Deseret News | LDS Church issues apology in missionary vandalism case

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LDS Church issues apology in missionary vandalism case

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Ruben Israel | 11:04 p.m. March 10, 2008

As a street preacher I AM OFFENDED that anyone would do this to another religion, this is even beneath us street preachers. SHAME ON YOU LDS and to think these young men have the keys to the kingdom.
See you in April, Ruben Israel

Anonymous | 11:11 p.m. March 10, 2008

The photo of the elder with the broken head, included the caption that he'd just broke it.

Whether it was accidental or on purpose it didn't say, but the caption on Photobucket did indicate that the guy broke it.

That was reported in an earlier article.

to sean | 11:17 p.m. March 10, 2008

If these men (not boys at 19...sorry) are disgraced for the rest of their lives because they were sent home from a mission early then maybe the rest of your church needs to learn some tolerance and forgiveness as well. Why would everyone be rude to him? They need to be punished for there actions and stupidity just like anyone that damages a ward house or temple.

Comments continue below

Try Again | 11:18 p.m. March 10, 2008

Did you read bruce Olsen's church statement--he said we(LDS Church}have worked hand in hand with Catholic Charities, that means for many years we have given lots of money to the Catholics to use in world areas we can't get resources into, Catholic Aid has helped us get food into North Africa and thus helped war torn starving people. Our leaders and ArchBishops like each other and have good working relationships.Lets all remember that fact.!!!

Voice of Reason | 11:12 p.m. March 10, 2008

When I heard of this story and saw the photos I was disgusted and am still that these Elders would be sensless enough to:
1. do what they did
2. put it out out the world wide web for all to see

The actual act of what they did strikes a deep chord with those of other faiths and wreaks of hypocrosy.

Due to the public component of this story there must be swift and harsh punishment for those involved from a church standpoint.

With that said, I really feel sorry for the Elders involved, not so much the real sensless one who put it on the web (no remorse, no maturation since 2006, no reverence for the calling he once held).

The punishment, public embarrassment and reprocussions of their actions will far outwiegh thier acts. I really feel sorry for them, especially if no harm was meant.

It's amazing how one moment of misjudgement can undo all the positive impact these boys have ever made in the church. Not only undo but be far more negative than positive. I'm sure this was not thier intention. I think that is the definition of immaturity and stupidity

nameless | 11:18 p.m. March 10, 2008

i know there acts were wrong and i know no ones to be judging but the lord .... and we should all mind our peas and ques

Sean | 11:21 p.m. March 10, 2008

Sorry, I feel there is more here.

I do not feel he should have been sent home. If he faces legal actions, I certainly can understand why. They wouldn't have much choice.

Also, though I say to forgive, I don't say that because they are LDS. And I understand fully that what they did was wrong. I'm only worrying about the boys and their futures. That should matter more than anything to everyone. Human life is more important than ANY statue. Don't dare say otherwise! I worry for them. The town will eventually heal. These boys may pay for more than they took.

We will be measured by how we measure others.

Their future is in the towns hands. So far I've read that they want to charge them with felony, conspiracy, and 4 more.

Another good point made previously is that if we pursued everything like this online, there would be no end. I can see some validity. This is an issue of hurt feelings.

I understand the other opinions here and respect them. The religion-to-blame arguments are irrelevant.

I feel sorry for the town and church but I would ask that they forgive these boys.

Love your Enemies.

I am appalled | 11:20 p.m. March 10, 2008

that you would defend those who would desecrate a religious article. I know some of you would be screaming for the head of one that did the same to an LDS temple. Those who defend these actions show what you really think of other religions. You are no different than a racist who turns their head to deplorable actions to other races. You show your true feelings to those who believe differently. I wonder what Pres. Hinckely would say to you.

to catholic in slc | 11:29 p.m. March 10, 2008

How long ago did you hear that class in church? When I was growing up, there was one book which made that statement, but under the direction of the church leaders the author of that book was asked to change how that was worded. You must not have been in my class when it was stated that even we Mormon's can be part of the "the great and abominable church". I need to ask, cause I had the understanding that the Catholic church teaches that they are the one true church also? I do not fault them for what they teach or those who choose to embrace that, but please don't fault Mormon's if they are embracing the teaching that the Priesthood Authority was restored. I take offense in your attacks on the Mormon beliefs, I could use your words right back at you on some of the Catholic church teachings. I respect and like many things about the Catholic church and glad that they take strong moral stands on things. Why put down any religion that teaches good and moral things? Oh, and as for the missionaries, they made their bed, they better be prepared to sleep in it.

pSSSSS! | 11:29 p.m. March 10, 2008

It was a 14 year old boy who started your church...these guys were 19!!

Mary | 11:38 p.m. March 10, 2008

Let the courts and the church deliver the just punishment and then let the comments fly. The police are investigating, the Catholic church is investigating and the LDS church is investigating. This is not being brushed under the carpet. Let's let the authorities do their job and then we may open the floor to comment.

Sean | 11:34 p.m. March 10, 2008

Disgrace from the town and from certain members. I didn't say that my religion would disgrace them forever. I am just saying that something this public isn't usually forgotten by everyone.

Before anyone comments about me saying earlier "love your enemies" I'm not trying to say that the missionaries and the town are enemies and this is some religious war. I do recognize that the boys did something wrong. I'm only quoting the term in the frame of forgiveness, nothing more.

Kim | 11:34 p.m. March 10, 2008

As a past missionary I have experience in doing extremely stupid acts. This is not because I was a missionary but that I was immature. I can't say I did something like this but it doesn't shock me.

I would be amazed if the young men didn't come forth with an explanation and accept the results of their actions. I only hope the good people in the community can find forgiveness in their hearts for these actions.

Outrage is a normal reaction I only hope that after the emotions subside people can find peace in both congregations. I believe there has been substantial suffering in both religions to last for a while.

To Sean | 11:38 p.m. March 10, 2008

Trespassing and vandalism are serious crimes. They need to be held accountable for what they have done. Every decision we make has consequences. They need to take their punishment. By telling them they were "bad boys" and only having them pay financial restitution tells them that it was only bad because they damaged something. They did more than damage a few statues. What they did was tell people that the Catholic church is something to be defiled. It is a slap in the face of all those that built that church and the memories of those who died in the name of their religion, not just the Catholic religion but those of all religions including the early Saints. Where do you stop? They didn't go there at random. They chose that site BECAUSE it was a Catholic church. Now to jail them would be a taking it too far but they do need to face some serious charges so that they understand that it was wrong of them.

To Sean (cont) | 11:39 p.m. March 10, 2008

I get the impression that some of my brethren actually believe that it wasn't that bad because it was a Catholic church. That is wrong of us.

Another Catholic in SLC | 11:49 p.m. March 10, 2008

re: to catholic in slc.
I agree that not just the LDS and Catholic churches believe that they are the one true church, but all religions tend to teach that. I also agree it's the individual that is the "abomination" to God. Both side need to stop pointing the finger at the other and learn to respect the good in each other. If we follow that God will choose who is the righteous one.
I believe that although detestable, mocking of a church is not a felony. Defiling any church should be. If they trespassed and vandalized then they need to face the music.

Re pSSSSS! | 11:49 p.m. March 10, 2008

I agree...JOSEPH SMITH was only 14teen. Was he just being mischievous as well?

D.S. | 11:52 p.m. March 10, 2008

Amazing that some Mormons defend these missionaries or make excuses.

You have shown your true colors. You do not care about truth. You only care about appearing right and destroying the faiths of others.

I am NOT impressed.

When a Catholic does something wrong, Mormons say the entire Catholic Church is in apostasy.

When Mormons do something wrong, including apostles and leaders, you stubbornly insist "the LDS Church is still true" but the INDIVIDUAL is blamed for making a mistake!

This is a horrible double standard.

Sean | 12:03 a.m. March 11, 2008

One of the best Joseph Smith statements I've ever read is something to the effect of not meddling with another man over his religion.

This is so true. There is no point. No production. Only cutting each other down. Many comments have been great and respectful. The people(YES on both sides) who attack each others religion just waste their time.

Kitenoa | 12:02 a.m. March 11, 2008

Missionaries greatly impact the lives of people, both positively or negatively. Belieeve it or not, much more is expected of LDS missionaries, both from inside the LDS Church and the general public, everywhere. Your behavior will be scrutinized with a fine tooth brush daily.

As with this unfortunate choice of insensitivity, suffer the consequences and move on. Forgiveness is one of the finer virtues of all faiths.

well said Sean | 12:08 a.m. March 11, 2008

Thank you good comment.
I'm a non-member who believe fully in what you said.

Janette | 12:19 a.m. March 11, 2008

Sean
We are talking about Mormon boys here. These guys are Mormons who are MUCH OLDER than was the LDS, very young, prophet Joseph Smith, when he claim to have revelation from God. Hummmmmm? No excuses!

Cindy in CA | 12:15 a.m. March 11, 2008

What was done here is obviously wrong. But, it's important to forgive. I'm sure Heavenly Father is shaking His head and wondering why so many are so harsh. Yes, it was terribly wrong. No, we don't know all the facts. Bottom line...forgive and let happen what needs to happen. These young men have a right to be forgiven and to move on with their lives. I'm sure no one here has ever erred for whatever the reason. We are to forgive so we can be forgiven. It's a shame when anyone doesn something against their neighbor, it's more of a shame to go on and on and on and be so unforgiving and ugly towards your fellow man no matter what religion you wish to enjoy or live.

Nobody Wins | 12:22 a.m. March 11, 2008

The sad part of this story is that nobody wins. If someone brushes off the actions as "just the actions of young men" they dismiss the outrage that the parishioners must feel. If someone attacks the Church because of the actions of these young men, they are seen as anti-LDS. If someone defends the Church while condemning the actions of the missionaries they seem to come across as condescending. Don't worry for those who think that the LDS Church should pay, we will. We'll pay for it every time someone makes reference to this horrible incident or turns away missionaries who have gone out to be the best representatives of the Church and the Savior as they can. We'll pay every time someone says, "see, I told you that's how Mormons are." But that's not how we are. We love the Lord and we love other people. Obviously there are some who don't but we as a people are not cruel, not ignorant of people's beliefs and heritage. We go out on missions at our own expense because we believe in the Savior's injunction to preach to all the world. It was wrong and so many will keep paying!

To Catholic in slc | 12:31 a.m. March 11, 2008

"Those people who leave the church, can't seem to leave the church alone". Get over it. I think your just looking for an oppurtunity to sound off.

April E | 12:32 a.m. March 11, 2008

I find it interesting that people keep referring to the age of these young men. I have a son out in "the mission field" right now and another son a couple of years younger than him. They have been taught that they are to treat others as they want to be treated. I know how upset I would be if someone came to my place of worship and mocked how I worshipped...no matter what age they are. I would hope that I have taught my sons to respect others and their beliefs. We are ALL children of God. We need to learn from this and teach our children what not to do. Sometimes what we think is self-evident to us, needs to be explained to our children through proper and improper behavior.

Dan | 12:33 a.m. March 11, 2008

I hope this will be a lesson learned--not only for those missionaries involved, but for anyone planning to be a missionary in the future.

If this is an example of "boys being boys," then we need to start talking about how we can fix the situation. To say that the missionaries are young doesn't remove the problem. We should expect more from our "boys" than this.

Troutman | 12:37 a.m. March 11, 2008

It is True that we LDS, Catholics, Baptists, Methodists, etc. etc. beleive in Forgiveness and Repentance. However, whether we truly FORGIVE and FORGET is another matter. I find it interesting that my church, LDS, we preach Repentance, but people just don't forget in the Church as much as they preach that! In most cases, if you have done a serious wrong, you a better off moving to another Stake or Ward, and even then your record goes with you and your wrongs are underlined for current Bishops to view. The only person to Forgive and Forget is OUR MASTER JESUS CHRIST! Thank goodness he does, or we all would be up Deep Creek!

interested again | 12:38 a.m. March 11, 2008

Again, the missionaries were OFFICAL REPRESENTATIVES of the LDS Church. I do not believe the LDS Church will see a lawsuit, but the ex-missionaries may. Certainly these young men will face criminal charges.

To others, there sure seems to be a lot of finger pointing and harsh comments. This will only bread hatered. Contension is of the devil, not God. Which side do you want to be on?

The LDS Church has taken action against these young men in so much as they are subject to the laws of God and rules of the LDS Church. GOD did not give ANY of YOU the POWER of JUDGEMENT in this case. Time to STOP, before God is offended and ye are judged of your sins as harshly.

The civil authorities will investigate and if the ex-missionaries decapitated the statue (vandlism) that is another charge they will face. If it was already broken then one less charge they will face. NOONE HERE KNOWS!!!!! Let it be. And the confession did NOT admit vandlism.

For the other possible crimes the young men will face the proper punishment in the legal system and in the LDS Church.

One day ALL will answer to GOD!!!

Catholic | 12:40 a.m. March 11, 2008

RE: to-to Catholic in SLC, 12:31 a.m.

You need to get over too! Who do you think you are telling someone else to get over it? It wasn't your church vandalized by Mormon missionaries...it was mine! You are pretty darn disrespectful for a Mormon! You need to GET OFF YOUR HIGH HORSE!

Mark | 12:50 a.m. March 11, 2008

Let's see:

1. They got caught (so it's not like they did it, felt guilty, and then confessed).

2. They took the time to photograph themselves with their "trophy".

3. Since one of them had a camera, put the photo on the internet, I assume there must have been some feeling of "accomplishment" (I guess).

As these young men were not only ordained elders, they were missionaries (representatives) of the LDS Church. To just say "boys will be boys" is the exact antithesis of why they are missionaries.

Their acts were illegal, immoral, and now very public, and puts the Church in an awkward position.

So, if the "boys" feel shame, well... great!

Louise | 12:57 a.m. March 11, 2008

This is very sad.

Simple Issue | 12:54 a.m. March 11, 2008

These three MEN violated ethical rules and legal statutes. Hold them accountable and mete justice, just as God will do for us.

For ALL who are Mormon-haters, Catholic-haters, or JUST haters, consider yourself ignored. At the end of the day, you are irrelevant. I encourage you to go become relevant by building something (ANYTHING) up instead of tearing it down.

a good story | 1:06 a.m. March 11, 2008

I remember hearing of two men who stole a sheep. They were caught and convicted of their crime. Their punishment was the branding of "ST" on their foreheads.

One man decided he did not want to be a criminal and resolved to do good no matter what. He set out to help others and do perform good deeds until the day he met his maker. Although he was ostracized for many years and endured many harsh words and actions he continued to be the person he wanted to be and doing good to others.

One day a young girl, who knew nothing of this man's past, was helped by this man. Afterwards she asked her father what the "ST" marked in his forehead meant. Her father thought for a moment and said I do not remember, perhaps it stands for SAINT.

Lets hope these young men will overcome the challenging future they certainly will have and repent and bring forth good works just as Christ has taught us to do. They will pay the price in the legal system as they should, but let us show forth love, just as Christ for the lady taken in adultary, and not condem.

Latter-day Guy | 1:34 a.m. March 11, 2008

Given some of these comments, I (speaking as an LDS RM) am surprised this type of thing doesn't happen more often. Some of the defenses/excuses of their actions here are disgusting. Of course they all ought to be disciplined/sent home early. (Those who worry about a permanent blight on the ex-missionaries' lives, should remember that later cruel treatment is not caused by the punishment they may receive; it is caused by uncharitable members of the church--who have their own repenting to do--and the culture that their attitudes create.)

I had thought that we were, in general, a less bigoted people. Certainly those missionaries have not acquitted themselves well on this account, but nor have many of the posters here. Before we focus on calling the nations to repentance, perhaps we should call ourselves.

Especially disappointing to me is the fact that I will have to explain this all to one of my dearest friends who is a Roman Catholic priest, one of the kindest most Christian people I have ever met. I have little doubt regarding his eternal destination; as for some of the self-righteous, here represented... well, I wouldn't put any money on theirs.

We need to repent.

Anonymous | 1:38 a.m. March 11, 2008

To Simple Issue | 12:54 a.m.

You show your own disrespect for others by classifying them as "haters" and then be dismissing them as "irrelevant."

You share the same spirit as did these missionaries.

YOU are irrelevant until you start caring about others.

Facts: | 1:55 a.m. March 11, 2008

1. Inexcusable Behavior, for Missionaries or anyone else.
2. Church has acknowledged this and apologized and offered help in reparations and full cooperation in the investigation.
3. The young men will pay dearly for their mistakes.
4. As members of the Church we are saddened by this whole event.
5. We will do our best to avoid this in the future.
6. Our relationship with the Catholic Church is important as we assist and cooperate with each other in humanitarian efforts.

End of story.

No need to get into all the name calling and side accusations.

Lori | 3:18 a.m. March 11, 2008

Latter-day Guy... excellent post
Thanks

Paul G | 6:19 a.m. March 11, 2008

To Anonymous @ 1:38 AM, Simple Issue has it right. The scriptures say the unrighteous will kick against the pricks (of conscience). People who are inspired by hatred rarely fight FOR anything, they just work to tear down others. They just aren't worth listening to. That's not the same as not caring about them. If someone is going to spend all his time telling me how wrong something is without telling me how something else is better, he's not doing any good, and he's just wasting my time.

To "I am appalled", some people just exude compassion and forgiveness, and it isn't right to attack them either. These young men should be punished for their actions, they have and will face consequences. I think it is correct to figure out why they did it, and it is also correct to place some of the blame on their immaturity. I don't believe they were "targeting" a Catholic shrine, as others have intimated. This in no way excuses them, but shows us all that as parents we need to make sure we teach respect for everyone and their culture/religion/etc.

Hopes for Interfaith Healing | 7:02 a.m. March 11, 2008

i have been working on interfaith movements & greatly appreciate the connections that have been made with the LDS church, the Catholic church, and many others... when it comes to issues concerning sacred sites (both LDS & non-LDS), it is SO important that this is healed in order to avoid an escalation of tensions & hatreds regarding our differences... there are many LDS people that i know who have a great deal of deep spiritual insights, great caring, and appreciation for the important universal spiritual truths of various paths and an awareness of the importance of respecting each other's differences... this shows the highest lights of a church while embracing the commonalities in our human diversity.

Julie | 7:09 a.m. March 11, 2008

I can't help wondering how this is affecting the lives of the three missionaries. It would be kind of weird to come home, meet a girl, get engaged, start planning a Temple Wedding and have this event turn up. That probably isn't even the case but I still bet what ever their situation this has caused them some real regret. It's about time. If they were feeling at all repentant the pictures wouldn't have shown up on the internet.

Hopes for Interfaith Healing | 7:18 a.m. March 11, 2008

i would also hope that the young men who committed this act of intolerance could definitely be given the opportunity to heal themselves & make ammends... this is very important to healing everything as a whole (themselves as well as the other people who have been hurt considering the historic link of the broken device to religious freedom in that area)... perhaps they could be given an opportunity to make ammends by getting counselling (NOT simply that they "did something wrong" but to truly understand the wrongness of intolerance from within the context & perspective of history... including intolerance that has been directed towards the LDS church throughout its history) ... perhaps they could also make amends (and heal themselves) by donating time, awareness, to discovering the beauty of all cultures & faiths... such as doing some work with something along the lines of the Peace Corps or a similar organization that could help them grow to higher levels.

Dear John | 7:22 a.m. March 11, 2008

To minimize what has happened is ridiculous. Drop the hammer on those that are responsible. Bring the full weight of the law on them. Those that were responsible for what happened did it by choice. They did it under agency and is not free agency because agency isn't free it was bought and paid for by our Savior in the Garden and on the Cross for all mankind even Catholics whom I love.

Re: catholic in slc | 7:33 a.m. March 11, 2008

"especially she are happier" I is a little confused on yours grammar.

Michael | 8:40 a.m. March 11, 2008

I was raised Catholic and was somewhat intolrant and arrogant about my beliefs when I was young. I think I have grown out of that ahd try to go with "Live and let live" as my philosophy. While these kids should be embarrassed, they are young and should not be marked for life. They should have the chance to redeem themselves and learn from the error of their ways.

I think this is a reflection of the problem caused by religions which preach that they are the one true religion and that all other religions and beliefs are somehow inferior.

Johnny Utah #9 | 8:47 a.m. March 11, 2008

This article and all of these comments are proof that differences in religion are still cause for hate and bigotry amongst humans. The world would be a lot better off without all these religions, telling us to hate one another, because your neighbor believes something different than you do. And yes, if you call another religion an "abomination" you too are a hateful bigot. "Can't we all just get along?"

Sean | 9:14 a.m. March 11, 2008

I'm not trying to argue but I will clear some things up.

I am not trying to relate Joseph to these boys. It's unfitting.

About punishment. I STRONGLY support legal justice. I feel that the town is going a little over board with 6 charges. With their futures on the line. I just feel it is too much. Forgiving works more miracles than stone casting. And the woman to be stoned was also guilty of a crime.

My MUCH bigger focus is on the crowd here and elsewhere who condemn these boys. They have no place. I believe that the town and the public should forgive them. Seek legal recourse which shouldn't be more than the crime itself, then move on.

I have fought religious intolerance on here from both sides, then get accused of being bias against catholics. I have fought religious battle and talked more about the boys future. I know my thoughts of other religions. I respect them. No one has any place saying otherwise.

So if they get prison time for this, how much of their life should disappear over property and hurt feelings?

Let the sinless in the town and here cast the first stone.

Frank | 9:26 a.m. March 11, 2008

"Johnny Utah"

I cant speak for everyone. But if it werent for "these religions" I would be a much worse person in the longrun. I come from a long family history of violent drunk short-tempered lawbreaking men, all who have died before theyve reached 60. One in fact is responsable for countless deaths due to his hatred of religion.
Due to religion I may be the first sober male of our line without a temper or a police record.

As for these boys I can sympathize with those that believe destroying these boys future isnt worth the price of that decapitated statue, but what these boys did doesnt stop at vandalism. Due to their actions and the public attention its received they have effected countless lives over the nation for the worst. Many a good word will fall on deaf ears because of this mistake.

Sean | 9:27 a.m. March 11, 2008

To: To Simple Issue

Some argue against you. But I couldn't agree more.

People will debate the boys on here all they want... I have... But the religious haters at the end of the day are forgotten.

That is on both sides.

A good saying. "Those who only fight will never finish building the home."

Catholic in Utah | 11:01 a.m. March 11, 2008

As a Catholic, I appreciate that some understand the gravity of the incident. I am really appalled that others of you take a defensive posture or even simply dismiss it.
I am confident that the Parish has no interest in take those boys through the ringer, let the Missionaries accept the consequences and move on with life. Wrong is wrong. If it was going to be so damaging to their life, it shouldn't have happened.

One note to the person that mentioned repentance and forgiveness: The boys should start with the Parish not their Bishop.

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AP photo/The Pueblo Chieftain, Mike Sweeney

La Capilla de Todos Los Santos or the Chapel of All Saints in San Luis, Colo. is framed by a sculpture of Jesus Christ. Deputies are investigating allegations that LDS missionaries may have decapitated a statue of a Mexican martyr and mocked a Catholic shrine in the San Luis Valley of southern Colorado.