Deseret News | Better duck — if you're a Mormon

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Doug Robinson: Better duck — if you're a Mormon

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goldyindy | 12:25 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Amen! I wholeheartedly agree! It's time we stop constantly saying "There will be opposition in all things" and start hiring lawyers. In Indiana, students here have had their rights violated in the schools numerous times, only to have the administration turn a deaf ear.
Most people are very tolerant and gracious. But, people who allow prejudice from a leadership position should be made responsible. This includes the Salt Lake City Mayor.
I was deeply saddened by the persecution I received by the protestors lining the sidewalks on the way to Conference. No one prepared me for the hatred. We have a right to worship freely in this country, and that includes worshipping in peace without being threatened. The scene of incivility on the streets at General Conference will go down in the history of this country as one of the most insensitive acts of intolerance left unchecked in America. Please elect a more humane mayor. We cannot let leaders get away with bigotry-related apathy towards our legal rights anymore

Submitted but not posted | 12:26 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

I submitted a post an hour or so ago entitled "I believe in Christ" and it was not posted. Why?
Please respond to my email address. Thanks...

Anonymous | 12:33 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

It is truly sad to see religious zealots taunting other religious zealots on the sidewalks to Conference.
But what do you expect from groups proclaiming to be the one, true one?
I think any cult is better off remaining underground and praying for each other.

Comments continue below

Ultimately Irony | 12:38 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

The primary political problem with Romney is his changing views/values in the past few years, supposedly to accommodate the evangelical right wing of the party. As Romney drifted toward conservativism in coincidence with running for president, Mormon defenders emerged and became outraged with his treatment in the media. If he had remained consistent in his liberal governance of liberal Massachusetts, I doubt many Mormons could have ethically supported his views and actions. But now that Romney is emanating the same Christian rhetoric that Huckabee and others give, he garners religious support and is understood as a "man of faith."

Basically, the LDS church (and seemingly 99% of its members) will vote for who Romney presents himself as today, but not who he was as a political professional. This dissonant position of the Mormon masses provides the ultimate irony in this political/religious/social discourse.

digga Tom | 12:43 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

The LDS has been out-of-touch with mainstream American society for its entire existence. Despite the fact that most Mormons are nice, regular folk, the more regular Christians learn about the specifics of Mormonism, the weirder it seems to them, just like Scientology. Face it: Evangelical Christianity does not embrace diversity. Unless the LDS comes under the wing of the Evangelicals, they cannot expect to gain political legitimacy at the national level.

Not Mormon | 12:50 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Wear the shoe if it fits AND Setting themselves apart - you're both pathetic. Not one person above has said they are perfect. They said they don't rip other churches in their services. I've been to many of their meetings and have never heard one demeaning thing said about another religion. Unlike my own church, and many pathetic anti-mormons like yourselves, which always have some petty remarks to spew. Mormons do get "noticed" and commented on in ways other groups don't, and in ways everyone else would be offended at. And they are held to standards others aren't - very hypocritical. Anyone who says this is not the case needs to open their eyes....it happens all the time!!

Double Standard | 12:53 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Why is it Mormons say voters shouldn't bring Romney's religion into the election, yet Mormons will vote for Romney for no other reason than the fact that he is Mormon?

Thank you | 12:55 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Mik, I thought I hear about the 'persecution' theme, today. That was close.
Let me see, where did you get your history from?
From documented facts? no..... from an unbias Mormon historian? no....... I know!! It must be the Church !!!! One of those 'faith-promoted' versions. How sad.

The party of Mormon | 12:58 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

The LDS should really think about starting their own political party. This seems to be working in Utah already. I once read a letter from an LDS person who proclaimed "a person cannot be a good Mormon if they are a democrat."
So, maybe the movement has already begun.

Mitt's religion | 1:01 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Mitt's religion has Articles of Faith to explain to the world the basic beliefs. Those who think that "Mormons" don't believe in Christ, take note:
Article of Faith 1: "We believe in God, the Eternal Father, and in His Son, Jesus Christ, and in the Holy Ghost." Article of Faith 11: "We claim the privilege of worshiping Almighty God according to the bdictates of our own cconscience, and allow all men the same privilege, let them dworship how, where, or what they may." I am a life-long member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, nick-named the Mormon Church.
I believe Mitt Romney is the best candidate for President, regardless of the fact that he is a member of the Church I attend. He will serve as inspired by God, our Heavenly Father, as did the founding fathers of this great nation.

LDS Cult? | 1:05 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Everyone calls the LDS Church a "Cult", but what does that mean? According to Merriam Webster it is:

1: formal religious veneration : worship
2: a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents
3: a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents

Nothing to be ashamed of, any church could be considered a cult.

Mainstream = truth? | 1:11 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

When has mainstream society ever correctly assessed religion? History proves that mainstream = disunity. The fact remains that evangelicals and protestant religions have never been of one accord. They battle the Catholic church according to their own understanding of Biblical teachings. Hence the reason there are so many religions. Mormonism does not lay claim to any other religion other than the direct stewardship by Jesus Christ through prophets. If that claim is false, obviously there is a problem. Who can prove that other than Christ himself? Apparently, no one on this planet can come to an accord until he settles it. Mormonism teaches a person to pray for understanding. It is that simple. What other religion asks its members to pray to an unseen being for understanding? Bible:James 1:5.

Anonymous | 1:15 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Props to Doug, thanks for the article.

Re: The Party of Mormon do you know any Mormons? Plenty of good LDS people are both republicans and democrats. Maybe you should think before you speak.

Elaine in Utah | 1:17 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

If a person had a plumbing question, would they ask an electrician? No--one would go to the source. If a person r-e-a-l-l-y wants to know what members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints believe in, go to the source! Simply go to www.lds.org and click on "About the Church" at the top. There is a wealth of information at this website including: Basic Doctrines; Church History; Temples; Mormon Tabernacle Choir; The Humanitarian Outreach Program...and so much more.

Candyce Miller | 1:18 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Good job, Doug. Double standards only bother the people to whom they show disprespect.

WY Reader | 1:18 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

So many whining Mormon-haters. Did you get your little feelings hurt at some point by a Mormon? Quit acting like 2-yr olds. NotMormon is right on. I don't agree with LDS on most things, but this article is completely true. And to all those people in Utah who complain about Mormons running the state...they tried to get away from idiots like you. You followed them there. Get over it.

Reality | 1:19 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

All of you who continue to write disparaging words about the Mormons are doing exactly what this article says you are doing? Why would you go out of your way to do this? It is very interesting.
"Thank you" how about the unibased opinion of Missouri that it was OK to kill a Mormon until it was recently changed. That must have been a figment of our imagination. Or is that not considered persecution?

Double Standard | 1:25 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

So, "Mitt's religion" when you say "I believe Mitt Romney is the best candidate for President, regardless of the fact that he is a member..." are you trying to tell us that Mitt's religion has nothing to do with the way you will vote? You just spent the first few lines of your post telling us that "Mitt's religion has articles of faith..." If his religion isn't important to the way you will vote, why tell us about Mitt's articles of faith?

To- Not Mormon | 1:26 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

What's holding up your baptism. What you say makes very little sense.

Sericks | 1:29 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

The real issue here is that people have gotten retarded and allowed his religious affilition come into play in this political race. No one who is mormon should probably be voting for Romney because of his political history. That is if they hold true to thier faith. He was a pro choice republican when it suited his political needs and now that he's running for president he's a pro life candidate. so there is some food for thought for those who ARE basing thier vote on religious preference.

secondly. No mormons are no discriminated against. least of all in utah. you the majority and your afraid because non mormons are on the rise and we have issues with the almost exclusively religiously run government here in Utah.

AND! Can a religion that preaches to be the one and only true church, and that all other churches are corrupt, expect shelter from criticism from the very churches they themselves are insulting? I think not.

Every Church believes it is true | 1:34 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Many posts have claimed LDS people of being arrogant hypocrites due to the fact we call our church the one true church. Well...Last I checked, most all religions feel they're church is the true church.
Next, LDS people have never claimed to have a "perfect" history. We all know HUMANS were instruments in restoring the gospel. So, anytime a human is used as an instrument for anything, there are going to be imperfections. I for one, overlook the imperfections of those who came before me because I believe the doctrine.
No one is hiding secrets from any of you. Like all religion, we don't want our imperfections splattered all over, but we are sure willing to talk about them. God and his gospel are perfect, not us human, LDS, members who are trying our very best. Lay off.

Sericks | 1:45 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

WY reader. I think the mormons are running the state and i just so happen to have the misfortune of being born here. to a mormon family. does that mean i followed them here still?

Sericks | 2:00 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Every Church Believes it is true

check into being just straight out christian. not catholic. Not baptist. But christian. Its not a one true church thing. Its a true church for you thing.

Mormons claim to be the one and only true gospel, and call all others corrupt, and then whine and moan when thier religion is attacked. to me that shows a real lack of security in thier faith to be honest. If you have no worries about your faith then stop your moaning. and if you want the attacks to stop. then stop telling people how wrong thier religion is. Then maybe the rest of us wont feel like we're under attack and have to defend ourselves.

censorship | 1:59 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Before everyone gets too angry, how many posts do you think the moderator has censored on both sides?

Should make everyone think.

martin luther | 2:26 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

The Protestant religions treat Mormons the same way they treated each other in the early 1800's. They try to disclaim each other's beleifs.
All paid ministers are taxed as businessmen. They will lie about the "competition" to stay in business, and their church is their business.

Carol P. Warnick | 2:32 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day-Saints (Mormons) has no need to defend itself. Those who believe in Christ should recognize the good that a church that bears His name is doing. It's His church and we as members are His followers. We as members are not perfect but we are trying to live by our ideals. What more can anyone ask?

WJ | 2:40 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

For those who want answers to the tough questions about the LDS church, go to the FAIRLDS website.

Wy Reader | 2:43 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Sericks - Did you read the post or just whip off a reply based on emotion? If you have a problem with Mormons running the state (who cares where you are from) - then I say the same thing to you. Get over it. A democracy means people can vote their beliefs. Guess what, if you go to Mississippi, or New England, who do you think runs the government there? Sounds like you need to get out of Utah and travel a little more for some perspective. By the way, Mormons are discriminated against. I've seen it in all 8 states I have lived in. Folks like you and others here like to blame Mormons for their own problems because of their beliefs. I don't see you ripping on Jews(everyone else is a gentile who will go to hell) or Muslims (all infidels will go to hell). You're just another politically-correct hypocrite.

J. Smith | 2:52 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

If there is only one God and one Jesus Chrsit

Then wouldn't it make sense that they would have only one church instead of hundreds that all teach different things about them?

If there is infact a God and a Christ who is good wouldn't it then make sense that if there is a good deity that there is also a bad deity? because everything has an opposite, so satan must be real too.

If Satan is real then he must be interested in doing whatever necessary to guide all of God's children (as we all are) away from God. This would make sense then that there are several religions that might teach things that are not true.

If all of the above is true then there must be one truth and one true religion, while everything else is false.

Anonymous | 2:52 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Sericks
I would dare say all people who have a religion think their "one" religion is true (despite what they call themselves). That's just silly to say we are the only one's who feel that way.
Another thing, I would dare say many churches call other religions corrupt. Just read your own comment...you sure aren't respecting my religion. I want to know how you personally have been "attacked" by the mormon church? The leaders of our church constantly tell the members to lvoe and accept all people of all faiths and backgrounds. It's human error when that advice isn't taken.

No Religion in Paradise | 3:01 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

To : Getting Old

Funny you should mention Book of Mormon injected into public policy. As a matter of fact both the U.S. Senate and the House of Representatives have used the Book of Mormon on several occasions as a weapon to prolong filibustors on key legislative issues.......but never by a legislative member who happened to be a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

If you feel that you've been so constitutionally denied by living in our fair state....feel free to move where you feel more constitutionally comfortable. I happen to like my Mormon neighbors.....better than the ones I grew up and lived with for 45 years in Cleveland.

Anonymous | 3:05 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

WY Reader-

I actually will rip on anyone for doing anything stupid. whether they"re muslim, jewish, christian, catholic, or any other denomination. I make no apologies for anyone. stupid is stupid and anyone or any group who is stupid should have it pointed out.

and yes a democracy means people can vote thier beliefs. so stop complaining that people are voting on thier belief that a mormon might not do well in the white house. and in perspective people shouldnt complain that people are going to vote for him because he is mormon.

All religions have thier persecutors and thier critics. get over it. I'm not mormon here in Utah and i constantly pay for it in one way or another.

and I have lived outside of utah. I served in The Marine Corps and spent about a total 2 year period of time living in San Diego California.

Sericks | 3:22 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Sorry I have to read through quick as I am at work.

How have I been personally attacked. Well lets see. I get bad looks for having tattoos and have to deal with thier judgement (yet mormons can't handle the judgement of others). I can deal with that. its my choice to have tattoos and piercings. how about the inability to get a regular beer in this state? All because of the arbitrary legislations of a religious state. How about being singled out by them, not to mention family, for not being a member. Being turned into a service project by the church. Family of mine whose children are told thier parents are behind on tithing and that makes them bad by senior members of thier wards. etc etc. the transgressions go on and on. yet you cry when your judged. its an adult world and you better start dealing with adult problems rather than whining.

Sign of the Times | 3:31 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Pearles before swine. Turn the other cheek.

Sericks | 3:38 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

and to eloborate also for anonymous

I agree. I'm not saying other churches dont say they are the one true church. However. What I am saying is that, just like the other churches, the mormon faith is open to scrutiny. They should stop complaining about it and just deal with it. its going to happen. Scrutiny will never stop.

Jimmy | 3:53 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

I've long been of the opinion that the LDS church is good and pure and that it's a fairly small cross section of the LDS population that gives them a bad reputation. I myself am LDS but haven't been active in years because I get tired of watching members treat non-members poorly. I admit the problem doesn't seem as bad outside of Utah County, but some of the things I've seen members do to non-members unprovoked is scary. When I confronted a member of my wards Bishopric about the way he treated one of our non-member neighbors children his response was "These people are not members of the church and your support of them shows disloyalty to the church." The Bishop did scold him and he apologized to me and my neighbor, but it never should have happened. I wish some of these bad members could realize they are the problem. I'd return to church in a heartbeat. Just my 2 cents.

not LDS | 4:22 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

i live in Provo. my neighbors on both sides and across the street are LDS. My friends and co-workers are LDS. They are probably the best people I know and will ever know. the only problem is they always try to convert me. which as they explained to me is just part of their Religion. The way i see it, if Romney is anything like my neighbors i'd vote for him with out a second thought.

Truthmonger | 4:24 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

If the Mormons don't have the tuth, then why is satan fighting so hard on all fronts, to discredit it???

Any why is satan fighting so hard to tear down christianity in this country, whether it is christmas or the mention of god in school???

Satan is very busy indeed in these latters days, with not much left trying stop the great and marvelous work.

Diego | 4:33 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

I'm tired of people saying they don't no about the LDS Church. It would seem to me that there are very few people who have not had and opporunity to talk with a member of the Church and or missioaries in the United States. If one really and sincerly wants to know about the Mormons it is truly not that difficult.

Cloudy | 4:34 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Sericks,
I read your comment and I understand how you feel. I am at a loss of words on what to say to you. Except just ignore the stereotype Mormon. Some members of the church have problems with this type of member as well as you. I am a member and it aggravates me just a bit as well, and I find it very repulsive. Many LDS go inactive over it. Ignorance is not always righteousness.

Just go do the best you can and ignore the rest.

Anonymous | 4:35 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Sericks,
Whining? Who's whining? "I have tatoos so mormons hate me!" whaaaaaa! I'm not a mormon but I know a lot of mormons who have tatoos. Stop pointing the finger. Obviously you are a little too sensitive. Lot's of mormon people have issues but so does everyone else--including me! I'm not stupid enough to blame one religion for anything!

Stephanie A. | 4:36 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Sericks wrote "Can a religion ... expect shelter from criticism from the very churches they themselves are insulting?" The article and the majority of the posts are not calling for other churches to accept them, or even to be civil - I, and likely most members of the LDS church, do not expect that. Within the religious community, disagreements are frequent; however, these religious disagreements should not be carried over to social or political arenas.

All I expect is to be treated as anyone would be treated - with respect for the sole reason that I am a person. Every person deserves to be evaluated and valued based on more than just his or her beliefs, and that should apply to members of the LDS church, too. THAT is the point of the article - that Mitt Romney should not be defined solely as "Mormon," as national media is wont to do. This need for respect also holds true for any other person, regardless of religious affiliation (or lack thereof). No one should be either disregarded or revered for their religious beliefs - there is much more to a person than that.

Doc | 4:41 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Reply to Double Standard | 4:47 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

I wrote "I believe Mitt Romney is the best candidate for President, regardless of the fact that he is a member" because he believes in God and will uphold the Constitution, which was inspired of God, and NOT because he is a member of the Church I attend. Maybe I should have made two separate posts instead of stating the beliefs of Mitt and my own choice that I will vote for him in the same post. The point is, though, that he is a good man, who believes in Christ and will be equitable in his administration to those of all faiths (see Article of Faith 11) because that is how he believes. That is how many Americans also believe, regardless of their particular choice of religion. I hope this explains this better. Thanks for the response...

Sarah in Missouri | 4:54 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

I think the problem here is people that have lived in Utah all there lives (non or mormon) don't really get what the article means. Mitt shouldn't have his religion questioned any more than any of the others. I live in CLAY COUNTY MISSOURI. Ya know where we were kicked out, and I am scared for my daughter to even tell people at school she is Mormon, because there are several churches just miles away from here that do nothing but bash the church every Sunday. It's very sad. It's bigotry, plain and simple. Mitt is getting it from both sides too. From some on the Christian Conservative side, that sneak it in whenever they can and from the democratic side (aka Larry O'donnell, why that man still has a job at MSNBC is beyone me). Bigotry should not be accepted period. And the whiners the complain about "this mean mormon", do you ever here people complain about "this mean catholic" no you don't, because it doesn't matter what religion they are. Why does it matter if a creep, thief ect is a mormon or not. People should be called on by there act, not there religion.

Why the surprise? | 5:21 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Mormons have been rabidly setting themselves apart since the first time Joseph Smith told everybody that all the religions of the time are wrong.
Why the shock and surprise from those outside the Zion Curtain?

Republican Mormon | 5:25 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Have you noticed that is the Republicans that are having such a hard time with a Mormon candidate? Why shoule we continue to support a party that hates us?

The democratic party doesn't have a problem that Harry Reid is a Mormon. Maybe we need to look there.

Re Serricks | 5:45 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Dude, I'm 47 active High Priest in our ward.

You can come and hang with me anytime. I have plenty of buddies who have tatts and piercings, and hang with them at Casinos and Karoke Clubs, where they do order real beers and drinks. we even have a $20 poker night each month, I consider it a payment for the food provided so it's not gambling.

You just need to meet some of us good people. We're out there.

It's not about the Tatts, it's about family and God...

Kayla Stoneman | 5:49 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Why is it that the Mormons are always being picked on? Yes we are very different. So what? That shouldn't make any difference to becoming a leader. Separation from church and state. We shouldn't even be talking about religion and politic together. It doesn't matter and it shouldn't make a difference on who we vote for. And all this coming from a 17 year old.

Great and Spacious | 5:53 p.m. Jan. 9, 2008

Doug hit the nail on the head with this article. Reminds me a lot of 1 Nephi 8: 25 - 28.

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