Deseret News | Reader comments: Texas judge separates FLDS custody cases

Reader comments
Texas judge separates FLDS custody cases

Bob | 7:12 p.m. July 25, 2008

Sociologically speaking, the FLDS has many of the characteristics of a clan or tribe. The FLDS communities are characterized by shared religion, similar life style and endogamy.

These were also characteristics of the early LDS Church, which has now chosen to take a different path.

spredbury | 7:30 p.m. July 25, 2008

I doubt this will be anything but another attempt by CPS to exercise their unbridled power to abuse mothers and children. They may have indicted 6, one who was already in jail, but neither CPS nor Walther have shown any justification for taking all of the children and subjecting them to the massive unwarranted abuse and trauma. I still want to know when CPS, Ms Meisner, is going to provide status on the promised investigation of alleged CPS abuse of FLDS mothers and children while in the San Angelo coliseum. Those allegations were from very credible sources and must be investigated. I have no faith in CPS or Judge Walther when it comes to the fair and just handling of this matter. CPS and the courts have a charter to protect children and Iï¿½m sure they do that well is many cases but in this case they blew it and abused their power and the FLDS mothers and children. I fully believe Doran, Walther, Meisner, Azar, and Voss are all doing anything and everything in their power to cover their rear ends so they can justify the seizure of all the FLDS children when much more appropriate avenues were available.

Joey | 8:01 p.m. July 25, 2008

Most likely Doran, Flora Jessop, and others were actively involved in the set-up. Proof of this lies in the fact that Rozita Swinton knew details of the raid as it progressed and used those details (which toys were being handed out and when, names of CPS personnel, activities, etc.) in her continuous hoax calls as one "Sarah" that was supposedly swept up in the raid. This little detail proves a conspiracy occurred and the raid was NOT carried out in good faith.
This latest concession corroborates this. I.e. the search and seizure warrant itself could not have been issued under good faith circumstances, seeing how it was overly broad, in that it covered 119 households as opposed to one. Any reasonable person can see that's ludicrous. And these are just two of a long laundry list of items that proves bad faith on the part of LE/CPS. The evidence gathered at YFZ must be tossed out, or the precedent set by this mess will be truly unsettling.

Comments continue below

gal50 | 8:31 p.m. July 25, 2008

Why were there only 175 mothers on the compound and taken along with the children if the children have 234 mothers? What is the story with 60 mothers who up to now, were never mentioned. Could it be that the cases are divided by mother-father, so that maybe 60 women were reassigned and had children by a second male? Did the news reports initially quote the wrong number? Were there children in the compound living only with their father or in other families? This remains unexplained.

gal50 | 8:38 p.m. July 25, 2008

Some of the explanation for the increase in mothers is that there was an disputed category. These were counted as girls, but were actually adult mothers. Additionally there were five girls who are also mothers, so these two groups together account for an additional 30 mothers for a total of 205 mothers. There was the one child supposedly visiting from Canada who would have a mother outside of Texas. There was also a mother who was away from the compound at the time the children were seized.

Adultery big time! | 9:13 p.m. July 25, 2008

The flds cost our country more money than what they are worth and they are worth nothing but jail time.

gal50 | 9:30 p.m. July 25, 2008

The reason there are so many cases is that some women have more than one case. Initially there were individual cases and two group cases, so a mother could have a few individual cases or a mother could have two children and two cases because one came from group A and one came from group B.

This is a good thing because mothers who comply with CPS requirements and who are not in the least associated with the 20 or so potential statutory rape cases (5 girls, 15 older cases where the victim is now an adult) can probably close their CPS case much earlier than they could if they were part of a group.

There is a grey area that includes allegedly raped girls, their offspring, their siblings, the other children of the man who allegedly raped the girl. Warren Jeffs children could be in this gray area since he may have had sex with twelve year-old girls and he may have offered up his own daughters. It would be interesting to find out what typically happens to these children.

BE KIND | 9:46 p.m. July 25, 2008

I opposed the separation between family members for whatever reasons.Warren Jeff has been in prison.Thats enough.Dont make worse the situation,instead we all need to help them to build the life a new.From what i see people just take advantage from this situation,esp LDS.they behave like they are holy and FLDS is dirty.they try hard to distant themselves in whatever way,saying hurtfull words toward FLDS.I am not FLDS,but i feel people treated FLDS members cruelly.Please dont look down on them !

from GA | 9:59 p.m. July 25, 2008

I'm glad that the indictment of possible child molesters has occurred. Now, when will the abuses of CPS come under judicial scrutinty? Will the FLDS need to sue for this to occur? Who officially can get the ball rolling?

Ronda | 11:28 p.m. July 25, 2008

MAN OH MAN! I'm sick of the FLDS hillbilly delinquents!... these guys are making me really mad!

Cats | 6:42 a.m. July 26, 2008

Some FLDS people came into my business yesterday. The wife looked about twenty. She had four small children. The husband looked like he was about twenty years older than she. He did all the talking. She hardly said a word. I felt so sorry for her and her children.

I just wish there was something that could be done to help these people. It is so hard for anyone to to have a chance when they are progammed from birth, trapped into marriage at such a young age and threatened with eternal damnation if they don't comply.

The Book of Mormon talks about people being lead astray by the "traditions of their fathers." I think the FLDS are an excellent exmample of this principle.

I applaud Senator Reid and the Texas authorities for trying to do something about this.

Eric | 7:58 a.m. July 26, 2008

The mean-faced, clipped-hair women of the CPS need to be put behind bars for their crimes against this God fearing group of people. These CPS people are the same ones who say it's all right to pass out condoms at the school and for the kids to have all the sex they want. But when it's sex with an older man to whom they are married, they have a problem.

Cats | 9:41 a.m. July 26, 2008

Sorry Eric: No one is buying your red herrings. Trying to blame CPS for condoms in school is ridiculous.

The fact is, the Texas Authorities are doing their best to try to protect children. Sex with underage girls is child rape whether they have some sort of a sham "marriage" or not.

I love all this obfuscation by FLDS members trying to convince the rest of us that they are victims of some sort of terrible miscarriage of justice. The only crimes that are being perpetrated against them are by their own leadership.

Even if they have made a few mistakes, I applaud the Texas Authorities for their efforts to protect children and bring these criminal FLDS leaders to justice.

P.S. I hope Elissa Wall's lawsuit against Warren Jeffs is successful and she gets all the assets the FLDS have. Then there might actually be some hope to help these people have real lives.

Think!!!! | 10:40 a.m. July 26, 2008

Joey | 8:01 p.m. July 25, 2008
Most likely Doran, Flora Jessop, and others were actively involved in the set-up. Proof of this lies in the fact that Rozita Swinton knew details of the raid as it progressed and used those details (which toys were being handed out and when, names of CPS personnel, activities, etc.) in her continuous hoax calls as one "Sarah" that was supposedly swept up in the raid. This little detail proves a conspiracy occurred and the raid was NOT carried out in good faith.
This latest concession corroborates this. I.e. the search and seizure warrant itself could not have been issued under good faith circumstances, seeing how it was overly broad, in that it covered 119 households as opposed to one. Any reasonable person can see that's ludicrous. And these are just two of a long laundry list of items that proves bad faith on the part of LE/CPS. The evidence gathered at YFZ must be tossed out, or the precedent set by this mess will be truly unsettling.
________________________________________________

AMEN, AMEN, AND AMEN!! Finally someone is talking a little sense, THANK-YOU!!

Hammmerhead | 10:46 a.m. July 26, 2008

to ERIC
I am so tired of going to Costco and running into inbred hammerheads in every isle of the store. One more hammerhead and I think I will scream!!!!!!!

From the Creek | 1:01 p.m. July 26, 2008

Cats,
No matter how you try to spin it, terrorizing children and telling them that it's "protecting" them isn't going to fly. How on earth can you justify illegally holding 26 adults as minors? How can you ever justify their actions in leaving a toddler in a stroller for over 24 hours without food or water? How can you justify them in refusing a diabetic girl her insulin? How can you justify their actions in separating siblings by up to 900 miles in some cases? How can you justify ripping babies from their mothers' arms?

The point I'd really like to get across is that no one has the right to break the law or ignore the constitution to try to enforce the law. Even if every single adult member of the FLDS were guilty of the crimes they're alleged to be committing, it will never justify the way in which the Texas authorities acted.

zxcvbnm | 3:50 p.m. July 26, 2008

Hey Creek. Ya know....when we begin by refering to people dressed differently than us as unibrow and have a hairstyle issue or cringe when we see someone dressed differently in Costco it is not much of a stretch to justify treating the "wierd" people differently.
Those people don't pray like us is the mantra of religious intolerance and it isn't much of a stretch to believe the gossip or innuendo.
Creek......good luck with the UEP fight......I'll be praying for ya.

Thomas | 11:31 a.m. July 28, 2008

Judge has shown that she has no use for due process of law and is not likely to change her mind.

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