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Final tally: 416 children removed
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Perverts | 12:58 p.m. April 9, 2008
All This is is Sex with underage girls in the name of "God". Texas
won't tolerate this. As a nation this Poligamy stuff has to STOP!!!
Re: texas citizen | 1:01 p.m. April 9, 2008
Did you even read ALL of the posts, or by all, are you just refering to the
posts that criticize the State of Texas?
Troy | 1:10 p.m. April 9, 2008
I think what Texas did was right.
I think anyone who argues for search/seizure protection over the advocation of true justice for children really must re-think their religion.
Doesn't protecting children have to be more important than keeping the police away from a known polygamist compound?
People, wake up! This isn't about religion. It's about deciding what moral values take precedence over others. Think about it -- what if your child was at this FLDS ranch in Texas? Would you want your child rescued?
I think anyone who argues for search/seizure protection over the advocation of true justice for children really must re-think their religion.
Doesn't protecting children have to be more important than keeping the police away from a known polygamist compound?
People, wake up! This isn't about religion. It's about deciding what moral values take precedence over others. Think about it -- what if your child was at this FLDS ranch in Texas? Would you want your child rescued?
Comments continue below
Frank | 1:19 p.m. April 9, 2008
Overall I'm glad for this forum,
"Major Difference" - Thanks for clearing up something that had seemed odd but makes a lot more sense now. My worry had been that unfair liberties were taken on an otherwise justified search.
"Horph34" - Has reafirmed my worry that people judge those that are not the norm by the worst possible situation while judging those that are familiar by the best possible situation. Acting on judgements like those can be a big mistake. Thankfully that wasnt the case in Texas.
Its a sad day when families, no matter how strange, are seperated. But I agree with many here, it had to be done, its a shock thats was a long time coming.
"Major Difference" - Thanks for clearing up something that had seemed odd but makes a lot more sense now. My worry had been that unfair liberties were taken on an otherwise justified search.
"Horph34" - Has reafirmed my worry that people judge those that are not the norm by the worst possible situation while judging those that are familiar by the best possible situation. Acting on judgements like those can be a big mistake. Thankfully that wasnt the case in Texas.
Its a sad day when families, no matter how strange, are seperated. But I agree with many here, it had to be done, its a shock thats was a long time coming.
Spencer | 1:27 p.m. April 9, 2008
May Heaven bless these sweet young people that have already been through hell.
Religion or no, no one has a right to harm other people. I'm very happy to
see the strength in this 16 year old young mother and her bravery to protect
herself, her baby and her little sister. There needs to be a separation of
Church & State, but that doesn't mean that people claiming some divine
inspiration can go around hurting children. The community must draw the line
someplace.
TO: Stu | 10:51 a.m. | 1:39 p.m. April 9, 2008
Amen, Brother!!! Apparently, the FLDS leadership thought that we Texans focus
only on iced tea, enchiladas, and good music! While that is almost true, we
certainly won't stand for 13-14 year olds being bartered off to the old
coots who set this thing up in Texas' backyard.
I would urge the ignorant who have piped up to simply READ, READ, READ, on the issue of the FLDS church! There are volumes of information to be found on this cult -- from men, women and children who have escaped.
I would urge the ignorant who have piped up to simply READ, READ, READ, on the issue of the FLDS church! There are volumes of information to be found on this cult -- from men, women and children who have escaped.
The Church has made a statement. | 1:38 p.m. April 9, 2008
SALT LAKE CITY 6 April 2008 The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints
reiterated Sunday that it has no affiliation whatever with a polygamous sect in
Texas that has been subject to investigation by state law enforcement officers
and child protective services. The Church discontinued polygamy officially in
1890, but more than a century later some news and Internet reports fail to draw
clear distinctions between the Church and practicing polygamous sects.
Underage marriage | 1:46 p.m. April 9, 2008
"Austin police arrested a 27-year-old teacher after he allegedly tried to
secure a marriage license and wed a student ten years younger than him. Police
say the 17-year-old girl's mother accompanied the pair to apply for a
marriage license last week.
The Akins High School teacher was arrested for allegedly having an improper relationship with the girl. If convicted, Arias could get up to 20 years behind bars."
I guess this underage marriage thing isn't legal with teachers either. Texas is getting so restrictive.
The Akins High School teacher was arrested for allegedly having an improper relationship with the girl. If convicted, Arias could get up to 20 years behind bars."
I guess this underage marriage thing isn't legal with teachers either. Texas is getting so restrictive.
DCFS Nightmare | 1:57 p.m. April 9, 2008
Several years ago in California a family friend had her toddler and two-week-old
newborn taken from her home after her angry and rebellious 13-year-old daughter
went to school and told her teacher that her mother had pushed her down the
stairs. It didn't matter that it wasn't true--they kept the children
for TWO MONTHS until it was verified that it wasn't true. The trauma it
caused that family is unbelievable and unforgivable. I witnessed other such
nightmares with DCFS throughout the years, and I've always compared them to
the IRS: a law unto themselves.
No Simple Answer | 1:56 p.m. April 9, 2008
Texas has opened Pandora's Box and there is no turning back now. Only time
will tell if is this unprecidented raid was a heroic act or the biggest fiasco
known to law enforcement. I don't think a lot of answers are going to come
from the women and children, after all this is a closed society that preached
that everything outside of their society is evil(government, law enforcement,
other religions, etc). Just figuring out what child belongs to whom is going be
problematic. I can just see the state ordered DNA testing for everyone in the
compound. One thing is for certain, that the state of Texas is going to have
their hands full for years to come.
JUST ONE MAN'S OPINION | 2:00 p.m. April 9, 2008
I have been reading all these comments about what has and is still going on, and
I just thought I would remind everyone- especially those making judgements,
either pro or con, about what they have been reading. In all likelyhood we do
NOT have all the facts. MOST OF THE TIME, law enforcement does not reveal ALL
the information they know while a case is in progress. So perhaps we should just
watch and wait to see how this all pans out before we verbalize all our
judgements.
go for it! | 2:06 p.m. April 9, 2008
No matter how long it takes to verify anything with these polygamy cults.
It's alway in the best interest of the children where there is suspect
abuse to remove them. This is nothing new when it come to polygamy. The
authorities did the right thing rather anyone wants to agree with this or not.
Rape Is Rape.
Way to go | 2:33 p.m. April 9, 2008
Texas!! I wish Utah and Arizona authorities would have the guts to enforce the
law and protect these children from further harm
Choice??? | 2:45 p.m. April 9, 2008
To everyone who is whining about their choice:
Everyone has the right to believe and live how they choose. However, wake up! These children were not given a choice in anything. It isn't like they were even told, "O.K., you have to chose one man who is about 50 years old or older. Here are your choices." I mean come on, what would you choose as a 13 to 15 year old, a 50 year old mate or another teenager? They were given NO choices. They can't leave without supervision. They can't chose their mate. And they can't have acquaintances in the "outside" world.
In order to prove a point, let's see how many of these "men" would stick around supporting their "families" if sex were not a part of the deal and there were no teenage girls anywhere to be found!!!!
Everyone has the right to believe and live how they choose. However, wake up! These children were not given a choice in anything. It isn't like they were even told, "O.K., you have to chose one man who is about 50 years old or older. Here are your choices." I mean come on, what would you choose as a 13 to 15 year old, a 50 year old mate or another teenager? They were given NO choices. They can't leave without supervision. They can't chose their mate. And they can't have acquaintances in the "outside" world.
In order to prove a point, let's see how many of these "men" would stick around supporting their "families" if sex were not a part of the deal and there were no teenage girls anywhere to be found!!!!
Larry | 2:56 p.m. April 9, 2008
I am all for the law taking control of the whole polygamy cult into custody.
This has gone on far too long. I agree with everyone one here that wants
something done.
As you know most men don't care about polygamy or abusing woman for self pleasures. Most of us out here respect woman. If the whole world were sex abusers then we would all be indulging in this ungodly practice. But as you can see most men in our world are NORMAL, except for a handful, and very small group of polygamist men, which I DO NOT consider real men. You folks do not want to hear what I think personally....It's not nice!
As you know most men don't care about polygamy or abusing woman for self pleasures. Most of us out here respect woman. If the whole world were sex abusers then we would all be indulging in this ungodly practice. But as you can see most men in our world are NORMAL, except for a handful, and very small group of polygamist men, which I DO NOT consider real men. You folks do not want to hear what I think personally....It's not nice!
Anonymous | 2:50 p.m. April 9, 2008
I think the memory of Waco must still be very strong, which has led to this
gross over-reaction on the part of Texas cps and law enforcement. It seems that
officials were aware of the compound and probably had plans put together for how
they would deal with the group. All they needed was an excuse, which they
got.
I feel for those little kids who were ripped away from their homes. I don't condone the abuse of children, or of anyone, but I also don't like to see the gov't swoop down and take children out of their homes with little evidence of wrong-doing. I also think the smarter way to go about it would have been to let the women and children stay in their homes and separate the men from them while they investigate. It seems that the pubescent girls are the ones in the most danger...so they could have started there and spared the littlest ones the terror of being ripped away from their homes. The whole situation is so sad. I hope it is resolved quickly.
I feel for those little kids who were ripped away from their homes. I don't condone the abuse of children, or of anyone, but I also don't like to see the gov't swoop down and take children out of their homes with little evidence of wrong-doing. I also think the smarter way to go about it would have been to let the women and children stay in their homes and separate the men from them while they investigate. It seems that the pubescent girls are the ones in the most danger...so they could have started there and spared the littlest ones the terror of being ripped away from their homes. The whole situation is so sad. I hope it is resolved quickly.
Texas Neighbor | 3:06 p.m. April 9, 2008
They need to do DNA tests on these children. They need to know the fathers of
the babies of underage girls so they can arrest them. They also need to have
the older mothers prove that they are the real mothers of the children they
claim. Is it possible the men kept their favorite wives with them and sent the
others to look after the children? I can't help but think the men had
something to do with the decision of these women to go with the children. I am
also wondering about the girl saying her sister might be coming to Texas. There
is some federal law about taking a woman across state lines for sexual purposes.
Maybe the feds ought to be brought in on this from that angle.
Anonymous | 3:09 p.m. April 9, 2008
Thank you Texas Citizen. That is the one big thing that everyone is missing in
this argument. We know only a very small fraction of what has happened at these
places. Let's not pretend like we know everything about it and what should
have been done.
Texan | 3:14 p.m. April 9, 2008
You break the law, you pay the price.
Don't mess with Texas.
Don't mess with Texas.
Re: Anonymous | 3:20 p.m. April 9, 2008
I don't think Texas could legally force the men out of their homes without
due process. The ONLY option Texas had was to take custody of the children until
the state determined that it was safe to return the children to their homes.
It's standard procedure to remove ALL of the children from the home, when that state suspects the even one of the children is being abused.
I think that Texas is doing the best they can, given the circumstances, by allowing the mothers to accompany the children. That's usually not the case, especially when the mothers or the other wives, at the very least, could be considered negligent by for not reporting the abuse.
It's standard procedure to remove ALL of the children from the home, when that state suspects the even one of the children is being abused.
I think that Texas is doing the best they can, given the circumstances, by allowing the mothers to accompany the children. That's usually not the case, especially when the mothers or the other wives, at the very least, could be considered negligent by for not reporting the abuse.
Hard Core TEXAN style | 3:43 p.m. April 9, 2008
I'd say lock em up for good for the sake of our woman kind. If these
poligamist can't treat a woman with respect than we need to GET A ROPE!
Texans also have some great snake bakes down here. If anyone one is interested.
Texans also have some great snake bakes down here. If anyone one is interested.
Breaks my Heart | 3:46 p.m. April 9, 2008
I don't excuse the practice of breaking laws or forcing people against
their will. I do believe in teaching correct principles to children and helping
them understand the consequences of their actions- good and bad. However, know
one can deny that this story makes headlines because of these people are
"different". I also doubt that love was lacking in most of these
families. Anyone quick to point a finger of scorn at these folks would do better
to look at their own impact on children. Where's the outcry when parents
promote or tolerate the immortality of their own children? My heart breaks for
children in either situation.
I don't know what will happen with these "removed" children, but we see the sad consequences of immorality in "normal" children and adults everyday. I urge anyone reading this to stop pointing the finger at them and use your hands to lift the children around you. Make a positive impact within your circle of influence and help stop the sad stories.
I don't know what will happen with these "removed" children, but we see the sad consequences of immorality in "normal" children and adults everyday. I urge anyone reading this to stop pointing the finger at them and use your hands to lift the children around you. Make a positive impact within your circle of influence and help stop the sad stories.
Frank | 3:50 p.m. April 9, 2008
I dont know "Larry", MOST of the men I knew my whole life aren't
by your definition "normal". The majority of men I know have used
women for self pleasures and are proud of that disrespect. Just like most
'normal' men we see on TV and in movies.
The only difference between a polygamist any normal man who's had relations with more than one partner is one stuck around and took some degree of responsibility, and the other discarded their partner never to return.
Do not think I am condoning the actions of the FLDS though. Poligamy has no place in the US right now. But while abuse and slavery are common in polygamy, they are not the point of polygamy. I hope we are not in denial that unwed polygamy is not only widely practiced; it�s the acceptable norm.
The only difference between a polygamist any normal man who's had relations with more than one partner is one stuck around and took some degree of responsibility, and the other discarded their partner never to return.
Do not think I am condoning the actions of the FLDS though. Poligamy has no place in the US right now. But while abuse and slavery are common in polygamy, they are not the point of polygamy. I hope we are not in denial that unwed polygamy is not only widely practiced; it�s the acceptable norm.
Delusional | 3:56 p.m. April 9, 2008
There are some painful truths in Mormon history. Denying them will not make them
go away- or help any members.
To Anonymous | 4:02 p.m. April 9, 2008
Waco is Waco. El Dorado is El Dorado.
Waco is ex-seventh day adventists who were practicing oh, horrors, polygamy.
El Dorado is people gone from the LDS over a hundred years ago, practicing, oh, horrors, polygamy.
There the comparison ends. One had an armory of guns, one apparently didn't. But you never know.
How come so many of you connect polygamy only with the LDS church and also place all the blame there? Blind?
Waco is ex-seventh day adventists who were practicing oh, horrors, polygamy.
El Dorado is people gone from the LDS over a hundred years ago, practicing, oh, horrors, polygamy.
There the comparison ends. One had an armory of guns, one apparently didn't. But you never know.
How come so many of you connect polygamy only with the LDS church and also place all the blame there? Blind?
Geoimage | 4:05 p.m. April 9, 2008
The wealthy Mormon Church needs to step up to the plate and help these women and
children make the transition to a real life.
God Bless the State of Texas for the courage which the Mormon Church and the States of Utah and Arizona so painfully lack.
God Bless the State of Texas for the courage which the Mormon Church and the States of Utah and Arizona so painfully lack.
RE: RE: A Peculiar People | 4:12 p.m. April 9, 2008
"If it weren't for the so-called "Fundamentalists", Mormons would not have the same bias which currently exists in society."
No, it isn't the 'fundamentalist Mormons' that cause 'bias', or disagreement if you will. It is doctrines taught by LDS that are contra to what is found within the scriptures of the Bible. Those of us that are picky about such things can see the difference between the LDS and the FLDS.
In regards to that difference: in light of the fact that the FLDS folks believe that they are in fact the 'true Mormons' as they have refused to compromise the beliefs gained by the teachings of early church prophets, how do you reconcile that fact? Just an honest question. These folks seem to believe they are just as Mormon, if in fact, not more so, than mainstream LDS. I also note many LDS that seem to be sympathetic with the FLDS.
Just wondering | 4:08 p.m. April 9, 2008
Did anyone happen to consider the fact that the authorities propably already
knew the history and what goes on in this group of people when they did the
raid, and the call from this young mother gave them reason to act upon it sooner
than later. This behavior is a long-going history of these people and thank
goodness they are acting on it now. I would think that if everyone would sit
back and wait to see the outcome of the findings as they are unfolding, they
will find out there are horrendous things that are happening to these kids, so
give it a rest in being critical of the authorities. Let's think and pray
for these youngsters as they are being mistreated and hopefully those who are
victims will be blessed in the long run.
cmckenzie | 4:22 p.m. April 9, 2008
The Mormon church should be taking the lead on purging St George and similar
locations of the kind of behavior these extremist groups engage in. Clean up the
backyard and show some real leadership.
50 year old men having sex with teenagers is pedophilia, plain and simple. It is illegal, immoral, and maiming to the heart and soul of the teenagers.
This business makes the abusive Catholic priests looks like amateurs. And while you are at it - get some financial compensation for these victims - sell the ranches and give them the proceeds.
50 year old men having sex with teenagers is pedophilia, plain and simple. It is illegal, immoral, and maiming to the heart and soul of the teenagers.
This business makes the abusive Catholic priests looks like amateurs. And while you are at it - get some financial compensation for these victims - sell the ranches and give them the proceeds.
ediddy | 4:42 p.m. April 9, 2008
Thanks Frank. Take a look at NBA headlines for the week and you'll find a
current case of "unwed" polygamy. Abuse is never to be tolerated as I
have stated more than once today, but the hypocrasy bandied about on these pages
today by those who label these polygamists as evil, sex mongering abusers, while
winking at the same behavior practiced all around us by "normal" Texas
Americans is shameful. The generqlizations heaped upon this
"different" society look pretty bigoted when the name is changed to
"movie star", "athletic hero", "free thinker" etc.
Polygamy is against the law in and of itself and subject to prosecution. The
easy way to get around it is simply to remain unwed and take no responsibility
at all for your immoral actions. Institutionalize the acts, and in Texas,
you're dead meat because then you're different. Prosecute as the law
dictates, not just when the locals have become sufficiently morally outraged.
Texan | 4:50 p.m. April 9, 2008
RE: the comment about being loved and taken care of in the FLDS group. If they
were loved, and had a choice of partners, that would be one thing. To be beaten
and have your ribs broken... well, if that's someone's idea of
"love", then I don't want any part of it.
shameful! | 4:44 p.m. April 9, 2008
It is not a good idea to have cults in America that enslave woman from birth.
There is nothing worse in my opinion than producing children into a world on a
conveyor belt were they have no control over their own lives. I heard the wacko
Warren Jeff tapes. I have been around polygamist and know of their brainwashing
techniques. They also use something called the school of the prophets if I
remember correctly. they use this to teach men how to brainwash woman. Believe
me it is real and a true fact and a horrible fact!
Ted | 4:50 p.m. April 9, 2008
re: frank
Don't judge all men by who you are. polygamy is not every man. It's only part of a few perverts out there who chose tis life style. You are wrong and strange in the head and mind, bud!
Don't judge all men by who you are. polygamy is not every man. It's only part of a few perverts out there who chose tis life style. You are wrong and strange in the head and mind, bud!
onthestreet | 4:56 p.m. April 9, 2008
April 9-Des News-Child Marriage-1
Interesting how even the authorities are referring to the �cooperation� of the FLDS as the �Stockholm Syndrome�, which is a favorable psychological response to their captors in hostage-taking and kidnapping. Even the authorities are referring to this as hostage-taking and kidnapping. So there are bound to be serious repercussions. Christ Himself married a 12-year old, and are Christians not followers of Christ? It is the law, the fundamental early-Christian and Jewish Bat Mitzvah, which is adulthood at age 12, when Christ Himself became an adult in the temple.
Here is Christ marrying a 12-year old: �And He took her hand (in marriage) and said Maid, arise. And she arose straightway�. The Hebrew for �Arose� is �Elyada: Knowing�, as Adam knew is wife, and she conceived. �Alyah: Sheep rump�. Also for �A-rose�: �Gederothayim: Double wall (belly and womb). �Straightway� is �Liylyth: Night spectre, and Zuwr: Pressed together or in proximity, to conceive. The Greek is Euthetos: Well-placed, appropriate, to meet, to cheer.
Interesting how even the authorities are referring to the �cooperation� of the FLDS as the �Stockholm Syndrome�, which is a favorable psychological response to their captors in hostage-taking and kidnapping. Even the authorities are referring to this as hostage-taking and kidnapping. So there are bound to be serious repercussions. Christ Himself married a 12-year old, and are Christians not followers of Christ? It is the law, the fundamental early-Christian and Jewish Bat Mitzvah, which is adulthood at age 12, when Christ Himself became an adult in the temple.
Here is Christ marrying a 12-year old: �And He took her hand (in marriage) and said Maid, arise. And she arose straightway�. The Hebrew for �Arose� is �Elyada: Knowing�, as Adam knew is wife, and she conceived. �Alyah: Sheep rump�. Also for �A-rose�: �Gederothayim: Double wall (belly and womb). �Straightway� is �Liylyth: Night spectre, and Zuwr: Pressed together or in proximity, to conceive. The Greek is Euthetos: Well-placed, appropriate, to meet, to cheer.
ello | 5:04 p.m. April 9, 2008
If the LDS church keeps it's own prophesies then polygamy will return.
That is a fact, and if polygamy returns then all the Mormons will be just like
the FLDS. IT is the same beast.
I am glad that I used my brain power and left the church three years ago, I never have to worry about such stupid and harmful things as polygamy. And to all the mormons who will read this and say that "you will have to worry in the after life", I will say this- Prove it.
Texas is doing the right thing, Utah should have done this years ago, but it hits too close to home to all the mormons here, they know someday they too will go back to polygamy. Have fun with that.
I am glad that I used my brain power and left the church three years ago, I never have to worry about such stupid and harmful things as polygamy. And to all the mormons who will read this and say that "you will have to worry in the after life", I will say this- Prove it.
Texas is doing the right thing, Utah should have done this years ago, but it hits too close to home to all the mormons here, they know someday they too will go back to polygamy. Have fun with that.
Give Me A Break | 4:59 p.m. April 9, 2008
People, just because a few people are bad doesn't make an entire society or
belief bad. Yes, there have been a few circumstances of abuse from this sect of
polygamist, but that does not mean the entire people should be prosecuted. It is
a sad day when the American people turn a blind eye to what our justice system
was setup to do, and that is to protect people. I absolutely agree with the
State removing a child from an abusive environment, but I have seen it more
times than not where the State has put a child back into that abuse and turned a
blind eye. 99% OF THE TIME THIS HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH POLYGAMY. Maybe we should
throw all men in jail for cheating on their wives (also a Utah law), throw all
homosexuals on an island, and create an all white society of bigets. Judge not
the things you do not truly understand. These people are not all bad, they
aren't all brainwashed, or on wellfare, and most of the polygamists that I
know are very loving and giving.
onthestreet | 5:12 p.m. April 9, 2008
April 9-Des News-Child Marriage-2:
The state is saying they can make a special law against God (Ex.22:29, Matt.7:16, Rev.22:2), against the Christian, against the religions of man, against the constitutional nature of man to produce his own kind after the Order of Heaven, which is spelled out in those scriptures, which makes it religion, and �Congress shall make no law respecting religion�. See, so they are violating both God and man, and their own law, and their own nature and being, and if the citizens will stand for that, God will not.
�Now the spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times, some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits�forbidding to marry� (I Tim.4:1-3).
Satan wants to �expand her options and change her choices�, just as Anon has put it� To expand her wisdom, for the forbidden will make her wise, said Satan to the woman, knowing full well the meaning of making her wise in worldly and sensual things, to be �sensual or devilish� (James 3:15). The FLDS people are the most moral people on the planet. Yes, they marry them. To not, that is the crime.
The state is saying they can make a special law against God (Ex.22:29, Matt.7:16, Rev.22:2), against the Christian, against the religions of man, against the constitutional nature of man to produce his own kind after the Order of Heaven, which is spelled out in those scriptures, which makes it religion, and �Congress shall make no law respecting religion�. See, so they are violating both God and man, and their own law, and their own nature and being, and if the citizens will stand for that, God will not.
�Now the spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times, some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits�forbidding to marry� (I Tim.4:1-3).
Satan wants to �expand her options and change her choices�, just as Anon has put it� To expand her wisdom, for the forbidden will make her wise, said Satan to the woman, knowing full well the meaning of making her wise in worldly and sensual things, to be �sensual or devilish� (James 3:15). The FLDS people are the most moral people on the planet. Yes, they marry them. To not, that is the crime.
Huguenot | 5:06 p.m. April 9, 2008
The LDS church forbids the practice of polygamy. But what is its stance on
polygamy as a practice in eternity? Responses by LDS members on this site which
express anger at a state for trying to interfere with the FLDS's family
life seem to me to indicate a great deal of sympathy for the bigamists in
question.
onthestreet | 5:10 p.m. April 9, 2008
April 9-Des News-Child Marriage-3
Yes, they give life, while American commits serial murder on children by the millions, because that�s the law. No, the FLDS do not have sex with the child-brides. The faithful �touch not the forbidden fruit�, for that is the Gospel from the beginning. And since then, the proper method is artificial insemination. Anything else, even with adults, is gross, sensual, animalistic, and criminal.
So every FLDS parent has the legal right to protect against that. That is the true religion. That is a most basic God-given human right, to shield their children for their Bar Mitzvah or Bat Mitzvah at 12, even as all the Biblical prophets were shielded, as the Nazarene Himself, to be a Nazarite or temple-worker, and NOT something defiled and cast out. The FLDS vow is �the vow of a Nazarite� (Numbers 6:2), and �to be a Nazarite unto God from the womb� (Judges 13:5). �Her Nararites were purer than snow, and polished like sapphire� (Lam.4:7).
Yes, they give life, while American commits serial murder on children by the millions, because that�s the law. No, the FLDS do not have sex with the child-brides. The faithful �touch not the forbidden fruit�, for that is the Gospel from the beginning. And since then, the proper method is artificial insemination. Anything else, even with adults, is gross, sensual, animalistic, and criminal.
So every FLDS parent has the legal right to protect against that. That is the true religion. That is a most basic God-given human right, to shield their children for their Bar Mitzvah or Bat Mitzvah at 12, even as all the Biblical prophets were shielded, as the Nazarene Himself, to be a Nazarite or temple-worker, and NOT something defiled and cast out. The FLDS vow is �the vow of a Nazarite� (Numbers 6:2), and �to be a Nazarite unto God from the womb� (Judges 13:5). �Her Nararites were purer than snow, and polished like sapphire� (Lam.4:7).
onthestreet | 5:16 p.m. April 9, 2008
April 9-Des News-Child Marriage-4
�And (the beast) shall speak great words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and think to change times and laws�But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away (the beast�s) dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the Most High� (they who are known by their fruits from the pure origin of the stream, to keep His Word: Ex.22:29, Matt.7:16, Rev.22:2).
Extensive details of evidence of Biblical Christian support for the FLDS at: http://texaspolygamy.blogspot.com/ (OTS threads).
�And (the beast) shall speak great words against the Most High, and shall wear out the saints of the Most High, and think to change times and laws�But the judgment shall sit, and they shall take away (the beast�s) dominion, to consume and to destroy it unto the end. And the kingdom and dominion, and the greatness of the kingdom under the whole heaven, shall be given to the people of the saints of the Most High� (they who are known by their fruits from the pure origin of the stream, to keep His Word: Ex.22:29, Matt.7:16, Rev.22:2).
Extensive details of evidence of Biblical Christian support for the FLDS at: http://texaspolygamy.blogspot.com/ (OTS threads).
sol vason | 5:24 p.m. April 9, 2008
Moslems are polygamous. Moslem fathers beat up and kill their daughters who
refuse to marry the man chhosen for them. These are called "Honor
Killings".
Google that term and you will find over a hundred dead girls.
Moslems believe a girl can be married and forced to have sex as soon as her first period. The prophet Mohammed married his first wife when she was 7 and had sex with her when she was nine. Google Mohammed's first wife and read the Suras and the Koran. All Moslems who believe in the prophet do this.
So why attack Mormans when there are so many dead and abused Moslem girls in the US? Is it because Moslems fight back?
Google that term and you will find over a hundred dead girls.
Moslems believe a girl can be married and forced to have sex as soon as her first period. The prophet Mohammed married his first wife when she was 7 and had sex with her when she was nine. Google Mohammed's first wife and read the Suras and the Koran. All Moslems who believe in the prophet do this.
So why attack Mormans when there are so many dead and abused Moslem girls in the US? Is it because Moslems fight back?
nonmember ct | 5:19 p.m. April 9, 2008
I have never heard so much BS in all my life. You guys are all sicko maniacs!!
You make up stuff to please yourselves and everyone out here knows it. Mental
illness is mental illness. And you guys are sick...God help your perverted
minds.
Barb | 5:39 p.m. April 9, 2008
Most cultures who practice polygamy abuse woman. Woman are second to nothing in
a mans world in these cultures. If our God was that kind of God than I'd
rather go to hell. However, polygamy was created by MEN for the pleasures of MEN
only.
Intelectual | 5:42 p.m. April 9, 2008
Mr. Sol Vason is an ignorant, uninformed shut in. Anyone who has ever met a
Muslim would NEVER voice such a rash opinion about the faith. Muslims are
beautiful, kind people. Only a small number engage in such old-fashioned
customs.
If only there was some way to keep idiots like you out of these kind of public forums.
If only there was some way to keep idiots like you out of these kind of public forums.
DeLaval Milker | 5:44 p.m. April 9, 2008
These kids were not seized by the state. They were rescued.
The stuff starting to come out is more than disturbing. This is wrong. Religion does not excuse it. Does not.
This is not government run amok. It is governemnt doing what it's supposed to do. Ya watching, Utah and Arizona?
The stuff starting to come out is more than disturbing. This is wrong. Religion does not excuse it. Does not.
This is not government run amok. It is governemnt doing what it's supposed to do. Ya watching, Utah and Arizona?
russ | 5:52 p.m. April 9, 2008
There seems to be a thread in some of these postings that breaking up a family
is bad, even if there is the strong possibility that there has been abuse.
Interesting. Mormon teaching?
Abuse of a child is abuse of a child. We have something called society because we know that abuse is wrong and that collectively we must prevent it.
My hat is off to Texas. They bit the bullet. AZ and UT did not.
Abuse of a child is abuse of a child. We have something called society because we know that abuse is wrong and that collectively we must prevent it.
My hat is off to Texas. They bit the bullet. AZ and UT did not.
to hoping for the best | 6:01 p.m. April 9, 2008
..."the LDS version of polygamy (when practiced) and the FLDS version of
polygamy are two different ways of practicing a Biblical principle. At NO time
in the history of polygamy in the LDS church did Joseph Smith or any of the
people who practiced this, EVER condone such activity or live this
way..."
You don't know your own history! Joseph Smith married 34 women. Two were only 14. Two more only 16. Eleven of them were married to living husbands.
Brigham Young had 27 wives. In his mid-40s he married a 15yo and two 16yos.
At the time the average age for a first marriage was 21-22yo which is born out by census and the age of estrus data.
Do a little research!
You don't know your own history! Joseph Smith married 34 women. Two were only 14. Two more only 16. Eleven of them were married to living husbands.
Brigham Young had 27 wives. In his mid-40s he married a 15yo and two 16yos.
At the time the average age for a first marriage was 21-22yo which is born out by census and the age of estrus data.
Do a little research!
Facts | 6:10 p.m. April 9, 2008
Fact: The LDS Church stopped practicing polygamy ONLY BECAUSE they were on the
verge of losing all assets including temples to the U.S. government.
Fact: If not for the courage of the U.S. government to take a stand against the LDS practice of plural marriage, today's LDS Church would be no more than a marginalized cult localized on some ranch or state border.
Fact: The LDS Church practices spiritual plural marriage today. Male LDS members can be sealed to multiple wives in the temple as long as their earthly spouse has either died or they have divorced - in essence having multiple wives sealed to him at once. Female LDS members can only be sealed to one man at a time. The previous sealing must first be broken. Polygamy always has been and continues to be central to the gospel and celestial marriage.
Fact: I will be shocked if the DN blog Czar posts this. It is on point as many are unaware in these posts of the historical and current facts regarding polygamy. However, it may be considered a bit to direct for this paper.
Fact: If not for the courage of the U.S. government to take a stand against the LDS practice of plural marriage, today's LDS Church would be no more than a marginalized cult localized on some ranch or state border.
Fact: The LDS Church practices spiritual plural marriage today. Male LDS members can be sealed to multiple wives in the temple as long as their earthly spouse has either died or they have divorced - in essence having multiple wives sealed to him at once. Female LDS members can only be sealed to one man at a time. The previous sealing must first be broken. Polygamy always has been and continues to be central to the gospel and celestial marriage.
Fact: I will be shocked if the DN blog Czar posts this. It is on point as many are unaware in these posts of the historical and current facts regarding polygamy. However, it may be considered a bit to direct for this paper.
TO GEOIMAGE from 4:05 | 6:12 p.m. April 9, 2008
I am typing this very slowly so that you can possibly understand. Obviously you
have missed it every time it has been published or said. THE LDS CHURCH IS NOT
AFFILIATED WITH THE FLDS CHURCH. It is its own entity. What is it you are not
getting here? The LDS church has no more responsiblity to "step up" as
you put it than do the Catholics, The Baptists, the Jews etc. I hope this is
clear enough for you. If not read it again Slower this time.
Angelo Frank | 6:26 p.m. April 9, 2008
It is a common reaction that as this crisis wears on that some people start to
sympathize with this sect, or cult, and it's principles. One can see this
in the various posts throughout the last few days. They have gone from almost a
uniform outrage at the FLDS and support of the actions of the Texas authorities
to now a certain commiseration on the part of a few with the sect. Merrill
Jessop is counting on the public to sympathize with his movement and this is
standard operating procedure for leaders of extremist sects and cults. The
effort to paint the Texas CPS as a bunch of thugs or brownshirts will be the
propaganda tool used by the spokespersons for the sect and will be a continuous
drumbeat in the press and on the internet blogosphere. Only the airing of the
real facts about the FLDS will counteract hoopla from the sect sympathizers and
supporters in the coming weeks and months as the legal maneuvering on both sides
unfolds. It will get real interesting to say the least.
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