Deseret News | Reader comments: The value of immigration

Reader comments
The value of immigration

Anonymous | 5:23 a.m. April 5, 2008

The "free movement of labor" may create benefits, but those benefits are unevenly distributed. The immigrants gain, obviously, as do some business interests (like certain real estate moguls), but study after study demonstrates that most Americans lose. So to suggest that 'everyone benefits' is like saying that theft is beneficial because some people got richer from what is a zero-sum "transaction."

A 1997 National Science Foundation Study found very minimal benefit to the nation overall: $10 billion a year in an economy of over $10 trillion - less than 0.1% increase, a number which doesn't include the affect on quality of life. Ask yourself: has your life gotten better from the last 15 years of mass immigration? Is your commute shorter? Are your schools better? Are your taxes lower? Are your politicians paying more attention to your concerns? Is the economy stronger or weaker?

Harvard economist George Borjas summed up that 1997 study this way:

*** "The typical native household pays somewhere between $166 and $226 in additional taxes because of immigration. There are approximately 90 million native households in the United States, so that the national fiscal burden lies somewhere between $15 billion and $21 billion per year." ***

Wilkey | 5:33 a.m. April 5, 2008

1,052,415

What does that number signify? The number of people who immigrated LEGALLY to this country in 1997. So if immigration is economically beneficial to this country then we are already doing more than our part to help it.

This paper repeatedly claims that we have the right to expect that flow of immigration to be legal but then it undermines that very argument by opposing ANY effort to make sure that would occur: NO state enforcement of immigration laws, give drivers licenses to illegals, give in-state tuition to illegals, ad infinitum, ad nauseum. Worst of all, it favors amnesty for the current 10-15 million people in this country illegally. Doing so would create a movement of people across our border so large that it would make the California Gold Rush look tiny by comparison.

The truth is we are arguing over minimal gains to the economy from immigration. The consensus among economists is that it's a very small positive gain, AT BEST. We're permanently changing our country for a few more pennies in our pocket.

One study showed cost to EACH California taxpayer of illegal immigration at $1,183 annually. That's $10.5 just for education, medical care, and incarceration.

ezra hinckley | 6:02 a.m. April 5, 2008

well if he studied at byu it must be true. i cant wait for that great one world dictatorship thats coming with all these wonderful open borders. we must reelect mcbush in order to save the constitution. go jazz

Comments continue below

jr | 7:02 a.m. April 5, 2008

Immigration can be valuable but not ILLEGAL ALIENS, those immigrating throught the process are willing to take their turn in line and tend to assimilate into the new society they choose to adopt. ILLEGAL ALIENS are another kettle of fish and considering Jones is representing the Mexican side of the border why then does he not mention the mistreatment of those coming from the south of Mexico. How convenient and one sided is his writings As much as we hate rules and regulations it is what helps keep a society in some kind of order without them there is a mess of which we now experience in the good ol' USA and Utah

Save Ferris | 7:29 a.m. April 5, 2008

Jeffrey Jones is a cabinet minister in Mexico? Mr. Rooney?

Dave | 7:43 a.m. April 5, 2008

It is and egg-head theory that would be disastrous.

Paul | 8:29 a.m. April 5, 2008

Of course, Jones is going to have that opinion. That's what he is paid to think. I don't see how having uncontrolled immigration of a lot of unskilled people into a country is somehow a good thing. Nor is it a good thing to have a lot of money siphoned off to another country. Too bad the Government won't put controls on money transfers leaving our country or require all employees to verify who they are hiring. Apparently that would be too inconvenient. At least Jones understands that Mexico needs to clean up its own act.

Dead Wrong | 9:35 a.m. April 5, 2008

This "opinion" epitomizes the "New World Order" agenda. Open immigration to developed countries is NOT the answer to the the 3rd world's overpopulated regions. How absurd to EXPECT us to ABSORB the poor illiterates of the world when it's a problem of their own making.

Overpopulation is the biggest problem in 3rd world countries and there is no excuse for it. Birth control and education would go farther and be less victimizing to developed countries than open immigration.

Immigration seen though Logic | 10:36 a.m. April 5, 2008

In history there have always been the timid souls that belive there is danger around every corner. The nursery rhyme henny penny says it well, this rooster was convinced the sky was falling down and convinced all the other barn yard anamials of this and put them in a panic.

Apparently our forebearers were well aware of these types of people and the myths they spread.

That said when cooler heads look at immigration using logic instead of bigotry and emotion, immigration is seen for what it is,

Good For Our Economy

wrz | 11:34 a.m. April 5, 2008

>>Ultimately, the loss of workers would put pressure on those countries to enact reforms that make them competitive in the labor market. >Pritchett told Reason Magazine recently that he compares immigration restrictions to Apartheid.<<

More baloney! YouTube "Immigration Gumballs" shows what happens with uncontrolled immigration.

MEB | 1:53 p.m. April 5, 2008

@Immigration seen through logic - You are as uneducated about nursery rhymes as you are about illegal immigration.

It was Chicken Little who went around convincing others that the sky was falling. And it's a children's story, not a nursery rhyme.

But accurate details don't matter, do they?

sparkes22 | 3:55 p.m. April 5, 2008

To Dead Wrong:

I'm on the internet every day, read 7 or 8 newspapers and 20 to 30 books a year but I've never read the "New World Order" agenda. Care to tell me what it is or where I can find such a document?

I suspect there's no such document and its another made up "fact" (similar to the "gay agenda" mentioned earlier this week) to stoke people's fears and drive them to the poll like lemmings.

Stewart | 4:51 p.m. April 5, 2008

I think the author has forgotten the numbers. Over 5 billion people live in poverty stricken 3rd world countries. Countries like the United States could never take in more than a drop in the bucket toward bringing these people out of poverty. Poverty for these will need to be dealt with in their home countries.

As for being a benefit, I think the jury is still out on that. It is certainly a benefit for cheap labor business and a capitalistic business model that requires a continually increasing number of consumers, much like direct marketing or ponzi schemes. In this type of business the many pay for the wealth of a few. The taxpayers generally pay for the costs of immigrants since they no longer are required to have sponsors to pay these costs. Like the illegal drug business, many pay for the wealth of a few. This even applies to legal immigration.

re MEB | 1:53 p.m. | 5:03 p.m. April 5, 2008

If one looks up chicken little, and henny penny in google, actually the nursery rhyme about the chicken claiming the sky is falling occurs under both names, chicken little and henny penny.

Looks like it is you who doesn't have all their ducks in a row.

check out Europe | 5:20 p.m. April 5, 2008

Western Europe is a great place to see the "benefits" of massive immigration from the third world (primarily Muslim immigrants) Natives are being forced to assimilate to the immigrant's culture instead of the reverse. Don't buy into this argument if you want your children to have a Country

wrz | 5:45 p.m. April 5, 2008

You're exactly right, check. Europe is fast becoming Muslim with Sharia Law and the works. Just as they planned.

Soon, if things don't change, the US will be Hispanic. My TV cable already has five or six Spanish speaking channels.

re wrz | 5:45 p.m. | 6:28 p.m. April 5, 2008

Moslems cut off peoples heads for insulting the "prophet". Mexicans bring us Mariachi Music and Mexican food.

Informed | 6:29 p.m. April 5, 2008

To Sparks22:

The "New World Order" isn't a DOCUMENT - it's a THEORY (for SOME it's an agenda) and if you haven't HEARD of it, then you're not as well-read as you THINK you are.

If PROOF is what you need, instead of relying on your OWN instincts and self-education, you'll be the last to know about it anyway.

c.o.e. | 6:59 p.m. April 5, 2008

It seems to me that most Americans whether conservative or liberal (except the real far left)are anti-illegal immigration. There are lots of instances where the majority is wrong - that's why I don't like Populism and also why true democracy always fails.But, I'm going with the majority on this one.... Heck, if I were an illegal alien I'd be against unchecked immigration also. For every worker here that will work for 10.00 an hour there are 5 more in Central America that will work for 5.00 an hour
And you know somewhere down the road all of the illegals that can prove that they paid Social Security taxes are going to be eligible for benefits.. and I don't know where it all ends

Curious | 8:05 p.m. April 5, 2008

"There is no reason to doubt that the free and orderly movement of laborers among nations would be any less beneficial."

The so called "free" movement of labor effectively means the end of the nation-state. Please quantify "free" in this instance, 100M, 200M, a billion people, where does it end??? You have no idea what a hell on earth this country would become with these quantities of people coming in.

If you want a preview of that hell, please take a look at the greater Los Angeles area. If you want to know the "benefits" look at California's massive budget deficits, overcrowded schools and hospitals, and gang crime. All the result of massive third world immigration to that area, both legal and illegal.

wrz | 9:02 p.m. April 5, 2008

>>Muslims cut off peoples heads for insulting the "prophet". Mexicans bring us Mariachi Music and Mexican food.<<

Would that that's all they brought. Some have been arrested for bring drugs. And don't forget the gangs in LA and elsewhere.

MEB | 10:45 p.m. April 5, 2008

Why argue with someone who won't educate themself? I have my ducks in a row, and I know the difference between a rooster, a hen, and a chick. I also know the difference between a nursery rhyme and a children's story. AND, I know what illegal immigration, left unchecked, will do to this country.

Details do matter.

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