Deseret News | 3 East High football players arrested, kicked off team

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3 East High football players arrested, kicked off team

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Willie Smith | 12:45 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Ok Mom. Maybe the student who is defending them in the previous post and claims to be a friend cares to address that question. Student wants us to be "shamed upon", so maybe this story is not true at all according to their version. Guess the legal system will now determine that for all.

I agree with that other poster that the Coaches are as much to blame for allowing this environment to thrive, even if Student says it wasnt as bad as the news said it was.

dave | 12:49 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

you all are talking more about what heroes the coaches are and not about the victims. i feel sorry for them, they are the heroes.

Dear FB Fan | 12:54 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Let's see how this goes.

First story: Mom and dad complain to the principal because the coaches are walking around the locker room watching their son naked as he changes his clothes. They want to have that pervert coach removed.

Second story: Mom and dad complain because their son was attacked in the locker room. They want to know where were the coaches? They should be fired because they aren't doing their job, watching the boys in the locker room.

Sounds stupid. NO, As a high school teacher and administrator for 29 of my 33 years in education I faced these same comments regularly. Half the parents wanted the coaches to walk the locker room all the time and the other half didn't want the coaches watching their sons dress and undress.

After a shooting on campus and a police investigation we found there were at least 30 students who knew the shooter had a gun, but didn't want to rat him out. You would think somehow we administrators would know he had the gun, after all 30 students knew it. On a campus of 4800 kids, 365 staff and 50 acres we didn't know everything.

Comments continue below

PUDDN | 12:57 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

That is some SICK behavior...THEY DEFINATELY SHOULD BE ON A SEX OFFENDER LIST!

Vladimir | 1:07 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

The unfortunate thing is that the three will not be punished in any meaningful way. It sounds like the coaches and school officials did the right thing. The courts, I'm afraid, will not do the right thing. The American judicial system is a joke. As assualts like this go on unpunished vigilante justice will be the only refuge to good people. My thanks to the press at least for covering the event. People deserve to know just how corrupt their nation is and how little it is worth fighting for.

MamaM: to Student | 1:22 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

In taking something "too far" your friend's behavior sadly ended up hurting your some of your other friends. I'm sorry this happened. The consequences of their actions are far reaching.

Whether or not they originally "intended no harm" is debatable, but regardless of their intent or they way the media may or may not have blowen the story "WAY out of proportion; the lives of others have been seriously and negatively affected by the choices and behavior of the attackers.

I don't believe the "people of the world have forgotten that these students are still people". This story unfortunately became real when three of your peers decided three other peers were not still people worthy of respect.

I'd be interested to know what you think the attackers did, and how the community should go about giving them and their victims the support they need.

itgetspassedon | 1:23 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Rape, Sodomy, Hazing? I would venture to guess these 3 didnt use their male anatomy in any of this, but the usual nearby object that is so often part of these sadistic rituals. Doesnt make it any less deviant, it brings out the inner rage and need for domination that is usually within the leader of the group. The others usually follow along, without the same rage, but caught up in the Power themselves. usually the leader learned this behaviour from a relative or older neighbor and quite possibly had it done upon them. Doesnt make any of it any better. Just like the leader walking around with it inside for never being able to tell a parent about it--they believe their victims will never tell a teacher or coach or policeman either.

I'm sure right now the leader of this pack is having the conversation with his parents that should have occurred at the time he learned of, witnessed or felt this same assualt upon himself.

Thank God for the judicial system to now determine punishment. For not knowing is not a defense. If incarerated they will learn real sexual assualt. Be careful when they r released.

Alex | 1:45 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

I'm glad that a few good people stood up and reported the sick behavior of the boys on the team. What they did is not hazing, it is sick behavior for which they need to be placed on the sex offenders list. It doesn't matter that they are 15 years old. They should know better and their parents should be ashamed of forcing their pathetic spawn into the public schools to abuse others.

neoconx | 1:45 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

gee VLADIMIR, at least we have a nation....you don't.

ED | 1:57 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Hey Coach. The number is 9-1-1! The first call should have been made to the police, period.

Imma-liberal | 2:19 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Why are you surprised?.

We trampled the pledge of allegience in school, we banned school prayer. We banned Christmas and gave you "winter break"... We rewrote history books to banish religious references and watered down moral codes.

Our teachers/professors have institutionalized your kids to hate America and have no respect for the office of the Presidency. School boards are now staffed with humanists and there is no longer a right or wrong, just excusable shades of gray.

We are breaking down your family. Even marriage is a meaningless definition now.

Kids who act out are fed medications instead of receiving correction. Stern words might offend someone, so it is replaced with "feel good" phrases that won't get us sued.

Should you really be all that surprised it has come to this? Why? Your children are exactly what you are teaching them to be.

Sick..... dellusional.....self absorbed and unconcerned with what is morally right or wrong. After all, what is right or wrong all depends on your individual opinion, does it not?

Jill | 2:24 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

You know prison time might be just the education the poor abusers need. Maybe we could get it covered under the "No Pervert Left Behind" law.

Reagan Conservative | 2:37 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Forced sexual humiliation to show dominace today, Pimping out your son or daughter tomorrow. Time to go back to teaching Traditional Conservative Values at school and home.

HRW | 2:41 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

The next chapter of the story will be to portray the freaks as victims themselves. Maybe they suffered a loss of self-esteem when they didn't make quarterback or perhaps their mommies didn't love them enough. I'm sure there are enough gullible people to buy any story the lawyers can devise. Alex is right, the parents should be ashamed.

it only gets worse | 2:46 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Why are you all so surprised??? What do you think goes on in all our alcohol-infused fraternity parties? When you are 19, 20 or 21, and drunk every Thursday night? H E L L O ? Many of us never had parents that wern't busy at work or too busy for us!

To Regan | 2:50 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Uh... honestly you live in Utah, I don't think that these criminals were "liberal" or lacking in "traditional conservative values." I think they were sick boys looking for a power trip. People from both sides of the aisle seek that kind of power, it is not tied into any specific morality, if it were, then rape would be simple to stop, just outlaw one political party or way of thinking. Sadly, the world doesn't work like that, and quick fix solutions compound the problem raher than healing it.

Don't blame liberals, you live in the most conservative state in the U.S., by a long, long way. Maybe if you lived in Mass. you could chaulk this up to acceptance of gays, but the face is these boys probably have/had girlfriends, and still think they're straight, despite being rapists.

Allen | 3:06 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Everyone seems caught up in the politics surrounding what happened. I'm sure that there is human excrement just like these boys in every school, red-state and blue-state. They didn't do what they did because of a political belief. They did it because they are scum. What matters most is what happens to the pathetic creatures next. Will there be justice or not?

Anonymous | 5:00 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

So now we attach the moderator when it's east high writing this stuff weird

whstrat | 5:11 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Isn't time we advance our learning experience by removing all forms of sports from our schools? If students desire to play in league sports, let private enterprise develop teams and leagues outside of the school system, where players would front the cost to be on the team, instead of the taxpayer. Why should 100 parents pay school taxes so just one in 100 kids gets to play on the football team? Its ridiculous in this day and age to allow this system to continue. Do away with the sports and you do away with the violence and the locker rooms and the showers where our children routinely are embarrassed or humiiated, or even worse attacked or assaulted. Enough already.

Keyzer Soze | 5:23 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

If those three go to prison they may be on the receiving end of some of the acts they tried to commit. Instant karma's gonna get you.

Ferris | 5:26 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Maybe there really is something to those science reports that claim toxins in our lives are gradually changing male hormones into female hormones. If we can have frogs with multiple legs, we can certainly have high school athletes with unexpected desires. Maybe we'll just have to adjust and change standards when the prom comes up.

Teacher in PA | 6:07 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

As a coach and a teacher, let me assure you that the adults in charge must have been neglecting their duties. You don't leave the student athletes at this age unsupervised for any great length of time. You check the locker room frequently or sit yourself somewhere so you can hear what's happening.

It shows a gross ignorance of liability issues on the part of the school/coaches that this was able to happen three times before they knew about it.

Cancel the season. The kids knew it was happening and did nothing. And what kind of a school still uses its showers? Join the 21st century and ban the showers. Most schools already have for this very reason. Harassment and rape.

grad student | 6:20 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

It's sad that some attribute this to homosexuality and "gay clubs". Unfortunately, sports are inextricably linked to hegemonic masculinity--that boys must be emotionless, aggressive, and in charge of their power. While these actions are certainly reprehensible, they are not unlike instances of heterosexual sexual assault, whereby the man wants to put the woman in her place. As such, this certainly aligns with hazing, for these three aggressors apparently wanted to steal the power from newbies while maintaining and strengthening their own. If you think I'm nuts, that's fine, but before you challenge me, read ANY book with "sports" and "masculinity" in the title. In this age of political correctness and female prominence in sport, the locker room is one of the last safe havens for traditional manhood. These acts have nothing to do with sexual arousal; they are all about "marking territory". Anybody claiming that this was an attack by "the gays" is clearly blinded by the big picture/their own ideology. Moreover, they are advertising their own ignorance regarding how systems of oppression writ large operate in our society. So thank you. Thank you for sharing your stupidity with all of us. Please educate yourself.

Educated Literate | 6:39 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Hmm..Last Time I checked, Officials in public schools are SUPPOSED to act "en loco parentis"--or in place of the parents--during school hours and activities. Leagally that phrase makes the supervisor, teacher or coach liable for the safety of the students under their watch.

Reading some of the posts that some coaches knew about muggings and other "hazing" acts makes me wonder why aren'tthere at least 3 supervisors or coaches in the locker room until the last student leaves? If I were the coach of East High, I'd wonder if the parents of the alledged victim were going to sue in civil court since it happened under his supposed supervision under "n loco parentis".

Monkey wrench | 6:43 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

These people were 15 years old. Hardly an age noted for reason, universal good judgement and exemplary behavior - even among the church going! Isn't it possible that they are guilty of grossly inappropriate, bullying behavior rather than the felonious assaults for which they are charged?

Bullying or threatening horseplay among juveniles is inappropriate behavior and should be condemmed, but rushing to judgement and demanding long prison sentences or worse without knowing all the facts serves no one.

Allegations levelled by the prosecutor do not equate to knowing all the facts.

Alicia G | 7:21 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Even though the kids are 15 years old and may not be "noted for reason", they apparently had enough reason to set a trap to sexually assault another person. They should be punished as an adult would be punished. We're talking about sexual assault NOT shoplifting.

Ralph Schmalph | 7:21 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Anyone who has played football, wrestled, or virtually any other sport knows that the object of the competition (at practices as well as games) is to dominate and acheive as high a rank in the pecking order as your skills, strength and character will allow. These "children" were not properly coached or parented if they thought that such acts as they committed in ganging up on someone would bring them prestige within the group. We have abandoned our young men to a feminized and "politically correct" society. Men should re-learn the priciples of chivalry, honor and strength of character. Also, allowing boys to vent their naturally aggressive behavior in the noble sport of boxing wouldn't be a bad idea either.

grad student | 7:29 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

RE: Ralph. This is not an attach...for the most part, I agree. But maybe men can only re-learn those principles by embracing a more (traditionally) feminine approach to life (something that is altogether taboo, for that would make them "gay"). And be careful about blaming the parents; there is, perhaps, no more insidious system of socialization that the schoolyard. Parents can teach until the cows come home, but put the student in a context where "fitting in" and peer pressure reign supreme, and there's just no telling what'll come out the other side, ya know?

Buddy | 7:34 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Actually, few of us know what really happened. We take the headlines and let our imagination take over. No, this is not to minimize the actions, but some discretion is warranted.

However, one really wonders why we incarcerate all children in schools for 12 years (more or less). Most kids get ample education in the first six years of school to fit into civilization. So, trade schools, apprentice programs, or even voluntary labor makes much more sense. But I suppose the "educational" mafia would oppose anything as reasonable.

truth | 7:48 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

this isnt hazing. its a sex crime. they should go to prison and be put on a sex offender list.

Karl | 8:01 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Gee, I wonder what rap music those male "spawn" have been listening to.
You don't suppose MTV taught them the same way they taught the Abu Grabb soldiers do you? Hmmm, let me stick my head in a hold and hope it goes away.
Oops, wait, I forgot, music or movies or TV doesn't affect kids behaviour.

What | 8:10 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

What? Hazing is gluing the kids locker shut or filling his helmet with peanut butter. Sodomizing a guy is rape and way beyond weird. I don't see how anyone could even use the term hazing in relation to this story.

Bryan | 9:57 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Why do so many of these sick people inhabit schools. It looks like our current schools are among the most dangerous places for our children. After paying billions of dollars per year, our children learn less than before and are subjected to a needlessly high risk of abuse from teachers or peers. It is time to take back the schools for the people instead of the education mafia who are clearly failing all of us.

lbjack | 10:10 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

Dear STUDENT. Thanks for your post. You know more about what happened than any of us self-appointed judge and jury. But, as I said in my post, bullying is inexcusable, and bullies should be punished. You know it when you see it. Be sure you're being honest with yourself.

No Corn | 10:35 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

I am amazed at the attack on the coach. He was told about this thing at 10pm, and reported it first thing in the morning. People say he should have called the police and school administrators that night? What were they going to do? Arrest a kid on a rumor? Waiting til the next morning gave him a chance to make inquiries to determine the validity of the accusation. Imagine if he had some kid arrested in the middle of the night and been wrong. I think the coach did the right thing by a) waiting, and b)acting on the tip. People need to walk a mile in his shoes before judging.

Oh really? | 11:00 p.m. Sept. 29, 2007

I think that every opinion that could be formulated has been expressed. Perhaps the moderator could stop allowing comments.

Hold Up... | 1:08 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

These are good kids. They are young...they did something stupid and are obviously going to learn a great lesson. They should not be going to prison...even jail for that matter. Please have a heart and understand the situation. I'm not excusing the behavior but I talk of hazing because that's all they meant by it. They were wrong for what they did and this was sexual assault but was not meant to hurt nor go this far. Be Christians for heavens sakes and stop acting like you all know the situation and can pass judgement or that your opinion even matters. Because first of all it doesn't, and seconly you don't even know these boys or the decision...you have gone off of what the media has said.

Roger | 1:42 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

I've heard it all, from defending these boys to prosecuting them and the bottomline is that they are not good boys. There may be a perspective that they are but they committed a terrible crime against another human being. Can't believe that people would rationalize this fact! These kids that were victimized didn't choose to be. Its easy to choose a side when its not you that was victimized.

Respect Others | 6:11 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

Its comes down to respect for another human being. No matter how old you are, your parents should have instilled in you the importance of respecting others. Parents need to teach character and integrity; these are the true traits of Manhood or Womanhood. This story saddens me.

Carole Knowles | 7:22 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

These are not good kids. They are not even kids. They are young men. They are criminals. You can bet that their crimes are the results of being desensitized by viewing pornography and violence for a period of time. Something like this does not happen overnight. When will parents realize that their young people need supervision, in and out of the home? Teaching them correct principles and letting them govern themselves is fine for educated adults, but not for children of any age. To govern oneself, you must have self-control, something most teenagers and too many adults lack.
I'm not completely blaming the parents and I'm certainly not blaming the coach. The young men are the criminals. But young people need supervision at home, at school, and at play. It's that simple. Adults need to act like adults, parents like parents, because teens will certainly act like teens, and without clear and reinforced rules, one thing might lead to another and before long, crimes like these will be committed. Parents: become and stay aware. Some growing-up sorrows can be avoided. Some can't. This could have been avoided. I am so sorry for the victims and their families.

sarah1 | 7:58 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

Stats indicate that children who sexually abuse were victims themselves once. If the adults in this situation are really doing their jobs, we're all going to hear about a lot more than just these three on this particular football team.

Thotman | 8:02 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

When I need a gravel driveway...I will just bring someone who has made a serious mistake and say...He who is without sin among you cast the first stone...I should have within seconds a few loads.. I am saddened that these kinds of horrific behaviors occur, I am more saddened at the defeatists who use this as an excuse to shut the world down...forward some hyper-moral agenda or simply pronounce to all of us without a brain how evil the world has become... 300 million people and a few (six in jena then three at east high) define someones view of our lives. I think we find a reflection of our fears in what we condemn. I hope the best for all involved...I do not want to participate in a stoning...not even if they are proven guilty. I wonder if in fifty years the three who committed this crime will be productive and contibuting adults...or if they wil have been discarded into the garbage pile of life. These comments on both ends of the spectrum are more troubling to me than I would have imagined when I began reading.

mister c | 8:08 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

In a year from now, this will have all blown over for the perpatrators. They will have some form of court action, a little wrist slap and that will be that. It is sick but it is the truth. We in America are weak when it comes to criminals. We let murderers walk, rapists free and bullies roam.
Our prisons are full of people that have introduced drugs into thier personal bodies, while the violent people get off after minimal time. We are confused!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This is also not an "athelete" thing, it happens in choir, theater, chess and checkers. We live in a world with some sick bullies. Keep your eyes open and go to Karate (but don't go to the restroom alone).

to: ricardo | 8:29 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

BRAVO..I agree whole-heartedly!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Skeeter | 9:04 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

Most of the comments are from people who do not know what went on. I don't either, but it sounds like the coaches did all that could reasonably be expected of them. I get frustrated with the Monday morning quarterbacking of those who know how they should have done better -- when they do not any of the details.

Jeff | 10:23 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

Rape (and that's what this is) is a crime of violence and not a crime that necessarly has to do with sex. Lashing out in violence by children is a red-flag to indicate deeper issues. Children do not come into this world as rapists. Whatever feelings of powerlessness and frustration that leads a child to think that this kind of abuse toward another child is the best way to go should be further explored and addressed. The hardest thing in a case like this is to also always remain loving toward the children who perputrated the acts. This is not easy, especially with our society's ideas toward homosexuality in general and since these acts were perputrated against children of the same sex, many will use it to fuel the flames of hatred toward gay people. That is unfortunate. Please know that I do NOT suggest that we should ever accept unacceptable behavior. However, to "throw-away" the kids who were the attackers whithout trying to help them is to waste a valuable resource and perhaps a chance to avoid future similar incidents.

InRussetShadows | 11:52 a.m. Sept. 30, 2007

What I find sadly funny in these situations are the second-guessers who claim to know what the coach, players, or police should have done. Did it ever occur to you that you are looking at all the pieces of the puzzle, without being under any time pressure? And it's oh-so easy to claim, self-righteously that you would have done this or that, even though you have no experience to back you up, except what you write here. And who knows if that's the truth or not? So please, just shut up and stop hunting for conspiracy theories.

Wow | 11:29 a.m. Oct. 3, 2007

I only just heard about this.
The coach and school did do what they were supposed to do, and I praise them for that, but I'm just amazed that everyone thinks that them doing what any human being should do is so amazing. Now, I'm from Australia, and I don't know any school that even has a sports team, so the thought of a coach ever attempting to cover something like this up is just digusting (not this coach, obivously, but there are people saying others would).
It's not hazing by any means. It's rape and sexual assault. Now, I despise treating people too softly, and while there's definetly a line, I disagree with absolute no-bullying policies (I mean, kids have to toughen up somehow), but this is just dispicable. For people to call something like this simple bullying or hazing really shows how warped our younger generations are becoming.
And I bet if the victims were female, you'd see the word rape 50 times throughout articles on this. But, males (and football players at that) are expected to be tough about it. "Boys will be boys". Please. Rape is rape, regardless of gender or school activities.

cattonhood | 5:25 p.m. Oct. 3, 2007

cottonwood has kids that have spent time in lock up for worse things LET'S GET REAL!

Student | 6:17 p.m. Oct. 3, 2007

THIS WAS NOT RAPE! Sodomize was recently altered to mean genitals to the face as well as its previous meaning. It is the new meaning of sodomy that the athletes are charged with, not the old. Although still severe, it is not rape and those of you who are accusing my friends of being rapists and being rape victims are very ignorant. Do some research before you throw such heavy and untrue accusations around and above all don't believe everything the media tells you.

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