Deseret News | Reader comments: Lawmakers not conservative enough, group says

Reader comments
Bob Bernick Jr.: Lawmakers not conservative enough, group says

BBKing | 5:33 a.m. May 2, 2008

Neat story. When can we expect the story about the UEA's scorecard that gives many legislators zeros, saying they aren't liberal enough?

And as for Attila the Hun comment, something must have really stuck in the craw of the author that he would go after the legislature this way.

Fact of the matter, this score card, and others serve a very useful purpose for those who pay attention. They show how legislators stack up relative to another. One Republican delegate takes all score cards he is able to find and creates a compilation. You find they are all very similar, and by comparing legislators on various votes you can see who the conservatives are, moderate Republicans, liberal Democrats and Blue Dog Democrats. It is very useful.

Bee in the bonnet on this one.

liberal larry | 6:24 a.m. May 2, 2008

Thanks, Bob, for posting the "grass roots" web site, it's always good to start the day with a laugh. More pro business drivel from the far right. It's hard to get anything accomplished in a state that has such a hatred for government, and lives by the mantra of greed and fear.
By the way, Huntsman, is doing a fine job of representing this state, we should all be proud that such a talented individual has dedicated this part of his life to public service.

Anonymous | 6:31 a.m. May 2, 2008

Thanks for perpetuating the myth that Utahns are conservative. Maybe next time, you can use the term uberconservative.

Utahns are conservative on abortion, gay rights, and guns. If Utahns were conservative on fiscal issues, we would have voted for vouchers, and our cities would not be wasting their money on UTOPIA and iProvo.

Comments continue below

Vote him out | 6:43 a.m. May 2, 2008

Yet another reason to vote out Wimmer. He is in over his head and is far too extreme to represent his constituents.

uncannygunman | 6:57 a.m. May 2, 2008

"Correctly." Ugh.

Crank all of these numbers up 25% to reflect the fact that these guys already deal themselves a steaming load of right-wing nuttiness to vote on to begin with.

Chuck | 7:46 a.m. May 2, 2008

Mark Madsen is NOT from Lehi, nor does his Senate district cover very much of Lehi. Howard Stephenson covers more of Lehi than Madsen does. Madsen is from Eagle Mountain! He used to be a city councilman there and has not moved. Please correct this.

Orem Parent | 8:10 a.m. May 2, 2008

Excellent that it it run by "FORMER" legislators. Let's continue the trend and vote out anyone else that ranked at the top of their list.

Groups like this are actually working against their own cause because the general public is now seeing them as the groups that have ruined our state in terms of public education.

Jared | 8:32 a.m. May 2, 2008

Wimmer in over his head? Haha! Sounds like his opponent just posted an blind comment.Wimmer accomplished more his first term, than did his opponent in tens years! Where do you guys get this stuff? What because he isn't rich? Or is it because he is a blue collar worker like the average Utah'n? HOW is he in over his head? A silly comment, by an ignorant person.

Anonymous | 8:42 a.m. May 2, 2008

I am sick of these fake grass roots organizations and brain dead think tanks. Go get a real job.

Cheats | 8:51 a.m. May 2, 2008

Wimmer and his young Fab Five buddies are all cheats! They stole money from the Republican party to get any advantage over their challengers. The guy can't even spell or write a write a good flyer. They embarrassed the party and act like they knew nothing about the flyer and it's bad timing to give them an advantage. To these men it is KILL their opponents or be killed. It's not about an election, it's life or death for these men to win their elections. Cheating isn't a problem for them. If this governement is truly a form representation, then we must all be cheaters!

Good Point | 8:58 a.m. May 2, 2008

I just read the "Cheats" comment and it reminded me that when I received my credentials for the state convention the other day, I decided that I would not donate to the Republican Party since they misuse the funds. I don't want to be a part of such a corrupt party. I want the corruption to end. Why is someone who is not a party official (Senator Bramble) being the credentials chair? Could it be the Bramharts at it again?

BBKing | 9:25 a.m. May 2, 2008

The comment about Utah not being so conservative is right on the money. If you remove the two moral issues, and guns, Utah is actually pretty moderate to left-leaning.

And for the comments about ruining education, oh vey! It never ends does it?!

The funny thing is, how many of those that posted on this story have bothered to read the score card and see how they would have voted. Go find the score card, which also lists the bills. I sent it out to about a dozen of my friends. Asked them to read the bills, see how they would have voted and get back with me.

Five have responded. On average they are scoring the 70's with one being a liberal Democrat brother-in-law who scored a respectable 55%.

Read the bills, make your own vote, find your score and then make a decision about who is too liberal, conervative or out of touch.

all is black or white | 9:25 a.m. May 2, 2008

Guess what?

Just like the word liberal has become a dirty word.
So has the word conservative.

This is the way it is in the world of extremists.

Anonymous | 9:38 a.m. May 2, 2008

When the terms conservative and liberal are bandied about today the subtext is childishly
"Conservatives are better than you."
And the stupidist of our neighbors are falling for this, do nothing, while the clever powers that be get wealthier and more powerful while the rest wonder how low can they go.

Gig | 10:01 a.m. May 2, 2008

I wonder if "grassrooots" have rated the ultra conservative Mullas in Iran or the Saudi monarchy. Probably give them a no pass as well. If Utah legislature cant make the grade then who on Gods green earth could?

Cudos to thinkers | 10:29 a.m. May 2, 2008

Conservatism has good ideas but it isn't the whole answer. Conservatism would have us believe that socialism is wrong. Conservatives ignore the fact that public funding of education is socialistic, as is public funding of police and the military.

Fact is if our legislators don't vote conservative all the time this is because no one idealogy has all the correct answers.

Fact is it is wise to search out the truth and what is best. If one is holds to any ideology rather than asking in each circumstance what is best, you will only be right part of the time.

Cudos to our legislators for asking what is right, rather than what is conservative.

Self Governance & Local Control | 11:56 a.m. May 2, 2008

Of course the legislature isn't conservative enough. The public isn't conservative enough and the legislature just mirrors the public. Utahns believe that it is OK to take from one to give to another if "the majority' says it is OK. That is not a conservative principle. That is a socialist (aka modern liberal) principle. Utahns like too much big government that restrict freedom and liberty.

We should leave people free, not make them slaves and/or wards of the state.

Liberty! | 12:47 p.m. May 2, 2008

Thomas Jefferson said in his 1st inaugural address: "...what more is necessary to make us a happy and a prosperous people? Still one thing more, fellow-citizens -- a wise and frugal Government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government, and this is necessary to close the circle of our felicities."

If we as citizens would embrace this principle we would all be better off, with greater freedom, less regulation, less taxation, and less legislative abuses. Of course, today we would then be called hardcore, right wing, arch-conservatives, rather than freedom-loving liberals (in the classical sense of the word).

a confused group | 1:03 p.m. May 2, 2008

Once again solid evidence that politically speaking, our brothers and sisters who call themselves "conservatives" don't really know what the (blank) they stand for (other than "against liberals!").

But not to worry.

The last election when the GOP got their "butts kicked" (Bush's words) and the coming November will change everything.

Thank God.

lost in DC | 1:01 p.m. May 2, 2008

Rather than sit in the basement with the only light being that coming from the computer screen and moan about who is or is not conservative enough (or too much), get out and talk to you legislator. Find out who he/she is and where they stand on issues. Let them know how you feel. If they have differing views than you do, talk to their opponent in the race for the seat. Pick which one best represents you. Even if your candidate loses, your state rep is still there to represent you, so let them know how you feel.

I speak with my state rep quite often (I'd say about every Sunday at church but liberal larry would have a cow). We don't always agree, but he listens to what I say and puts forth a well thought out reason for why he feels (and votes) the way he does. I know that he respects my opinion even if he doesn't agree; and I know that he gives careful thought and study to each issue.

Jim Pederson | 2:04 p.m. May 2, 2008

Don Guymon, the head of Grassroots Republicans, isn't a conservative, he's a libertarian.

Grassroots is a small group of libertarian-oriented legislators and political wannabees. They wrap themselves in the cloak of Reagan conservatism in order to get their views accepted in this state. Their real hero is Milton Friedman. You know, the libertarian free-mareketer who wanted vouchers for schools and the legalization of prostitution.

June | 2:27 p.m. May 2, 2008

Please, Bob Bernick, save the ink. This story has no credibility because this organization (a very small organization of only a few people) has no credibility.
I'd rather watch grass grow

Flummoxed in Zion | 10:10 p.m. May 2, 2008

And this "piece" is supposed to be helpful or informative exactly how?

Thomas W. Clay | 9:46 p.m. May 3, 2008

How many of you actually went to the web site? The link is there. Just click on it - I dare you.

I have been to the web site. I read the report. I even read the reasoning they gave for each of the issues / bills involved. While I don't always agree with Don, he is an honest and honorable man who publishes and explains not only his results, but his method of analysis.

Don Guymon | 1:15 p.m. May 4, 2008

Thanks for the kind words Tom.

Jim Pederson, if you are refering to me as being a libertarian because I love liberty then that is correct.

I have always been a Republican. I believe in the platform and have served on the party's central commitee for nine years.

The secretary of GrassRoots is Donna Dahl who served in the legislature and as the Republican Party's vice chair. Bill Barton the chair served in the state senate.

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