Deseret News | Reader comments: Utahns not so happy with legislators

Reader comments
Utahns not so happy with legislators

tenx | 5:48 a.m. March 25, 2008

Dan - Are you sure that the Govs rating isn't just 86% of Illegal Immigrants rather than 86% of registered voters? Must be a mistake!

Timj | 6:09 a.m. March 25, 2008

Finally my old neighbors in South and West Jordan are realizing that Buttars is a bad person to represent them. I've known it for years...it's too bad it has taken them that long to figure it out.
No more Eagle's Forum pawns, please.

Cliff | 6:19 a.m. March 25, 2008

Fifty-three percent republican and 25% democrat? The actual distribution of elected officials is no where near that distribution...why? Immoral gerrymandering by an autocratic, monolithic one party system. That's why.

Comments continue below

Bill | 6:26 a.m. March 25, 2008

I think they should all be replaced before they get to powerful. I'm voting for new people. They can't do any worse than the ones in there now. The problem with fellow utahn's is they are all sheep. Afraid to make chages. Changes can be good rather than follow the good old boys all the time. I also agree with tenx's comment above. Good for you.

wjres | 7:01 a.m. March 25, 2008

I'm sure Sen. Buttars and his buddies considered this fallout when they met at Grand Teton Lodge to plan his current campaign. Nice excuse to take your business and campaign funds out-of-state. (see campaign disclosure statements on file with Lt.Gov.)

Anonymous | 6:58 a.m. March 25, 2008

Throw the bums out!
Every one.
A revolving door.
Do this every election.
Maybe then they will get the hint.

Scooter | 7:34 a.m. March 25, 2008

I can't believe this headline.
Is it true?
I'm shocked.
.....
Now hopefully the State Government will get it, we are sick & tired of the "tax-them-into-submission" mentality.
Vote new reps. into office.

AIMHO

Jeremy | 7:35 a.m. March 25, 2008

Cliff,

It is easy to claim immoral gerrymandering, but the truth may be a little more complicated. If every area in the state were truly 53% Republican to 25% Democrat, then you'd have only Republicans in the Legislature, because 25 never beats 53. The truth is that there are a few democrat strongholds in the state, and a lot of Republican strongholds. The only way to get Republican representation down to only 53% would be to go with proportional representation, or to gerrymander the state in order to guarantee proportional representation. I'm not sure why that would be less immoral than any other type of gerrymandering.

I might point out that all of this ignores the Independent vote. I imagine a lot of them are, like my father, conservative, but that they hate the idea of parties and party loyalty, so they vote for the Republican most times. If that's the case, then the real balance might be closer to 75% to 25%, and then the balance of power in the legislature seems not quite so "immoral," does it?

Orem Parent | 7:46 a.m. March 25, 2008

It is easy for me.

Did you vote for vouchers?

If yes, you do not get my vote.

If no, you get my vote.

The only real good or harm the legislature does is with public education and illegal immigration.

They have failed on both accounts for many years now.

Time to get rid of the slackers that serve their own self interests and vote in someone that cares about our children and their future.

What a Joke! | 7:50 a.m. March 25, 2008

I think we'd have better "representation" if we took pages out of the phone book and threw darts at them to pick legislators. I really do.

Then factor in no campaign finance rules, low or non-existent ethics standards, closed meetings, no application of government records disclosure laws to the legislature, one of the most impossible voter referendum laws in the nation, and on, and on, and on, not to mention the crass attempts to profit personally from everything from property development to nuclear power generation, the whole system is terrible.

I am not a far-right or left wing nut -- I am a middle-of-the-road voter who thinks we need some balance if only to slow down the craziness.

And, this is not to mention the number of bills passed where little or no homework is done to understand the real issues (committee hearings have become virtually meaningless). Find something you know a lot about and research what happens when the legislature makes a decision on that matter and you will see what I mean.

Worst of all -- we get exactly what we deserve!

El Piloto | 8:14 a.m. March 25, 2008

An 12% of the public actually know who their representatives are. Voters aren't happy with Butters...what's new! Nice non-story there Bob!

Patrick | 8:10 a.m. March 25, 2008

I think the majority of the 104 elected representatives are good, honorable people that share my conservative family values. However, many of the decisions are made by a small group of people and if you don't fall in line bad things can happen, such as having your bills held up in Rules and never being considered or voted on. I think the process is even more important than the people because the majority (in my opinion) will make the right decisions if allowed to. In my opinion, the legislature needs to 1) re-adopt term limits (which they rescinded in 2003) so we can get some new faces with fresh ideas, 2) institute real ethics reform (such as stricter conflict of interest laws and bans (or limits) on gifts to legislators), and 3) cap the number of bills a legislator can introduce to avoid the temptation of introducing a bill that will personally benefit the legislator thinking that no one will find time to read it. Add to this list repealing the exception to the Open and Public Meetings Act the legislature carved out for itself.

Utah Resident | 8:29 a.m. March 25, 2008

Jeremy, never mind that the MAJORITY of voters in SL, Summit or Tooele Counties are Independents or Democrats, the GOP majority Gerrymandered these areas into pieces to protect their one-party status in this state. It went down as one of the worst examples exhibited in the entire country. But never mind that, the important thing is to maintain One-Party Rule, One-Party State, Now and Forever. Amen.

arc | 8:49 a.m. March 25, 2008

If the rest of the state reps and senators were as good as mine, the whole state would be better. Don't throw them all out!

Anonymous | 8:54 a.m. March 25, 2008

Sorry arc -
your reps and senators are just going to have to bite the bullet.
Sort of a sacrifice for the greater good.
The only way to strike fear into their hearts is to throw them all out.

orion | 8:59 a.m. March 25, 2008

I don't get it. Why the magic with the capital "R" next to candidate names? How blind Utah voters are!

MadMax | 9:18 a.m. March 25, 2008

It is unfortunate that most voters do not know or care to find out how their legislators vote on issues. If they actually did this one thing I believe most legislators would be replaced. The goofy laws we have would not be on the books without being passed via a majority of the legislature voting for them and a governor signing them into law. Hold these folks accountable. Why do we not have ethics reform? (If the majority of the legislature wanted it, we would have it.) Why did we have an omnibus education bill which included bills previously voted down? (It took a mjority of the legislature to pass that bill.) Why do we have a watered down immigration bill which most Utah voters find objectionable? (It took a majority of the legislature to pass it.) These issues would still have a differnent outcome if our governor had actively worked the opposite side of these issues. He does have veto power. Even if a bill is 'veto proof' he could veto it to send a message to the legislature that he disapproves it. Wake up Utah voters! It is past time for a big change.

Jimmy Boy | 9:45 a.m. March 25, 2008

No surprise that Buttars didn't return calls. I've e-mailed him and the Legislative Leadership repeatedly to no avail. Its easier to simply ignore the media and constituants.

Reader | 9:59 a.m. March 25, 2008

Maybe voters are wising up and realizing they must get rid of a percentage of these self-serving clowns. Hopefully, we will see people like Curtis, Bramble, and Buttars replaced. It is healthy to have 25% of the Legislature cleaned out and turned over each election.

Educator | 10:00 a.m. March 25, 2008

All the talk in the world won't make a difference if we don't go to caucuses tonight. Republican or Democrat, it's equally important. Be sure that YOUR voice is heard tonight when delegates are elected to represent your neighborhood at the party conventions. Those delegates will decide which names go on the ballot in Novemeber for the rest of us to choose from. That's how Chris Buttars has be allowed to return every year, it's the delegates, not the voters. And, if you want REAL choice, become a delegate yourself. You'll be every candidate's best buddy for the next 8 months!

the thing | 10:17 a.m. March 25, 2008

Interesting that a state that is ranked so highly by those who watch us, one with a solvent economic plan, is so unhappy with the prosperous situation it is in.

To the thing | 10:46 a.m. March 25, 2008

Utah's recognition for being well run has nada to do with the legislature, but with an extremely devoted and underpaid State workforce. The legislature treats them like dirt. Governor Ken takes the credit, but what has he actually done in office? Nada again. Nada. Encore nada. Have our educational results improved? No. Is our air quality better? No. Is our economy sliding downhill? Yes. Is our legislature full of crooks and incompetents? Yes.

Resigned | 11:24 a.m. March 25, 2008

I beg to differ on voters "adoring" Gov. Huntsman. I can't say that I've agreed with much of what he's done or said while in office. He seems to be soft on everything, except bringing yet more people....oops, "businesses," into UT. That and protecting illegal immigrants so UT businesses can have cheap labor. The only good thing he did was vouchers, and that didn't didn't make it. So we get more of the same mediocre education for our children from way too many downtrodden and mediocre teachers. Yippee!!!!!!!!!! We in UT just love the status pro.

Mike R. | 11:48 a.m. March 25, 2008

It's the Governor Stupid! A liberal masquerading as a conservative. Just like his hero Ahnolt. He should be the one with the low approval ratings.

Be involved! | 11:53 a.m. March 25, 2008

Utahns should make informed electoral choices and go to their caucus meetings tonight.

Gabi | 11:54 a.m. March 25, 2008

As a former mormon, I can explain why the RED R is magical.

The prophet admonishes the Saints to encourage multi-party voting.

That translates in Relief Society and Priesthood meetings to the following, "Republican = Mormon = the only true church = only true political party = if you vote other than R, you will burn in hell"

I was told many times in church that I could not be a good mormon if I didn't vote republican.

One reason why I no longer attend or participate in mormonism.

Johnny-O | 12:18 p.m. March 25, 2008

I think Patrick pretty much hit the nail on the head. With the repeal of term limits and leadership making all of the decisions it reminds me of a nursery rhyme: Tick tock the game is locked and nobody else can play.

Generic | 12:38 p.m. March 25, 2008

Isnt it funny that the Democrats crying about a one party system in Utah, are the same ones wanting to throw out all the bums in office,,,,,,and replace the R with a D? Isnt that still a one Party problem?
As for the Governor, I will be voting for SuperDell in this election.

Lynny | 12:46 p.m. March 25, 2008

The caucus system is broken. It just doesn't work in all precincts the way it should.

I'm sure there are some areas where it works the way intended, but more and more often the average Joe or Jane in any given area has no chance of being elected as a delegate.

Influential or powerful individuals or church associations have distorted the system so that it doesn't function as originally intended. Incumbent legislators strongarm the process to ensure only those who are supportive of their own re-election are chosen as delegates - much the same way they strongarm each other into voting their way when the legislature is in session.

My preference would be to go to a straight primary system. I know that won't happen here, just as I know that an unhealthy number from one party will be elected in the General election, and that we won't stop aggregious gerrymandering, and that open-mindedness is not appreciated in this wonderful state.

To Gabi | 12:49 p.m. March 25, 2008

I've been told the same thing in Church, but I don't need their approval. As a practicing Mormon and a Democrat, I vote my own conscience and let them vote theirs. So far I've never lost a friend over politics, and certainly not my testimony. Years ago somebody told me I couldn't be a good Mormon and a Democrat. I thought about it, decided she was wrong, and that was that. It's as much my Church as it is hers.

Joel McHale | 12:55 p.m. March 25, 2008

Great post Gabi!

Hateful People | 1:02 p.m. March 25, 2008

Don't you think the Governor is doing a good job unless you have had dealings with him
He only has Lily White Teeth
These 104 People are people you do not know as well
Now you know Buttars is a true RACIST.
Even in 2008, In the Legislature, This behavior is being up held my the President
I am appalled by the voters in Utah that will vote a straight Republican ticket and get these same incumbunts back into your lives
Most of the laws that are passed are UnConstitutional
Of Course you do not know anything about the Constitution
Listen Up
Time to learn

Funny Headlines | 1:03 p.m. March 25, 2008

Utahns Not So Happy with Legislators
Russians Not So Happy with Stalin
Jews Not So Happy with Hitler
Chicago Not So Happy with Capone

In the know | 1:37 p.m. March 25, 2008

What the heck HAS Huntsman done for Utah to get that kind of approval rating...other than fly under the radar so he doesn't have to deal with anything controversial that will affect his ratings! He has no backbone to stand up for what the people want and the sad thing is, he'll probably be elected again cuz to the older voters, he's Daddy's boy and to those who don't follow politics...he hasn't caused any waves so they'll vote for him again...SO SAD! Another sad thing...no one of any substance is running against him. Utah is in sorry circumstances to have Ken and Barbie in the Mansion for another term.

Anonymous | 3:04 p.m. March 25, 2008

Shame on you Bob for fanning the flames of racism again.

Shame on you Bob for dragging an innocent man through the mud once again.

And all for your own personal gain.

And how could anyone think huntsman is doing a good job?

He has never shown any spine at all. if he was any good as an executive wouldn't he still be involved in his fathers business? I guess even daddy wouldn't trust with the keys to the family car.

Vote No for Huntsman | 3:19 p.m. March 25, 2008

Interesting comments about Gov. Huntsman. I believe people are blinded by what the media says and Huntsman follows what the media reports. He has not backed the people of Utah, he only looks for reelection. I voted for him, and now the only way I would vote for him is if he ran against Rocky Anderson and then I would think twice.

Anti Incumbent | 3:24 p.m. March 25, 2008

I am strong LDS that does not care about the R.

The R goes back to a day when R stodd for something.

My Bishop said to stay away from any R rated anyway.

Just voting for non-incumbents.

Gary Coleman ran for Gov in CA when Arnold won.

C'mon Gary, this time you have at least my vote.

You put your name in the hat, I'll help.

bhparkman | 4:25 p.m. March 25, 2008

Don't trust polls. The data can be easily recorded wrong, corrupted, misinterpreted, or end up useless. Trust your own decisions about your representitives and don't rely heavily on the opinions of random folks and the media.

Contact your representitives and candidates on your own: grill them for information, question their motives, test their personalities - do your own work.

Don't be afraid of your candidates or representitives. If they give you a hard time or refuse to acknowledge your requests for information, then make sure you get their refusal on tape and publish it.

These representitives are your temp employees. They are not royalty. If your representitive doesn't do their job for your area, then recall them. If they break the law, then impeach them. The checks and balances still apply. It's up to the citizens to enforce them. What good is a anonymous poll when your actions are in the open.

earth | 4:33 p.m. March 25, 2008

Let be real here. The reason for the percentage is because a lot of us vote for the person JUST because they are in our WARD. There are lot of Crooks who are LDS. ie: Val Southwick. We need to look at the candidate and not his religion. Remember Hitler was also religious. We need to have new representative every 4 years. If we vote them out every term, then they can't have all the special interest to look out for. They will have to listern to the people. Let all do our job and vote the BUMS OUT. PEACE.

Utah Republican | 7:12 p.m. March 25, 2008

We, as right thinking, good people of Utah, have the duty to vote for the Republican Party. Our spiritual leaders have spoken, and they say, vote Republican. That's as good as an order from God, so we all have the responsibility to vote Republican. We, as right thinking people, cannot allow the left leaning, socialistic, probably even communistic, Democratic party to gain a foothold in the right thinking state of Utah. If we allowed that, before long, we'd have things like federal and state funded education, federal funds for roads, farm subsidies, federally administered retirement fund, federally administered health aid for the old and infirm. We, as right thinking Utah Republicans cannot allow that. We stand for competition, only the strong survive, let the weak and helpless fend for themselves, tax cuts for the wealthy, get all you can while you can. All of which are God's plan. We cannot let socialistic thinking, left leaning, probably communistic Democrats have any say in our right thinking state of Utah. Thank you.

Special interests | 8:49 p.m. March 25, 2008

Why do voters keep electing people just because they have that Republican label? You'd think that after having so many special interest legislators who only care about their own personal agendas - Stephenson, Madsen, Morley and Tilton - that voters would want officials who are fair and care about real issues.

R | 9:59 p.m. March 25, 2008

Mormons are not all republicans...

They just like Pirate Movies...

RRRRRRRRRRR!!!

Harry Reid, a Democrat gave a fine talk at BYU.

James Faust Democrat.

LDS can be democrats. Most are just to smart.

bhparkman | 12:48 a.m. March 26, 2008

Just an FYI: I am NOT a Democrat, Republican, Green's, Utah Green's, Constitution Party, Liberal, Conservative, or Socialist.

My wife says I'm a Sovereign Independent. Meaning I have my household's best interest at heart - not some useless political ideology that drives me to irrational acts. Personal liberty and the sovereignty of the household under a mother and father is central. The heads of the household focus on the households' social/economic/political/spiritual standing to advance their holdings and security through provident self-reliance, lobbying efforts, and use of all liberties.

The home literally becomes the center of our lives: the economic center with income and industry (the home becomes a business), the social center through home education and fun time, the political center where children are reared to know the Constitution and laws by heart, the spiritual where we practice the exhortings of both Church and God.

After the house is is in order, then we venture to help the neighbors if they require assistance. Conservatives claim to do this, but I have seen little proof. There is no religious duty to vote Republican. There is religious duty to be free.

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