Reader comments
Voucher debate grows more heated

Good idea.

Frank's comments are ridiculous and biased on this subject -- as usual. He cries about the reference to Ted Kennedy, but his outrage never seemed to come over into his writings when the teacher's union always says Wal-Mart is financing the pro-voucher movement. Reality, the NEA that supports many things opposed by working families is funding the anti-voucher movement by the tune of $3 million. Spin that Frank!

Public money funding religious instruction is indeed a scary thought. Propagating any form of Fundamentalism through schools, which will be a reality with this plan, with money we are compelled to supply to the state through our taxes, should give nightmares to any freedom loving American.

What kind of 'safeguards' are we talking about here? Will special ed. kids and behavioral problem kids get more money? They take more money to teach and babysit. Will all these kids get tested to make sure they're actually learning what they need to? It would've been nice to get some specifics here...

Kudos to both of you!

Good thinkin'!

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Hey Webb The money already follows the student in the public school system! Pretending it dosen't just confuses the issue. If parents want to send their child to a school that better serves them persoally they can. They just have to pony up the funds.

Parents already have choice in where they send their children to school. The money follows the child through the public school system.

Most reasonable talk we've heard on the voucher controversy! Lead on!

In fact, the most reasonable points on anything when both of you are commenting. :)

Who are you really, and what have you done with P&W?

Perhaps it is time to re-examine the proper role and scope of government. Since government is funded by theft, and its edicts executed by violence, I'd rather it be divested of its presumptive role in education. Eliminate public education, eliminate property taxes which go towards public education, and eliminate child-labor laws. Let those who learn by their own experience the value of an education acquire one through the sweat of their, or their parents', brows.

The arguments mostly seem to be about the money. I see the issue as a division of social classes. All children are entiled to a free education, not an inferior education. Fix the public schools first!It is society that benefits from a quality education. Every one should pay for it. If school voucher proponants get their way, we will have only quality education for the rich. The public schools will still have the same problems and no one will care about it but the poor who will still be footing the bill for all. Qualifying for the maximum benefit of $3,000.00 is still not going to help a poor family who can not make up the difference in tuition. The legislators are telling us that they can't fund public schools, but they can fund private schools?? Listen to you conscience, people! Vouchers are a bad idea.

The availability of federal aid has distorted the price of higher education to the point that students graduate with so much debt they will repay it their entire careers. We don't need that with K-12 too. Plus, that Harvard degree will always be worth more than an equally as expensive degree at a lower-rated school. Do we want to stratify K-12 as well?

Here's a scary Halloween thought for Webb. Let's take your idea a step further...

Let's give parents the ultimate "choice" in education by allowing them to pay for the education of their children. They can then "choose" the Walmart option or the Nordstrom option or all "choices" in between.

Or, if that's too scary for you Mr. Webb, I'll meet you half-way. Let's give ALL taxpayers the "choice" of deciding what school/student they want to fund with the educational portion of their taxes. ALL taxpayers would have a scholarship set up in their name and the appropriate amount of money donated to the school/student of their "choice". That way, if a taxpayer doesn't want their tax dollars going to the "education establishment" they can "choose" something else. However, it also would protect the taxpayer who doesn't want their tax dollars going to fund private or home schools that base their curriculum on a particular religious idea (American Heritage, for example).

I like Webb's idea, "when public money flows to the individuals rather than the institution a better result is achieved in his opinion"

I would like a voucher for police protection. I feel if i had my own security detail around me 24/7 I would feel safer. I wouldn't have to call the police with petty little problems like break-ins.

I would also like a voucher for my own military protection. I am not a big fan of the Iraq war. I would rather have my voucher go to some peace efforts and maybe some nukes and a bunker.

You know, uh, I have never felt my state reps have really looked out for my interest and my tax dollars. I would like a voucher for hiring an attorney to overturn some of the bone head ideas they come up with.

As I said I think Webb is spot on, but I doubt he thinks I should get vouchers like these because it is foolish and absurd, but how can one argue that school vouchers should be given and not police vouchers or military vouchers?

Vote no on 1.

You statists supporting the government school monopoly wouldn't argue that food stamp recipients have to eat at a government cafeteria, would you?

So like food stamp recipients who get to shop at supermarkets like most of us (excluding those members of the political class who get to eat out all the time), let parents receiving educational vouchers chose where that money will be spent -- whether government-run or independently run.

LaVarr says, "A lot of legislators and business leaders want fundamental reform and more parental options." Isn't that interesting that parents aren't included in that list of supporters? Seems that the pro-voucher people forgot to ask the parents what they want. Oh, wait, they already know. Every poll has shown that the majority of parents don't want vouchers. This might explain why the pro-voucher legislators (Republican leadership) are using obscure references to religion and abortion as well as threatening a non-partisan group of community leaders who are studying solutions to the health care debacle.

Millionaires don't get food stamps.

Hey "Just A Math Teacher",
Maybe you should have studied more history . . . or do you really want to go back to a society made up of ONLY "haves" and "have nots"?

That's right! My tax money never has paid for millionaires to get food stamps and lets not forget that while there are no government operated cafeterias where people can spend their food stamps, there are safeguards in place that guarantee that people are actually buying food with their food stamps. Utah's voucher law has no safeguards in place that guarantee that people shopping with their vouchers are actually buying quality education. Anyone could start a private school, hire teachers that "they" deem qualified, teach whatever curriculum "they" feel is appropriate,and give whatever norm referenced test "they" feel whould make their school look good at the end of each year and receive state money to run their program and let's not forget, make a nice profit for themselves. If vouchers ever become a reality in this state, I'd like to know as a tax payer that my money was actually paying for an education that was, at the very least, comparable to that in public schools.

jackhp and Linda, your comments are right on! Thanks for speaking common sense. I'm a definite NO on vouchers!

Nice try at spinning yet another Webb. Mr. Webb would make a good utah county legislator. Trying to spin his ideas and get people to bend to his ideas even though time and time again the people say they don't agree.

It is simple. Vouchers will go down. The people putting out the kennedy, moveon, clinton ads will be blamed for it. Then some pathetic legislator will have a new voucher bill ready for reading the day after the vote.

Listen people. If your legislators supports voucher even after they get voted down, you need to vote them out.