality, I think any offensive or defensive award should go to the lines. It all starts with the big uglies.

Good luck to the Gougs in continuing dominance over the Pac-10

great choices!!! | 6:12 a.m. Dec. 5, 2008

I'm a huge BYU fan and have been for all of my adult life. Two of my four sons graduated from there. But I couldn't be more proud of any team than I am of the Utes this year. They won every game and you can't do better than that. And in the biggest rivalry game, the Utes were strong and ready. All of these awards are very deserving. BYU, Max Hall, and Robert Anae need to do a lot of work to improve. They were sharp at the start of the season, but as they settled into a predictable offense that a number of teams handled better than expected, the season fortunes became apparent. A great offense uses many weapons and had BYU used 5-9 receivers and 4 running backs effectively, they would have surely had the expected season. Collie would have been average, but BYU would have been a great team. If BYU doesn't make the change I've articulated, then perhaps they'll see it after another disappointing year in 2009. Congratulaions to Kyle W and all the Utes.

Collie agreement | 6:24 a.m. Dec. 5, 2008

Collie had the statistics because he was Hall's first choice on just about every pass play. If Collie catches a decent percentage of the passes thrown to him, he'll lead the nation, as he did. But to have a great team, BYU needed more diversity in the offense. Each play was predictably to Pitta, Unga, and Collie. Three options is quite different than seven. And those seven positions ought to be filled by thirteen players at a minimum. The offense becomes less predictable and results in the defense having to guess more, leaving them more vulnerable. BYU has a ton of talent, but the offensive strategy woefully waned. This is a team sport and accolades for Collie and Hall and Unga would have been there if BYU would focus on team excellence. I sincerely hope that the coaches understand this flaw in their system. Utah, on the other hand, deserved all the accolades they received because a smart coach and talented quarterback ran an offense with many options that had TCU and BYU on their heels, guessing what would happen next. GO UTES!!

To all the BYU fanatics | 6:43 a.m. Dec. 5, 2008

But UTAH is 12-0!!! Remember that as you argue your points.

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