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Sore losers won't let go in California
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re: Free agent | 2:36 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
The LDS (Mormon's) and other Christian groups as a whole do not HATE gays!
If you read the gay agenda you will realize that their using the Hate is on
purpose... to make those whose are sitting on the fence feel sorry for them and
therefore take up their cause. They know what they are doing - it is all well
planned out - and if you fall for their lies then you are truly a fool!!!!!
re: It dosen't matter | 2:38 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Yes, they are people too. We all agree on this. But what they are trying to do
is to take real rights away from us. How can you not see this??? We do not
think them inhuman - just because we stick up for our rights - get real!
Red | 2:39 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Re: Henry Drummond 10:24 am: "It has never been illegal for Mormons to
vote."
"In 1887, [Congress passed] the Edmunds-Tucker Act.... [M]embers of the Mormon Church ... will not be allowed to sit on juries; they will not have the right to hold office; they will not have the right to vote."
- Ken Verdoia
"In 1887, [Congress passed] the Edmunds-Tucker Act.... [M]embers of the Mormon Church ... will not be allowed to sit on juries; they will not have the right to hold office; they will not have the right to vote."
- Ken Verdoia
Comments continue below
re: Yeah | 2:41 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
you don't appear very smart by your comments!
California is not whinning - They are the ones that won!
It is the gay's EVERYWHERE (not every one of them) that are doing the whinning and the bashing, sending hate male, destroying property, making people loose jobs, etc etc
get your facts straight!
California is not whinning - They are the ones that won!
It is the gay's EVERYWHERE (not every one of them) that are doing the whinning and the bashing, sending hate male, destroying property, making people loose jobs, etc etc
get your facts straight!
It's all about the kids???? | 2:45 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Allow me to quote you:
"I think our creator knows more than we do about the road to happiness. Let's trust him!"
Hold on there pardner, my imaginary friend/creator is not the same as your imaginary friend/creator.
My imaginary friend says your imaginary friend is false. Get ready for battle!
P.S. Aren't gay people icky?
"I think our creator knows more than we do about the road to happiness. Let's trust him!"
Hold on there pardner, my imaginary friend/creator is not the same as your imaginary friend/creator.
My imaginary friend says your imaginary friend is false. Get ready for battle!
P.S. Aren't gay people icky?
Texas | 2:48 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
For all those gay who say Prop 8 lied and misled and that they won't force
their agenda or way of life on everybody, check this out:
eHarmony, a Christian-based match making organization, recently started a gay version of its service because the HomoMaphia sued them. That is what most of the folks, to include the LDS, fear...Once gay marriage is legalized, then every institution who won't support it will be sued, sued, and sued again.
The arguement that churches are trying to legislate morality is a loser, too. Aren't all laws morality? Doesn't society define some things (drugs, prostitution, underage marriage, marriage of siblings, polygamy) as abnormal and not acceptable to society.
No doubt over time, the gays will win their agenda. I wonder if then, they will support the FLDS and their polygamist desires. Isn't that their Constitutional right? No? How, dare you try to limit marriage to two consenting adults. After all, couldn't 4 or 7, or 15 adults consent to a relationship?
eHarmony, a Christian-based match making organization, recently started a gay version of its service because the HomoMaphia sued them. That is what most of the folks, to include the LDS, fear...Once gay marriage is legalized, then every institution who won't support it will be sued, sued, and sued again.
The arguement that churches are trying to legislate morality is a loser, too. Aren't all laws morality? Doesn't society define some things (drugs, prostitution, underage marriage, marriage of siblings, polygamy) as abnormal and not acceptable to society.
No doubt over time, the gays will win their agenda. I wonder if then, they will support the FLDS and their polygamist desires. Isn't that their Constitutional right? No? How, dare you try to limit marriage to two consenting adults. After all, couldn't 4 or 7, or 15 adults consent to a relationship?
What! | 2:50 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Nice article Brother Benson. Did your church edit it first, or do they still
believe in 'Freedom of Speech'? Wait, why would they get involved?
Scott | 2:52 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
"Anti-Mormon bigots" said at 9:40 a.m.:
"It's sad to see anti-Mormon bigotry thinly disguised as pro-gay advocacy."
How about:
It's sad to see anti-gay bigotry thinly disguised as pro-family advocacy.
Not true? You don't hate gays, you're just pro-family? Then how about giving others the benefit of the doubt and believing them when they say that they just want to be able to marry the person they love.
The LDS Church was the most visible and influential participant in the "yes" campaign, so it's not illogical for someone who feels they've been mistreated to focus their efforts on the Church.
Violence and vandalism are wrong, but peaceful protest (and the vast majority of the protest /has/ been peaceful) is an acceptable way of expressing the hurt and sorrow that people within the gay community feel at the outcome of the Prop 8 vote.
"It's sad to see anti-Mormon bigotry thinly disguised as pro-gay advocacy."
How about:
It's sad to see anti-gay bigotry thinly disguised as pro-family advocacy.
Not true? You don't hate gays, you're just pro-family? Then how about giving others the benefit of the doubt and believing them when they say that they just want to be able to marry the person they love.
The LDS Church was the most visible and influential participant in the "yes" campaign, so it's not illogical for someone who feels they've been mistreated to focus their efforts on the Church.
Violence and vandalism are wrong, but peaceful protest (and the vast majority of the protest /has/ been peaceful) is an acceptable way of expressing the hurt and sorrow that people within the gay community feel at the outcome of the Prop 8 vote.
This is not about rights | 2:52 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
this is about what God wants, and he doesn't want gay people married.
In the bible, Dog says, "gays shall not marry".
Pretty simple, in my mind.
In the bible, Dog says, "gays shall not marry".
Pretty simple, in my mind.
re: Tantrum | 2:53 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Hey - I have not heard this - please site your source
Herb Gravy | 2:54 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Oh, my. Oh, my!
Scott | 3:01 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
1:56 p.m. said:
"If you were killed in a car accident would you honestly want your young boys to be placed in the care of two gay men?"
If nobody in my immediate family was able to care for my kids, I would have absolutely no problem with them being taken care of by two gay men. I know a gay couple who is raising two boys, and they are some of the most caring and involved parents I've met.
I would certainly prefer gay parents for my kids over many of those who have commented on this article. As a gay man (who has never acted on his attractions) and a Mormon, it makes me sad to read some of the judgmental and hate-filled remarks being made in the name of religion.
I'm comfortable with who I am and able to read such comments without taking them personally, but I know many gay members of the Church who struggle with shame for who they are, and comments like many on this forum only increase the pain and self-loathing they feel. Please try to remember that when you demonize gays you might be demonizing your neighbor.
"If you were killed in a car accident would you honestly want your young boys to be placed in the care of two gay men?"
If nobody in my immediate family was able to care for my kids, I would have absolutely no problem with them being taken care of by two gay men. I know a gay couple who is raising two boys, and they are some of the most caring and involved parents I've met.
I would certainly prefer gay parents for my kids over many of those who have commented on this article. As a gay man (who has never acted on his attractions) and a Mormon, it makes me sad to read some of the judgmental and hate-filled remarks being made in the name of religion.
I'm comfortable with who I am and able to read such comments without taking them personally, but I know many gay members of the Church who struggle with shame for who they are, and comments like many on this forum only increase the pain and self-loathing they feel. Please try to remember that when you demonize gays you might be demonizing your neighbor.
Sore Losers? | 3:01 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
I can imagine the the hand wringing moral indignation that would be going on in
ward houses around the world if this had not passed.
And I imagine an effort to get this back on the ballot again would be in full force by all the out-of-the-state-of-California mormons.
So imagine where your outrage would lie if tables were turned.
The measure passed. I accept that, but I don't have any personal tie to it. But the LDS church and its members (among other religions and groups, I understand, but we are in Utah and our dominant culture was very vocal sticking its nose in California's business)sure didn't accept the court's ruling and moved to change the law.
Why didn't they just accept what it was and move on? The answer could be that they are sore losers, perhaps? Or that they went through the legal processes afforded our citizens in this country - just as the people ridiculed in this column are doing.
And I imagine an effort to get this back on the ballot again would be in full force by all the out-of-the-state-of-California mormons.
So imagine where your outrage would lie if tables were turned.
The measure passed. I accept that, but I don't have any personal tie to it. But the LDS church and its members (among other religions and groups, I understand, but we are in Utah and our dominant culture was very vocal sticking its nose in California's business)sure didn't accept the court's ruling and moved to change the law.
Why didn't they just accept what it was and move on? The answer could be that they are sore losers, perhaps? Or that they went through the legal processes afforded our citizens in this country - just as the people ridiculed in this column are doing.
Great Article | 3:02 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Obvious point made - all these states have passed the same amendment that was
passed in California (twice), yet there were no hate-filled riots or threats
made against the majority in those states.
I'm all for rights and every American should be extended rights to live a happy and productive life; however, there also should be limits given. And, I love how the gay and lesbian community says they simply want to be accepted, but if they're not their retaliation is more violent, bigoted and hateful than anything that they claim is perpetuated against them. "All we want is to be accepted, but be warned that if we're not, and if the majority votes against us, we will riot against that majority and will threaten their lives and their families..."
I'm all for rights and every American should be extended rights to live a happy and productive life; however, there also should be limits given. And, I love how the gay and lesbian community says they simply want to be accepted, but if they're not their retaliation is more violent, bigoted and hateful than anything that they claim is perpetuated against them. "All we want is to be accepted, but be warned that if we're not, and if the majority votes against us, we will riot against that majority and will threaten their lives and their families..."
Deseret News Readers... | 3:04 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Sure can't get enough of all things gay. Just look at the most widely read
and commented on articles the last several months--gay, gay and more gay. I
have to chuckle, you all sure love yourselves some gay.
To Anon @ 2:00 | 3:07 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Liberals don't believe in marriage? This is news to me!
I have a slew of liberal friends, almost all of whom are married.
Huh.
I have a slew of liberal friends, almost all of whom are married.
Huh.
realitycheck | 3:10 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
re one human family response 12:53pm
bigoted response? did you actually read the 12:38 pm post? how was that bigoted?
you also failed to answer the question. do you really think 6 million americans just decided to be gay? if it's not a gene, how do you explain it?
really - we want to know. should 6 million americans be unhappy for their entire lives just so you can push your morals on others?
why are you mormon? it's one of the most bizarre religions ever invented. yet you believe that a Temperance League guy in the 1800s was given the plan for you to be like God. using seer stones and all kinds of Lord of the Rings type stuff... And you believe him.!!
Is that a gene problem? If someone told you - don't be mormon - would you do it? just because they and their friends said it was immoral? (and many think it is sacreligious.)
no - you want your rights. so who are you to push for the removal of the rights of others? what makes you so special? have you learned nothing at all?
you are the bigot and can't even recognize it...
bigoted response? did you actually read the 12:38 pm post? how was that bigoted?
you also failed to answer the question. do you really think 6 million americans just decided to be gay? if it's not a gene, how do you explain it?
really - we want to know. should 6 million americans be unhappy for their entire lives just so you can push your morals on others?
why are you mormon? it's one of the most bizarre religions ever invented. yet you believe that a Temperance League guy in the 1800s was given the plan for you to be like God. using seer stones and all kinds of Lord of the Rings type stuff... And you believe him.!!
Is that a gene problem? If someone told you - don't be mormon - would you do it? just because they and their friends said it was immoral? (and many think it is sacreligious.)
no - you want your rights. so who are you to push for the removal of the rights of others? what makes you so special? have you learned nothing at all?
you are the bigot and can't even recognize it...
YouBet | 3:11 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Setting aside morality, gay, straight, man, woman, slave, bible, churches . . .
who ever heard of a consitution being amended to guarantee that certain people
NOT have certain rights under the law? Please people . . . this is the United
States. Prop 8 will not pass Supreme Court scrutiny.
Observer | 3:11 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
As somone far smarter than I once said:
"If you want homosexuals to stop having sex, let them get married. It works for the rest of us."
"If you want homosexuals to stop having sex, let them get married. It works for the rest of us."
Jane | 3:11 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Great article, thank you!
Loved the Article | 3:14 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Shows how out of touch these people are with the values of Middle America, Which
I am proud to call my home. I hope this wakes up the silent majority in this
proud nation.
realitycheck | 3:14 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
re realitycheck 1:01pm
"since when did paying taxes become a right"
what? the point is gay couples want to file as "joined" - currently listed as married on the tax forms, but they don't care what you call it. If you and your wife get a tax break, the gay couple wants a tax break...
what don't you get? do I need a translator? and no, I'm not gay. but it's really "slow" people like you that need to have it explained so many times...
"since when did paying taxes become a right"
what? the point is gay couples want to file as "joined" - currently listed as married on the tax forms, but they don't care what you call it. If you and your wife get a tax break, the gay couple wants a tax break...
what don't you get? do I need a translator? and no, I'm not gay. but it's really "slow" people like you that need to have it explained so many times...
Scott | 3:15 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
2:09 p.m. said:
"Since homosexuality occurs in the minority of the population that suggests that it might be some type of biological or genetic disorder..."
People thought the same thing about left-handedness for a long time. Left-handedness has been associated with witchcraft and devil worship. Those who are born left-handed have historically been forced to try to overcome their natures and adapt to a right-handed world. It's only fairly recently that we've realized that left-handedness is a perfectly normal trait that occurs in a minority of the population.
Your argument makes no sense. You say that there is no evidence that indicates that homosexuality is caused by genes, but then claim that it is a genetic (i.e. "caused by genes") defect.
In truth, studies have indicated a variety of factors that "cause" homosexuality, including genetics, prenatal environment, and developmental influences throughout childhood. Less important than what "causes" it is the modern realization that homosexuality is a normal orientation in a minority of the population. (Even the Church now recognizes it as a "core characteristic"--see "Same-Gender Attraction" on the Church's website--and one that in many cases cannot be changed).
"Since homosexuality occurs in the minority of the population that suggests that it might be some type of biological or genetic disorder..."
People thought the same thing about left-handedness for a long time. Left-handedness has been associated with witchcraft and devil worship. Those who are born left-handed have historically been forced to try to overcome their natures and adapt to a right-handed world. It's only fairly recently that we've realized that left-handedness is a perfectly normal trait that occurs in a minority of the population.
Your argument makes no sense. You say that there is no evidence that indicates that homosexuality is caused by genes, but then claim that it is a genetic (i.e. "caused by genes") defect.
In truth, studies have indicated a variety of factors that "cause" homosexuality, including genetics, prenatal environment, and developmental influences throughout childhood. Less important than what "causes" it is the modern realization that homosexuality is a normal orientation in a minority of the population. (Even the Church now recognizes it as a "core characteristic"--see "Same-Gender Attraction" on the Church's website--and one that in many cases cannot be changed).
realitycheck | 3:18 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
re - realitycheck poster 1:06pm
wow - we do seem to have a communication problem, don't we?
I, as an individual, can list my wife on my health insurance. a gay person cannot do that.
I can file married when I do my taxes. a gay couple cannot do that.
it's unclear to me where you are confused. please either refrain from answering, or be concise in your answers. It's not rocket science...
wow - we do seem to have a communication problem, don't we?
I, as an individual, can list my wife on my health insurance. a gay person cannot do that.
I can file married when I do my taxes. a gay couple cannot do that.
it's unclear to me where you are confused. please either refrain from answering, or be concise in your answers. It's not rocket science...
civil unions vs marriage 1:08pm | 3:21 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
state benefits are not the same thing. in california, you cannot list your
"significant other" on your medical insurance. you can file a joint
state tax return.
are you all really so naive that you think this was just done for the heck of it? do you really believe the propaganda saying everyone already has these rights?
are you all really so naive that you think this was just done for the heck of it? do you really believe the propaganda saying everyone already has these rights?
Result of Prop 8? | 3:26 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
It seems the only thing Prop 8 accomplished is making California and indeed,the
whole country acutely aware of what Non-LDS and Ex-LDS in Utah are very familiar
with. Namely, how the LDS treat those they don't like and don't
approve of.
News Flash | 3:26 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
To those of you who are against gay marriage because then gays would get to
adopt kids:
Guess what? Gays in California get to adopt kids any way! So do gays in Florida.
Guess what? Gays in California get to adopt kids any way! So do gays in Florida.
re: re@ugh@12:23 | 3:29 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
If you "hardly doubt" does that mean you mostly agree?
I am thoroughly steeped in the history of the LDS faith. My comments are not directed at the majority of its members. How interesting that you thought they were.
The "ugh" is for the nasty display of arrogance, judgment and the sound of cackling glee that leaps from the words of the comments posted here. I stand by my opinion that if all of you who throw such withering words at others for stating their thoughts were left with only yourselves, you would surely soon turn on each other. Your behavior as displayed here is a corrosive habit.
I am thoroughly steeped in the history of the LDS faith. My comments are not directed at the majority of its members. How interesting that you thought they were.
The "ugh" is for the nasty display of arrogance, judgment and the sound of cackling glee that leaps from the words of the comments posted here. I stand by my opinion that if all of you who throw such withering words at others for stating their thoughts were left with only yourselves, you would surely soon turn on each other. Your behavior as displayed here is a corrosive habit.
And another news flash | 3:29 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
eHarmony was sued in a state that does NOT allow gay marriage - so obviously
allowing gay marriage would have no impact on suits such as this anyway!
realitycheck | 3:30 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
re poster 2:32pm
sorry, but my brother is married to a fine woman, as am I. Although I believe in equality for all, I am quite heterosexual.
and I don't push my religious moral agenda on others so I obviously am not mormon...
sorry, but my brother is married to a fine woman, as am I. Although I believe in equality for all, I am quite heterosexual.
and I don't push my religious moral agenda on others so I obviously am not mormon...
Kevin Olson | 3:31 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
I'm going to spend every vacation dollar that I have in Utah. Forget
California. I'm sure that I will go back to California some day, but my
money will go to Utah, Colorado, Arizona, Oregon, and all the other 30 states
that have voted on protecting the definition of marriage as being between a man
and women.
to See the Light | 3:35 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Unchangeable. . ."thou shalt not murder" unless it is to defend
yourself, or your property, or someone else, or in times of war, or the victim
is of what you consider a sub-species, or I who gives you the right to take over
their lands, or . . .
Try another argument.
Try another argument.
Vegas702Jer | 3:37 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Wow, the more I read the sadder it gets. This is why I left the church.
Politics and Religion don't belong in the same sentence. I don't
think it's a matter of the church "hating gays" but let's
draw the line and leave other states alone.
to it's all about the kids???? | 3:38 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
I'm not sure what your "imaginary friend/creator" is. I assume
you are referring to your atheism. Ok so you are an atheist. Fine, we do live in
a country that allows you to worship anything from the all mighty dollar (not so
mighty anymore) to a golden calf to the actual creator of the earth (Jesus
Christ). You don't have to believe in God but remember your opinion
doesn't determine truth (nor does mine). Truth exists independent and in
spite of the ignorant opinions of man and opinion alone has no power to alter
truth. Having said that, let's talk about science - I assume you at least
accept that?? It is SCIENTIFIC FACT that homosexuals have much higher than
normal suicide rate as well as drug abuse and AIDS. So, let's just throw
young, innocent children into that sort of environment and see what comes out
the other end. Use your imagination!!!
realitycheck | 3:40 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
what is the worst thing that can happen if prop 8 is overturned and federal law
changes to require gay unions be recognized?
I'm not gay, but very interested in hearing the mormon response to this. (I'm sure Sarah Palin would consider it to be the final step to "end of days"...)
so - what's the worst that can happen? no more babies because everyone is gay? everyone dies of aids? the devil takes over the world?
I would really like to know... enlighten me...
I'm not gay, but very interested in hearing the mormon response to this. (I'm sure Sarah Palin would consider it to be the final step to "end of days"...)
so - what's the worst that can happen? no more babies because everyone is gay? everyone dies of aids? the devil takes over the world?
I would really like to know... enlighten me...
Anonymous | 3:43 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Sore Losers (3:01 pm):
Let's vote on gay marriage until the cows come home.......or until it passes. The people of California have now passed this initiative twice. The first time, a handful of judges decided that the majority of the people who voted on this didn't matter, and overturned it. Who marched and protested when the judges ruled against the people? Please provide sources.
The "gay" protestors are making spectacles of themselves. They want to protest the Sundance Film Festival? Great, hurt the one advocate they have, Robert Redford and the sympathetic Park City community.
Let's vote on gay marriage until the cows come home.......or until it passes. The people of California have now passed this initiative twice. The first time, a handful of judges decided that the majority of the people who voted on this didn't matter, and overturned it. Who marched and protested when the judges ruled against the people? Please provide sources.
The "gay" protestors are making spectacles of themselves. They want to protest the Sundance Film Festival? Great, hurt the one advocate they have, Robert Redford and the sympathetic Park City community.
re: This is not about rights | 3:44 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
lol
Thanks for the laugh. It made reading all of these comments completely worthwhile.
:o)
Thanks for the laugh. It made reading all of these comments completely worthwhile.
:o)
One Human Family | 3:44 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Have any of you that responded to my previous post ever actually spoken with a
gay person? Some of your posts are so incredibly ignorant and hateful. I
sincerely hope you are not fellow Mormons. If so, you should be ashamed of
yourselves.
No one answered my previous question. When did you choose your sexual orientation? In addition, could YOU live a life of celibacy void of any intimate relationships? Please really think about it. This is exactly what you are asking our gay brothers and sisters to do.
No one answered my previous question. When did you choose your sexual orientation? In addition, could YOU live a life of celibacy void of any intimate relationships? Please really think about it. This is exactly what you are asking our gay brothers and sisters to do.
the HLDS | 3:46 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
I'm thinking that the gay community needs to become a religion. then they
would have all kinds of rights, and could push their moral agenda on others.
they could call the religion Homosexual Church of Latter Day Saints or HLDS.
that way the mormons would be on their side and get laws passed just like the mormons did here. and they can confuse the population into thinking all mormons are gay, not unlike the FLDS does concerning polygamy.
isn't religious freedom wonderful?
that way the mormons would be on their side and get laws passed just like the mormons did here. and they can confuse the population into thinking all mormons are gay, not unlike the FLDS does concerning polygamy.
isn't religious freedom wonderful?
Cougar Blue | 4:04 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Why is it so difficult for Mr. Benson and many others to realize that in a
representataive democracy, you don't assume that the majority always wins.
That is precisely the point of the way this country's constitution was set
up. I don't care if the anti-gays crowd wins every vote until he__
freezes over, it is still wrong and is a slap in the face of our form of
government. When it comes to treatment under the law, the majority does not
have the right to rule the minority. That's simply the way it is.
to anonymous | 4:04 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Mormons were Democrats, as a block, until they felt the Democrats threw them
under the bus on the polygamy issue. After that, the Mormons as a block became
Republicans.
Forced Downmythroat | 4:05 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
I considered myself very tolerant of the LGBT community until the aftermath of
Prop.8. I had gay friends in highschool and later on I had gay friends at work.
I thought they were great friends and I appreciated them. It makes me sick that
gay people are now refusing to be tolerant of me and my lifestyle. I believe
that marriage is religious in nature. And now, the gay community (who is
generally unreligious) is telling me that I am wrong. I now must believe in a
definition of marriage that they have created, so that they can feel more
accepted. Unfortunately, they feel it neccessary to force their lifestyle on me,
even though I would never force my lifestyle (heterosexual) on them. It's
funny how what goes around doesn't come around.
re: Reality Check | 4:06 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
I think Mr. Reality Check is getting pretty upset. Isn't that usually what
happens when people are proven wrong. BTW, I'm not the one you were
addressing but I'll answer you question. "YES" 6 million
Americans CHOSE to be gay just like many millions choose to smoke.
Homosexuality is and always was an immoral practice and a sin. Perhaps the
shame some feel is that they know they are wrong and their conscience is telling
them what they're doing is wrong. You mentioned genetics. How can you not
see that it's genetically wrong. you can't put two male plugs
together or two female ends. They're not compatible.
Gays are now worse off ... | 4:12 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
So, we have all now seen what the radical gay movement is "REALLY" all
about. Intimidation, threats, violence , hate, etc.... So much for peace loving
folks who just wants equal rights. This has NEVER been about equal rights. This
has ALWAYS been about shoving the radical twisted, gay ideology down the throats
of everyone else in society and if they don't like it or agree with it just
shove harder. My personal resolve has been significantly strengthened to limit
and regulate this dangerous segment of society.
Law | 4:13 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Actually RealityCheck you are wrong...again. In California if you are a
registered domestic partner you MAY file taxes jointly.
Also in California regarding insurance, a domestic partner might be included just as a legal spouse might be included and depends on the employer. Simply because you can place your spouse on insurance doesn't mean ALL can.
Also in California regarding insurance, a domestic partner might be included just as a legal spouse might be included and depends on the employer. Simply because you can place your spouse on insurance doesn't mean ALL can.
Query | 4:16 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
Why is the Supreme Court of California seemingly always referred to by the Yes
on 8 proponents as a "few, liberal San Francisco-based judges?"
Yes, the Supreme Court of California been based in San Francisco, with satellite offices in Sacramento and Los Angeles, but, as far as liberality is concerned, I doubt that 6 Republican-appointed judges are extreme leftists.
Yes, the Supreme Court of California been based in San Francisco, with satellite offices in Sacramento and Los Angeles, but, as far as liberality is concerned, I doubt that 6 Republican-appointed judges are extreme leftists.
re - its all about kids 3:38pm | 4:17 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
perhaps gays have a higher suicide rate and instance of aids because they are
persecuted every day. why worry about aids when all the mormons on here wish
the gay population would just curl up and die? why not commit suicide when you
are belittled daily?
I'm not gay, but I imagine the pressures of the moral majority would be devastating to anyone that was...
I'm not gay, but I imagine the pressures of the moral majority would be devastating to anyone that was...
Re: Ken Verdoia | 4:17 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
"In 1887, [Congress passed] the Edmunds-Tucker Act.... [M]embers of the
Mormon Church ... will not be allowed to sit on juries; they will not have the
right to hold office; they will not have the right to vote."
Don't know where you dug up this quote Ken but its not accurate. Probably was an opinion piece. The Edmonds-Tucker Act did not target Mormons by name. It simply stated that to be on a jury, to hold office, or to vote an individual had to denouce poligamy. Obviously many Mormons wouldn't denounce poligamy but that was my argument orginally. Mormons were never unable to vote!
Before anyone else suggests laws were passed that stated Mormons couldn't vote go look up the entire Edmunds-Tucker Act resolutuion on page 635 of volume 24 of the US Statutes at Large.
Don't know where you dug up this quote Ken but its not accurate. Probably was an opinion piece. The Edmonds-Tucker Act did not target Mormons by name. It simply stated that to be on a jury, to hold office, or to vote an individual had to denouce poligamy. Obviously many Mormons wouldn't denounce poligamy but that was my argument orginally. Mormons were never unable to vote!
Before anyone else suggests laws were passed that stated Mormons couldn't vote go look up the entire Edmunds-Tucker Act resolutuion on page 635 of volume 24 of the US Statutes at Large.
I have a question | 4:18 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
re: reality check and civil unions ve marriage
IF this is true what you say about these two thngs (medical insurance and taxes) then why dosen't the gay agenda work on solving these thing another way then by changing marraige. Then we all could be happy - I would support you in this whole heartily but when you try to change marraige and in so doing take rights away from us - then you will not get my support - It seem to me and a whole lot of other people that the gays want A LOT more then just these two things or they would not be fighting so hard to get marraige changed.
P.S. I have read the gay agenda..and a few other agendas put out by gays... so have a lot of other people.
IF this is true what you say about these two thngs (medical insurance and taxes) then why dosen't the gay agenda work on solving these thing another way then by changing marraige. Then we all could be happy - I would support you in this whole heartily but when you try to change marraige and in so doing take rights away from us - then you will not get my support - It seem to me and a whole lot of other people that the gays want A LOT more then just these two things or they would not be fighting so hard to get marraige changed.
P.S. I have read the gay agenda..and a few other agendas put out by gays... so have a lot of other people.
Kevin | 4:19 p.m. Dec. 1, 2008
@IT's ALL ABOUT KIDS!!!! | 1:56 p.m.
I know it's next to impossible but change attitudes on here, but gay and lesbian parenting enjoys broad support from medical experts. Organizations that have officially supported adoption by same-sex couples include
the American Psychological Association,
the Child Welfare League of America,
the American Bar Association,
the American Psychiatric Association,
the National Association of Social Workers,
the North American Council on Adoptable Children,
the American Academy of Pediatrics,
the American Psychoanalytic Association,
and the American Academy of Family Physicians.[3]
The American Psychological Association states in its Resolution on Sexual Orientation, Parents, and Children (adopted July 2004):
there is no scientific evidence that parenting effectiveness is related to parental sexual orientation: lesbian and gay parents are as likely as heterosexual parents to provide supportive and healthy environments for their children"; and "research has shown that the adjustment, development, and psychological well-being of children is unrelated to parental sexual orientation and that the children of lesbian and gay parents are as likely as those of heterosexual parents to flourish."[1]
My source is wikipedia under LGBT_parenting.
I know it's next to impossible but change attitudes on here, but gay and lesbian parenting enjoys broad support from medical experts. Organizations that have officially supported adoption by same-sex couples include
the American Psychological Association,
the Child Welfare League of America,
the American Bar Association,
the American Psychiatric Association,
the National Association of Social Workers,
the North American Council on Adoptable Children,
the American Academy of Pediatrics,
the American Psychoanalytic Association,
and the American Academy of Family Physicians.[3]
The American Psychological Association states in its Resolution on Sexual Orientation, Parents, and Children (adopted July 2004):
there is no scientific evidence that parenting effectiveness is related to parental sexual orientation: lesbian and gay parents are as likely as heterosexual parents to provide supportive and healthy environments for their children"; and "research has shown that the adjustment, development, and psychological well-being of children is unrelated to parental sexual orientation and that the children of lesbian and gay parents are as likely as those of heterosexual parents to flourish."[1]
My source is wikipedia under LGBT_parenting.
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