Deseret News | Reader comments: Utah population booming

Reader comments
Utah population booming

Bob G | 4:40 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

The growth can be attributed to the safe haven status and financial support given to illegals by Utahs city's and towns. This is not an indication of good growth, dependent growth that the tax payers of Utah are faced with. Jobs for illegals is rampant and uncontrolled in Utah and there is no hope for the americans in Utah to get any relief or job security. These illegals are more of a burden to taxpayers that has no benificial outcome as indicatiors of growth. Bragging as purveors of treasonous support and a haven for all the mexican illegals is not something to be proud of, it is disgusting and immoral to classify illegal growth as an indication of a good economy. It is if you are an illegal alien where jobs are plentiful and they are good at displacing and putting the real americans out of jobs and an income. These population growth statistics should segregate the growth of the numbers of illegals seperately and not as growth in a good economic sense. Illegal growth is not good growth, it is negative growth.

Sleuth | 5:19 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Utahï¿½s increased population growth data can be misleading especially when spun as ï¿½an indication of how well [Utahï¿½s] economy is doing to draw people in for jobs,ï¿½ and ï¿½people ï¿½ coming ï¿½ is an indication that the economy is making room." This rhetoric masks Utahï¿½s ï¿½get byï¿½ political economic grip on the working poor, which sustains Utahï¿½s very small controlling bourgeois. By way of example, Californians migrating to Utah after selling their $400K to $1MM California homes and purchasing new Utah homes for cash at 1/3 those prices, does little to rectify overall state poverty and working poor conditions, with well paying jobs. They are not moving here because Utah has great jobs. The majority of Utahï¿½s jobs are $7 - $15 per hr., no benefits, etc., leading to no prospective rising material standards of living. If Utahï¿½s design of low paying jobs in indicative of a dynamic progressive spontaneous economy benefiting the entire population, then Keynesian economics v. laissez-faire economic liberalism needs to be re-written.

vern | 5:34 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Now all we need is a new 8 lane north-south freeway then we will be all set.

Comments continue below

Anonymous | 6:22 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

All major social problems stem from over-population.
Fasten your seat belts.
Things are going to get bumpy.

Lifelong Utah | 6:36 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

It's a Pretty Great State!

rk | 6:46 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Your article was highly informative and made me look at Utah's population increase of 120,039, from July 2006 to July 2007, in a different way. I noticed in a recent publication that this number almost exactly represents the total population of the second largest city in Utah - West Valley City! [NIBLICK DEVELOPMENT, INC - City: West Valley City Pop: 120,327 - DATE: 9 Aug 07] Now that's some growth! Thanks for the update. A most excellent read!

Glass half full | 7:45 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Thanks for a good, informative article. It's amazing to read the comments, also. Some folks are so stuck in their ideological bent that if Utah didn't get snow, they might blame it on "illegals". Give it a rest, please. You really don't help your cause. And then there's "Anonymous" who thinks "over-population" will inevitably lead to "major social problems". I've lived in several of the largest cities of the world and Utah is far from over-populated, and far from the social ills about which "Anonymous" should be concerned. Look at the bright side.... please! There's a lot there to see.

Voice of reason | 8:10 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Utah! You are a desert! You don't have any water! Grow as large as you like but stop making everybody else in the country subsidize your golf courses and sprawl.

Anonymous | 8:33 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I love your optimistic look "Glass half full"
But today's Pollyanna attitude is naive at best.
Developers must develop ... or go under. That left turn that takes so long to make will take longer next year. Live with it. It's a numbers thing.
Enjoy the (relatively) "undevelopment."
We are in the age of overbreed and nothing can stop it.

L | 8:35 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Sometimes when looking at percentages only we may get confused. If you have a population of 5 and you get one more that is about 20% but if you have a population of 1 and an increase of 1 you have 100% but both were only a real increase of 1. The doubling of a population in a one room place is certainly more of an impact of adding the same 1 person to a big home.

The article shows Utah gaining 66,795, California 300,000 and Texas 500,000. Utah has the highest percentace because of the lowest population, CA is lower in % because they have a higher population before.

The real impact depends on a lot of things including the area of land avilable, what it is like, jobs available, money & resources available. It may (or may not) be harder for Utah to provide schools etc. for 67M than it is for TX to provide for 700M & the same thing for jobs. It obviously takes more new jobs to support the real growth in TX & CA.

Some growth is good, not all growth is good in my opinion. Maybe some people don't want to be first?

Real Voice of Reason | 8:35 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

To "Voice of Reason" -- Yes, Utah is a desert. And we have some golf courses . . . but not as many as our neighbors in Nevada, Arizona and California (all of which steal Utah water). Just ask "the Snake" Harry Reid about his plan to steal water from Snake Valley for his Las Vegas golf courses.
And while you're talking about everybody else in the country "subsidizing" Utah, remember that over 70% of Utah is owned by the federal government and is not subject to taxation. They don't pay for basic services like police protection, Sheriff search and rescue, schools, feeding poor people, etc. They don't even care for the illegal aliens they have allowed to migrate to Utah and be supported by our schools, hospitals and other infrastructure. Also, the funds for the interstate highway system have all but dried up, so they don't pay to build many roads anymore, either. If PEOPLE and BUSINESSES owned more of that property, you'd better believe that they'd be contributing to the State's funding needs. So when you visit our beautiful state some day, please remember that it is really UTAH CITIZENS who are subsidizing YOU!

Bill | 8:47 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Bob G - Growth figures are based on out-of-state driver's licenses that are surrendered--not a guess of how many illegals moved here. It's a bit difficult for an illegal to surrender an out-of-state driver's license, eh? Maybe, just maybe, some of this growth can be attributed to a baby boom generation that is on the cusp of retirement and want to relocate from elsewhere. And, maybe some of the boomers are LDS that are 'coming home to roost', so to speak. But illegals? Nah. And, btw, there is no such thing as 'negative growth'.

And Voice of reason--please explain how everybody else in the country is subsidizing our golf courses.

Yo, Sleuth--if, in point of fact, it is Californians that are moving here and buying homes for cash, it ain't gonna hurt the economy. They have to pay property taxes, use local businesses, and generally increase employment via ancillary services.

Back Home | 9:24 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Moved back here because of the smog, traffic, gangs, grafitti and congestion in California.

Didn't have a million dollar home. Bought a home of equal value here. Now retired. Spending California earned money to pay for Utah's needs.

Utah's income tax is double what I paid in California. Didn't pay taxes on groceries in California.

Half of my neighbors came from other states and are also retired. Non of us came because of jobs. We came because of the quality of life.

My weight has dropped 30 pounds, my pulse has dropped 10 points to 62 and my blood pressure is now 116 over 73. Not bad for a 66 year old. That is what quality of life can do for you.

matten | 9:46 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I left Utah 27 years ago, and I've never looked back. I plain and simply could not make a decent lving there. I hear it's a bit better now, but I seriously doubt people are moving to Utah because of job growth. More likely it is retired people moving back and immigration (legal and illegal). I enjoy visiting family members in Utah, but give me 2-3 days, and I'm anxious to leave again. The incredible schism between LDS and non-LDS is really unfortunate. I had great friends of both persuasions. I believe that much of the hate-filled stuff that is regularly posted to these boards is the result of a few people, not a majority on either side. I wish all you good folks in Utah a great New Year.

Anonymous | 9:58 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Have you noticed that every graduating class is bigger than the one before it?
What is everyone going to do?
Flip burgers?

Re: Matten | 10:09 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Reading DesNews online = Looking back.

Anonymous | 10:13 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Man has the tendency to put off certain disagreeing facts until the last possible moment.
There is an obvious population explosion in the world today and like it or not is unstoppable.

Rich | 10:19 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

At one time all the candidates for the Cache County Council ran on a platform that for growth. There was nobody I could vote against. I eventually left Cache Valley when it became so crowded that I couldn't get through Logan in 10 minutes, when the fishing streams got so crowded that all my favorite places were taken most evenings, when Logan began looking like any other city in the U.S. with Home Depot forcing out Anderson's Lumber, Wal-Mart forcing out a myriad of small shops, etc. I still miss the golf courses up there but the cost of golfing skyrocketed during my stay in the valley. I fear that a similar change will alter the lifestyle of the Wasatch Front. With growth comes many problems, and with the state's left fighting the right, the growth will not be accommodated properly. Look how the Sierra Club and Mayor Rocky Anderson were successful in delaying the construction of roads designed to handle the greater traffic flow. Those types will fight, fight, fight to prevent services from being provided to an ever-expanding population. If they could, they would stop population growth, but that's beyond their power. Utah is becoming another California.

Anonymous | 11:21 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I saw Utah before its population hit one million. Life was better then. Life was nearly ideal except for the winters.

I just read the old whine about Rocky and stopping highways. It's a shame that hate blinds you. UDOT made the mistake. Before you build anything you do a risk matrix. Educated people want to know what their liabilities will be before they waste time and money. If you needed federal highway funds and you're in the business of construction you should know you need environmental impact studies.

Utah will never be another California. You can't export the climate. I live in Sacramento now. I don't care what the mayor of LA or San Francisco does in those cities. Whine in Utah is Rocky. Here it's Cabernet.

You hit the nail on the head. Why would I not change plans to return to Utah? Utah will have all California's problems an a cold miserable climate and no beaches.

porky | 11:57 a.m. Dec. 27, 2007

anyone who travels I-15 in Davis County knows the population is booming. even daytime hours are miserable. we all know what a joke it is during commute hours. And we're still ONE YEAR AWAY from "commuter rail" (diesel smoke belching heavy rail) and the tree-huggers 55mph parkway of Legacy. heaven help Davis County

Beach Time In Sacramento? | 1:08 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

What? Don't kid yourself and others, there is no beach (or beach lifestyle) in or near Sacramento.

I relocated from San Diego - yes there are beaches there - about 10 years ago. The trasition was tough and it's not for all (thank goodness) but I am now very happy with the quality of life here. So. Cal is a mess now with outragous costs and crowding No. Cal has always been a boring mess.

I came here for a good job (not retirement) and to have a good place to raise kids. I am glad it's not the place all people like, I don't want it to mushroom out of control like SD County did in the 80's-90's. The growth seems good right now. Great companies opening here and infrastructure generally keeping up (Davis county not included, but give it a few years).

Just keep in mind beaches are a 90 minute flight away but the mountains are only 15 minutes drive.

I do find it strange that so many people that were so happy to leave the state still read the Des News... Hmm, maybe you miss it more than you thought.

Water, Who Needs Water? | 1:16 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Does anybody know why more reseviors were/are not being built in the mountains to store fresh water?

I heard when i moved here that most fresh water runoff from the Wasatch Mountains ends up in the Salt Lake and then is unusable. Is this true and if so seems like a good place to start for future water needs - not just "stealing" water from other state's rivers.

BTW - water for golf courses is not always a waste, they bring in/support tourism that helps the state and makes quality life better. "A bad day on the course is better than a great day at work."

Anonymous | 1:21 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Man also seems to find unfathomable soultions to seemingly impossible problems... The problems with worldwide population growth are being addressed everyday and we'll see great advances in the coming years!

Have faith in technology, progress and the ingeniutiy of humans. It will all be great for future generations.

Solar power, wind power, hydorgen fuel cells, desalinization processes and super crops are exciting stuff!

Out of contense? | 1:39 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I was wondering if I had read this correctly in regard to population growth in New Orleans:
"Things are not all well in New Orleans...It's no time to be popping..."

Kjaerbye | 1:41 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I moved to Utah from San Diego 10 months ago and thought it would be a better place to live. Well I miss the Pacific Ocean and "blacks Beach". I do not miss the traffic, smog, nor do I miss the nightly cop helicopters that fly at night looking for drugies. People drive slow in the fast lane on I-15 and as a general rule my car insurance and taxes I pay are higher here than in California. Question: Where is all the money from the taxes we pay for a population under 3 Million being used?

to anonymous | 1:42 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

you can place ALL the people alive in the world today in the state of Texas with each and every individual getting 1500 square feet. That's more than my 3 bedroom, 1 bath home. The earth is not overpopulated. The problem is the underproduction and inequitable distribution of food. Trying to solve a food problem by addressing population will never work, since pop. is not the problem. Try again.

Anonymous | 1:55 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

All one has to do is go outside today in any city to see that we most definitely are experiencing a population explosion. And guess what? There will be even more next year!
But if you want to pretend you are living in a far away, quiet, pristine place that nobody knows about ...
go for it!

Bill | 2:05 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I preferred Utah 40 years ago when there was some open space where I played as a kid, when kids could play outside all day and no one had to worry that they'd be abducted, and when you could water half an acre lot for a lot less than the $400/month it costs to keep my grass green in 2007.

Dear Anonymous | 2:11 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

About 15 years ago I read some research that stated you could move all the families of the earth to the United States and each family would have 5 acres of property. The rest of the earth then would be unpopulated.

Over population is caused by people congregating together, pure and simple.

Anonymous | 2:22 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

To "to anonymous": go spend 5 years in urban Orange County, California with a commute to work and then say that there isn't an overpopulation problem. Quality of life descends precipitously to a low quality in a myriad of ways long before you get to 1500 square feet of elbow room per person.

(You need an acre of farmland per person to produce food anyway, so there's more than just elbow room involved.)

Anonymous | 2:31 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Surely you're not foolish enough to believe that I propose moving the world's population to Texas! That merely illustrates (to those willing to see) the point. Are there places that are overcrowded? Duh, yes! That does not, however, mean the the earth is overcrowded. See "Dear Anonymous" comments to get on track here. May I encourgae you to stop with the personal attacks, and discuss the issue?

cities | 2:44 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

The only way we working stiffs can survive is to be where the jobs are. And where are the jobs?
Cities!
And what do find in these Cities?
People!
Lots of 'em.
Can't go back to the farm because big industry is putting ma and pa farms out of business.
Life is suffering (the 1st Noble Truth in Buddhist philosophy)

IM | 2:58 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I think that this is great! I love that with Utah's growing population we can elect another Member of Congress and get a few more things done that are important to us. We are unique b/c Hatch, Bennett, and Cannon are in great positions in DC but one more vote on a key committee like Resources can make all the difference in the world for us. Then, as pointed out earlier, we can start haulting Sen Reid's assault on Utah's water.

Likes elbow room. | 2:59 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

What personal attack are you talking about, Anonymous?
Is disagreeing with you somehow a "personal attack?"

The fact is, there are many acres of land taken out of play by mountains and deserts- no water/no arable land. Most of the Mojave, the Rockies, etc have rational supply problems that make "Dear Anonymous's" stats meaningless. There are water supply problems that the region is running up against. There is energy and food to be taken into account. Americans will have to learn to do with much less if we are to fit a billion more people into the United States. To those willing to make those sacrifices, we're not overpopulated. To those who would like to maintain quality of life, we are bordering on it in many of our urban areas now.

Anonymous | 4:01 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Too many people means nobody agrees on anything anymore. Liberals are evil. Those against the war are guilty of treason, outsiders are also evil ... do you need more examples of a decaying, divided society that is running out of liveable space?

Anonymous | 4:42 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

To Dear Anonymous,

If everyone on the planet were moved to the United States, and given an equal distribution of land (with disregard for desert, mountains, etc) each person would have only .36 acres.

9,826,630 km (Area of US)
1 km = 247 acres
6.6(10^9) humans being
-> .367 acres / person

Anonymous | 4:51 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

That's a very nice formula 4:42.
I am sure there is lots and lots of space in the deserts of Moab, on top of Mt. Olympus, Death Valley, in the middle of the Great Salt Lake, etc.
So all is well.
Now turn on the TV or read the newspaper to get a reality check and get back with me.
Thanks.

Anonymous | 5:04 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

We are running out of liveable (and affordable) space.
Society is coming apart at the seams.
People advocating action are being called wacko liberals by the Limbaugh-ites.
Where will this madness end?

Lizzy | 5:16 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

I agree with BILL and the good old days 40 years ago. Things have definitely changed just a bit since then and not for the better. The only thing back then that I ever got in trouble for as a kid was somebody yelling at me thinking I was the brat of Brigham Youngs g,granddaughter, and I was told to get off his lawn... Big deal! i could still live with that. Nevertheless, we never ever had to lock our doors back then with surveillance cameras surrounding our home as we do now.

Eric | 5:49 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Utah....a great place to employ; a terrible place to be employed. With half the population of Phoenix and more public employees than Phoenix the place is over-governed, over-regulated, over- taxed, over lawyered, and way too far over to the east from California. But I'm not moving back.
Carry on!

Billy boy | 6:01 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Utah is a great place to live! I don't let anybody or any religion get my way. Nothing to get bent about or over. Utah is one of the most beautiful places on earth to live. We just need to clean-up the crime.

Anonymous | 7:31 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

The U.S. population will reach 313 million on Jan 1.
This is up 1% from last year.
And guess what?
There will be even more people next year.
And with every population increase comes more crime.
More people. More crime. Get used to it.

Things don't change | 9:42 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Back in the day there was never crime, right? Wrong. Ever heard of Hammurabi's code or the Ten Commandments? Both ancient documents that talked about crime. That's right, crime has always been in society, and always will be. The good old days really weren't all that good. Time to live in the here and now.

Anonymous | 9:58 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

make room for everyone!growth is a sign of a progressive state as far as utah is concerned.people used to live where jobs and opportunity provides.as utah winter olympics invitation was "the world is welcome here" it means everyone is welcome and the state is ready to give room for everyone.

The Good old days? | 10:28 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

Lizzy, you want to go back to the good old days? How far back? Back to when women couldn't vote, or own property, or to when a husband could beat his wife on a whim? Maybe back to when women got paid less for doing the exact same job as a man? Or do you want to back even further to before the times of electricity and plumbing? There's nothing like plague and famine to control the population.

Cooked in Sacto | 11:59 p.m. Dec. 27, 2007

To the guy from Sacramento,
I'm from the SF peninsula. I would rather live in Utah than that blast furnace called Sacramento. And I really lived near the beach, not two hours away. What I miss about California-
Well nothing I guess. I do miss what California WAS when I was a kid. Doesn't exist anymore.

L | 11:38 p.m. Dec. 28, 2007

Some have seemed to equate more population with lower taxes. Based on many other around the country, most residential developments to not pay their own way and those areas that are referred to as "bedroom communities" that don't have a business/industrial tax base usually have very high taxes.

There was another mention of the lands managed by federal agencies in relation to taxes. 1-Their are payments in-lieu of taxes 2-A study was made(a number of years ago) where the assumption that the National Forest was privatized, The County Assessor gave the tax appraisals from similiar property, then on the expense side comparisons were made, even reduced fire-fighting costs were assumed etc. The conclusion was it was not profitable for the County to consider that idea when everything was considered. Things may have changed since then, but I suppose it would be less advantegous now than it was then. I don't remember, but I don't think there were any adjustments for possibility of reduction in hunting or other recreational opportunities on private "tax paying" lands that were previously public. I think the public lands are an important resource to the State & tourist industry.I think we should keep public lands public!

Anonymous | 12:54 a.m. Dec. 29, 2007

If you put the entire worlds population into Texas then you would have a population density smaller than the island of Manhattan.

Anonymous | 7:42 a.m. Dec. 29, 2007

All I know is that just about everyplace I go in Salt Lake City DOES feel that the entire population has been put here.

Add your comment

Comments are monitored. Any comments found to be abusive, offensive, off-topic, misrepresentative, more than 200 words or containing URLs will not be posted.

Words Remaining

E-mail address: For internal use only. We may want to contact you to publish your comment (not your e-mail address) in the newspaper or for a separate story idea.