Reader comments
FLDS classes to focus on 'core strengths'
103 comments | Read story
- Page:
- < Previous
- 1
- 2
- 3
- Next >
Are you kidding me? | 2:25 p.m. July 31, 2008
This is the best CPS can do in the way of Parenting classes... are you kidding
me????? CPS removed the children from their home, seperated them from their
parents for weeks and weeks and now the best they can do are classes on
diversity...classes on tolerance...these parents have a life!! Making them go to
these classes is a waste of their time.. matter of fact, the entire ordeal has
been a waste of their time and a needless hardship on the women, men and the
children being put through this. I am not a member of FDLS... I am simply a
person living in Texas hoping that CPS will be sued in the end by every FDLS
member out there so CPS can be put out of business and be forced to start the
entire stucture over from scratch. If any FDLS folks are reading this...my
prayers are with you.
to realitycheck 12:34 | 2:28 p.m. July 31, 2008
Who decides which religions are extreme and which ones aren't? You? The
Texas government? How can you say that the FLDS children are forced into their
religion and given no choice? Have you lived with the FLDS? Do you know them? Or
are you just buying into the tabloid media stories and sensational memoirs
written to pander to a jaded public? Enjoying reading a memoir about the
travails of one person's experience is one thing. But when that book
incites the full force of the Texas government to bear down on a helpless
community, and shred all their civil rights to pieces then we have a problem.
Hopefully you can see that.
re zxcvbnm 1:31pm | 2:32 p.m. July 31, 2008
So you gave 5 examples, and none are religious extremists. Shouldn't you
be comparing apples to apples, like the FLDS and Wahhabi muslims?
Comments continue below
Billingsley | 2:36 p.m. July 31, 2008
I'm not a FLDS fan | 12:44 p.m. July 31, 2008
"Why don't they teach classes on human sexuality and development and why it is wrong to force barely pubescent girls into forced adult sexual relationships? (i.e. rape) "
Because if there were any cases of forced sexual relationships with "barely pubescent girls", the state would have retained custody and there would be no need for parenting classes.
The thing you don't seem to understand is that CPS can say anything in public for the purpose of manipulating public opinion, but when they are under oath, the have to tell the truth or go to jail. When CPS was under oath, no evidence of "rape" was presented. Go figure.
"Why don't they teach classes on human sexuality and development and why it is wrong to force barely pubescent girls into forced adult sexual relationships? (i.e. rape) "
Because if there were any cases of forced sexual relationships with "barely pubescent girls", the state would have retained custody and there would be no need for parenting classes.
The thing you don't seem to understand is that CPS can say anything in public for the purpose of manipulating public opinion, but when they are under oath, the have to tell the truth or go to jail. When CPS was under oath, no evidence of "rape" was presented. Go figure.
Robert | 2:36 p.m. July 31, 2008
Shirl | 12:19 p.m. July 31, 2008
"why don't we have camera's in their homes for about 6 months and see what their day to day actions are!"
Ask George Orwell.
"why don't we have camera's in their homes for about 6 months and see what their day to day actions are!"
Ask George Orwell.
YFZ mobsters | 3:03 p.m. July 31, 2008
The raid was a fiasco and unconstitutional, but these bully boys of the FLDS get
no sympathy from me. I agree with Harry Reid that the polygamous sects resemble
organized crime syndicates. The women and children are treated like property
and welfare cash-machines, and lived without knowing their rights as
Americans.
This is a women's and children's rights issue, not a religion issue.
This is a women's and children's rights issue, not a religion issue.
FLDS be Grateful | 3:12 p.m. July 31, 2008
This may seem heavy handed, but the FLDS culture is degenerate and Texas is
offering them a(perhaps unwelcome) hand up.
Jesus taught in as much as ye have done it to the least of these ye have done it unto me.
However the FLDS for all their zeal and religiousness, to not practice this. They treat blacks as if they are sub-standard. Some of the children said things to black counselors during their "being held" that indicates this.
This religion is strict in many things, but the core of what is supposed to be religion they miss. They are missing the mark.
I hope they are also taught that is is wrong to kick young teens out of their homes before they are able to fend for themselves, leaving them either to starve or live a life of crime or depend on charity.
FLDS you are a degenerate culture. You can't see this? Be grateful that society is reaching in and helping to give you a decent culture.
Jesus taught in as much as ye have done it to the least of these ye have done it unto me.
However the FLDS for all their zeal and religiousness, to not practice this. They treat blacks as if they are sub-standard. Some of the children said things to black counselors during their "being held" that indicates this.
This religion is strict in many things, but the core of what is supposed to be religion they miss. They are missing the mark.
I hope they are also taught that is is wrong to kick young teens out of their homes before they are able to fend for themselves, leaving them either to starve or live a life of crime or depend on charity.
FLDS you are a degenerate culture. You can't see this? Be grateful that society is reaching in and helping to give you a decent culture.
Dennis | 3:11 p.m. July 31, 2008
Cats | 7:22 a.m. July 31, 2008
"Teaching children to be racist and frightened of everyone is abuse." "Forcing women..."
If CPS had had evidence of this, the kids would not have been returned to their parents.
"Isolating... refusing to allow them the freedom to choose their own life's course is abuse."
Amish? Hassidic Jews?
"warped culture being lead by false prophets with out-of-control sex drive and megalomaniac egos is a form of abuse."
Gay marriage=warped culture
George Bush=megalomaniac
Bill Clinton=out of control sex drive
Pat Robinson=false prophet
Teaching children to fear the color red is a form of abuse.
No, they teach them to revere the color red.
"Warren Jeffs has publicly stated he is NOT a prophet, NEVER was a prophet and is one of the MOST WICKED."
Yes, a man in prison who is in poor heath can reach the breaking point. We didn�t need you to tell us that.
"Texas is only trying to help FLDS."
By illegally raiding a community, and detaining over 400 kids, Texas has lost the benefit of the doubt. We can only assume that ANYTHING Texas does is intended to do these people harm.
"Teaching children to be racist and frightened of everyone is abuse." "Forcing women..."
If CPS had had evidence of this, the kids would not have been returned to their parents.
"Isolating... refusing to allow them the freedom to choose their own life's course is abuse."
Amish? Hassidic Jews?
"warped culture being lead by false prophets with out-of-control sex drive and megalomaniac egos is a form of abuse."
Gay marriage=warped culture
George Bush=megalomaniac
Bill Clinton=out of control sex drive
Pat Robinson=false prophet
Teaching children to fear the color red is a form of abuse.
No, they teach them to revere the color red.
"Warren Jeffs has publicly stated he is NOT a prophet, NEVER was a prophet and is one of the MOST WICKED."
Yes, a man in prison who is in poor heath can reach the breaking point. We didn�t need you to tell us that.
"Texas is only trying to help FLDS."
By illegally raiding a community, and detaining over 400 kids, Texas has lost the benefit of the doubt. We can only assume that ANYTHING Texas does is intended to do these people harm.
Questions to ask to find the | 3:16 p.m. July 31, 2008
Extremes might be:
1. Are the teachings mandatory to be a "good person", "get to heaven" or even to stay in the group?
2. Is "thinking for yourself" encouraged? Does a person feel threatened if they think "outside the lines"?
3. Is respect of others no matter the gender taught? (not just respect as far as mother or father or religious leader, but respect for just being a person.)
1. Are the teachings mandatory to be a "good person", "get to heaven" or even to stay in the group?
2. Is "thinking for yourself" encouraged? Does a person feel threatened if they think "outside the lines"?
3. Is respect of others no matter the gender taught? (not just respect as far as mother or father or religious leader, but respect for just being a person.)
realitycheck | 3:21 p.m. July 31, 2008
well, the FLDS should feel like they are in good company now.
Warren Jeffs had all dogs banned in Short Creek (and my understanding is he had them "disposed of" too).
The religious police in Saudi Arabia just issued an edict that no pets could be sold or walked in the capital city because of "the rising phenomenon of men using cats and dogs to make passes at women. If a man is caught with a pet, the pet will be immediately confiscated and the man will be referred to religious authorities."
This isn't Saudi Arabia, yet you limit rights just as much as they do. Why is that? And why live here, in the land of the free, if you aren't going to give your people freedom?
by the way - JrzWrld - I'm not sure where you got the 50% number, but I can almost guarantee the number would be MUCH higher if the children were properly educated. The ratio of Middle Easterners adopting a western attitude (as they become educated) is far higher than westerners adopting Middle Eastern attitudes. That's why the Saudis ban western things - not for religion - it's to control people.
Warren Jeffs had all dogs banned in Short Creek (and my understanding is he had them "disposed of" too).
The religious police in Saudi Arabia just issued an edict that no pets could be sold or walked in the capital city because of "the rising phenomenon of men using cats and dogs to make passes at women. If a man is caught with a pet, the pet will be immediately confiscated and the man will be referred to religious authorities."
This isn't Saudi Arabia, yet you limit rights just as much as they do. Why is that? And why live here, in the land of the free, if you aren't going to give your people freedom?
by the way - JrzWrld - I'm not sure where you got the 50% number, but I can almost guarantee the number would be MUCH higher if the children were properly educated. The ratio of Middle Easterners adopting a western attitude (as they become educated) is far higher than westerners adopting Middle Eastern attitudes. That's why the Saudis ban western things - not for religion - it's to control people.
Gene | 3:23 p.m. July 31, 2008
realitycheck | 2:26 p.m. July 31, 2008
�they get 10 hrs of sermons and 2 hr of actual usable teaching.�
Yeah, right. 10 hours of sermons per day.
Some great reality check.
�they get 10 hrs of sermons and 2 hr of actual usable teaching.�
Yeah, right. 10 hours of sermons per day.
Some great reality check.
realitycheck | 3:47 p.m. July 31, 2008
re- to realitycheck 2:28pm:
you're kidding. right? They have taken every possible bible quote, and then some, and turned each one into a rule. They isolate their members and promote rule after rule that removes rights. That's not extreme?
Living in FLDS would be like living in Saudi Arabia as a Wahhabi, except the Saudis promote higher education, and actually send their children here to learn. (Unless you are a woman of course. If so, your fate is similar to the FLDS....)
The fact is, the FLDS are AFRAID to let their people get well educated, because it would spell the end to their culture. That's the problem. Their restrictive lifestyle has less to do with religion than it has to do with the men preserving their lifestyle.
If you can't tell the difference between an extremist organization and a moderate one, then you need to take some time to think about it. The removal of what we consider basic human rights and freedoms is a good place to start....
you're kidding. right? They have taken every possible bible quote, and then some, and turned each one into a rule. They isolate their members and promote rule after rule that removes rights. That's not extreme?
Living in FLDS would be like living in Saudi Arabia as a Wahhabi, except the Saudis promote higher education, and actually send their children here to learn. (Unless you are a woman of course. If so, your fate is similar to the FLDS....)
The fact is, the FLDS are AFRAID to let their people get well educated, because it would spell the end to their culture. That's the problem. Their restrictive lifestyle has less to do with religion than it has to do with the men preserving their lifestyle.
If you can't tell the difference between an extremist organization and a moderate one, then you need to take some time to think about it. The removal of what we consider basic human rights and freedoms is a good place to start....
Extremists? | 3:56 p.m. July 31, 2008
Here's an extreme quotation for you "He that loveth father or mother
more than me is not worthy of me; and he that loveth son or daughter more than
me is not worthy of me."
That, in case anyone is interested, is a quotation from Jesus Christ, from the King James version of the Bible--Matthew 10:37.
How do Christians (of whatever sect they may be) translate that into their daily lives?
If you truly believe in your religion, whatever it may be, doesn't it have to come first in your life?
The catch, I suppose, is to make sure that your religion is based on eternal truths and not man-made ones. Not easy in today's world.
That, in case anyone is interested, is a quotation from Jesus Christ, from the King James version of the Bible--Matthew 10:37.
How do Christians (of whatever sect they may be) translate that into their daily lives?
If you truly believe in your religion, whatever it may be, doesn't it have to come first in your life?
The catch, I suppose, is to make sure that your religion is based on eternal truths and not man-made ones. Not easy in today's world.
you must be joking | 4:10 p.m. July 31, 2008
Great the state of Texas is telling a peaceful group of parents how to raise
their children.
Is this the same state that has little or no compassion on the way treated the children from the FLDS when they lied to them and put them in custody with no rights to an attorney.
TEXAS officials need to take this class
Is this the same state that has little or no compassion on the way treated the children from the FLDS when they lied to them and put them in custody with no rights to an attorney.
TEXAS officials need to take this class
zxcvbnm | 4:15 p.m. July 31, 2008
I had a good laugh about the Saudis and their anti pet declaration.....and ole Jeffs getting rid of dogs surely makes him a dog hater........call PETA.
Try this one on for size..in the small speedtrap known as Lott, Texas the city council several years ago made an open season on dogs. You see the police weren't writing enough tickets to out of towners to pay a dog catcher so the council invited the citizens to shoot the offending critters on sight.
Yep......Texas town hates dogs.........nothing new for this part of the country.
As far as the Wahabi being extremists.....ok.......they can teach a few of the classes I mentioned earlier. You see...... equal opportunity extremism......one persons normal is another persons extremism.
One persons reality sometimes need to be checked by those with no agenda.......hey RC....read closely.
realitycheck | 4:18 p.m. July 31, 2008
You people all need to get a life! You take me far too seriously. I am actually
a man of very small stature. I write from behind a prison wall, I have no use of
my hands or feet and am bound to a wheel chair. I realy would like to run for
political office someday...but when San Quentin is your home address...well you
get the picture.
Thank the Lord | 4:27 p.m. July 31, 2008
I just had a revelation.
Flds are going down big time.
Flds are going down big time.
compromise | 4:26 p.m. July 31, 2008
Okay, first of all, there is nothing more repugnant to me than the mere idea of
polygamy. That being said, this is America. Maybe we can come to compromise, as
in only marrying off girls at 18 versus 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, and 17! After that,
if they want to marry some old guy who's their half-sister's uncle, go
ahead.
The tolerance and parenting classes don't focus on the real issue, which is trying to prevent sexual abuse!
The tolerance and parenting classes don't focus on the real issue, which is trying to prevent sexual abuse!
Thomas | 4:44 p.m. July 31, 2008
Some people think polygamy is a violation of women's rights. And yet after
the raid, no woman was grateful for their rescue. in fact, the eCPS was so
desperate that they threatened these women with the loss of their children in
attempt to get them to go to a women's shleter.
realitycheck | 4:55 p.m. July 31, 2008
hah - the poser is back at 4:18pm. I love it when the FLDS starts using my
name. It means I must have struck a nerve. It happens every time.
The only reason to use my name is to discredit my comments, which means you believe I am influencing opinions and/or making too much sense.
That's great. Thanks for the compliment!!!
The only reason to use my name is to discredit my comments, which means you believe I am influencing opinions and/or making too much sense.
That's great. Thanks for the compliment!!!
Nasty Norma | 5:10 p.m. July 31, 2008
RE: REALITY CHECK
You need to work on your mind, it is much more important then using your hands. I'm afraid you would be a scary guy if you had the use of your hands.
You need to work on your mind, it is much more important then using your hands. I'm afraid you would be a scary guy if you had the use of your hands.
zxcvbnm | 5:24 p.m. July 31, 2008
Thomas..you said a mouthful. The CPS used threats and intimidation to gat the women and the children to say things that in all likelyhood will be seen thru in court.
Having read as many accounts of the CPS "interviews" that have been published as I possibely could it is obvious that the women were threatened at every turn.
Starting the initial interview of the children at 10pm and going till 9am throws the sleep deprivation factor into the bowl of questionable tactics used by CPS. Voss even mentioned that she had been up for 26 hours when the first round of the inquisition was over......kinda skews judgement huh.
The women endured threats, sleep deprivation, and horrible living conditions before being taken from their children.
No wonder they were tired and worn out after the whole affair......then to spend hours on end driveing hundreds of miles to see their kids and get to court........
From what I understand...the CPS county offices are at Ft Concho. CPS were on their home turf.
RL | 5:26 p.m. July 31, 2008
Re: Oh Ya Tolerance
You don't even sound legitimate. It amazes me what people will lie about. Shut up and stop posting unless you are going to be truthful, completely.
This is all just too hilarious. Texas, teaching these people tolerance... I just have to LOL. Man, we have a lot of screwed up people in charge.
You don't even sound legitimate. It amazes me what people will lie about. Shut up and stop posting unless you are going to be truthful, completely.
This is all just too hilarious. Texas, teaching these people tolerance... I just have to LOL. Man, we have a lot of screwed up people in charge.
Not a reality show | 5:37 p.m. July 31, 2008
To: Shirl | 12:19 p.m. July 31, 2008
You said:� If the FLDS have nothing to hide and say their lifestyle is good and pure, then why don't we have camera's in their homes for about 6 months and see what their day to day actions are! That way if I hear the term "keep sweet", I will know that the people writing these books are right.�
Would you mind if someone placed cameras in your home to record your life 24/7 for six months. These people have rights. They are not reality show contestants to be gawked at by strangers.
You said:� If the FLDS have nothing to hide and say their lifestyle is good and pure, then why don't we have camera's in their homes for about 6 months and see what their day to day actions are! That way if I hear the term "keep sweet", I will know that the people writing these books are right.�
Would you mind if someone placed cameras in your home to record your life 24/7 for six months. These people have rights. They are not reality show contestants to be gawked at by strangers.
Anonymous - 1:41 p.m | 5:42 p.m. July 31, 2008
How about that, the state teaching the FLDS that the family is the most
important group affiliation. While at the same time forcing wives and daughters
to testify against their husbands and fathers and siblings.
Seems the integrity of the family is the least of the state's concern.
And who is the state of Texas to preach? If a person believes as the Bible says, that a person should put God before husband and wife, and children, and father and mother, then so beit. Is the First Amendment dead in Texas?!! Who is the state to tell you who your most important affiliation should be?!! Get out of our homes and our bedrooms and our lives Texas!!
Seems the integrity of the family is the least of the state's concern.
And who is the state of Texas to preach? If a person believes as the Bible says, that a person should put God before husband and wife, and children, and father and mother, then so beit. Is the First Amendment dead in Texas?!! Who is the state to tell you who your most important affiliation should be?!! Get out of our homes and our bedrooms and our lives Texas!!
to realitycheck | 5:48 p.m. July 31, 2008
If you want to outlaw fundamentalist religions, then go lobby congress. Until
then quit your rants about the FLDS and how horrible they and the Amish are for
teaching their children the Bible and their centuries old heritage.
And above all, mind your own business!
And above all, mind your own business!
Cherilyn Bacon Eagar | 6:23 p.m. July 31, 2008
I lived in Dallas, Texas for 12 years. We were involved in the community and
with the National Council of Christians and Jews. I never considered myself a
"victim," but as a Mormon, there was much intolerance.
For example, we were seeking a live-in nanny and found one we wanted to hire, a Korean Baptist woman. We received a phone call from her pastor and they came over to talk to us together. He explained that she could not take the job because we worshipped "Satan" and belonged to a "cult." I was floored.
On another occasion, a group of parents asked me to run for the school board not knowing that I was LDS. When they found out, those that had already come to know me defended me, but in the end the rumor was that I was Mormon.
We can also thank Texas evangelicals who prohibited a Mormon athlete from praying before a high school football game for providing the ACLU with a case using this na�ve Mormon family to go all the way to the Supreme Court to prohibit any prayer at all at school activities.
Who needs tolerance here?
Cherilyn Bacon Eagar
World Class Education Research
For example, we were seeking a live-in nanny and found one we wanted to hire, a Korean Baptist woman. We received a phone call from her pastor and they came over to talk to us together. He explained that she could not take the job because we worshipped "Satan" and belonged to a "cult." I was floored.
On another occasion, a group of parents asked me to run for the school board not knowing that I was LDS. When they found out, those that had already come to know me defended me, but in the end the rumor was that I was Mormon.
We can also thank Texas evangelicals who prohibited a Mormon athlete from praying before a high school football game for providing the ACLU with a case using this na�ve Mormon family to go all the way to the Supreme Court to prohibit any prayer at all at school activities.
Who needs tolerance here?
Cherilyn Bacon Eagar
World Class Education Research
Cats | 6:57 p.m. July 31, 2008
To Zipporah: I don't misunderstand anything. I know that is what the FLDS
believe about red. It is in the Bible that Christ will wear red on his return.
But, to ban red as a color is extremist. To tell children there is something
wrong with wearing it or using it is extremist. You know it was only done
fairly recently and is one more of Warren Jeffs' weird control tactics.
There is no doctrine anywhere that red is a color that can't be worn or
used. This is what you call fanatacism and is based on the direction of a man
who has publicly admitted that he is not a prophet, was never a prophet and is
one of the most wicked men of this dispensation.
And, I don't "Hate" FLDS. I hate a lot of the things they do, particularly the leadership. I feel sorry for them. They need help. When you spend that many years being isolated and following a false prophet, it's pretty hard to be in touch with reality.
If these people weren't breaking the law, they wouldn't be having these problems. We have a tolerant society, but you can only push it so far.
And, I don't "Hate" FLDS. I hate a lot of the things they do, particularly the leadership. I feel sorry for them. They need help. When you spend that many years being isolated and following a false prophet, it's pretty hard to be in touch with reality.
If these people weren't breaking the law, they wouldn't be having these problems. We have a tolerant society, but you can only push it so far.
zxcvbnm | 7:12 p.m. July 31, 2008
Ms. Eagar. The Catholics have much the same problem as the LDS in Texas. It is not as bad as it used to be but I have been on the receiving end of some anti Catholic rants.
Every thing from we pray to statues to the Pope is the antiChrist......oh well.....there are intolerant people everywhere.
It is just my guess- | 7:48 p.m. July 31, 2008
but I'm looking at why the Judge, who would not acknowledge these people in
any tolerant way, is demanding a class on tolerance? Etc. etc. etc. ad nausium.
Something is being generated that needs a CYA smokescreen! Perhaps an injection
of something that the court could not legally do, in court. But why should that
matter- seems to be the norm todate.
Clean up | 8:27 p.m. July 31, 2008
You FLDS people need to clean up your act and then the authorities will get off
your back. Just live the American laws like everyone else. Stop with all the
phony excuses.
Zipporah | 8:56 p.m. July 31, 2008
"This is what you call fanatacism (sic) and is based on the direction of a
man who has publicly admitted that he is not a prophet, was never a prophet and
is one of the most wicked men of this dispensation."
No, this is what YOU call fanaticism. I call it a religious belief and if you had bothered to pay any attention during your schooling, or had any familiarity with the Bible or American and world history, you would understand that religious beliefs evolve over time.
If they didn't, we would be burning pagans at the stake today and slavery would still be an acceptable practice.
"If these people weren't breaking the law, they wouldn't be having these problems. We have a tolerant society, but you can only push it so far."
I can see that you also slept through Civics class. Pity, that.
No, this is what YOU call fanaticism. I call it a religious belief and if you had bothered to pay any attention during your schooling, or had any familiarity with the Bible or American and world history, you would understand that religious beliefs evolve over time.
If they didn't, we would be burning pagans at the stake today and slavery would still be an acceptable practice.
"If these people weren't breaking the law, they wouldn't be having these problems. We have a tolerant society, but you can only push it so far."
I can see that you also slept through Civics class. Pity, that.
From the Creek | 9:42 p.m. July 31, 2008
What a load of nonsense, realitycheck:
"The fact is, the FLDS are AFRAID to let their people get well educated, because it would spell the end to their culture. That's the problem. Their restrictive lifestyle has less to do with religion than it has to do with the men preserving their lifestyle."
===========
We're not the least bit afraid to be educated. Why do you keep posting that? Because you read it in some story book? I've noticed that the most faithful members among us are generally the most educated ones. Education is encouraged for men, women, and children and you can never have too much.
And Cats, you do not understand us. I think you got your info from the same story book that realitycheck did. Warren Jeffs never banned the color red. He wasn't even the one that requested we not wear excessive amounts of red in our clothing (it was his father, about 1992-1993). Do you think it bothers me in the least bit if I see someone wearing red? Not at all, and it doesn't bother our children either. Red is still as much a color as any other, and still very much used.
"The fact is, the FLDS are AFRAID to let their people get well educated, because it would spell the end to their culture. That's the problem. Their restrictive lifestyle has less to do with religion than it has to do with the men preserving their lifestyle."
===========
We're not the least bit afraid to be educated. Why do you keep posting that? Because you read it in some story book? I've noticed that the most faithful members among us are generally the most educated ones. Education is encouraged for men, women, and children and you can never have too much.
And Cats, you do not understand us. I think you got your info from the same story book that realitycheck did. Warren Jeffs never banned the color red. He wasn't even the one that requested we not wear excessive amounts of red in our clothing (it was his father, about 1992-1993). Do you think it bothers me in the least bit if I see someone wearing red? Not at all, and it doesn't bother our children either. Red is still as much a color as any other, and still very much used.
Gee, I never | 11:02 p.m. July 31, 2008
In all my years in Pennsylvania, come to think of it, I never saw an Amish
person wearing red either! I have no idea why, and it's none of my
business why anybody does or doesn't chose to wear a particular color. I
also knew conservative Mennonites who would only drive black or navy blue cars
with bumpers painted dark, rather than chromed. Their sincere attempts to be
humble and not call undue attention to themselves were worthy of admiration in
my estimation. Neither were their hair styles, prayer veils (caps), or dresses
any of my business.
Why are so many of you posters so critical of things are are neither right nor wrong, simply an evidence of a culture? It makes you appear to be very unkind and vengeful.
Let's save the judgment for genuine offenses!
And no, I'm still not FLDS, nor do I live in Utah!
Why are so many of you posters so critical of things are are neither right nor wrong, simply an evidence of a culture? It makes you appear to be very unkind and vengeful.
Let's save the judgment for genuine offenses!
And no, I'm still not FLDS, nor do I live in Utah!
ziger1 | 11:04 p.m. July 31, 2008
Having followed this saga of twists and turns since day one, I can truthfully
say it has brought out the best, and worst of human endeavors, not only in
Texas, but throughout the world. Witness the sympathy for the mothers and
children as far away as Europe. The comments I have read along the way are
expected from a variety of thinking subjects, and rightly so.
What troubles me most of all is the audaciousness of a well-meaning child welfare agency overstepping, thru collusion with the local justice system, their authority, as brought to light by both the appelate and Texas Supreme Court. Still they are short sighted in dealing with a quagmire of their own making. Judge Walther, and her subordinates, of course, hope for a quick solution. I personally think the FLDS should ride it out to the US Supreme Court. A favorable ruling against biotry of religious sects might cure the tactic of point and shoot mentality.
Ben Stein said it best. Gestapo tactics. And Mr. Stein is perhaps one of America's most conserative citizens. Come to think of it, he might just make some sense of it all. Persevere FLDS. Texas is more than confusion.
What troubles me most of all is the audaciousness of a well-meaning child welfare agency overstepping, thru collusion with the local justice system, their authority, as brought to light by both the appelate and Texas Supreme Court. Still they are short sighted in dealing with a quagmire of their own making. Judge Walther, and her subordinates, of course, hope for a quick solution. I personally think the FLDS should ride it out to the US Supreme Court. A favorable ruling against biotry of religious sects might cure the tactic of point and shoot mentality.
Ben Stein said it best. Gestapo tactics. And Mr. Stein is perhaps one of America's most conserative citizens. Come to think of it, he might just make some sense of it all. Persevere FLDS. Texas is more than confusion.
Intelligence | 11:24 p.m. July 31, 2008
I agree with FROM THE CREEK.
Give me a break | 11:23 p.m. July 31, 2008
If the fdls were anything like the Amish, there woulnd not be a problem today.
The Amish live a plain lifestyle, don't use modern things, I have never
heard that they practice polygamy, or force the young girls to marry the old
men. When the Amish come of age they are given the opportunity to go live like
anyone else. Some do not return, some do. At lease they give them an
opportunity to see the outside world.
The main difference between the Amish & fdls is the Amish are civalized.
The main difference between the Amish & fdls is the Amish are civalized.
Smart & Intelligent | 9:04 a.m. Aug. 1, 2008
And, I agree with "CLEAN UP" 8:27p.m.
Grandpa Phil | 10:15 a.m. Aug. 1, 2008
Cherilyn Bacon Eagar, you are a wonderful person and I salute you. Thanks for
your input.
I don't get it | 11:23 a.m. Aug. 1, 2008
Cherilyn - religious intolerance is the pits, isn't it.
I'm curious why the live-in nanny wanted her pastor to talk to you when applying for a job. Seems weird and excessive. A little too much religious control, wouldn't you say?
And how would the parents wanting you to run for the school board ever find out about your religion? Did they ask? Isn't "none of your business" a decent reply to that?
And how would a Texas high school even know if someone was praying or not? Anyone can pray whenever they want. How would anyone know? And what makes you think the Mormon family was naive?
It all seems very strange. Seems like people flaunt their religions to get attention....
I'm curious why the live-in nanny wanted her pastor to talk to you when applying for a job. Seems weird and excessive. A little too much religious control, wouldn't you say?
And how would the parents wanting you to run for the school board ever find out about your religion? Did they ask? Isn't "none of your business" a decent reply to that?
And how would a Texas high school even know if someone was praying or not? Anyone can pray whenever they want. How would anyone know? And what makes you think the Mormon family was naive?
It all seems very strange. Seems like people flaunt their religions to get attention....
Cry Baby | 11:56 a.m. Aug. 1, 2008
Well,Cherilyn Bacon Eagar, Why I never! Goodness gracious me! My my but
aren't we wonderful and so martyred by others?
Somehow, I have to stand on the side of-- I DON'T GET IT?
Somehow, I have to stand on the side of-- I DON'T GET IT?
Maybe . . . | 12:43 p.m. Aug. 1, 2008
maybe texas can enact an equal opportunity law for them instead- if men can have
more than one wife, then women can have more than one husband
(for those of you who don't understand sarcasm or verbal irony, don't take this seriously, this is a joke)
(for those of you who don't understand sarcasm or verbal irony, don't take this seriously, this is a joke)
ha ha | 5:40 p.m. Aug. 1, 2008
yeah, one husband to nag on monday, one to nag on tuesday, one to nag on
wednesday, etc.
then one to yell at whenever she feels like it
i like that idea
then one to yell at whenever she feels like it
i like that idea
Polygamy | 5:54 p.m. Aug. 1, 2008
Have dog will roam.
Yes, thanks you! | 1:01 p.m. Aug. 2, 2008
"Thank the Lord"...I had that "revelation too"! No more
excuses for you guys. You are going down and there is nothing you can do about
it. Hard to take? Move into the 21st century and slowly start to realize the
realities of life.
Alex | 3:03 p.m. Aug. 4, 2008
I personally would have thought that a class that taught the laws against
underage marriage and abuse would have been far more productive than preaching
how they need to be tolerant and multicultural. Oh well. I guess at this
point, the FLDS should just smile, take it, then be on their way.
By the way, FLDS, would you please keep it clean. While I have and will continue to defend your rights, that picture of Warren Jeffs with the little girl didn't exactly warm my heart towards you and I'm not the only one who thinks so.
By the way, FLDS, would you please keep it clean. While I have and will continue to defend your rights, that picture of Warren Jeffs with the little girl didn't exactly warm my heart towards you and I'm not the only one who thinks so.
Alex | 3:13 p.m. Aug. 4, 2008
Yes, thanks you!:
If FLDS goes down as you hope, it will go down from within and on its own. Threats do little but embolden the faithful. Personally, I can take it or leave it.
If FLDS goes down as you hope, it will go down from within and on its own. Threats do little but embolden the faithful. Personally, I can take it or leave it.
re Alex | 4:08 p.m. Aug. 4, 2008
I would have thought that a class on physical abuse for the fathers would have
been even better. There's no way to keep a large multi-wife multi-child
family in line in a repressive environment without abuse, since the penalty for
failure would be banishment.
Abuse can't be avoided in the FLDS. Perhaps if the men were to understand that they can stick up for their family and no one can make them leave, then it wouldn't be so. But that's not the case.
Abuse can't be avoided in the FLDS. Perhaps if the men were to understand that they can stick up for their family and no one can make them leave, then it wouldn't be so. But that's not the case.
To Cry Baby | 5:27 p.m. Aug. 4, 2008
You know when people call names, it is a sign of their insecurity and weak
character. Your comments remind me of Obama and his shallow approach about
things, his saying, they will say that my name is funny, that I don't look
like the others on a dollar bill and so forth. Like you Baby, he plays a word
game and uses them to spin things, he can't talk straight and just say this
or that. He of course would not call McCain a cry baby, he does have more class
than that, but he lacks class in making these comments that are reverse attacks
and then call race card when someone says it is wrong. When I hear him, he
reminds me of the smart nerdy kid on the school play ground and he is spinning
it to get the bully in trouble. I saw that in McCain also during the GOP, but I
don't really think that mature people are going to respond or take
seriously name calling and ignorance. Please Baby, we would love to hear from
you, but next time, instead of name calling, respond in an adult manner.
Alex | 5:42 p.m. Aug. 4, 2008
"I would have thought that a class on physical abuse for the fathers would
have been even better. "
Agreed. The whole parenting class is a humongous waste of time. It doesn't address anything pertinent to the case.
While I believe that there could be abusive behavior inside the compound, I don't believe that we can definitively conclude that by virtue of the compound being a multi-wife, multi-child family environment. There are already other issues more compelling than cohabitation to recommend public scrutiny.
In any case, I'm into prosecuting the guilty, not bringing down organizations. I don't do that. If FLDS goes down, they will do it themselves. If the 5 that were indicted are convicted and go to prison, then more and more of the public sympathy for the FLDS erodes.
Regardless of the outcome of the case, for FLDS to maintain their good name, they need to be able to show good faith. I hope they can, because I hate the idea of a snoopy government using this case as an excuse to be more invasive in people's lives.
Agreed. The whole parenting class is a humongous waste of time. It doesn't address anything pertinent to the case.
While I believe that there could be abusive behavior inside the compound, I don't believe that we can definitively conclude that by virtue of the compound being a multi-wife, multi-child family environment. There are already other issues more compelling than cohabitation to recommend public scrutiny.
In any case, I'm into prosecuting the guilty, not bringing down organizations. I don't do that. If FLDS goes down, they will do it themselves. If the 5 that were indicted are convicted and go to prison, then more and more of the public sympathy for the FLDS erodes.
Regardless of the outcome of the case, for FLDS to maintain their good name, they need to be able to show good faith. I hope they can, because I hate the idea of a snoopy government using this case as an excuse to be more invasive in people's lives.
- Page:
- < Previous
- 1
- 2
- 3
- Next >
Add your comment
Comments are monitored. Any comments found to be abusive, offensive, off-topic, misrepresentative, more than 200 words or containing URLs will not be posted.
Words Remaining
E-mail address: For internal use only. We may want to contact you to publish your comment (not your e-mail address) in the newspaper or for a separate story idea.
Related content
- Utah Jazz game at a glance 11:53 p.m.
- Construction worker injured in jump 11:47 p.m.
- AFL readies new schedule 11:44 p.m.
- Sports briefs 11:42 p.m.
- Disappearance called 'sususpicious' 11:40 p.m.
- Defense witness goes on offensive 11:37 p.m.
- Auto sales in China accelerate 11:37 p.m.
- Bestor takes fans on magical journey 11:36 p.m.
- Sager likes to add color to games 11:33 p.m.
- LDS to emphasize helping needy 11:22 p.m.
- Nude bathers cited for lewdness
- Few details on missing W.V. mom
- Jazz fall apart late at L.A.
- Crash landing next to I-15
- Defense witness goes on offensive
- BCS = power conference monopoly
- Palin signs books, chats with fans
- I-15 expansion barreling south
- 5 officers lose their certification
- Y.'s Emery bruised, but rarely beaten
- Letters: Global warming a lie
256 - TCU to play Boise in Fiesta Bowl206
- BYU football: Bronco weighs in on Hall193
- Palin signs books, chats with fans165
- Cougars going back to Vegas150
- Utah/BYU rivalry can be more civil149
- Andersen apologizes for Jordan hoax142
- Max Hall wants to look ahead124
- Nude bathers cited for lewdness120
- Jazz fall apart late at L.A.110
There was a time when free shipping was rare. This holiday season, you...
Love him or hate him, Utah Sen. Orrin Hatch knows how to get attention.
My wife Lisa and I would prefer never to argue. But that's not going to...
Latest comments
We love Coach Boylen and hope the yewts keep him around for a long, long,...
In the New Testament it states in several places that disciples of Christ...
I suggest he read her book, just for a start, But the secret is that Palin is...
1. Because Sarah Palin and her husband sat at a dining room table at night...
For some time Mexico has been in financial trouble. It has a lot to do with...
So what is the maximum time Mitchell could be incarcerated for kidnapping,...
Asiata==============got injured against a Big East team. Go Harvey!!!...
As of 2009, the NCAA recognizes the lists of All-Americans selected by the;...
I'm not saying the guy from Florida isn't good. Obviously the fact that he...
That is about how I feel about Cal as a football team. I did not even know...
Advertisements